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  #631  
Old 09-18-18, 11:29 AM
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Mr. Slippery Mr. Slippery is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Johnny Moxon View Post
Is there a meeting today or something?
I agree, drop crossovers. But also, it’s going to be tough to schedule games weeks 4 and 5 with other leagues having games.
It's difficult but doable, and it would be better than the current set-up if the goal is to get more teams into the playoffs. As you and others have stated, the crossovers are killing many of these teams' playoff chances.

Last edited by Mr. Slippery; 09-18-18 at 11:39 AM.
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  #632  
Old 09-18-18, 11:38 AM
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Originally Posted by IVCFan View Post
Until the league starts performing better as a whole in weeks 1-3 this is going to continue to happen. And in Sandy Valley's case, you can't be a DV school and beat up on DVI and DVII schools all year and expect to make it.
Absolutely.

In this set-up Sandy Valley all but guarantees themselves of having to go 8-2 or better every year if they want to be a lock to make the playoffs. Heck, the two biggest schools they'll beat this year both look to be headed for 1-9 seasons at best (Claymont might beat Newcomerstown, and Minerva may have a chance against River View).

It's not necessarily so much that SV is playing so many DVIIs, it's that those DVIIs aren't doing well in the nonleague games and the crossover games.

If you go 10-0 against 10 DVIIs who all go 5-5 while playing nothing but DVIIs, your average is 21.00. The problem is when you don't go 10-0 and all those DVIIs are winning 4 games or less...
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  #633  
Old 09-18-18, 11:52 AM
Football 101 Football 101 is online now
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Originally Posted by styx View Post
Wow looking at Fantastic50 scenarios... Whoever did come up with this league set up and agreed to it has done a disservice to the young men playing. Crazy to think there is so many leaders in districts that don't understand simple math as it pertains to how you qualify for the playoffs...
maybe the math they used was travel budget and mileage.

seems if there are only two changes to be made to make the league smoother then it must have been set up pretty good.

I watch other leagues that can't seem to get anything right.
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  #634  
Old 09-18-18, 03:01 PM
Ivchonk Ivchonk is offline
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Had some free time today and was looking at opponents and Records.
If you include week 5 opponents here is how it shakes out.
I do not consider .500 a winning record.

Ridgewood-has not played anyone with a winning record

Garaway-has not played anyone with a winning record

Indian Valley- has played 3 teams with a 3-1 record

People who are complaining about there teams not making the playoffs ivc does hurt but the AD needs to schedule a better non conference to help get teams like Sandy Valley over the hump!!!!!!!!!!
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  #635  
Old 09-18-18, 04:38 PM
RubberChickenII RubberChickenII is offline
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Indian valley has played 2 3-1 teams one of which is sandy in crossover, out of ridgewood/garaway a hand. They played 0-4 Minerva and 1-3 coshocton, as did ridgewood.
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  #636  
Old 09-18-18, 04:45 PM
lon lon is offline
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Crossovers guarantee your conference 12 more losses. Obviously if crossovers were eliminated it could be more losses, but also it could be a lot more wins. Conference is a joke as long as they keep two crossover games.
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  #637  
Old 09-18-18, 04:57 PM
Ivchonk Ivchonk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RubberChickenII View Post
Indian valley has played 2 3-1 teams one of which is sandy in crossover, out of ridgewood/garaway a hand. They played 0-4 Minerva and 1-3 coshocton, as did ridgewood.
As I stated in the last post I was including week 5 opponents witch would make it 3. 3-1 teams. I
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  #638  
Old 09-18-18, 05:05 PM
Ivchonk Ivchonk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lon View Post
Crossovers guarantee your conference 12 more losses. Obviously if crossovers were eliminated it could be more losses, but also it could be a lot more wins. Conference is a joke as long as they keep two crossover games.
I agree 💯 Ion. Iv got lucky with the crossovers 3-1 Sandy and 3-1 buckeye trail. Imo garaway had no business playing TCC it does more harm then good. I feel all the AD in the leauge should know what was happening and play a harder non conference. As of now crossover games will still happen ad have to be smarter it helped their teams have a chance at the playoffs
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  #639  
Old 09-18-18, 05:30 PM
RubberChickenII RubberChickenII is offline
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Trail...also a crossover, league controlled not school controlled. Trail dropped ridgewood week 1 game. Not as easy as some think to schedule non leagues. Only opponents that are willing to play non league games are those that think they can beat you. Obviously those teams are not ideal to schedule when your league struggles to carry any points towards postseason. Danville typically wins games, as does northwestern. Coshocton was coming off of a state semi berth when wood scheduled them. Can’t control certain things. League needs to be a more stable source of opportunities, for all schools involved
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  #640  
Old 09-18-18, 06:32 PM
mingua mingua is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RubberChickenII View Post
Trail...also a crossover, league controlled not school controlled. Trail dropped ridgewood week 1 game. Not as easy as some think to schedule non leagues. Only opponents that are willing to play non league games are those that think they can beat you. Obviously those teams are not ideal to schedule when your league struggles to carry any points towards postseason. Danville typically wins games, as does northwestern. Coshocton was coming off of a state semi berth when wood scheduled them. Canít control certain things. League needs to be a more stable source of opportunities, for all schools involved
Trail absolutely dropped Ridgewood for week one and picked up a long-term deal with traditional rival Caldwell (who they beat and will most likely make the playoffs) and who on Earth can blame them?? What insane person wants to play on a yearly basis Ridgewood, Claymont, and Indian Valley, along with the five mandatory schools in the "small school" division that includes what should be big school Sandy Valley????
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  #641  
Old 09-18-18, 07:03 PM
RubberChickenII RubberChickenII is offline
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I don’t blame trail for dropping the wood. Like I said teams want to try to schedule teams they have a chance of beating, not blaming trail at all. My response was to above poster who made it out that IV “scheduled” 3-1 teams, sandy and trail, those were not scheduled, yet league arranged. Not wood and garaway fault they don’t play sandy and trail.
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  #642  
Old 09-18-18, 07:10 PM
RubberChickenII RubberChickenII is offline
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Wood tried to re up the northwestern contract after next year only to be told they are gonna look elsewhere, just as trail, bellaire, Shadyside and Steubenville Catholic before them. Not easy to find teams in area to play in week 1-3. Waynedale also decided not to re up after this season.
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  #643  
Old 09-18-18, 08:23 PM
colorswitch colorswitch is offline
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Buckeye Trail Football coach said he was sick about dropping Ridgewood but felt it was best for the program going forward. He Is a closet Ridgewood fan though.
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  #644  
Old 09-18-18, 09:20 PM
IVCFan IVCFan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Football 101 View Post
maybe the math they used was travel budget and mileage.

seems if there are only two changes to be made to make the league smoother then it must have been set up pretty good.

I watch other leagues that can't seem to get anything right.
It's really unfortunate that travel budget and mileage seems to be the most important factor in the IVC scheduling model in all sports (not just football) and not playing competition that prepares the IVC teams to be successful come postseason in all sports.
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  #645  
Old 09-18-18, 09:37 PM
IVCFan IVCFan is offline
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Originally Posted by lon View Post
Crossovers guarantee your conference 12 more losses. Obviously if crossovers were eliminated it could be more losses, but also it could be a lot more wins. Conference is a joke as long as they keep two crossover games.
So here's the thing. Almost every other league is already in league play in weeks 4-5 so how exactly is this hurting the IVC?

I get the disadvantage of the big schools not gaining much beating smaller schools but it's also an advantage for a team like East Canton who beat Ridgewood and Tusky Valley last year.

The bigger problem is weeks 1-3. Look at my post earlier on the thread at who the IVC beat in weeks 1-3. The league needs to gain more points by beating teams that are going to go 6-4, 7-3, 8-2, etc instead of beating teams who might win 2-3 games.

Also, if we are going to nitpick the league does not help itself when Newcs plays Buckeye Trail in week two and Tusky Valley plays Sandy Valley in week three. You are essentially playing league games in the non-league portion of the schedule where now you are destined to add at least 2 losses where you could've went 4-0 or 3-1. Now, if Newcs was in the small school and Sandy was in the large those matchups could be league games.

And I know this is hard to do but if the league could somehow add some more schools to the non-league schedule that'd be great. That way multiple IVC teams aren't playing the same opponent in non-league games. For example, no IVC team played Tuslaw this year. It might mean more travel but mathematically it doesn't help Sandy to beat Minerva and then have Indian Valley turn around and beat Minerva.
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  #646  
Old 09-18-18, 09:48 PM
lon lon is offline
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How about keeping one crossover game and then in week 4 have the MVL vs IVC challenge.
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  #647  
Old 09-18-18, 09:54 PM
IVCFan IVCFan is offline
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Personally, if the same 12 teams stay in the IVC I'd like to the following happen:

#1 - The Sandy/Newcs switch:

Big School - Indian Valley, Claymont, Ridgewood, Garaway, Tusky Valley, Sandy Valley
Small School - East Canton, Buckeye Trail, TCC, Strasburg, Malvern, Newcomerstown

#2 - Permanent crossoversin football. Two big school teams would play the same two small school crossover each year. This will keep some rivalries going, keep travel down (since it's an IVC issue) and the matchups aren't that bad

Tusky Valley/Sandy Valley matched with East Canton/Malvern
Garaway/Ridgewood matched with Strasburg/TCC (a bit rough but not worse than now)
Indian Valley/Claymont matched with Buckeye Trail/Newcs (BT may not like this)

#3 - Make the following week 10 matchups

Indian Valley vs. Claymont
Tusky Valley vs. Sandy Valley
Ridgewood vs. Garaway
East Canton vs. Malvern
TCC vs. Strasburg
Newcomerstown vs. Buckeye Trail

Maybe I'm way off, but that seems better overall than what we have now.
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  #648  
Old 09-18-18, 10:07 PM
Ivchonk Ivchonk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RubberChickenII View Post
I donít blame trail for dropping the wood. Like I said teams want to try to schedule teams they have a chance of beating, not blaming trail at all. My response was to above poster who made it out that IV ďscheduledĒ 3-1 teams, sandy and trail, those were not scheduled, yet league arranged. Not wood and garaway fault they donít play sandy and trail.
Manchester was not leauge arranged.
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  #649  
Old 09-19-18, 01:40 AM
Qwertyqwerty Qwertyqwerty is offline
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Jokingly told my uncle before the SV IV game that Sandy was probably scared at the thought of not having the small schools to beat up on every year ... but it could very well keep them out of week 11 furthermore who would be the ideal switch for sandy to the south
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  #650  
Old 09-19-18, 06:53 AM
Redline Redline is offline
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Originally Posted by Qwertyqwerty View Post
Jokingly told my uncle before the SV IV game that Sandy was probably scared at the thought of not having the small schools to beat up on every year ... but it could very well keep them out of week 11 furthermore who would be the ideal switch for sandy to the south
I would say it's pretty obvious who the ideal switch would be
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  #651  
Old 09-19-18, 06:55 AM
styx styx is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Football 101 View Post
maybe the math they used was travel budget and mileage.

seems if there are only two changes to be made to make the league smoother then it must have been set up pretty good.

I watch other leagues that can't seem to get anything right.
You seem to be an IVC apologist??? The fact remains the league set up will cost multiple teams home playoff games and maybe even playoff games. How do you argue with that!? Answer: People who just don't get it...
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  #652  
Old 09-19-18, 06:57 AM
styx styx is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IVCFan View Post
Personally, if the same 12 teams stay in the IVC I'd like to the following happen:

#1 - The Sandy/Newcs switch:

Big School - Indian Valley, Claymont, Ridgewood, Garaway, Tusky Valley, Sandy Valley
Small School - East Canton, Buckeye Trail, TCC, Strasburg, Malvern, Newcomerstown

#2 - Permanent crossoversin football. Two big school teams would play the same two small school crossover each year. This will keep some rivalries going, keep travel down (since it's an IVC issue) and the matchups aren't that bad

Tusky Valley/Sandy Valley matched with East Canton/Malvern
Garaway/Ridgewood matched with Strasburg/TCC (a bit rough but not worse than now)
Indian Valley/Claymont matched with Buckeye Trail/Newcs (BT may not like this)

#3 - Make the following week 10 matchups

Indian Valley vs. Claymont
Tusky Valley vs. Sandy Valley
Ridgewood vs. Garaway
East Canton vs. Malvern
TCC vs. Strasburg
Newcomerstown vs. Buckeye Trail

Maybe I'm way off, but that seems better overall than what we have now.
This...

Teams can schedule their non league how they see fit based on travel etc.
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  #653  
Old 09-19-18, 07:12 AM
hammerman37 hammerman37 is offline
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This is a just to stir up the muck and meant to agitate some just for fun: of the "big schools" who has played the toughest schedule when the considering factor is their state enrollment division against others in their state enrollment division thus far through week 4?
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  #654  
Old 09-19-18, 07:13 AM
Football 101 Football 101 is online now
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Originally Posted by styx View Post
You seem to be an IVC apologist??? The fact remains the league set up will cost multiple teams home playoff games and maybe even playoff games. How do you argue with that!? Answer: People who just don't get it...
You couldn't be more wrong

I don't let facts cloud my opinions. The league was set up as is right now by travel and mileage which was sparked by Newcomerstown pounding the table.

That is the starting point. The schools have identified that SV should be in south, and there is a growing concern of the crossovers.

Those are the facts. Schools are getting crunched for funds, and enrollments are in decline, so yes there is a sense of streamlining and trying to make every dollar count.

The last thing anyone wants is for their school to try to pass another levy

The statements of doing what is best for league standings for playoffs is not on the top of school administrations to do lists. Not saying I agree or disagree.

Rather than identify me as an apologist, you could say I am a bit of a realist.

The thing that stifles decision making in the IVC is the principals vote.

Secret ballot - should there be a switch yes or no - is all that got done yesterday.

dispute - argue - whatever - the crossovers stink. Why not just put SV in south for football and have BT and Newc switch with TV and SV for winter and spring to appease travel budgets, precedent has already been set. And if everyone is worried about week 5 scheduling...then bring it back to one crossover. A school like SV will still play Malvern and EC in non league due to long standing rivalries, but Garaway v TCC, come on man.
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  #655  
Old 09-19-18, 08:19 AM
mingua mingua is offline
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Any word on how the "secret ballot" turned out?
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  #656  
Old 09-19-18, 08:30 AM
Football 101 Football 101 is online now
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They voted that yes there should be a switch. that is it

not a vote to make the switch but should there be a switch. What has happened that there needs to be a secret ballot? wow

as far as playoff points go and getting teams into playoffs, all I can say is if a school thinks they are really hurting for points then let's see who that school is - let them step up, and then let's look at the non league schedule first - cuz I don't see many teams in the league really loading up non league with potential tough opponents that will bring in points.

IV playing a D5 manchester doesn't necessarily impress me. Manchester isn't what they used to be, and they are D5. Then they turned around and played Minerva - like come on man...I feel playing big red would do them more good then the sleeper vs minerva. Ridgewood should play manchester
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  #657  
Old 09-19-18, 08:32 AM
lon lon is offline
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Secret ballot says make the switch but who knows if they will do it.
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  #658  
Old 09-19-18, 08:34 AM
Johnny Moxon Johnny Moxon is offline
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Don’t know if this is true or not but I heard the vote was unanimous to switch sandy and newcomerstown starting in 2020.
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  #659  
Old 09-19-18, 08:42 AM
hammerman37 hammerman37 is offline
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Originally Posted by Football 101 View Post
They voted that yes there should be a switch. that is it

not a vote to make the switch but should there be a switch. What has happened that there needs to be a secret ballot? wow

as far as playoff points go and getting teams into playoffs, all I can say is if a school thinks they are really hurting for points then let's see who that school is - let them step up, and then let's look at the non league schedule first - cuz I don't see many teams in the league really loading up non league with potential tough opponents that will bring in points.

IV playing a D5 manchester doesn't necessarily impress me. Manchester isn't what they used to be, and they are D5. Then they turned around and played Minerva - like come on man...I feel playing big red would do them more good then the sleeper vs minerva. Ridgewood should play manchester
I hear a lot of the same thing Football 101 , "SV/Newcomerstown are the reason we are struggling with playoffs", yet I look at non league schedules and they're not as strong as they should be if this is why we aren't getting teams into the playoffs according to some. So you move those two, then who are you going to blame when your non league is still soft?
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  #660  
Old 09-19-18, 09:15 AM
mother_nature mother_nature is offline
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I disagree, I think the non league needs to be softer for everyone. If this would happen it would bring more points into the league. Nct should schedule conotton, beallsville, west m. The problem is our schools are not winning non leagues and SV doesnt get to play a 3-0 non league in Ridgewood or a 3-0 non league in garaway. And neither one of them get SV. Ridgewood scheduled a D5 state semi team two years ago coshocton, D5 northwestern, a perennial playoff team. Garaway scheduled Danville, a state final four last year, just happened to be one of the worst teams they have had. Sv scheduled Fairless, I believe a playoff team.
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