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  #31  
Old 02-20-18, 08:58 PM
FossyWriter8 FossyWriter8 is offline
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Two things:
1) Here's a link to what Joe Scalzo wrote: http://www.cantonrep.com/sports/20180219/canton-gets-good-feedback-from-state-football-finals

2) This is a column, not a news article. Doesn't mean there isn't news or facts in it, just means that it contains the writer's opinions and feelings on a subject.
  #32  
Old 02-20-18, 09:17 PM
Pope Francis 1 Pope Francis 1 is offline
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Best facility in the state for hosting HS playoffs: UC Nippert Stadium

Best weather in the state for hosting December games: Southwest Ohio

Number of years Cincinnati has hosted state finals?

Number of years a Cincinnati school was "voted" state champs before playoffs?

Yes, I'm whining.....
  #33  
Old 02-21-18, 06:51 AM
Wahoo Sam Wahoo Sam is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pope Francis 1 View Post
Best facility in the state for hosting HS playoffs: UC Nippert Stadium

Best weather in the state for hosting December games: Southwest Ohio

Number of years Cincinnati has hosted state finals?

Number of years a Cincinnati school was "voted" state champs before playoffs?

Yes, I'm whining.....
And SWO Schools have to deal with the logistics of an overnight trip while their opponents sleep in their own beds.

But remember 2004 when Colerain played McKinley on their home field. OHSAA officials asked if McK could have their home locker room for convenience.

Kerry Coombs said "I don't care. We'll play them in the dang Parking Lot!"
  #34  
Old 02-21-18, 07:35 AM
bop bop is offline
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No dog in the fight, but there is not a better venue to play a HIGH SCHOOL FOOTBALL game in the United States of America. It is perfect. 1st class yet small enough to feel like it should.
  #35  
Old 02-21-18, 07:42 AM
bob22 bob22 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by USA70PP View Post
The last time I went to Canton for a state championship game, bought my ticket at the school, filled the gas tank at Kroger before I left Marion, ate a bite at a Mickey D's on the way, had a coke and two boxes of popcorn at the game, and drove home after the game. Total spent in Stark County for the day less than $10.00.
The last time I went (2008) the wife and I spent 3 nights in a hotel, ate 11 meals, and the wife went Christmas shopping. Total spent=I don't want to know.
  #36  
Old 02-21-18, 08:32 AM
bass10 bass10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bob22 View Post
The last time I went (2008) the wife and I spent 3 nights in a hotel, ate 11 meals, and the wife went Christmas shopping. Total spent=I don't want to know.
Not to mention the groups of guys that attend just like the states for basketball in attendance. The number of bars frequented and amounts spent has to be pretty large.
  #37  
Old 02-21-18, 10:54 AM
Sykotyk Sykotyk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bass10 View Post
Not to mention the groups of guys that attend just like the states for basketball in attendance. The number of bars frequented and amounts spent has to be pretty large.
And those were projected in the numbers. $111/day minimum average for single day trip visitors, and much more for those staying overnight. The problem is that's an overly optimistic average.

Partly because the $111 average is based on in-state day trips. The ENTIRE trip. Not just what you're spending at your destination. And that's for vacations. Not many consider going to a title game as a vacation. In fact, 90+ % don't even know they're going to Canton that weekend until literally the week beforehand.

And another issue is they're using simple math: $111 x 60,000 attendees = x.

The problem, those recurring fans attending 3-6-7 games? They're getting counted for each time they're part of the 60,000. Which, if say, 500 fans go to all 7 games, they're counted as 3,500. And their financial impact figured as: $111 x 3,500 = $388,500.

I seriously doubt even a single person is putting down almost $800 on a weekend in Canton for the finals.





As for the suggestion of Cincinnati hosting. Nippert's a great stadium and I'm sure the renovations recently have made it even better. The problem? They don't bid for them. And that's not something special about Ohio.

PA just put up for bid the next four football titles. One bid was submitted. West Virginia just a year or so ago put up for bid the Super Six. One bid was submitted.

The standards for those bidding are so high, basically the only group that has a decent shot at getting a winning bid is the group who is already hosting them and knows the intricacies of putting on the games.

And that's basically Canton and Ohio Stadium. The only reason they left Ohio Stadium was the switch from astroturf to grass. And the only reason they moved back was the whims of Jim Tressel wanting them back. Now that they're caught in a quasi-partnership, the OHSAA isn't about to draw the ire of either host. They might be left with nobody wanting to host it. And then it's just a matter of the OHSAA renting a venue and doing it themselves. Instead, they like the community or rather OSU to do the leg work for them.
  #38  
Old 02-21-18, 01:29 PM
ohiopup ohiopup is offline
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TRUE

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sykotyk View Post
...
As for the suggestion of Cincinnati hosting. Nippert's a great stadium and I'm sure the renovations recently have made it even better. The problem? They don't bid for them. And that's not something special about Ohio.

PA just put up for bid the next four football titles. One bid was submitted. West Virginia just a year or so ago put up for bid the Super Six. One bid was submitted.

The standards for those bidding are so high, basically the only group that has a decent shot at getting a winning bid is the group who is already hosting them and knows the intricacies of putting on the games.

And that's basically Canton and Ohio Stadium. The only reason they left Ohio Stadium was the switch from astroturf to grass. And the only reason they moved back was the whims of Jim Tressel wanting them back. Now that they're caught in a quasi-partnership, the OHSAA isn't about to draw the ire of either host. They might be left with nobody wanting to host it. And then it's just a matter of the OHSAA renting a venue and doing it themselves. Instead, they like the community or rather OSU to do the leg work for them.
= = = = = = =

NOT TRUE

Quote:
Originally Posted by Wahoo Sam View Post
...
But remember 2004 when Colerain played McKinley on their home field. OHSAA officials asked if McK could have their home locker room for convenience...

...
If you are refering to the McKinley team using their own locker room for the game; that decission
was made by the OHSAA weeks before the finals, that if McKinley was in it they would not be using
the alternate locker room. Colerain was simply informed of that, they were NOT asked!

P.S. Every time someone mentions that home field thing...
I think of the scene in the movie Hoosiers where the coach measures the Key and Rim
Height... Fawcett was 100yds long and 53 1/3yds wide!



:>---

EGA
  #39  
Old 02-21-18, 07:40 PM
brianwr112 brianwr112 is offline
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Got the chance to be on a State Championship team a couple decades ago. We traveled from SWO on Thursday to play in the Friday night game. Had practice in the old Rubber Bowl. Got to catch one of the earlier games on Friday before team meal and then our game. Playing at Paul Brown was a cool experience knowing the history. I believe our entire community traveled to the game and nobody complained one bit. A lot of the fans made a weekend of it and hit up the Hall of Fame and some Saturday games. The team traveled back after the game and were welcomed home to a police escort which wasn't really needed based on the place being a ghost town. Nobody wanted to play at Nippert. We wanted to play at one of the most storied fields in high school football.
  #40  
Old 02-21-18, 07:51 PM
sam the butcher sam the butcher is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianwr112 View Post
Got the chance to be on a State Championship team a couple decades ago. We traveled from SWO on Thursday to play in the Friday night game. Had practice in the old Rubber Bowl. Got to catch one of the earlier games on Friday before team meal and then our game. Playing at Paul Brown was a cool experience knowing the history. I believe our entire community traveled to the game and nobody complained one bit. A lot of the fans made a weekend of it and hit up the Hall of Fame and some Saturday games. The team traveled back after the game and were welcomed home to a police escort which wasn't really needed based on the place being a ghost town. Nobody wanted to play at Nippert. We wanted to play at one of the most storied fields in high school football.
Nice post.
  #41  
Old 02-21-18, 09:10 PM
my2sense my2sense is offline
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That was then, this is now. The best venue according to the OHSAA is now the Shoe or Benson/Fawcett. Props to Benson for a job well done.
  #42  
Old 02-21-18, 09:12 PM
my2sense my2sense is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jackson03 View Post
People have to leave their convenience-filled suburban playlands for almost 24 hours. They might even be forced to go to a different McDonalds than they're used to!! THE HORROR

I hope they ban live video broadcast of games again, too. Listen to the radio or get nothing if you can't show up.
Great post

If you can't/dont want to come - don't. We will enjoy it without you.
  #43  
Old 02-21-18, 09:47 PM
sam the butcher sam the butcher is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by my2sense View Post
Great post

If you can't/dont want to come - don't. We will enjoy it without you.
Wow...."If you don't want to come - don't. We will enjoy it without you."

Please tell me you're going to enter this in the OHSAA's slogan contest for future games. Lol.

Too bad the village will never be completed, you undoubtedly would have had a great slogan.
  #44  
Old 02-21-18, 09:57 PM
sam the butcher sam the butcher is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jackson03 View Post
People have to leave their convenience-filled suburban playlands for almost 24 hours. They might even be forced to go to a different McDonalds than they're used to!! THE HORROR

I hope they ban live video broadcast of games again, too. Listen to the radio or get nothing if you can't show up.
The location discussion is a legit one, you don't know everybody's situation to criticize them. I think the SWO contingent are whiners and look silly with all the things they cry about, but again, the location of the game argument is a legit one.
  #45  
Old 02-21-18, 10:51 PM
my2sense my2sense is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sam the butcher View Post
Too bad the village will never be completed
Noted
  #46  
Old 02-21-18, 11:13 PM
Ts1960 Ts1960 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by my2sense View Post
Noted
One can only hope with a water park and sky lift to downtown LMAO
  #47  
Old 02-21-18, 11:22 PM
brianwr112 brianwr112 is offline
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I'd actually like to know how many SWO players/coaches truly wish the games were held in Cincy? You hear the fans complain but I truly think the kids enjoy the travel. Throughout the regular season and playoffs many of the teams get the chance to play at Nippert (know that's changing with the new NCAA rules). To play at the Shoe is a dream of many OSU fans who won't continue their football career at the Big Ten level. Many, like myself, prefer the history of the Canton area has with football. That, and the festive feel the community has for the weekend compared to what Columbus offers. It's a personal preference. Spending the night before the game, as a team, in the hotel was a once in a lifetime experience. No way I'd of rather slept in my own bed and bused to Columbus in the morning. The whole community was very welcoming which included getting standing ovations at the places we dined. Many of those people probably hadn't even heard of our school but recognized the accomplishment and made every kid feel like a star. Not sure Columbus provides that. Like I said, it's just my personal opinion.
  #48  
Old 02-22-18, 05:57 AM
sam the butcher sam the butcher is offline
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To be completely honest with you brianwr112, your post (#39) was excellent and I think my2sense would agree, but in your post you complimented Paul Brown Tiger Stadium and my2sense hates EVERYTHING associated with Massillon.

If you would take your post and replace PBTS with Fawcett Stadium, he would be driving to your house to pat you on the back. Fact.
  #49  
Old 02-22-18, 06:34 AM
The Dock The Dock is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jackson03 View Post
Columbus has enough money and enough going on. The economic boost is a big deal for Stark County. Yeah, it's not centrally located, and please keep screeching about how it's not fair, it's not fair, it's not fair for SW Ohio. Who cares? Kids in Alaska have to take airplanes to play their neighbors. You'll survive the extra 90 minutes on the highway. No need to be slothful.

Only thing I would change is that the Thursday game(s) needs to go. Bring PBTS back into it if needed to make the schedule work.
If you're coming from Cincinnati, the difference between Columbus and Canton in terms of round-trip mileage is ~260 miles. Assuming you get 30 miles to the gallon, and assuming gas is at $2.45/gal, that is an extra $21.23 to put towards getting to and from the game(s). Also, it's an extra four hours on the highway to/from; not 90 minutes.

To misrepresent the facts of the situation (calling the difference between Canton and Columbus "90 minutes" when it is actually four hours while completely disregarding the increase in fuel costs) just undermines the Stark County argument for having the state title games back there. Calling people's (reasonable) aversion to not spending the extra time and money in order to attend the state title games in Canton, as opposed to Columbus, "slothfulness", when there are actual time-constraint considerations and possible financial barriers that affect working people's ability and inclination to attend is probably not the best of ideas. But hey, you do you, bro.
  #50  
Old 02-22-18, 06:58 AM
Wahoo Sam Wahoo Sam is offline
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[QUOTE=Sykotyk;6992149]
As for the suggestion of Cincinnati hosting. Nippert's a great stadium and I'm sure the renovations recently have made it even better. The problem? They don't bid for them. And that's not something special about Ohio.

Tom Gamble, the promoter who has put on the Crosstown Showdown for 20 years made a bid on them in the past. He even got the support of the Bengals. Cincy met the two stadium criteria and all the other hokum. But the OHSAA kept moving the target by adding more criteria until it was clear that only Canton would be accepted.

No sane person is going to go through the cost and expense of making a bid if you know fix is in.
  #51  
Old 02-22-18, 07:04 AM
Wahoo Sam Wahoo Sam is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohiopup View Post
TRUE



= = = = = = =

NOT TRUE



If you are refering to the McKinley team using their own locker room for the game; that decission
was made by the OHSAA weeks before the finals, that if McKinley was in it they would not be using
the alternate locker room. Colerain was simply informed of that, they were NOT asked!

P.S. Every time someone mentions that home field thing...
I think of the scene in the movie Hoosiers where the coach measures the Key and Rim
Height... Fawcett was 100yds long and 53 1/3yds wide!



:>---

EGA
Nice little video when your in the middle of the State and don't need to worry about a 4 hour drive.

Your right it wasn't an ask it was an Edict. A lot of Colerain fateful were upset that it was going to be a True HOME GAME for McK. Coombs didn't want it to be a distraction. That is why he made the Parking Lot Quote.

The OHSAA in the 90s and early 00s especially under Claire "Greasy Thumbs" Muscaro was so biased against SWO that the Poster on here use to call the OHSAA the "NORTHERN CABAL"
  #52  
Old 02-22-18, 07:18 AM
Wahoo Sam Wahoo Sam is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brianwr112 View Post
Got the chance to be on a State Championship team a couple decades ago. We traveled from SWO on Thursday to play in the Friday night game. Had practice in the old Rubber Bowl. Got to catch one of the earlier games on Friday before team meal and then our game. Playing at Paul Brown was a cool experience knowing the history. I believe our entire community traveled to the game and nobody complained one bit. A lot of the fans made a weekend of it and hit up the Hall of Fame and some Saturday games. The team traveled back after the game and were welcomed home to a police escort which wasn't really needed based on the place being a ghost town. Nobody wanted to play at Nippert. We wanted to play at one of the most storied fields in high school football.
Kids don't know or care about those fields. They know the Shoe and that is a big deal to them to be able to say they played there.

I went to a few D-1 games in the early 00s. And I gotta say it wasn't that great on experience. For Colerain in 04, I remember a lot of fans with Colerain swag on their cars had them keyed. Parking was in someone's yard. The facilities were in bad shape (I assume the last 2 were taken care of). I remember the staff being surly and unhelpful (that goes for all 3 times I was there).

For St. X in 05 I witnessed the heartwarming moment when the Canton Police used police dogs to separate Families from hugging their sons after the game.

And then there were the Elder fans who suffered the humiliation of having to clean the snow off their own seats.

No special memories for me of Canton.
  #53  
Old 02-22-18, 07:22 AM
Pope Francis 1 Pope Francis 1 is offline
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While I understand the Browns won just as many games on the road as at home this past year, most football teams would prefer to play in their home town.
  #54  
Old 02-22-18, 08:04 AM
jackson03 jackson03 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Dock View Post
To misrepresent the facts of the situation (calling the difference between Canton and Columbus "90 minutes" when it is actually four hours while completely disregarding the increase in fuel costs) just undermines the Stark County argument for having the state title games back there. Calling people's (reasonable) aversion to not spending the extra time and money in order to attend the state title games in Canton, as opposed to Columbus, "slothfulness", when there are actual time-constraint considerations and possible financial barriers that affect working people's ability and inclination to attend is probably not the best of ideas. But hey, you do you, bro.
I understand that those concerns exist and are real, I just don't care about them.

Come on, literally everything worth doing in this state is in Cincinnati or Columbus. A couple people in SWO might miss the game so one of the very few days people come to Canton has got to get nixed? Bull. Attendance was up, the atmosphere was great. We earned it, bro. Sorry to the very small number of people that won't be able to make it, that's unfair, but you already live in a much nicer area with better prospects. I could write an essay about everything unfair that happened to Canton.
  #55  
Old 02-22-18, 08:25 AM
Pope Francis 1 Pope Francis 1 is offline
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Only 2 reasons I travel to NE Ohio

1) Burning rivers

2) NFL team w perfect season
  #56  
Old 02-22-18, 09:45 AM
19AL63 19AL63 is offline
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Back in the day when the games were played between Massillon and Canton, we went to all six games. Brought our wives up and stayed at a B&B in Homes county (north east corner) Wives shopped and we watch high school football. What we spent at and for the games was nothing compared to what the wives spent shopping in Amish country. When it was all said and done we all went home happy with great memories of the weekend. Since they moved to Columbus and went to one stadium and now back to just Canton it is not the same and even though I enjoy the games it is not the same fun we use to have. What is the saying about nothing stays the same, but being old and having possibly only a few years left to go I wish it could have.
  #57  
Old 02-22-18, 09:47 AM
19AL63 19AL63 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pope Francis 1 View Post
Only 2 reasons I travel to NE Ohio

1) Burning rivers

2) NFL team w perfect season
How long has it been since you went north? Long time?
  #58  
Old 02-22-18, 10:08 AM
Pope Francis 1 Pope Francis 1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 19AL63 View Post
How long has it been since you went north? Long time?
Nope, I was just up in Cleveland last month marching in the Browns 0-16 "Perfect Season Parade". I met lots of nice, friendly, folks while celebrating the Browns place in the history books.
  #59  
Old 02-22-18, 11:45 AM
The Dock The Dock is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jackson03 View Post
I understand that those concerns exist and are real, I just don't care about them.

Come on, literally everything worth doing in this state is in Cincinnati or Columbus. A couple people in SWO might miss the game so one of the very few days people come to Canton has got to get nixed? Bull. Attendance was up, the atmosphere was great. We earned it, bro. Sorry to the very small number of people that won't be able to make it, that's unfair, but you already live in a much nicer area with better prospects. I could write an essay about everything unfair that happened to Canton.
While I agree that Stark County isn't the hottest tourist destination in America right now, I think it is somewhat irrelevant to the topic of where the state titles should be. (Although, I obviously don't live in Stark County nor do I stand anything to gain/lose by it being/not being played in the Canton [area.])

The way I see it, Canton is a good - but definitely imperfect - location for the state title games. If my school ever makes it to the state title game in football again, I'll show up if its played in Columbus, Canton, Ann Arbor or high water. As the casual fan, the fan who follows area schools and will go to a few postseason games to watch some good football, I'll likely stay home and try to catch them on the 'tube if they're in Canton/Stark Co. And I personally don't agree with the premise of "get nothing if you don't show up", nor do I think it is the most practical business model the OHSAA wants to effect in the long-term.

Personally, I have some empathy toward your position. At the same time, as a football fan, I think it's kind of a flimsy argument for the status quo. Ambivalence at it's finest, I suppose?
  #60  
Old 02-22-18, 12:45 PM
Mackinbiner Mackinbiner is offline
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Originally Posted by Pope Francis 1 View Post
Nope, I was just up in Cleveland last month marching in the Browns 0-16 "Perfect Season Parade". I met lots of nice, friendly, folks while celebrating the Browns place in the history books.
You would go to Cleveland for the sham of the "Perfect Season Parade", yet complain about going to Canton if your team is playing for a state championship?

Sounds about right for you.
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