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  #61  
Old 07-06-17, 03:39 PM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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unintentional comedy scale is off the charts on this one
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  #62  
Old 07-06-17, 03:51 PM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Originally Posted by Raider6309 View Post
I cant stand old people(50+) that think today is worse than back then. Its like no, you are just old and think it was better then because you were young.
Surprising statement. Would you have a similar attitude toward someone that claimed today is better ?

Many aspects of American life are far different today from 20, 30, or 50 years ago. It's undeniable. People have preferences. People place different value on some things like convenience and comfort or respect and civility. Also undeniable. It's very easy to believe that someone sincerely feels today's world is worse than it used to be. You "can't stand" such a person ?
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  #63  
Old 07-06-17, 03:55 PM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Originally Posted by 14Red View Post
So EP, what is the incentive for coming back to work if you get paid to stay at home? That's not dense, that's reality?

Also, is it fair if you have 20 women in your workforce that don't have babies, work full time and never get paid maternity leave, vs. the 20 who have babies?? Doesn't seem quite fair to me...
One obviously wouldn't want to pay some flunky, but all sorts of benefits are extended to quality employees. Seems pretty simple.....
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  #64  
Old 07-06-17, 06:37 PM
gneiss rocks gneiss rocks is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cabezadecaballo View Post
These, actually-



-perfect for yard work.

Nice isolated phone pocket (so it doesn't get scratched), water bottle, hand pruners, pair of gloves. Perfect.

And these, not those flip-flops-



Best shoes ever. Beat down and ragged now, though. Gore-tex is even still intact. Can't throw them out.
Agree on the shoes, I'm on my 6th pair. I call them 4 wheel drive Cadillacs for your feet. I wear them in from fall to spring and have a nice going out pair (drives my wife nuts when I try wear them to wedding or something) and the survivor version...I can get extra years out of them by with Shoe Goo or Goop, just clean and redo the goo a couple times a year and they are good until they turn to slicks.

I can see the point coming when happy feet overtake happy wife.
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  #65  
Old 07-06-17, 09:42 PM
scbuckeye99 scbuckeye99 is offline
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I live in the rural south. Some of the trailer parks down here could have their own schools.
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  #66  
Old 07-07-17, 11:40 AM
14Red 14Red is offline
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Originally Posted by eastside_purple View Post
You don't get paid to stay at home permanently. Are you really this dumb or trolling? It's the same as any benefit that is extended to all, but may be used by a few.
tell me this EP, how many people you work with that do not use all their vacation. If you told me that 75% of the people you know use 50% of their vacation, then I'll shut up and go away. Most people use every ounce of every minute of any time off they can get. I suppose your for allowing the Dad to stay home with the mom and baby for 6 weeks and get paid for it??
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  #67  
Old 07-07-17, 11:48 AM
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eastside_purple eastside_purple is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 14Red View Post
tell me this EP, how many people you work with that do not use all their vacation. If you told me that 75% of the people you know use 50% of their vacation, then I'll shut up and go away. Most people use every ounce of every minute of any time off they can get. I suppose your for allowing the Dad to stay home with the mom and baby for 6 weeks and get paid for it??
I know several of my employees don't use all their pto for a fact.

I think extending a paternity leave for a father is a good benefit as well. I offer 2 weeks and a lighter schedule for a week beyond that. I guess I don't employ selfish aholes and have found other associates are more than happy to help cover for the new father and/or mother.
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  #68  
Old 07-07-17, 12:04 PM
TylerDurden TylerDurden is offline
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Originally Posted by 14Red View Post
tell me this EP, how many people you work with that do not use all their vacation. If you told me that 75% of the people you know use 50% of their vacation, then I'll shut up and go away. Most people use every ounce of every minute of any time off they can get. I suppose your for allowing the Dad to stay home with the mom and baby for 6 weeks and get paid for it??
Not even close to being true.
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  #69  
Old 07-07-17, 01:29 PM
Raider6309 Raider6309 is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scbuckeye99 View Post
I live in the rural south. Some of the trailer parks down here could have their own schools.
Athens has realistically high real estate. There is actually a small trailer park in Athens on a piece of property that's probably worth a million dollars
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  #70  
Old 07-07-17, 02:19 PM
14Red 14Red is offline
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Originally Posted by eastside_purple View Post
I know several of my employees don't use all their pto for a fact.

I think extending a paternity leave for a father is a good benefit as well. I offer 2 weeks and a lighter schedule for a week beyond that. I guess I don't employ selfish aholes and have found other associates are more than happy to help cover for the new father and/or mother.
That's wonderful. Enjoy your unusual workforce.
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  #71  
Old 07-07-17, 02:23 PM
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eastside_purple eastside_purple is offline
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Originally Posted by 14Red View Post
That's wonderful. Enjoy your unusual workforce.
Thanks. Is it unusual to employ people who aren't selfish aholes?

FYI. http://www.forbes.com/sites/clareoco...leave-in-2016/
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  #72  
Old 07-07-17, 02:41 PM
zeeman zeeman is offline
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Originally Posted by TylerDurden View Post
Not even close to being true.
And how exactly can you prove your post anymore than he can?
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  #73  
Old 07-07-17, 02:48 PM
TylerDurden TylerDurden is offline
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Originally Posted by zeeman View Post
And how exactly can you prove your post anymore than he can?
Because there's research and stats to back up my post.
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  #74  
Old 07-07-17, 03:02 PM
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eastside_purple eastside_purple is offline
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Yeah, a casual google search reveals workers use about 50% of their time on average.

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/05/24/worke...tion-time.html

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/55-...ion-2016-06-15
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  #75  
Old 07-07-17, 03:36 PM
Neopolitan Neopolitan is offline
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Another face-plant by the 14red/zeeman duo.
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  #76  
Old 07-07-17, 03:38 PM
Sykotyk Sykotyk is offline
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It would depend entirely on if they still got paid for it or not.

First 'real' job I ever had, you lost your PTO if you didn't use it. So, tons of time off in December for everyone making sure they used their remaining days off. Was a ridiculous policy rather than just paying out the unused days/hours.
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  #77  
Old 07-07-17, 03:43 PM
TylerDurden TylerDurden is offline
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Originally Posted by Sykotyk View Post
It would depend entirely on if they still got paid for it or not.

First 'real' job I ever had, you lost your PTO if you didn't use it. So, tons of time off in December for everyone making sure they used their remaining days off. Was a ridiculous policy rather than just paying out the unused days/hours.
Did they have to hire temp staffing to cover the people taking time off? If not, then there really isn't anything ridiculous about the policy at all. Why should they incur an additional payroll expense because people didn't plan their vacation throughout the year?
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  #78  
Old 07-07-17, 05:15 PM
zeeman zeeman is offline
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Originally Posted by eastside_purple View Post
Yeah, a casual google search reveals workers use about 50% of their time on average.

http://www.cnbc.com/2017/05/24/worke...tion-time.html

http://www.marketwatch.com/story/55-...ion-2016-06-15
Made you look
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  #79  
Old 07-07-17, 05:16 PM
zeeman zeeman is offline
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Originally Posted by Neopolitan View Post
Another face-plant by the 14red/zeeman duo.
Numnuts
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  #80  
Old 07-07-17, 05:18 PM
zeeman zeeman is offline
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Originally Posted by TylerDurden View Post
Because there's research and stats to back up my post.
So it's 50-50 so you're both half right and I'm 100% right! Yeah Zeeman!
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  #81  
Old 07-07-17, 05:29 PM
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eastside_purple eastside_purple is offline
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Originally Posted by Neopolitan View Post
Another face-plant by the 14red/zeeman duo.
That's what they do best.
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  #82  
Old 07-12-17, 10:50 PM
Crusaders Crusaders is online now
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Just in time for automation
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  #83  
Old 07-13-17, 01:09 AM
Sykotyk Sykotyk is offline
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Originally Posted by TylerDurden View Post
Did they have to hire temp staffing to cover the people taking time off? If not, then there really isn't anything ridiculous about the policy at all. Why should they incur an additional payroll expense because people didn't plan their vacation throughout the year?
They didn't hire temps (it was the week before and after christmas, you're not hiring temps the week before Christmas). What they did have was horrible lack of people in the office those last two or three weeks of the year each year. Because whether you were approved or not, you took your unused vacation time.

The worst was a person who scheduled off their remaining few days a week before Christmas (approved). But, then got sick after Christmas and had to call off (they came to work some), but didn't get paid for the time off and got in trouble for being off without PTO to cover the missed hours.

Just a ridiculous policy. Either roll it over, or just pay out the PTO at the end of the year as a bonus. Use all your time, but need a last-minute day off at the end of the year? Now you're docked for not working. Two times you don't have PTO to cover time off, and you're terminated. Great logic.
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  #84  
Old 07-13-17, 05:45 AM
eastisbest eastisbest is offline
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Originally Posted by Sykotyk View Post
They didn't hire temps (it was the week before and after christmas, you're not hiring temps the week before Christmas). What they did have was horrible lack of people in the office those last two or three weeks of the year each year. Because whether you were approved or not, you took your unused vacation time.

The worst was a person who scheduled off their remaining few days a week before Christmas (approved). But, then got sick after Christmas and had to call off (they came to work some), but didn't get paid for the time off and got in trouble for being off without PTO to cover the missed hours.

Just a ridiculous policy. Either roll it over, or just pay out the PTO at the end of the year as a bonus. Use all your time, but need a last-minute day off at the end of the year? Now you're docked for not working. Two times you don't have PTO to cover time off, and you're terminated. Great logic.
Bigger picture of having to run an organization in which it only takes a few, taking advantage to mess things up? Anal? Who knows.


I'd rather work under the policy you describe. As I recall (yeah that long ago) the engineering firms I worked for, rolled over with a max to a forced pay out. You could only accumulate so much. Not my area of decision making but I've been told roll-over can be difficult to manage for the reason stated that people tend not to take all that accumulated, particularly those with many years in and additional time per year. Then when they lump sum it and are gone for an extended period.. leaves a hole in the organization.

"docked" Maybe I'm being too picky but is not getting salary you haven't earned really being "docked?"
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  #85  
Old 07-13-17, 07:58 AM
TylerDurden TylerDurden is offline
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Originally Posted by Sykotyk View Post
They didn't hire temps (it was the week before and after christmas, you're not hiring temps the week before Christmas). What they did have was horrible lack of people in the office those last two or three weeks of the year each year. Because whether you were approved or not, you took your unused vacation time.

The worst was a person who scheduled off their remaining few days a week before Christmas (approved). But, then got sick after Christmas and had to call off (they came to work some), but didn't get paid for the time off and got in trouble for being off without PTO to cover the missed hours.

Just a ridiculous policy. Either roll it over, or just pay out the PTO at the end of the year as a bonus. Use all your time, but need a last-minute day off at the end of the year? Now you're docked for not working. Two times you don't have PTO to cover time off, and you're terminated. Great logic.
I get that you weren't a fan of the policy, but I'm still not seeing what is so ridiculous about it? I guess the idea of having to use every single hour of time off is just foreign to me.
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  #86  
Old 07-13-17, 09:28 AM
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Corporations figured out some guys like to cash in pto and capped the rollover and moved to a use it or lose it benefit. It makes sense though, because the benefit is intended to boost work/life balance, not to supplement income.
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  #87  
Old 07-13-17, 09:43 AM
eastisbest eastisbest is offline
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"use it or lose it" we called "forced vacation." That is the one that makes no sense to me. If my work performance is falling off, let me know. Otherwise, give the employee the flexibility to balance their own home/work life. Being forced to go on vacation (or lose it) when the company is in a critical bid process also didn't seem wise. It felt a betrayal to colleagues and stupid business.


The "cap" I get. Losing an employee for 2-3 months vacation built up can be critical to the health of the company and colleagues. But I think it better policy to pay anything over the cap. Semantics I suppose but I and colleagues I remember giving opinion considered vacation as part of income. Losing it would not go over well. I think it's better employee-business relation to pay vacation that falls over the cap, if there is one in place. This can amount to thousands of dollars and losing a good employee to another company over it... not worth the minor savings.

Capping sick? I'll agree some sectors, sick is accumulated at an extremely high rate, really meant to protect against long term illness. Seems more a rock and a hard place corporate decision but how can these policies really be cheaper than the company than ones that just meet the needs?

Last edited by eastisbest; 07-13-17 at 10:07 AM.
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  #88  
Old 07-14-17, 02:09 AM
Sykotyk Sykotyk is offline
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Two days off with no pto to cover your hours and you were terminated. But actually schedule your time off rather than just randomly call off with no advance notice at the end of the year was fine.

Also the company could control how much pto you were able to take at once. If you weren't approved only your first day off unapproved could use pto. Day two and three with no pto meant your were terminated. Even if you had banked pto. Unless fmla or something they legally had to let you on. But even then, they'd let people go and just assume they wouldn't fight the termination.

Overall a horrible company and found out they were bought by their biggest competitor.

Also I know an older gentlemen that worked for the post office. His pto rolled over. Never took off work. Had over two years of pto when he retired. Kept getting his regular weekly pay until he exhausted it and then could actually file for retirement benefits.

Last edited by Sykotyk; 07-14-17 at 12:20 PM.
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