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  #61  
Old 08-03-17, 01:26 AM
ideliver ideliver is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bluengold View Post
Article posted today on Cleveland.com regarding the transfers

http://www.cleveland.com/hssports/bl...re_back_a.html
Wow?! Are they emulating Golden State?
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  #62  
Old 08-03-17, 08:08 AM
C'Town216 C'Town216 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bball216 View Post
Education is a major factor to most parents when sending a child to VASJ - even parents of athletes. Mr.Gaffney is on the record of saying this is strictly a basketball decision. That tells me he is not happy with something basketball related (position, touches, discipline, etc). Sonny is a snake oil salesman. Sure he has sent kids to college and he also failed to get control of one who ended up in prison. He has also had very talented teams under perform greatly. Zo is very talented but he struggled when Joe's played against kids bigger than him - there are going to be some tough kids in that conference Garfield plays in. I hope education does not come back and bite him when scholarship time rolls around.


Considering Farmer was originally enrolled at VASJ in 09-10 and was supposed to be a part of a group that could of had deep runs themselves in the playoffs with Demonte Flannigan and Devin Carter before his sudden switch to Garfield Hts.
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  #63  
Old 08-09-17, 06:06 PM
Henry37 Henry37 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bball216 View Post
I would not be surprised with the high level players that are transferring in that Garfield gets hit with some kind of recruiting violation this season.
Hasn't happened yet and probably won't. The OHSAA has rolled out the red carpet for GH and SVSM to become what they've become.
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  #64  
Old 08-09-17, 07:07 PM
StarstoShine StarstoShine is offline
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Hoban Football is far worse than either Garfield or STVM Hoops
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  #65  
Old 08-10-17, 09:28 AM
starktops starktops is offline
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what has changed. a couple of years ago a coach got a job and was told to bring his son would be strictly a basketball move and the boys would have to sit out half the games. do they move to solve the problem? there is not an academic reason.
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  #66  
Old 08-10-17, 11:47 AM
spirit454 spirit454 is offline
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There are many schools in Ohio that have good and even great academic traditions. Any person, like Bball216, who feels these athletes are making moves for academics is being fooled. The only education factor driving this is the educational establishment they can get to after high school.
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  #67  
Old 08-10-17, 05:04 PM
hoban2020 hoban2020 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spirit454 View Post
There are many schools in Ohio that have good and even great academic traditions. Any person, like Bball216, who feels these athletes are making moves for academics is being fooled. The only education factor driving this is the educational establishment they can get to after high school.

Exactly. I thought the college recruiting trail was blazed on the AAU circuit and not during high school play because college coaches are busy coaching their own teams while in-season?


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  #68  
Old 08-10-17, 05:07 PM
hoban2020 hoban2020 is offline
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Originally Posted by StarstoShine View Post
Hoban Football is far worse than either Garfield or STVM Hoops

Will you ever stop the blessed whining?

Suddenly Hoban adopts the same model SVSM has been using for decades and they're the devil. Or maybe you just don't like the level playing field now


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  #69  
Old 09-02-17, 02:46 PM
James x2 James x2 is offline
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VASJ to play a game on the court where Hoosiers was filmed.

Sounds pretty neat to play on that court in that arena.Durring the interview Babe stated that 7??????????? players have left the program????? Who left and when did this happen.And why? Never heard of such a mass exiting of a legendary and hugely successful program at any school.Public or private.Anyone read this article in the papers?,or know of these players leaving? Gafney is obviously 1.
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  #70  
Old 09-04-17, 12:02 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Not counting Gaffney, I know of at least 1, possible 2 players that were tampered with by a public school coach. The rest were for the usual reasons. It's their families loss, though I feel for the student because when they are older and wiser, they will regret it. Playing for VASJ is a privilege and not for everyone or every family.

Last edited by MugnMaul78; 09-04-17 at 04:13 PM.
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  #71  
Old 09-06-17, 12:46 PM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Hey Mug, what other public school allegedly tampered with VASJ players? Tampering is a serious allegation. And are you saying Garfield Heights tampered with Gaffney?
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  #72  
Old 09-06-17, 09:03 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
Hey Mug, what other public school allegedly tampered with VASJ players? Tampering is a serious allegation. And are you saying Garfield Heights tampered with Gaffney?
No I am not saying that about Garfield Hts and Gaffney. Obviously Sonny is Sonny but Gaffney's dad wanted that change for his own reasons.

No, I was saying that about at least 1 of the other 6 players. Unfortunately the parent of the student that transferred will not publicly acknowledge what happened because that would mean their child will sit for the year, but VASJ knows, and the school that did it knows that VASJ knows.
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  #73  
Old 09-07-17, 03:04 PM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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But Mug, why would these kids leave? Didn't they just win a state title in division 5? And isn't the head coach the kid who played division 1-AA college ball at navy in the mid 90s? Is there something else going on? 7 kids leaving is a ton.
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  #74  
Old 09-07-17, 03:37 PM
Lakeshore5 Lakeshore5 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
But Mug, why would these kids leave? Didn't they just win a state title in division 5? And isn't the head coach the kid who played division 1-AA college ball at navy in the mid 90s? Is there something else going on? 7 kids leaving is a ton.
Quite the trolling effort here, keep it up.
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  #75  
Old 09-07-17, 05:06 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
But Mug, why would these kids leave? Didn't they just win a state title in division 5? And isn't the head coach the kid who played division 1-AA college ball at navy in the mid 90s? Is there something else going on? 7 kids leaving is a ton.
In hopes that your comments are sincere, I will respond. I have already made comments on the why for 3 of the 7 and general comments on all 7. That is as specific as I will get on a public forum. There is an additional factor possibly for a couple of the kids of coaches moving on that may have played a role in their decision as some coaches bond differently with different kids.; with our success, Coach Ward is now head coach at Orange, Coach Haynes is at another school, Coach Juice left when his son graduated.

To correct you, we won the DIII title in 2017 and the DIV title in 2015 and have been in the state finals that last 5 years straight. Our coach is a 2X state champ as a player and played at and was team captain at the US Military Academy at West Point (Army). He also won a Gold Medal at the World Armed Forces games.
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  #76  
Old 09-07-17, 08:21 PM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Tampering allegations are pretty strong, although you don't use the word "recruiting" in your response. I'm curious how you would define tampering? It just seems like this would be a bigger story if these tampering allegations were true. Wouldn't the coach reach out to a local reporter to try to get this story in newspapers if it were accurate?
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  #77  
Old 09-07-17, 08:26 PM
Lakeshore5 Lakeshore5 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
Tampering allegations are pretty strong, although you don't use the word "recruiting" in your response. I'm curious how you would define tampering? It just seems like this would be a bigger story if these tampering allegations were true. Wouldn't the coach reach out to a local reporter to try to get this story in newspapers if it were accurate?
We have a winner. Ding! Ding!
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  #78  
Old 09-07-17, 08:48 PM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Guess I didn't realize that you had to be a VASJ supporter to post on this site. Or if you asked a question you were deemed a troll. Hopefully no more kids leave as I enjoy following them in the tournament.
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  #79  
Old 09-07-17, 11:24 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
Tampering allegations are pretty strong, although you don't use the word "recruiting" in your response. I'm curious how you would define tampering? It just seems like this would be a bigger story if these tampering allegations were true. Wouldn't the coach reach out to a local reporter to try to get this story in newspapers if it were accurate?
Recruiting is what happens in middle school when a family contacts the school to explore what that school has to offer in all areas and you try and sell your education and environment to that family.

Tampering is when a basketball coach from one high school contacts the student who is already enrolled at another high school and then comes over to that families home and sits in the living room of that family, all in the attempt to convince the student and parent to have the student transfer to that coaches high school. To top that off, this illegal contact of the student was done a week before school began and it was done during the No Contact Period (August) for Basketball, which is yet another violation of OHSAA rules.

Yes it is a very big story, but without the parent's cooperation to agree to file a compliant with OHSAA, it can't be proven by OHSAA. Since the parent gave in to the student and ultimately transferred, the parent won't file a complaint or their child will sit.
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  #80  
Old 09-08-17, 08:02 AM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Mug, thank you for the detailed explanation. And it certainly sounds like you are in the know. Yet, it seems no different from when I grew up...when kids I grew up with and played with, suddenly enrolled at Ignatius or Joes right before the start of school, instead of going to Mayfield or Brush. Goes back to the old private v. public debate. And now the private school is complaining...
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  #81  
Old 09-08-17, 04:25 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
Mug, thank you for the detailed explanation. And it certainly sounds like you are in the know. Yet, it seems no different from when I grew up...when kids I grew up with and played with, suddenly enrolled at Ignatius or Joes right before the start of school, instead of going to Mayfield or Brush. Goes back to the old private v. public debate. And now the private school is complaining...
I understand but the key difference here is whether a student is already enrolled in another high school or not. Trying to raid another high schools students is wrong no matter who the schools are, private raiding public or public raiding private.
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  #82  
Old 09-09-17, 09:33 AM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Agree 100% Mug. OHSAA has a huge problem on its hands if another coach is going into the homes of players attending other schools to recruit. Which leads me to believe that if contacted, regardless of whether the parent would cooperate, the OHSAA would investigate. I'm beginning to question the credibility of your source, and still wondering if more is going on at VASJ than meets the eye. Why wouldn't the school losing the players file a complaint? What do they have to lose? Unless, of course, the accusations are baseless.
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  #83  
Old 09-10-17, 03:38 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
Agree 100% Mug. OHSAA has a huge problem on its hands if another coach is going into the homes of players attending other schools to recruit. Which leads me to believe that if contacted, regardless of whether the parent would cooperate, the OHSAA would investigate. I'm beginning to question the credibility of your source, and still wondering if more is going on at VASJ than meets the eye. Why wouldn't the school losing the players file a complaint? What do they have to lose? Unless, of course, the accusations are baseless.
It is not baseless. A person at the meeting with the coach and student told my source. The offending school and coach knows that VASJ knows. OHSAA is powerless without proof (phone records, texts, emails, or photos).
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  #84  
Old 09-11-17, 02:03 PM
spirit454 spirit454 is offline
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Or maybe VASJ admins are thinking "what goes around comes around" and they are accepting the results rather than opening any doors that could be slammed in their faces later.
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  #85  
Old 09-11-17, 07:09 PM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Spirit, you may be on to something there. It's either that or Mug's source is lying to him. If Mug is certain his "source" wouldn't lie to him then it is an indictment on the administration if they wouldn't back up the program and its coach. Too much of this stuff going around these days and unfortunately coaches will tell a fib or two to make themselves look like something they aren't.
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  #86  
Old 09-14-17, 12:15 PM
Bball216 Bball216 is offline
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I don't think what goes around comes around fits in this situation. When you are talking about private schools that are allowed to recruit and public schools that are not. VASJ does not go after kids once they have started high school. Look at the rosters the last say 6 years. Very few kids have transferred into VASJ and even less have had any success in sports. There are several reasons why kids transfer - can't afford it, don't like the acedemic standards, parents, AAU coaches, dislike of a coach, recruitment by another coach, etc. Each kid is different. The kids now seem a lot more entitled than in the past. You have kids and parents thinking a child is better then they are and some who think they should not have to pay to attend school. Who knows the real reason why kids have left. You pick up the pieces and move on with kids who want to be part of something bigger than themselves. VASJ will be just fine. We will see how well the transfers do. Karma is funny sometimes. VASJ is a special place, but it's not for everybody. The school and the program is demanding and NOBODY is bigger then the program or school.
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  #87  
Old 09-14-17, 02:36 PM
spirit454 spirit454 is offline
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1 kid transfers out, must be the costs.
2 kids transfer out, must be recruited by other coaches.
3 kids transfer out, this place is not for everyone.
4 kids transfer out, someone does think they're bigger than the school and it may be the coach.
5+ kids transfer out, karma is very funny.
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  #88  
Old 09-17-17, 11:20 AM
Bball216 Bball216 is offline
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I can see why kids at times transfer from a school where their individual talent exceeds that of the program. Example: Had Higgins attended Wickliffe instead of VASJ. That program would not develop his game or allow him to test his abilities against the best the state and nation has to offer. That is not the case with the kids who transferred from VASJ. There is NOTHING another program can provide for these kids that has not already been or could be provided for them at Joe's. Remember Gaffney is getting all these offers and has not had a practice yet at Garfield. He is getting those offers off what he did at Joe's and in AAU.

I spoke with some of the VASJ players on Friday and they have the attitude that if you don't want to be here - leave. They are chomping at the bit to play. Joe's did lose some talent - but they still have talent as well. I have heard rumors that the kids didn't want to play for Coach Kwas. If true that is a shame because they will not realize how good they had it until they are gone. Is Kwas easy to play for - no. Name me one GREAT coach that is. Does he work you hard - yes, is he hard on you - yes, does he make you accountable- yes, does he make you attend class, be on time and get good grades - yes, does he expect more from you than you expect out of yourself - yes, does he make you a better person when you leave then you were when you arrived - yes and most importantly does he help and love his players - yes. Is he perfect - no. Name me anybody who is.

There are a lot of haters both outside the program and unfortunately some inside. I don't know how you can be a fan of Joe's yet say some of the things that I have heard. Pretty pathetic. That comes with the territory when you have the sucesss Joe's has. The coaching staff and the roster will look different - but the program and school remains elite. Some of these players have left to attend programs where all that matters is basketball. That might be ok for now but there is so much more to life than basketball. It will be interesting to see how successful these players are in their new homes and how they will act or feel if they fail to have the success they did at Joe's. No doubt the basketball season will be interesting this year with all the player and coaching changes all over NE Ohio. I for one cannot wait for all the drama to end and the playing to start.
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  #89  
Old 09-17-17, 08:04 PM
spirit454 spirit454 is offline
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Many schools can provide what VASJ can. Some of the drama comes from thinking otherwise. I would say Gaffney's offers have come from what he has accomplished, not from being on a VASJ roster.
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  #90  
Old 09-17-17, 10:42 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Originally Posted by spirit454 View Post
Many schools can provide what VASJ can. Some of the drama comes from thinking otherwise. I would say Gaffney's offers have come from what he has accomplished, not from being on a VASJ roster.
Gaffney has been on ESPN twice, been to the state title game twice, and was a state champ last year. He hasn't played a minute at Garfield and yet he has several DI offers. Garfield has had lots of guys athletically like him that don't get noticed or get offers. You're high if you don't think he was well coached and prepared over those two years academically and athletically. My hope for him as a person is that he continues to progress in both areas.
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