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  #541  
Old 03-09-18, 09:02 PM
jmog jmog is online now
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1 min left, wrestler A is down 4-2 and gets a TD to tie.

30 sec left as wrestler B nearly gets to his feet wrester A let’s him.

Wrestler B jogs away from wrestler A at least 10 feet toward center but never faces.

Ref gives escape.

Wrestler A attacks, gets TD and rides out for a 6-5 win.

After time runs out THEN opposing coach goes to table. After 5 min of discussion.

The ref reverses the escape/TD and they reset the clock with :24 sec left.

But they only erased the TD, start them on their feet with wrestler B up 5-4 which is the final score.

Can you change a call that happened 30 seconds “ago” and reset the clock after time had run out? On top of it how do they award the escape but not the TD?

Semifinals match, 220 D3 Skye vs Kuhn. Skye got completely robbed.
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  #542  
Old 03-09-18, 09:58 PM
350zjk 350zjk is offline
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[QUOTE=jmog;7006243]1 min left, wrestler A is down 4-2 and gets a TD to tie.

30 sec left as wrestler B nearly gets to his feet wrester A letís him.

Wrestler B jogs away from wrestler A at least 10 feet toward center but never faces. (RIGHT NOW STALLING SHOULD BE CALLED on B)

Ref gives escape. (Correct call)

Wrestler A attacks, gets TD and rides out for a 6-5 win.

After time runs out THEN opposing coach goes to table. After 5 min of discussion.

The ref reverses the escape/TD and they reset the clock with :24 sec left.

But they only erased the TD, start them on their feet with wrestler B up 5-4 which is the final score.

Can you change a call that happened 30 seconds ďagoĒ and reset the clock after time had run out? On top of it how do they award the escape but not the TD?

Can't comment much more than what I added in the quote above. Was "bad time" called? Need more info. on the rationale of the reversal of the call.
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  #543  
Old 03-10-18, 12:15 AM
CoachHoversten CoachHoversten is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmog View Post
1 min left, wrestler A is down 4-2 and gets a TD to tie.

30 sec left as wrestler B nearly gets to his feet wrester A letís him.

Wrestler B jogs away from wrestler A at least 10 feet toward center but never faces.

Ref gives escape.

Wrestler A attacks, gets TD and rides out for a 6-5 win.

After time runs out THEN opposing coach goes to table. After 5 min of discussion.

The ref reverses the escape/TD and they reset the clock with :24 sec left.

But they only erased the TD, start them on their feet with wrestler B up 5-4 which is the final score.

Can you change a call that happened 30 seconds ďagoĒ and reset the clock after time had run out? On top of it how do they award the escape but not the TD?

Semifinals match, 220 D3 Skye vs Kuhn. Skye got completely robbed.
Watched this match...whole arena booed. My question, why didnít mogadore coach question this before they restarted on their feet?

As a former certified official, I can understand taking away the escape if that is what they decided was the right call, but then you restart on top/bottom because of ďbad timeĒ and he can ride out for OT. What did the other coach question? Iím assuming that an escape shouldnít have been called and therefore a takedown shouldnít/couldnít be called. Canít give escape and then say no takedown. So again, why didnít mogadore coach question this? Iíd have gotten head official over there.

Also, I HATE the ďruleĒ that a defensive wrestler must face to give 1. If they are no longer being controlled and have the ability to defend themselves, itís 1. If they choose to not defend themselves, thatís their choice and you get taken down for it. Definition of rule is control.
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  #544  
Old 03-10-18, 08:19 AM
350zjk 350zjk is offline
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Also, I HATE the ďruleĒ that a defensive wrestler must face to give 1. If they are no longer being controlled and have the ability to defend themselves, itís 1. If they choose to not defend themselves, thatís their choice and you get taken down for it. Definition of rule is control.[/QUOTE]



In the description above there is without question loss of control, regardless of whether wrestlers are facing each other. Maybe the TD was taken away because the defensive wrestler was unable to defend himself with his back turned. Don't know, wasn't there.
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  #545  
Old 03-10-18, 09:52 AM
jmog jmog is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 350zjk View Post
Also, I HATE the ďruleĒ that a defensive wrestler must face to give 1. If they are no longer being controlled and have the ability to defend themselves, itís 1. If they choose to not defend themselves, thatís their choice and you get taken down for it. Definition of rule is control.


In the description above there is without question loss of control, regardless of whether wrestlers are facing each other. Maybe the TD was taken away because the defensive wrestler was unable to defend himself with his back turned. Don't know, wasn't there.[/QUOTE]

How can an escape be given if the defensive wrestler is not able to defend himself?

It either has to be escape and TD or no points at all. It canít be what was actually changed to, escape but no TD.
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  #546  
Old 03-10-18, 10:54 AM
jmog jmog is online now
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Found out later on the head coach for Mogadore was called to the head table and the local sports reporter was there.

Head table/head ref apologized for the botched call but there was nothing that could be done at this point. Such horse crap.
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  #547  
Old 03-10-18, 11:25 AM
350zjk 350zjk is offline
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How can an escape be given if the defensive wrestler is not able to defend himself?

It either has to be escape and TD or no points at all. It canít be what was actually changed to, escape but no TD.[/QUOTE]



Being able to defend oneself has nothing to do with loss of control. If you're 10 ft. away from your opponent after he WAS in control, it IS loss of control. Now if a TD is awarded when a wrestler's back is to his opponent it should be negated; unable to defend oneself.
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  #548  
Old 03-10-18, 11:45 AM
jmog jmog is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 350zjk View Post
How can an escape be given if the defensive wrestler is not able to defend himself?

It either has to be escape and TD or no points at all. It canít be what was actually changed to, escape but no TD.


Being able to defend oneself has nothing to do with loss of control. If you're 10 ft. away from your opponent after he WAS in control, it IS loss of control. Now if a TD is awarded when a wrestler's back is to his opponent it should be negated; unable to defend oneself.[/QUOTE]

Even if the kid had plenty of opportunity to turn around? He jogged himself to center with his back turned and didnít turn around. So the offensive wrestler is punished for a kid not turning around when he had the chance?
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  #549  
Old 03-10-18, 11:59 AM
350zjk 350zjk is offline
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Even if the kid had plenty of opportunity to turn around? He jogged himself to center with his back turned and didnít turn around. So the offensive wrestler is punished for a kid not turning around when he had the chance?[/QUOTE]


I Should have been more precise. IF the wrestler makes no attempt to turn around it should be an immediate, quick stalling call. At that point if there is still no effort to face his opponent a TD can occur from behind. The stalling call and verbal escape justifies the ability to defend oneself.
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  #550  
Old 03-18-18, 03:50 PM
Like_That Like_That is offline
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At the NCAA tourney the officials would put a device on top of one armband. It made it look like their armband had a large bulge. Does anyone know what it is?
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  #551  
Old 03-18-18, 04:35 PM
MPhillips MPhillips is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Like_That View Post
At the NCAA tourney the officials would put a device on top of one armband. It made it look like their armband had a large bulge. Does anyone know what it is?
Timer. Vibrates when time is out. Or is supposed to.
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  #552  
Old 03-19-18, 12:47 PM
Like_That Like_That is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPhillips View Post
Timer. Vibrates when time is out. Or is supposed to.
Thank you. That is what we guessed, but we weren't 100% sure.
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  #553  
Old 09-20-18, 09:28 AM
HHSCoach HHSCoach is offline
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The setup

Wrestler A is on top with both legs in but is high. Wrestler B reaches up- grabs his head and pulls him under. Wrestler A is going to his back - Wrestler B locks his hands as he pulls wrestler A to the mat.

Scenario 1- The legs of Wrestler A stay in as he is on his back- whats the call?

Scenario 2- The legs of Wrestler A come out and he flips over wrestler B- whats the call?

Nothing changes with Wrestler B's lock
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  #554  
Old 09-20-18, 11:17 AM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HHSCoach View Post
The setup

Wrestler A is on top with both legs in but is high. Wrestler B reaches up- grabs his head and pulls him under. Wrestler A is going to his back - Wrestler B locks his hands as he pulls wrestler A to the mat.

Scenario 1- The legs of Wrestler A stay in as he is on his back- whats the call?

Scenario 2- The legs of Wrestler A come out and he flips over wrestler B- whats the call?

Nothing changes with Wrestler B's lock
There are too many variables to be able to decide without seeing it but, if I understand you correctly, wrestler B is the defensive wrestler?

If so, wrestler B can lock his hands all he wants with no penalty. If wrestler A is on his back for 2 seconds, it is a fall. The control (whether legs are in or not) does not matter in this case. However it sounds like an all or nothing move. If he is not held with shoulders in contact for 2 seconds, there likely is no change in control.
Look at Rule 7-1-5d or the picture on page 69 of the rule book.

In the second situation, depending on how they end up, it could be an escape, a reversal, or no change if wrestler A gets the control back.

Wrestling is very fluid (never static for long) so you wait to see how the situation ends up.

Hope this helps.

Last edited by Jim Behrens; 09-21-18 at 07:46 AM.
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  #555  
Old 10-05-18, 06:50 PM
jmog jmog is online now
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Growth allowance question. I know it’s +2 after Christmas. Someone told me it was +3 at the state tournament in Columbus. I can’t find this in the manual anywhere?
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  #556  
Old 10-08-18, 06:28 AM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmog View Post
Growth allowance question. I know itís +2 after Christmas. Someone told me it was +3 at the state tournament in Columbus. I canít find this in the manual anywhere?
Using this as a resource, nothing I read in paragraph 8 indicates that.
IOW, I would not count on it. OTOH, the OHSAA sometimes does the unexpected.

https://www.ohsaa.org/Portals/0/Spor...ourneyRegs.pdf
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  #557  
Old 10-11-18, 08:02 AM
SLhornet SLhornet is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Behrens View Post
Using this as a resource, nothing I read in paragraph 8 indicates that.
IOW, I would not count on it. OTOH, the OHSAA sometimes does the unexpected.

https://www.ohsaa.org/Portals/0/Spor...ourneyRegs.pdf
Page 9
Point 11

"11. Weigh-Ins
Scales are unavailable Wednesday, March 7. Scales will open Thursday, March 8 at 10:00 a.m. in the Aux
Gym. The wrestler will be able to weigh-in unofficially from 10:00 a.m. to 11:05 a.m. on the same scale which
he will weigh in officially beginning at his appointed time. Coaches are encouraged to utilize this unofficial weigh
in. By making the same scales available for the unofficial weigh in, it is anticipated that all wrestlers will make
weight during the official weigh in. All wrestlers must weigh in Thursday, March 8 from 11:15 a.m. to 12:15 p.m.
Weigh in shall be scratch weight plus 3 pounds for the Thursday Weigh In."
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  #558  
Old 11-04-18, 09:24 AM
tarl tarl is online now
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Do forfeits count in a college wrestlers total of how many matches he can wrestle in a single day and is 6 the amount of matches?
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  #559  
Old 12-01-18, 12:04 PM
johnwallace72 johnwallace72 is offline
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Stalling on escapee for not turning around to wrestle aggressively.


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  #560  
Old 12-22-18, 10:45 PM
Lionattack Lionattack is offline
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If a wrestler works the head constantly snapping , trying to bring the head down for a front headlock and has scored off of it should it be called for stalling.

Do referees consider a snap from neutral to a headlock , then bringing it to the mat and spinning an offensive move? If wrestlers continues to work this and scores with it but never shoots should he be hit for stallng? Only works the head but is successful.

Just looking for thoughts on this.
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  #561  
Old 12-23-18, 09:29 AM
dion dion is offline
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Exactly when should wrestling be stopped, and a TF awarded?
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  #562  
Old 12-24-18, 01:01 PM
350zjk 350zjk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dion View Post
Exactly when should wrestling be stopped, and a TF awarded?
The Rule Book on p.23 states " the match shall continue until the near fall situation has concluded..." Now it doesn't say near fall criteria, so I interpret this to mean if the back is in anyway exposed to the mat, wrestling would continue. To me that would be a near fall situation. Note: It doesn't say until the pinning combination has ended.
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  #563  
Old 12-24-18, 03:24 PM
wlpdrpat wlpdrpat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 350zjk View Post
The Rule Book on p.23 states " the match shall continue until the near fall situation has concluded..." Now it doesn't say near fall criteria, so I interpret this to mean if the back is in anyway exposed to the mat, wrestling would continue. To me that would be a near fall situation. Note: It doesn't say until the pinning combination has ended.
I could be wrong but my understanding is that wrestling continues until the points are awarded. Similar to a tilt; until the offensive wrestler releases their hold the points are not awarded. Why would it be any different in the case where the points would result in a TF? If they are still working the hold then they have not been awarded points.

Please correct me if I am wrong on my understanding.

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  #564  
Old 12-24-18, 03:57 PM
350zjk 350zjk is offline
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[QUOTE=wlpdrpat;7218538]I could be wrong but my understanding is that wrestling continues until the points are awarded.


Yes, but during a TF, pts. are awarded "...after a NF situation has concluded." If a defensive wrestler's back is no longer exposed to the mat then there is no longer a NF situation. More specifically, if you have an arm bar and a half or a cradle you have a pinning combination, but not necessarily a NF situation. Hope that makes sense. Just how I read it.
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  #565  
Old 12-24-18, 04:22 PM
wlpdrpat wlpdrpat is offline
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I've seen it called both ways. For example offensive wrestler using a tilt before releasing the hold but opponent is no longer exposed...points are awarded to end match. However, with a pinning combination they typically allow the offensive wrestler to continue to work for the pin until he releases or changes holds. Again this is observation of how the rules have been interpretted in our area (SW).

It would be nice to know the interpretation for both situations from the big guy in Ohio.

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  #566  
Old 12-24-18, 09:15 PM
5Count 5Count is offline
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The TF should be awarded and the match ended as soon as the defensive wrestler comes out of near fall criteria.
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  #567  
Old 12-24-18, 10:40 PM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 5Count View Post
The TF should be awarded and the match ended as soon as the defensive wrestler comes out of near fall criteria.
Not exactly correct.
Rule 5-11-4b states, in part, "the match shall continue until the near fall situation has concluded".
As an example, a wrestler is out of NF criteria when the defensive wrestler is at 46* or greater but the situation has not changed. You would allow the offensive wrestler to try for the fall as none of us can tell a difference that small.
However if the defensive wrestler can base out or defend himself, the points are awarded and the tech fall is earned.

Last edited by Jim Behrens; 12-24-18 at 10:57 PM.
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  #568  
Old 01-03-19, 10:43 PM
Tartan78 Tartan78 is offline
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After the two pound growth allowance is given, what is the rule governing the max weight a kid can wrestle at? Meaning if he has never made scratch at 170 but weighs in at 171.4 after the growth allowance can he wrestle at 195?


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  #569  
Old 01-07-19, 10:16 AM
jfide650 jfide650 is offline
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Yesterday’s (1/6) Ohio State vs NC State 125lb match. Ohio State locks hands. NC State completes successful reversal near center of the mat. Referee stops match and awards the points. Match restarted with NC state in top position. New NCAA rule or referee error? On tv you could hear the NC State bench yell “free move” but didn’t hear anyone say anything about stoppage of match.
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  #570  
Old 01-07-19, 01:05 PM
dion dion is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jfide650 View Post
Yesterdayís (1/6) Ohio State vs NC State 125lb match. Ohio State locks hands. NC State completes successful reversal near center of the mat. Referee stops match and awards the points. Match restarted with NC state in top position. New NCAA rule or referee error? On tv you could hear the NC State bench yell ďfree moveĒ but didnít hear anyone say anything about stoppage of match.
I had questions concerning a number of decisions/judgments he made during that match. Not sure if he was one of the better college officials I've seen.
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