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View Poll Results: What do the Browns do with the first pick?
Myles Garrett 21 55.26%
DeShaun Watson 4 10.53%
Mitch Trubisky 4 10.53%
Jonathan Allen 1 2.63%
Pick another player not listed 2 5.26%
Trade the pick 6 15.79%
Voters: 38. You may not vote on this poll

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  #91  
Old 03-09-17, 08:43 AM
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bedevil bedevil is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Lahey View Post
Browns should probably draft a new WR too, they're gonna be dumb enough to let Pryor go.
They don't want to let him go, but they are not going to overpay to keep him, either.
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  #92  
Old 03-09-17, 08:52 AM
Jim Lahey Jim Lahey is offline
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I sure that is how Belichick sees it ... Saban, Lombardi, ... all the great coaches.

Why play a player 70 snaps if he is going to "take plays off" ... why not just play him on passing downs ... so he can do his "primary function" ... #1 picks overall are not just pass rushers. Great players make plays all over the field, not just when it comes their way. While understand that you might not go 100% a 100% of the time ... there is a reason why people are asking him about his effort ... because his effort is less than many other DLinemen.

There are reasons why NE wins championship ... without "difference makers" on defense ... because yes, they expect their players to play hard all the time. It is called a winners mentality ... something most Browns' fans can't/don't understand.
Tell that to Clowney and Mario Williams. Also, the league is different now than it was even 10 years ago. Teams covet pass rushers. That's why JJ Watt and Von Miller are so highly thought of. Are they capaple of stopping the run? Sure. But their biggest stregnths are getting to the QB.

And NE doesn't have difference makers on defense? Ty Law, Revis Island, Vince Wilfork, Richard Seymour, Tedy Bruschi, Rodney Harrison, Asante Samuel, Jerod Mayo, Dont'a Hightower, Albert Haynesworth, Chandler Jones, Aqib Talib, Jamie Collins, Malcolm Butler. Yup, not one difference maker in that list.
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  #93  
Old 03-09-17, 08:52 AM
Jim Lahey Jim Lahey is offline
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Originally Posted by bedevil View Post
They don't want to let him go, but they are not going to overpay to keep him, either.
Which is utterly moronic.
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  #94  
Old 03-09-17, 09:13 AM
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Free agents avoiding Cleveland lol.
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  #95  
Old 03-09-17, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Jim Lahey View Post
Yup.
show me the post where i stated that
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  #96  
Old 03-09-17, 09:31 AM
joesports joesports is offline
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Originally Posted by Jim Lahey View Post
Tell that to Clowney and Mario Williams. Also, the league is different now than it was even 10 years ago. Teams covet pass rushers. That's why JJ Watt and Von Miller are so highly thought of. Are they capaple of stopping the run? Sure. But their biggest stregnths are getting to the QB.

And NE doesn't have difference makers on defense? Ty Law, Revis Island, Vince Wilfork, Richard Seymour, Tedy Bruschi, Rodney Harrison, Asante Samuel, Jerod Mayo, Dont'a Hightower, Albert Haynesworth, Chandler Jones, Aqib Talib, Jamie Collins, Malcolm Butler. Yup, not one difference maker in that list.
Revis (HOFer) great -- only one year with NE
Seymour (HOFer?) -- I will give you this one
Wilfork -- pretty good at time (that is why he was shipped out)
Bruschi -- really good, not a difference maker, good player on a good team
Harrison -- at the end of career, maybe one or two good years
Samual -- good player, not even close to all time great
Talib -- one year with NE?
Hightower -- good, not great ... just like the rest

so 2 of these were great players, and one only played for a year with NE ... and that is over the past 15 years.

What NE has is a bunch of really good players who "do their job" ... and play hard ... or BB ships them out ... that is the point! NE takes good players, who play hard, do their job, and has many of them. It is called playing team defense.
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  #97  
Old 03-09-17, 09:43 AM
Jim Lahey Jim Lahey is offline
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So because Revis only spent one year in NE, that means he wasn't a difference maker for them? Same with Talib? What an utterly moronic statement. And who said anything about an all time great? Difference maker does not equal all time great. Using that terrible logic, there's only what? 3-5 difference makers in the NFL in any given year?

I can do the same thing. You used zero evidence or stats to back your claims up.

Revis - one year. Top 3 CB. Difference maker
Seymour - Difference maker
Wilfork - Top 5 DT for most of his time with the Pats. Difference maker
Bruschi - Great player on some great teams. Difference maker
Harrison - 2003 and 2004, one of the best CBs in the league. Difference maker
Samuel - Difference maker. 10 interceptions and 24 passes knocked down in 2006.
Talib - 4 INT, 14 passes knocked down. Sealed the win in Atlanta with a knocked down pass. Differnece maker
Hightower - great. Difference maker. Just like the rest.

What about Ty Law? Jerod Mayo? Albert Haynesworth? Chandler Jones? Jamie Collins? Malcolm Butler?
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  #98  
Old 03-09-17, 10:11 AM
clarkgriswold clarkgriswold is offline
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Browns signing the annually mediocre Kenny Britt. Not a good sign for Pryor returning.
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  #99  
Old 03-09-17, 10:22 AM
Jim Lahey Jim Lahey is offline
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4 year, $32.5 million with $17 million guaranteed for Kenny Britt. Gotta imagine the Browns outbid themselves for this one.
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  #100  
Old 03-09-17, 10:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Lahey View Post
4 year, $32.5 million with $17 million guaranteed for Kenny Britt. Gotta imagine the Browns outbid themselves for this one.
Good Christ! And I wondered if they would overpay for Pryor?
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  #101  
Old 03-09-17, 10:51 AM
clarkgriswold clarkgriswold is offline
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* 9 prior arrests
* Consistent underperformer
* Problem with drops
* Not great in the lockerroom

PERFECT BROWN!
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  #102  
Old 03-09-17, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by clarkgriswold View Post
* 9 prior arrests
* Consistent underperformer
* Problem with drops
* Not great in the lockerroom

PERFECT BROWN!
Wonder what analytics they used to factor in those attributes?
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  #103  
Old 03-09-17, 01:46 PM
joesports joesports is offline
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Originally Posted by Jim Lahey View Post
So because Revis only spent one year in NE, that means he wasn't a difference maker for them? Same with Talib? What an utterly moronic statement. And who said anything about an all time great? Difference maker does not equal all time great. Using that terrible logic, there's only what? 3-5 difference makers in the NFL in any given year?

I can do the same thing. You used zero evidence or stats to back your claims up.

Revis - one year. Top 3 CB. Difference maker
Seymour - Difference maker
Wilfork - Top 5 DT for most of his time with the Pats. Difference maker
Bruschi - Great player on some great teams. Difference maker
Harrison - 2003 and 2004, one of the best CBs in the league. Difference maker
Samuel - Difference maker. 10 interceptions and 24 passes knocked down in 2006.
Talib - 4 INT, 14 passes knocked down. Sealed the win in Atlanta with a knocked down pass. Differnece maker
Hightower - great. Difference maker. Just like the rest.

What about Ty Law? Jerod Mayo? Albert Haynesworth? Chandler Jones? Jamie Collins? Malcolm Butler?
You think Rodney Harrison was a CB ... proves you are clueless!!!!!
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  #104  
Old 03-09-17, 01:51 PM
clarkgriswold clarkgriswold is offline
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Originally Posted by bedevil View Post
Wonder what analytics they used to factor in those attributes?
Most of them come from a law enforcement database.
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  #105  
Old 03-09-17, 01:54 PM
clarkgriswold clarkgriswold is offline
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Regardless of what the Pats do, Garrett is the pick. Plain and simple. Plays on, plays off, whatever, he's the consensus best player in the draft. There's been less debate on that than I've seen about a potential first pick in a long time.
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  #106  
Old 03-09-17, 02:02 PM
Jim Lahey Jim Lahey is offline
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You think Rodney Harrison was a CB ... proves you are clueless!!!!!
You do know "D" and "C" are right next to each other on the keyboard, right? If that's the best counterargument you can come up with it's clear you're the clueless one. You have yet to provide one bit of statistical evidence for any of those guys being a difference maker. Only thing you've offered is: "they only played one year there, they suck!"
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  #107  
Old 03-09-17, 02:04 PM
Jim Lahey Jim Lahey is offline
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Originally Posted by clarkgriswold View Post
Regardless of what the Pats do, Garrett is the pick. Plain and simple. Plays on, plays off, whatever, he's the consensus best player in the draft. There's been less debate on that than I've seen about a potential first pick in a long time.
Luck, 2012? But agreed on Garrett. Of course Joesports doesn't want him though. He's been consistently wrong on the Browns player/coach personnel decisions for awhile now. I remember when he argued that Schurmer, Chud and Pettine along with Quinn, McCoy, Weeden should all be given more time, and the only reason the Browns were awful wasn't because of the bad picks made but, because they weren't given enough time. The fact NONE of those guys are head coaches/starting QBs else where proves him wrong.
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  #108  
Old 03-09-17, 02:11 PM
joesports joesports is offline
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Originally Posted by clarkgriswold View Post
Regardless of what the Pats do, Garrett is the pick. Plain and simple. Plays on, plays off, whatever, he's the consensus best player in the draft. There's been less debate on that than I've seen about a potential first pick in a long time.
There is no doubt he has the most talent of anybody in the draft ... and I don't know him or have ever talked to his coaches and people who do know him ... just judging him from what I see on video ... it scares me to take a guy who is playing less hard than most other players ... that is why he is being asked about it ... is he going to be the leader of your defense? Is this the guy that is going to lift the rest of the players to greater heights? I hope I am wrong, I hope he is everything these draft experts think he is ... I just have seen these drafts experts get infatuated with 40 times, heights, weights, and all that combine stuff and forget to watch the video to see if he can play ... to have these guys be just what they were in college ... a really talented player who sometimes looks great and sometimes disappears for most of the game.
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  #109  
Old 03-09-17, 02:13 PM
Jim Lahey Jim Lahey is offline
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Originally Posted by joesports View Post
There is no doubt he has the most talent of anybody in the draft ... and I don't know him or have ever talked to his coaches and people who do know him ... just judging him from what I see on video ... it scares me to take a guy who is playing less hard than most other players ... that is why he is being asked about it ... is he going to be the leader of your defense? Is this the guy that is going to lift the rest of the players to greater heights? I hope I am wrong, I hope he is everything these draft experts think he is ... I just have seen these drafts experts get infatuated with 40 times, heights, weights, and all that combine stuff and forget to watch the video to see if he can play ... to have these guys be just what they were in college ... a really talented player who sometimes looks great and sometimes disappears for most of the game.
Yeah, I'm sure every franchise just sits there and watches the combine and doesn't watch a single second of film.
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  #110  
Old 03-09-17, 02:29 PM
joesports joesports is offline
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You do know "D" and "C" are right next to each other on the keyboard, right? If that's the best counterargument you can come up with it's clear you're the clueless one. You have yet to provide one bit of statistical evidence for any of those guys being a difference maker. Only thing you've offered is: "they only played one year there, they suck!"
Great excuse you clueless fool .... Here is the second. Albert Haynesworth, played 6 games with NE at the end of his career, and made 3 tackles ... real difference maker there you clueless idiot. Where are your great stats ... 4 INTs make a player a difference maker???????

The point about 1 year is that is all he played with NE, there is no doubt that Revis is a difference maker, but he was only on their team 1 year ... same with Talib, you act like they were there forever. I am not saying that most of those guys were not good football players, just not difference makers.

PS - Never said Schumer, Weeden, Pettine and Quinn should be given more time. What I did say was I would give McCoy one more year, because I did not like the QB in the draft, especially Weeden ... I still think they would have been better sticking with McCoy and not drafting Weeden. Chud ... I have no idea if he would be a good coach or not, but firing a coach every year is stupid.
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  #111  
Old 03-09-17, 02:39 PM
Jim Lahey Jim Lahey is offline
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Yeah, I'm sure you've never made a typo before. There you go, you have finally excluded one person from the list. You've yet to give any other reasoning for the other 13 guys on the list other than "they only played one year, they suck!!!!"

Okay, so you agree Revis and Talib were difference makers. Glad we got that out of the way. Not sure why that was so hard for you to admit. And nope, never said or acted like they were there for forever. You don't have to be around for forever to be a difference maker. Hell you just admitted those two were difference makers. If you make a difference in one year, you're a difference maker for that team. Sorry you can't grasp this very basic definition. You're basically arguing that Revis doesn't deserve a Super Bowl Ring....because he was only on the team for one year. I mean seriously, who's definition of a difference-maker is "Sure fire HOFer who has played on a team for 10 years" That's just incredibly stupid....which I guess is par the course for you.

And yeah, you definitely have said that the Browns are bad because they lack continuity and they shouldn't move on from bad coaches/players after realizing they are bad.
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  #112  
Old 03-09-17, 03:05 PM
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You guys eloquently state your positions and just about the time I start to buy in you act like 6 year olds by calling each other names and your point gets completely lost.
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  #113  
Old 03-09-17, 03:08 PM
Jim Lahey Jim Lahey is offline
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Zeitler to the Browns. He's good, but he's definitely not the 2nd best guard in the NFL (2nd highest paid). 5 years, $60 million. PFF had him as the 7th best guard last year.
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  #114  
Old 03-09-17, 03:26 PM
clarkgriswold clarkgriswold is offline
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Zeitler to the Browns. He's good, but he's definitely not the 2nd best guard in the NFL (2nd highest paid). 5 years, $60 million. PFF had him as the 7th best guard last year.
That's the problem with sucking- you have to overpay to get people to come to the Browns.
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  #115  
Old 03-09-17, 03:28 PM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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http://www.cleveland.com/browns/inde...nding_joe.html

Bitonio and center JC Tretter of the GB Packers now under contract. Cam Erving to sub in at guard ?
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  #116  
Old 03-09-17, 03:29 PM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Looking more and more like a defensive-focused draft.
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  #117  
Old 03-09-17, 03:39 PM
clarkgriswold clarkgriswold is offline
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Brock Freaking Osweiler???????
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  #118  
Old 03-09-17, 03:40 PM
clarkgriswold clarkgriswold is offline
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Originally Posted by cabezadecaballo View Post
http://www.cleveland.com/browns/inde...nding_joe.html

Bitonio and center JC Tretter of the GB Packers now under contract. Cam Erving to sub in at guard ?
For Jacksonville I hope.
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  #119  
Old 03-09-17, 03:40 PM
Jim Lahey Jim Lahey is offline
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Greco looked pretty good before going down with an injury, didn't he? Odd signing of Tretter. Hasn't even played in half his possible games because of injury.
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  #120  
Old 03-09-17, 03:41 PM
clarkgriswold clarkgriswold is offline
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Texans dump Osweiler with a 2nd pick to the Browns just to ditch that contract.
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