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  #1  
Old 09-22-14, 09:18 AM
McKDogs1 McKDogs1 is offline
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Suburban League > Federal League??

As a Stark County native and Federal League member, it pains me to say this, but it looks like the times have changed, and that the football of the Suburban League of Summit and Medina counties may have surpassed the once far superior Federal League & Stark County.

I find this very surprising, especially when you consider that the Federal League is primarily Division 1 teams, and the Suburban is primarily Division 2 and 3 teams!

SUBURBAN Div County
Nordonia(4-0) [2:4] Summit
Copley(4-0) [2:4] Summit
Tallmadge(4-0) [3:7] Summit
Wadsworth(3-1)[1:1] Medina
Revere(3-1) [3:7] Summit
Green(2-2) [1:1] Summit
Highland(2-2) [2:4] Medina
Cloverleaf(0-4) [3:8] Medina

FEDERAL/Stark Division
Massillon (4-0) [2:4]
Jackson(4-0) [1:1]
GlenOak(3-1) [1:1]
McKinley(1-3) [1:1]
Hoover(2-2) [1:1]
Perry(2-2) [1:1]
Lake(1-3) [2:4]

Not too long ago, it would have been laughable to even suggest that the Suburban League could even compete with the Fed/Stark, let alone be considered as possibly better.

Hats off to the Suburban League schools for elevating your game!
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  #2  
Old 09-22-14, 10:01 AM
BHSspartans13 BHSspartans13 is offline
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LOL. All one needs to do at who the schools were playing in their non-conference slates. And this is when many of the Fed schools are somewhat down compared to their traditional pasts. Some of those 4-0 and 3-1 Suburban league schools would probably be 1-3 or 0-4 if they were playing some of the schedules that most Fed schools have.
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  #3  
Old 09-22-14, 10:21 AM
bubba25 bubba25 is offline
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the shear size of the FL schools still gives them an advantage. i think most SL teams would be worn down in the second half against most FL teams due to depth of talent.
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  #4  
Old 09-22-14, 10:24 AM
TIGERS#71 TIGERS#71 is offline
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I seen the Nordonia @ Highland game this past week & came away impressed with Nordonia. Highland has dropped off dramatically from the team that knocked my Tigers out last year. I have seen Tallmadge on film & they look pretty good. After Nordonia & Tallmadge I really don't think there is much room for comparison with the Fed. I can't really include Copley right now in the discussion because they really haven't beaten anyone yet.
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  #5  
Old 09-22-14, 10:27 AM
tallmadge H2 dad tallmadge H2 dad is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TIGERS#71 View Post
I seen the Nordonia @ Highland game this past week & came away impressed with Nordonia. Highland has dropped off dramatically from the team that knocked my Tigers out last year. I have seen Tallmadge on film & they look pretty good. After Nordonia & Tallmadge I really don't think there is much room for comparison with the Fed. I can't really include Copley right now in the discussion because they really haven't beaten anyone yet.
Totally agree. I think the top SL teams might be included with the FL, but from top to bottom, the Fed is still the stronger league in my opinion. So where a Jackson might be equal to a Nordonia or Tallmadge, Lake > Cloverleaf.
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  #6  
Old 09-22-14, 11:21 AM
FanDad FanDad is offline
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Maybe the more pertinent list would be the stronger entries from next year's Suburban big side?

Hudson
Nordonia
Stow
Wadsworth
Brecksville

Currently down "bigs"
Cuyahoga Falls
Twinsburg
North Royalton

Add the three strongest on the small side

Highland
Aurora
Tallmadge

You have 8 pretty good football programs
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  #7  
Old 09-22-14, 11:29 AM
Oil Filter Oil Filter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FanDad View Post
Maybe the more pertinent list would be the stronger entries from next year's Suburban big side?

Hudson currently down: Twinsburg
Nordonia Cuyahoga Falls
Stow North Royalton
Wadsworth
Brecksville

Add the three strongest on the small side

Highland
Aurora
Tallmadge
Yeah, the more pertinent list is to pick and choose from 16 teams -- most of which aren't even in the league now -- and compare them with the 6 teams currently in the Fed.
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  #8  
Old 09-22-14, 11:58 AM
FanDad FanDad is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oil Filter View Post
Yeah, the more pertinent list is to pick and choose from 16 teams -- most of which aren't even in the league now -- and compare them with the 6 teams currently in the Fed.
Well I guess that you and the Fed should enjoy continuing to live in the past. I'm looking ahead. Do you see the Fed changing after adding Green? I think Green left the changing Suburban big side for an overall easier schedule in the Fed.

As for the present, Green gave Jackson a game for a while, and Green beat Lake. The rest of Green's Suburban schedule may not translate directly as a comparison of strength, but it will say a little bit about relative strength.

Last edited by FanDad; 09-22-14 at 12:09 PM.
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  #9  
Old 09-22-14, 12:19 PM
Oil Filter Oil Filter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FanDad View Post
Well I guess that you and the Fed should enjoy continuing to live in the past. I'm looking ahead.
Translation: I'm ignoring the present.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FanDad View Post
Do you see the Fed changing after adding Green?
If you want to look ahead, look to the more pertinent question: how long until this two-tiered SL splits in half? The Fed will still be there after the implosion.
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  #10  
Old 09-22-14, 12:37 PM
FanDad FanDad is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oil Filter View Post
Translation: I'm ignoring the present.


If you want to look ahead, look to the more pertinent question: how long until this two-tiered SL splits in half? The Fed will still be there after the implosion.
If you want to talk the present and reality, the first thing we need to do is throw out Massillon, because the Fed wants no part of you in a league. So if we look at the six Fed teams against the top six Suburban teams (more than fair because the Fed schools are larger), then I would have to say the Suburban is stronger at present.

Going forward, whatever configuration remains of the larger Suburban teams will likely be stronger than the declining Fed, because the communities in the routes 82, 80, and 91 triangle will stay together. Massillon's MO will leave them on the outside looking in for any league.

Last edited by FanDad; 09-22-14 at 12:56 PM.
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  #11  
Old 09-22-14, 12:45 PM
McKDogs1 McKDogs1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FanDad View Post
If you want to talk the present and reality, the first thing we need to do is throw out Massillon,
Kind of like how Highland threw massillon out of the playoffs last year?
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  #12  
Old 09-22-14, 12:52 PM
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I'd take the top 6 in the new GCC over either of those leagues going into next year. But all 3 are pretty solid.
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  #13  
Old 09-22-14, 12:53 PM
FanDad FanDad is offline
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Originally Posted by McKDogs1 View Post
Kind of like how Highland threw massillon out of the playoffs last year?
Kind of....... more theoretically in this case.

Last year, I think you could say Massillon was removed forcibly. No theory involved.
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  #14  
Old 09-22-14, 01:03 PM
TIGERS#71 TIGERS#71 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FanDad View Post
Well I guess that you and the Fed should enjoy continuing to live in the past. I'm looking ahead. Do you see the Fed changing after adding Green? I think Green left the changing Suburban big side for an overall easier schedule in the Fed.

As for the present, Green gave Jackson a game for a while, and Green beat Lake. The rest of Green's Suburban schedule may not translate directly as a comparison of strength, but it will say a little bit about relative strength.
Green IMO could easily be one on those teams in just a couple years be a serious force. That community is booming right now & no clear signs of slowing down. A favorable housing market & proximity to expanding retail, restaurants, medical care etc. could have Green becoming a rather enticing community to relocate to for many families!
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  #15  
Old 09-22-14, 01:14 PM
McKDogs1 McKDogs1 is offline
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Sadly, whether you include massillon or not, I think the Suburban is stronger. Considering last year massy crushed the Fed champs, and then were beaten by Highland, it is kind of hard to argue otherwise.
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  #16  
Old 09-22-14, 01:25 PM
McKDogs1 McKDogs1 is offline
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Green???

Don't get me started on Green. They stole massillon's colors and McKinley's mascot. Here's a thought, get your own mascot and colors - and here's a hint for the colors - one of them should probably be GREEN. Hello?!?

Green is definitely a booming community though! Boettler park, the new Twisted Olive, lots of new shopping.

Not sure how the Green Orange Crush (WTF??) fits into this conversation since they were beaten pretty soundly by teams from both leagues, and will probably end up near the bottom of the SL this year, and the bottom of the FL next year. But definitely an up and coming community!
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  #17  
Old 09-22-14, 02:09 PM
Oil Filter Oil Filter is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FanDad View Post
If you want to talk the present and reality, the first thing we need to do is throw out Massillon...
Rigging the game even further? The SL gets to grab teams from all over NEO, but the Fed is limited to their 6 actual members?

It's easy to see why you'd want to do that, though. It's had to argue that your group is better when the two best teams are on the other side.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FanDad View Post
Going forward, whatever configuration remains of the larger Suburban teams will likely be stronger than the declining Fed, because the communities in the routes 82, 80, and 91 triangle will stay together.
But the "larger Suburban teams" aren't really the Suburban, are they? Again, you're trying to polish your resume using schools which have never played a single game in league competition.

Or more to the point, the Fed will be together longer than the about-to-be-Suburban big schools. The SL's new upper division will split away from the small schools, then it will fracture apart. Wait and see.

Last edited by Oil Filter; 09-22-14 at 02:32 PM.
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  #18  
Old 09-22-14, 02:12 PM
tallmadge H2 dad tallmadge H2 dad is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Oil Filter View Post
No one has brought Massillon into this conversation. Until you. The topic is Fed vs. SL. What kind of dumbazz would think that includes Massillon?


But the "larger Suburban teams" aren't really the Suburban, are they? Again, you're trying to polish your resume using schools which have never played a single game in league competition.

Or more to the point, the Fed will be together longer than the about-to-be-Suburban big schools. The SL's new upper division will split away from the small schools, then it will fracture apart. Wait and see.
Bottom line...most years, the top couple of SL teams are just as good as the top Fed teams. as an overall conference, I still think the Fed is stronger. Just my opinion.
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  #19  
Old 09-22-14, 02:13 PM
Maxie Maxie is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McKDogs1 View Post
Sadly, whether you include massillon or not, I think the Suburban is stronger. Considering last year massy crushed the Fed champs, and then were beaten by Highland, it is kind of hard to argue otherwise.

You are making this analogy using one game??? What about Massillon's record with Nordonia, Twinsburg, Cuyahoga Falls and Stow?

In reality, make all the comparisons you want. However, Massillon should be kept out of the analogy because the Tigers aren't a member of your league. You're happy, we're happy.
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  #20  
Old 09-22-14, 02:17 PM
jbj jbj is offline
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Originally Posted by McKDogs1 View Post
Green???

Don't get me started on Green. They stole massillon's colors and McKinley's mascot. Here's a thought, get your own mascot and colors - and here's a hint for the colors - one of them should probably be GREEN. Hello?!?

Green is definitely a booming community though! Boettler park, the new Twisted Olive, lots of new shopping.

Not sure how the Green Orange Crush (WTF??) fits into this conversation since they were beaten pretty soundly by teams from both leagues, and will probably end up near the bottom of the SL this year, and the bottom of the FL next year. But definitely an up and coming community!
Green many many years ago was short on money and Massillon was kind to give them uniforms to use at start up. That is the reason they are orange and black. You should really know the facts before your lip opens
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  #21  
Old 09-22-14, 02:28 PM
Oil Filter Oil Filter is offline
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Originally Posted by tallmadge H2 dad View Post
Bottom line...most years, the top couple of SL teams are just as good as the top Fed teams. as an overall conference, I still think the Fed is stronger. Just my opinion.
Sounds reasonable.

But seriously, where does the "SL is better" talk come from? Because the SL has beat up on a bunch of weak teams? The aggregate record of the SL's OOC opponents is 37-59. The aggregate record of the Fed's OOC opponents is 47-28. .385 vs. .627. Bit of a difference, wouldn't you say?
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  #22  
Old 09-22-14, 02:47 PM
McKDogs1 McKDogs1 is offline
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Originally Posted by jbj View Post
Green many many years ago was short on money and Massillon was kind to give them uniforms to use at start up. That is the reason they are orange and black. You should really know the facts before your lip opens
Okay, so they borrowed the colors. Whatever. Is Green orange? No. Green is Green, so their colors should be green. I think nowadays the Green School District is no longer in the red and now has enough green ($) to buy some green uniforms!

Is Green the new Orange is the New Black?? Heck, I don't know. I just know its confusing to go to a Green game and see a bunch of freakin' orange. It makes me white with rage, but maybe that's just because I hate orange.

If you go to an Orange game up in Pepper Pike, you'll see that their color is ORANGE, not green, or purple, or blue. Imagine that.

By the way, I'm just messin' around here Green people. Please don't take it personally. Don't be blue because I'm criticizing your colors. But have some guts, quit bein' yellow and get some new colors. I'm sure your fans would be tickled pink if you did.
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  #23  
Old 09-22-14, 02:49 PM
y2h y2h is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by McKDogs1 View Post
As a Stark County native and Federal League member, it pains me to say this, but it looks like the times have changed, and that the football of the Suburban League of Summit and Medina counties may have surpassed the once far superior Federal League & Stark County.

I find this very surprising, especially when you consider that the Federal League is primarily Division 1 teams, and the Suburban is primarily Division 2 and 3 teams!

SUBURBAN Div County
Nordonia(4-0) [2:4] Summit
Copley(4-0) [2:4] Summit
Tallmadge(4-0) [3:7] Summit
Wadsworth(3-1)[1:1] Medina
Revere(3-1) [3:7] Summit
Green(2-2) [1:1] Summit
Highland(2-2) [2:4] Medina
Cloverleaf(0-4) [3:8] Medina

FEDERAL/Stark Division
Massillon (4-0) [2:4]
Jackson(4-0) [1:1]
GlenOak(3-1) [1:1]
McKinley(1-3) [1:1]
Hoover(2-2) [1:1]
Perry(2-2) [1:1]
Lake(1-3) [2:4]

Not too long ago, it would have been laughable to even suggest that the Suburban League could even compete with the Fed/Stark, let alone be considered as possibly better.

Hats off to the Suburban League schools for elevating your game!
Its still laughable....
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  #24  
Old 09-22-14, 07:15 PM
COLTCOUNTRY COLTCOUNTRY is offline
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Originally Posted by TIGERS#71 View Post
Green IMO could easily be one on those teams in just a couple years be a serious force. That community is booming right now & no clear signs of slowing down. A favorable housing market & proximity to expanding retail, restaurants, medical care etc. could have Green becoming a rather enticing community to relocate to for many families!
They have been saying this about Green for years.
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  #25  
Old 09-22-14, 07:31 PM
OBIE-WON OBIE-WON is offline
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Originally Posted by McKDogs1 View Post
Kind of like how Highland threw massillon out of the playoffs last year?
Long live the Bees.
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  #26  
Old 09-22-14, 08:10 PM
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Originally Posted by jbj View Post
Green many many years ago was short on money and Massillon was kind to give them uniforms to use at start up. That is the reason they are orange and black. You should really know the facts before your lip opens
Green actually wanted to have "green" colors in the recent past but Highland and Cloverleaf were already "green" in the Suburban League.
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  #27  
Old 09-23-14, 08:20 AM
TIGERS#71 TIGERS#71 is offline
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They have been saying this about Green for years.
They have? I was unaware. All I know is when I drive through Green it is growing fast.
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  #28  
Old 09-23-14, 08:31 AM
COLTCOUNTRY COLTCOUNTRY is offline
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SL-Fed argument has been going on for years and will never be resolved. It's like the Middle East.

Yet, every year someone brings it up.
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  #29  
Old 09-23-14, 08:56 AM
FanDad FanDad is offline
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Originally Posted by Maxie View Post
You are making this analogy using one game??? What about Massillon's record with Nordonia, Twinsburg, Cuyahoga Falls and Stow?

In reality, make all the comparisons you want. However, Massillon should be kept out of the analogy because the Tigers aren't a member of your league. You're happy, we're happy.
You are right.

Massillon is not part of the Fed, and probably never will be. We may as well add 2013 St. V's to the Suburban list if we are going to compare Fed + Massillon.
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  #30  
Old 09-23-14, 08:57 AM
FanDad FanDad is offline
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Originally Posted by COLTCOUNTRY View Post
SL-Fed argument has been going on for years and will never be resolved. It's like the Middle East.

Yet, every year someone brings it up.
This is the last year that it will be an argument. Next year the Fed won't be close.
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