Yappi Sports - THE Ohio Prep Sports Authority  

Go Back   Yappi Sports - THE Ohio Prep Sports Authority > Boys HS Sports > Boys Track & Field/Cross Country

Hello Guest!
Take a minute to register, It's 100% FREE! What are you waiting for?
Register Now
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 12-06-16, 08:19 AM
claynation claynation is offline
All District
 
Join Date: 11-03-14
Posts: 121
claynation is on a distinguished road
2017 OATCCC clinic details?

Does anyone have a schedule for the clinic yet? The OATCCC's website still has the 2016 clinic schedule posted. Trying to decide if I want to attend or not.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #2  
Old 12-06-16, 08:43 AM
EuclidandViren EuclidandViren is offline
All Ohio
 
Join Date: 04-01-12
Posts: 768
EuclidandViren is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by claynation View Post
Does anyone have a schedule for the clinic yet? The OATCCC's website still has the 2016 clinic schedule posted. Trying to decide if I want to attend or not.
I recommend always attending. The information from the speakers is only a small aspect of the clinic. At the clinic networking with coaches from other schools is a large aspect. Additionally, the clinic provides a bonding experience for coaching staffs.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 12-06-16, 09:18 AM
SOTT SOTT is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 01-08-06
Posts: 2,957
SOTT is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by EuclidandViren View Post
I recommend always attending. The information from the speakers is only a small aspect of the clinic. At the clinic networking with coaches from other schools is a large aspect. Additionally, the clinic provides a bonding experience for coaching staffs.
I agree. As much as it's nice to hear from different speakers on a variety of topics, I enjoy just spending time with the coaching staff from our school as well as those from other schools.

Always a good time.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-02-17, 09:01 PM
claynation claynation is offline
All District
 
Join Date: 11-03-14
Posts: 121
claynation is on a distinguished road
Any update here? OATCCC website still hasn't posted a schedule.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-02-17, 10:20 PM
Run4Life Run4Life is offline
All Ohio
 
Join Date: 10-08-10
Posts: 555
Run4Life is on a distinguished road
Remember these may change prior to the clinic, but this is the schedule as of today.

2017 OAT/CCC
TRACK FIELD CLINIC SPEAKER SCHEDULE
THURSDAY JANUARY 26th
5:00 PM
CLINIC REGISTRATION
TIME/ROOM
TOPIC
SPEAKER AFFILIATION
6:30-9:30 PM
Ohio College Displays in Main Hallway
Participating Colleges
6:30-7:20 PM
Regent
Rotational Drills in the Throws Ashley Muffet/Duncan Ohio State University

A
Team Culture/Training/Success in Dist. Train. Hannah Weiss Capital University

B
Block Clearance & Perfecting the Drive Phase Matt Cole Baldwin Wallace Univ.

C-D-E
Commonalities/Prep of Elite Pole Vaulters Brian Clymer Kenyon University

7:30-8:20 PM
Regent
Major Faults & Simple Corrections in Throws Nathan Fanger Kent State U

A
How Minor Changes Lead to Major Strides Ben Carlson Ohio Wesleyan Univ.

B
Breaking Bad Habits & Proper Hurdle Tech Kirby Blacklely/Overton Findlay U

C-D-E
Comp.Take Off Posture,Power, Performance Riley Northrup Ashland University

8:30-9:20 PM
Regent Introducing Weight Throw to High Schoolers Jud Logan Ashland U

A
Training the 5,000M Linh Nguye Univ. of Toledo

B
Sprinting the Dragon Way Gray Horn Tiffin University

C-D-E
Horizontal Jumper Training Methods Brian Brillon Ohio State University

Magnolia OHSAA Central District Coaches Meeting Andy Cox/Rex Carr Worthington/Lakewood

9:30-10:30 PM
A
OATCCC General Membership Meeting Jeff Sheets Heath High School

10:30-12:30 AM
Regent/C-D-E MF Athletic Social & Karaoke

FRIDAY JANUARY 27th
7:30 AM
CLINIC REGISTRATION TIME/ROOM TOPIC SPEAKER AFFILIATION

7:30-8:30 AM
Magnolia
Athletes In Action Prayer Breakfast Tim Ellis Athletes in Action

8:30-4:00 PM
Friday only time for registration
Vendor Hall
Rio Grande University College Credit
Bob Willey
Rio Grande University
(1 & 2 hr graduate credit available)

8:30-9:30 AM
Juniper Technically Strong, But Mentally Weak Nathan Fanger Kent State U

A
Top 7 Lessons for Coaching Distance Runners Dr. Jason Karp Run Fit

B
Developing 100/110M Hurdlers Lonnie Green Purdue University

C-D-E High Jump Training & Technique Joe Walker Jr. Univ. of Louisville

Regent
Good Middle School Meet Management Richard Thomasey Ridge H.S. (N J)

Magnolia
OHSAA Northwest Dist. Coaches Meeting
Jim Epperly WaynesfieldGoshen H.S.

9:45-10:45 AM
Juniper Discus Throw 2107 Mac Wilkins Olympic Gold Medalist

A
OHSAA Rules Interpretation Div I Dale Gabor OHSAA

B
Coaching the 400 Meters Lonnie Green Purdue University

C-D-E
Technique & Accuracy in the Long Jump Boo Schexnayder USTFCCCA

Regent Middle School Sprint Starts Wayne Clark OAT&CCC

11:00-12:00 PM
Juniper
Introduction to Weight & Hammer Throws Nathan Fanger Kent State U

A
Understanding Interval Training Dr. Jason Karp Run Fit

B
OHSAA Rules Interpretation Div II Dale Gabor OHSAA

C-D-E
Long Jump Joe Walker Jr. Univ. of Louisville

Regent
Middle School High Jump Tim Walters OAT&CCC

12:15-1:15 PM
Juniper Shot Put 2017 Mac Wilkins Olympic Gold Medalist

A
Middle Distance Training Brice Allen Ohio State University

B
Developing Linear Speed Lonnie Green Purdue University

C-D-E
OHSAA Rules Interpretation Div III Dale Gabor OHSAA

Regent
Middle School Sprint Mechanics Tim Walters OAT&CCC

Magnolia
Northeast District Coaches Meeting Diane Krumpak South Range H.S.

1:30-2:30 PM
Juniper Velocity Based Training Larry Judge Ball State University

A
41 Years of Training Distance Runners Ron Martin OAT&CCC

B
What Does It Mean To Be A Coach Joe Walker Jr. Univ. of Louisville

C-D-E
Prev & Handling of ShinSplint/Hamstring Inj Boo Schexnayder USTFCCCA

Regent
Middle School Pole Vault Jack Warner Olympic Coach

Magnolia
Southeast District Coaches Meeting Al Riffey Warren H.S.

2:45-3:45 PM
Juniper Glide Shot Put Larry Judge Ball State University

A
Lactate Threshold Dr. Jason Karp Run Fit

B
Coaching the Sprints Charles Clinton USATF

C-D-E
Pole Vault Jack Warner Olympic Coach

Regent
Middle School Long Jump Tim Walters OAT&CCC

Magnolia
Southwest District Coaches Meeting Michael Beaty Meadowdale H.S.

4:00-5:00 PM
Juniper Path to Olympic Gold Mac Wilkins Olympic Gold Medalist

A
Training Tips/The New Rave in Distance Tr. Ron Martin OAT&CCC

B
Coaching the Hurdles Charles Clinton USATF

C-D-E
Basic Triple Jump Boo Schexnayder USTFCCCA

Regent
Middle School Distance Jack Lintz OAT&CCC

Magnolia
East District Coaches Meeting Doug Joy John Glenn H.S.

6:30-9:30 PM
A-B HALL OF FAME BANQUET

9:30-12:30 AM
B
UCS Social

7:30 AM
CLINIC REGISTRATION
8:00-10:00AM

C-D-E
OHSAA Pole Vault Safety Certification Marty Dahlman Watkins Memorial H.S.
2 Hour Required Class

Juniper
M-F Throws School

8:15-9:15 AM
Foundation: Stand/Throw Shot Put & Discus Mac Wilkins Olympic Gold Medalist

9:25-10:25 AM
Learn to Turn Larry Judge Ball State University

10:35-11:35 AM
Glide Shot Put Mac Wilkins Olympic Gold Medalist

11:45-12:45 PM
Indoor Weight Throw Larry Judge Ball State University

12:55-1:55 PM
Discus & Rotational Shot Put Mac Wilkins Olympic Gold Medalist

Regent
Asics Distance School

8:15-9:15 AM
Training Female Distance Runners Dr. Jason Karp Run Fit

9:25-10:25 AM
Distance Training Brice Allen Ohio State Univ.

10:35-11:35 AM
Art & Science of Recovery Dr. Jason Karp Run Fit

11:45-12:45 PM
Goal Setting/Communicating with Millennials Brice Allen Ohio State Univ.

12:55-1:55 PM
Running Myths Dr. Jason Karp Run Fit

A
First to the Finish Sprints/Hurdles School

8:15-9:15 AM
Coaching Relays Charles Clinton USATF

9:25-10:25 AM
Strength Training for the Sprints & Hurdles Tim Walters OAT&CCC

10:35-11:35 AM
Sprint Drills Charles Clinton USATF

11:45-12:45 PM
Coaching the 4 X 100M Relay Wayne Clark OAT&CCC

12:55-1:55 PM
Hurdle Drills Charles Clinton USATF

B
UCS Jumps School
8:15-9:15 AM
Progressions for the Long Jump Boo Schexnayder USTFCCCA

9:25-10:25 AM
Plyometrics for Jumpers Boo Schexnayder USTFCCCA

10:35-11:35 AM
Pole Vault I Jack Warner OAT&CCC

11:45-12:45 PM
Pole Vault II Jack Warner OAT&CCC

12:55-1:55 PM
Circuit Training for Jumpers Boo Schexnayder USTFCCCA

C-D-E
ODE Pupil Validation

12:00-12:30 PM
Registration ($20.00)

12:30-2:30 PM
Class Tim Berger Muskingum University
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-29-17, 07:01 AM
psycho_dad psycho_dad is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 08-17-10
Posts: 2,587
psycho_dad is on a distinguished road
Sort of surprised that no one has commented on the proposal to go to 6 divisions.
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-29-17, 07:34 AM
SOTT SOTT is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 01-08-06
Posts: 2,957
SOTT is on a distinguished road
I want to see the PowerPoint before I make too many judgements but my initial reaction is not favorable to the idea. I will say I was definitely not impressed with the way it was presented to the coaches. At one point the presenter from Loveland made the comment, "Even if you don't understand all the details, tell your ADs you're in favor of the proposal."
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-29-17, 09:15 AM
ccrunner609 ccrunner609 is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 02-15-10
Posts: 2,612
ccrunner609 is on a distinguished road
Scott,

You needed to see the whole proposal with powerpoint. It was well done and the work that was put into it was amazing.

As for what they did this year, not so much. During the SW coaches meeting the coaches really had some questions that werent anwsered with anything that seemed logical.

Question: How do you expect to run 6 divisions at the district level when in alot of cases you cant get enough officials and locations that are willing to do 3?
Answer: Districts will be scrapped and the state moves to qualifying standards for a regional meet where the top 16 get in.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-29-17, 10:18 AM
SOTT SOTT is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 01-08-06
Posts: 2,957
SOTT is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccrunner609 View Post
Scott,

You needed to see the whole proposal with powerpoint. It was well done and the work that was put into it was amazing.

As for what they did this year, not so much. During the SW coaches meeting the coaches really had some questions that werent anwsered with anything that seemed logical.

Question: How do you expect to run 6 divisions at the district level when in alot of cases you cant get enough officials and locations that are willing to do 3?
Answer: Districts will be scrapped and the state moves to qualifying standards for a regional meet where the top 16 get in.
Those are my points exactly. I DO want to see the PowerPoint because I do appreciate the fact that people spent a lot of hard work coming up with the proposal. As you said though, the way it was presented to coaches this weekend was terrible. The same thing happened in the NE District coaches meeting. Questions were answered with what seemed to be disdain.

How does everyone else feel about scrapping districts? To me, it goes against the spirit of our sport: competition.

Once again, maybe the PowerPoint will answer this question, but it seems logical to me that if six meets can be run in three days (as is proposed) why can't four meets (ie. having four divisions) be run in two days? Six divided be three is two, and so is four divided by 2.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-29-17, 11:13 AM
psycho_dad psycho_dad is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 08-17-10
Posts: 2,587
psycho_dad is on a distinguished road
Not sure why 4 won't work...Seemed a bit fuzzy with the math, but only saw one brief question and answer tid bit and the questions didn't seem to be answered. 6 is too many divisions.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-29-17, 11:37 AM
ccrunner609 ccrunner609 is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 02-15-10
Posts: 2,612
ccrunner609 is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_dad View Post
Not sure why 4 won't work...Seemed a bit fuzzy with the math, but only saw one brief question and answer tid bit and the questions didn't seem to be answered. 6 is too many divisions.
you lose money with 4 divisions. THe OHSAA knows this. THe rental at Jesse Owens for the 3rd day is what does it.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-29-17, 03:46 PM
EuclidandViren EuclidandViren is offline
All Ohio
 
Join Date: 04-01-12
Posts: 768
EuclidandViren is on a distinguished road
With 6 division we are still 43 out 50 states in sending kids to the state meet. The major points were number of students represented at the state meet. Right now I believe we ar2 47.

States like Louisiana and Alabama have 7 divisions yet 3 million people in the state. Ohio has over 11 million people.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-29-17, 04:37 PM
psycho_dad psycho_dad is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 08-17-10
Posts: 2,587
psycho_dad is on a distinguished road
Who cares what other states do? For a non profit organization, turning a profit is not necessary. If turning a profit is a must, maybe Finding a place with a more reasonable rental rate might be a better way to go. Isn't Welcome stadium bigger? Shouldn't let Ohio State hold us hostage.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-29-17, 04:55 PM
fanofrunning fanofrunning is offline
All Region
 
Join Date: 09-09-12
Posts: 338
fanofrunning is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccrunner609 View Post
Scott,

Question: How do you expect to run 6 divisions at the district level when in a lot of cases you cant get enough officials and locations that are willing to do 3?
Answer: Districts will be scrapped and the state moves to qualifying standards for a regional meet where the top 16 get in.
Interesting that districts would be scrapped. How many regular season meets around the state are conducted where wind gauges are used? Will that be a requirement for sprints/long jump?
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-29-17, 07:08 PM
ccrunner609 ccrunner609 is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 02-15-10
Posts: 2,612
ccrunner609 is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by fanofrunning View Post
Interesting that districts would be scrapped. How many regular season meets around the state are conducted where wind gauges are used? Will that be a requirement for sprints/long jump?
That was brought up. Wind gauges at all meets. Officials at all events. FAT meets would only get bigger.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 01-29-17, 07:19 PM
madman madman is offline
All Ohio
 
Join Date: 09-27-10
Posts: 897
madman is on a distinguished road
Great.

So, if you are unfortunate enough to have a windy spring, it is conceivable that an athlete never has a chance to qualify. Beautiful.

If we are really going to put that much emphasis on times & distances done at multiple sites under different conditions, let's just turn the whole thing over to Milesplit, or some such entity.

No sense wasting gas on getting competitors to the same venue.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 01-29-17, 07:23 PM
fanofrunning fanofrunning is offline
All Region
 
Join Date: 09-09-12
Posts: 338
fanofrunning is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccrunner609 View Post
That was brought up. Wind gauges at all meets. Officials at all events. FAT meets would only get bigger.
"Officials at all events." Altor, how many regular season meets have you been to where the participating schools are told by the school hosting the meet that they are responsible for conducting a field event? Presumably, a great jump/throw/height mark would not be eligible for district qualification. To be fair, a small invitational might not be the event where an athlete achieves a district-qualifying mark, but at smaller schools this might be the case. Then what do you do about ties for top 16th place district marks? It will be interesting to see if this division expansion really pans out and the concerns/issues are able to be ironed out to the satisfaction of most.
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 01-29-17, 09:25 PM
mathking mathking is offline
All American
 
Join Date: 07-25-10
Posts: 1,314
mathking is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by madman View Post
Great.

So, if you are unfortunate enough to have a windy spring, it is conceivable that an athlete never has a chance to qualify. Beautiful.

If we are really going to put that much emphasis on times & distances done at multiple sites under different conditions, let's just turn the whole thing over to Milesplit, or some such entity.

No sense wasting gas on getting competitors to the same venue.
Agreed. Those who favor qualifying standards as opposed to head to head competition for advancement always say they want the best athletes. Well this has the very real possibility of never giving some athletes a real shot. Weather conditions matter.

But leaving that aside, think about the incentives in play when you have a kid coming back from injury. There is going to be a lot more pressure to rush back from an injury now. You don't how they will perform and what the weather will be like so you need to bring them back not for the post season but two or three weeks before that.

And why do we need to do that anyway? There will be same number of teams competing no matter how many divisions. And I can see why district meets of only 8 (or even fewer) teams might not be appealing. Why not just have the district meets qualify more athletes to the regional, then you don't need to double the number of district meets.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 01-30-17, 05:40 AM
psycho_dad psycho_dad is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 08-17-10
Posts: 2,587
psycho_dad is on a distinguished road
I didn't hear the entire proposal, but if they go to standards, does a team get more than 2 in per event? Can a Woodridge get 4 or 5 in the 1600 or 3200? Can a team get 4 sprinters in?

Going to standards changes the fundamental way the sport is coached and participated. Instead of training and building towards the end of the season, there will be kids that won't double so they can try and hit a standard at a certain meet etc. I see it taking the team aspect of the sport away even more than it is now.

Seems to me that if they go to 6 divisions, that they would just eliminate the District meets and just go to Regionals and qualify the top 4 from there. Probably would have to stagger the 24 Regionals so that there are enough timing crews and officials to work them.

Also seems to me that they could make money off of 4 divisions just as easy. There is only a certain capacity that the venue has at the state meet. 4 divisions would pack the place to capacity without adding a day to the meet.

Where are they going to park any extra busses or cars? They already do not have the room.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 01-30-17, 10:05 AM
CoventryTrackXCguy CoventryTrackXCguy is offline
All Ohio
 
Join Date: 10-28-15
Location: Coventry, Ohio
Posts: 618
CoventryTrackXCguy is on a distinguished road
I agree about too many divisions. 6 divisions are absolutely ridiculus. I could see maybe going to four. But I dont think they should ever strip away the team aspect to the sport further. I highly disagree with getting rid of districts and going with qualifying standards. I understand the arguement that they want just the best competing. But isnt top 4 or whatever tovregionals from each district accomplishing just that? I mean, I suppose some districts are gonna be more competitive in some events that others so it wont be perfect, but thats just the way it goes simetimes.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 01-30-17, 07:41 PM
SOTT SOTT is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 01-08-06
Posts: 2,957
SOTT is on a distinguished road
"The other states" comparison kept being thrown around at the clinic this past weekend as well and as psychodad said, who cares. I couldn't care less what other states do. Just because Louisiana has a third our population and qualifies twice as many kids to the state meet (I think they total six divisions) doesn't mean that should be the gold standard. California has one division. Maybe that should be the gold standard.

I'll continue to say it, as others have, but if six divisions can work in three days why the heck can't four divisions work in two days? That's just ludicrous. A day is a day is a day. How would the state lose money by keeping the meet two days and adding a division?

I'm not necessarily even sold on four divisions, but I am at least sympathetic to the argument. Six divisions, however? Don't we still want state qualification to mean something? We are continually one of the top state in terms of representation at the highest levels of our sport, be it the NCAA or beyond. Our system fosters competition, a raising of the bar, and athletes who are prepared to make the next jump. Let's think very carefully before we rush to judgement and turn our system on its head.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 01-30-17, 08:38 PM
panott panott is offline
All Region
 
Join Date: 02-23-07
Posts: 444
panott is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by mathking View Post
Agreed. Those who favor qualifying standards as opposed to head to head competition for advancement always say they want the best athletes. Well this has the very real possibility of never giving some athletes a real shot. Weather conditions matter.

But leaving that aside, think about the incentives in play when you have a kid coming back from injury. There is going to be a lot more pressure to rush back from an injury now. You don't how they will perform and what the weather will be like so you need to bring them back not for the post season but two or three weeks before that.

And why do we need to do that anyway? There will be same number of teams competing no matter how many divisions. And I can see why district meets of only 8 (or even fewer) teams might not be appealing. Why not just have the district meets qualify more athletes to the regional, then you don't need to double the number of district meets.
I don't think most of you understand how easy it will be to qualify to Regionals with 6 divisions . The argument that some really good athletes won't get there is pretty far fetched. If you can't qualify to the regional when there are only 25-30 teams in each one there is really no way that you should be running at the State meet anyway. You will still have the head-to-head competition in the Regional just like you do now and the top 4 will qualify. There may well be other arguments against 6 divisions but this one is bogus.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 01-30-17, 09:06 PM
madman madman is offline
All Ohio
 
Join Date: 09-27-10
Posts: 897
madman is on a distinguished road
Sure it's easy for the true studs, but the athletes that fill out the fields will need their best efforts to make it. I suppose you could say who cares about the marginal athletes, they aren't going to win or move on the the State Championship anyway, but if you have that attitude you probably shouldn't be making decisions about scholastic athletics.

There are clearly environmental differences between Ohio locales that have undeniable effects on performance. Even meets held within 5 miles of one another on the same day can have significant differences based on the direction runners finish - one group can have a head wind and the other a tail wind.

Thinking that times and distances done in different competitions are always comparable is a fallacy that may be common among those not familiar with the sport, but it's astounding that it can be believed, or ignored, among those who profess an interest.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 01-30-17, 09:23 PM
panott panott is offline
All Region
 
Join Date: 02-23-07
Posts: 444
panott is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by madman View Post
Sure it's easy for the true studs, but the athletes that fill out the fields will need their best efforts to make it. I suppose you could say who cares about the marginal athletes, they aren't going to win or move on the the State Championship anyway, but if you have that attitude you probably shouldn't be making decisions about scholastic athletics.

There are clearly environmental differences between Ohio locales that have undeniable effects on performance. Even meets held within 5 miles of one another on the same day can have significant differences based on the direction runners finish - one group can have a head wind and the other a tail wind.

Thinking that times and distances done in different competitions are always comparable is a fallacy that may be common among those not familiar with the sport, but it's astounding that it can be believed, or ignored, among those who profess an interest.
So I have 30 teams in my Region and no team can qualify more than 2 athletes per event so that gives me only 60 people that I need to be faster than throughout the entire season. As it is set up now, we have approximately 30 individuals per District and 4 Districts for a Regional. That means there are 120 athletes competing for those spots. You aren't making it harder for athletes to qualify --- you are making it easier.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 01-30-17, 09:45 PM
madman madman is offline
All Ohio
 
Join Date: 09-27-10
Posts: 897
madman is on a distinguished road


Quote:
Originally Posted by madman View Post
....
Thinking that times and distances done in different competitions are always comparable is a fallacy that may be common among those not familiar with the sport, but it's astounding that it can be believed, or ignored, among those who profess an interest.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 01-30-17, 10:06 PM
mathking mathking is offline
All American
 
Join Date: 07-25-10
Posts: 1,314
mathking is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by panott View Post
I don't think most of you understand how easy it will be to qualify to Regionals with 6 divisions . The argument that some really good athletes won't get there is pretty far fetched. If you can't qualify to the regional when there are only 25-30 teams in each one there is really no way that you should be running at the State meet anyway. You will still have the head-to-head competition in the Regional just like you do now and the top 4 will qualify. There may well be other arguments against 6 divisions but this one is bogus.


I am saying (and I believe madman is too) that we don't want to get rid of District meets and move to qualifying standards. Psychodad's admonition about further downplaying team competition is also well taken. That argument is not really any different whether we have six or three divisions. I think getting rid of advancement based on head to head competition is a bad idea.

Another point to remember when we talk about competition being watered down is that it isn't balanced now. The majority of the athletes are in division one. Our division of our conference has only six schools now (don't get me started on that), but there are probably more athletes on those six teams than on all of the teams in most of the D3 districts. Don't get me wrong, I think it would be unfair for us to be competing at the district meet against D3 schools. (I have coached in D3 as well.) But it is much harder in general to advance in D1 because athletes are competing against a much bigger pool of potential opponents.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 01-31-17, 08:35 AM
psycho_dad psycho_dad is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 08-17-10
Posts: 2,587
psycho_dad is on a distinguished road
We are in a conference that does not pole vault, so we only vault at invites and against teammates in sort of jump offs. We typically do not go into the District with top marks, but we usually come out with some qualifiers to the Regional. Not sure qualifying standards would help us develop in a slow and steady manner. Also, what would take the place of the District week if we went straight to the Regional?

We typically do not have kids run a lot of 3200m races throughout the season. Would we have to force them to run more to hit a mark? We run kids all over the place in many different races, experiment with different relay members. Would we have to keep an eye on the qualifiers list each week and make decisions based off what other teams have done? I don't like the thought of that. And, it would be worse at larger division schools. We don't necessarily run our top 2 performers in the regular season in an event once the championship season starts. What if our third or 4th kid didn't hit a standard or wasn't in the top 50% or whatever the qualification process is?

I'm sure we would be just fine and I know I'm thinking in a 3 division mindset, but I believe, in high school, times don't matter or shouldn't matter that much in the regular season.

At our league meet, we put kids all over the place as a strategy. We might not run top kids in an event so that they can do another event where we can maximize our team point total. It's part of the sport. We do the same at the District meet.

Things like getting into good heats at meets is a big deal all of a sudden. We have entered legit times for what we have run at meets and gotten put in the slow heat. Not a big deal now, but in the new system, it could be huge.

We had a kid a few years ago that was injured and could not run in the regular season. I'll have to check, but I think he only ran one other meet except for the District, Regional and State meets. He placed at the state. Couldn't do that in a qualifying standard system. might have to risk bringing him back way too soon.

Just choosing meets to go to changes. We might have to go chase competition rather than developing our lesser athletes. The elite kids on our team would be even more of a focus than they are now. I like being able to choose our schedule based on progression of the entire team and not just to chase times and marks.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 01-31-17, 10:51 AM
ccrunner609 ccrunner609 is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 02-15-10
Posts: 2,612
ccrunner609 is on a distinguished road
Many good posts here. From a lot of perspectives this proposal turns our sport on its head.

Does it need it? In some cases yes.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 01-31-17, 11:11 AM
SOTT SOTT is offline
All World
 
Join Date: 01-08-06
Posts: 2,957
SOTT is on a distinguished road
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccrunner609 View Post
Many good posts here. From a lot of perspectives this proposal turns our sport on its head.

Does it need it? In some cases yes.
This isn't meant to be snide, but which aspects of our sport need turned on their respective heads in your opinion?
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 01-31-17, 11:12 AM
Seppo Kaitainen Seppo Kaitainen is offline
All District
 
Join Date: 10-01-10
Posts: 117
Seppo Kaitainen is on a distinguished road
Another interesting thing about qualifying via time rather than head to head is it doesn't take fatigue into account. I have a girl who can easily run a 58, 2:15, 5:15, and 11:30, but she's not going to do all of that at one meet. Would she qualify to the regional meet in all those events? Would she crowd out other athletes despite the fact that she only intends to run the 800?
Typically your best milers are also pretty great 800 runners, but can they come back from an all out 16 to race a great 800 in 80 degree weather?
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
2017 Canton McKinley Football Season IUDOGS Football 232 06-24-17 02:40 PM
2016-17 Suburban League American Discussion Yappi Boys Basketball 554 03-27-17 07:04 PM
Historic Dodgertown Youth Baseball Tournaments 2017 hdodgertown Baseball 0 09-14-16 01:20 PM
Want to play for the Cincinnati Fury in 2017? CinciFury Baseball 0 07-25-16 02:59 PM
2017 Ohio All-Star Wrestling Team - Now Accepting Applications Ohio TofC Wrestling 1 06-02-16 01:37 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:34 AM.




Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Registration Booster - Powered By Dirt RIF CustUmz