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  #181  
Old 01-06-17, 11:18 PM
2731 2731 is offline
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Originally Posted by CitrusCrunch View Post
hold up so are you saying there will be 4 girls from ohio like there are 4 boys out of 160 so is that like 4 out of all the boys that play in ohio high school
That's not what I'm saying at all... That list is one version of the top 160 senior age boys in the country. It's great that 4 are from Ohio.

The point you are purposefully missing, is that less than 10 play club and high school, (only one of the Ohio boys, and that's a pretty amazing accomplishment for that young man) All of the rest are DA players. And that list is only 160 players long.

I think NCAA div 1 finds the academy system "useful".
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  #182  
Old 01-07-17, 06:45 AM
CitrusCrunch CitrusCrunch is offline
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my daughters played in a simpler time but my nieces are gonna be high school age coming up so i try to keep up with this stuff. say what you want but i dont see high schools on your list could be missin them i guess. da might be an option for one or two of my nieces in the years to come so id like to understand it but not finding much info locally. so are you saying that they can play hs and da based on the boys you mentioned as i thought that was not an option. school ball will be important for my nieces coming from small towns.
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  #183  
Old 01-07-17, 08:09 AM
Upper 90 Upper 90 is offline
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Man most of those are Mls based. Are you really using that as an argument for the girls side? Weak sauce.
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  #184  
Old 01-07-17, 09:27 AM
Hoosier Parent Hoosier Parent is offline
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Originally Posted by 2731 View Post
In 5 years the girls list will look like this too.. but you'll be too old to remember.

http://www.collegesoccernews.com/ind...school-seniors
i'd argue that the current list of ECNL or National League club committments are currently equal to or more impressive than that list.
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  #185  
Old 01-07-17, 01:11 PM
2731 2731 is offline
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Originally Posted by Upper 90 View Post
Man most of those are Mls based. Are you really using that as an argument for the girls side? Weak sauce.
Sigh. I think ostriches are less obtuse than y'all.

On the boys side most Da's are Mls based. The point is... (And after this I'm done, you all can continue to dream....) the clubs getting the best players and therefore the most college looks are the DA's on the boys side.

This will happen on the girls side as well. It will take time and happen over the course of 3-5 years as more and more girls DA clubs get added. And they will add... many over the course of that time.

This will erode the talent pool in the ECNL until in 5 years, U14 girls will be skipping it in favor of the academy system.

High schools don't count and they don't count today.

Tomorrow, ECNL will be a minor league. This affects no high school aged girls right now. It's a new system, it will implement over time and US Soccer will replace US Club as the main system for the highest talent.

The colleges will follow the kids.
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  #186  
Old 01-07-17, 03:41 PM
Hoosier Parent Hoosier Parent is offline
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Makes sense.That's why I follow Yappi, to learn from you guys (Gals)
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  #187  
Old 01-07-17, 05:38 PM
CitrusCrunch CitrusCrunch is offline
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me to and now that 2731 cleared up that they can play hs and do da i feel better about it that was my biggest concern. be tough for a lot of girls i am sure each will figure out what is best for their own.
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  #188  
Old 01-08-17, 08:27 AM
buckshooter5 buckshooter5 is offline
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DA is designed for one thing and one thing only, to keep the money flowing into the present system. ECNL is a disrupter, the fat boys are pissed, do not mess with their wallets. Ask yourself how those involved with soccer get filthy rich in the USYSA. All about the kids, I mean $$$$. DA is DOA.
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  #189  
Old 01-09-17, 09:30 AM
Upper 90 Upper 90 is offline
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The reason the DA's affiliated with MLS teams are so successful at getting the top talent is that they are tied to the MLS team. The boys want to play there, wear the gear, practice at the training grounds etc with the dream of playing at the club or another MLS club. Nothing obtuse about it. It is proving to be a very successful model for the boys. But the girls thus far only have NWSL and none of those are MLS affiliated. I am not sure why the MLS teams don't have girls teams, it would seem to make sense since the structure is already in place. In all honesty I hope it succeeds and brings a bright light to soccer in our area. I just don't see it basing it off two local clubs.
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  #190  
Old 01-09-17, 09:34 AM
Rohbino Rohbino is offline
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Do parents and those following soccer closely honestly believe that US Club Soccer, the US Soccer Federation, and the USYSA are making the recent changes to do what is best for the kids? I, for one, am not a believer. The recent changes are politically/power motivated and are being done to protect monetary interests. If the governing bodies of soccer really wanted to make meaningful changes the game would be more accessible for the kids and it would be doing more to foster development in a broader spectrum of the population. Can anyone honestly state that soccer is becoming more accessible than, let's say, what it was five or ten years ago?

Is the Girls DA really needed? I think that we won't know the real answer for a few years. In the short term, though, I would argue that the GDA is more about politics and power. I don't believe that the Federation is attempting to kill the ECNL but instead is trying to put US Club Soccer in its place. For perspective on this go back in time and note that clubs banded together because they felt that in doing so they would have more power and would do a better job with player development. That was the beginnings of US Club Soccer. The clubs that were/are heavily ingratiated with US Club Soccer rallied/rally against things like ODP. Was this really being done in the interest of the players? I don't believe that it was. US Club Soccer offered a streamlined process for paperwork and made those matters easier for the clubs. It also gave power back to the clubs. Player development was an afterthought. What happened, and what US Club Soccer abetted in, was that youth soccer turned more into a business-oriented endeavor. So while the Federation might be stating that the GDA was started in the name of development, it is being done, in the short term at least, to repudiate the validity and philosophy of US Club Soccer and the ECNL.

Not to be one-upped, US Club Soccer started the boys ECNL. Is the boys ECNL really needed? I doubt it. Again, we probably won't know until the program is in place for a bit. In the short-term the Boys ECNL reeks of a case of "taking the ball and going home" by US Club Soccer and the ECNL. Is it really being done for player development and what is in the best interest of the players? No, it isn't. It's being done in the interest of the clubs. It is merely a power play that is motivated by politics.

The territorial pissings that permeate youth sports in general, and youth soccer in particular, are blatantly obvious. It's sickening how the "leaders" (I use the term "leaders" loosely here) of the sport always profess to be doing what is best for development, what is best for the growth of sport, what is best for the kids, blah, blah, blah. I would have a lot more respect for these clowns if they were honest and would state that they are doing what is best for themselves, their fiefdoms, and their political interests. None of it will change, though, as long as parents believe what the "leaders" are telling them – that the changes are being done for the kids. The true leaders and innovators of youth soccer won't emerge until they quit playing lip-service to "player development." As of now, on the women's side of the game at least, the ball is in the field of the Federation and GDA. Let's see what they do with it. The pessimist in me tends to believe that we'll see more of the same. I would like to be surprised.

Last edited by Rohbino; 01-09-17 at 05:44 PM.. Reason: clarification
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  #191  
Old 01-09-17, 12:35 PM
soccerdad soccerdad is offline
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just a little info on boys side. when my son played (92's). the boys DA was just starting and there were 2 teams CUP and the other I won't mention were loaded with talent. these teams cleaned up where ever we traveled to play. NO players from the NON CUP team even tried or were convinced not to try and play in the DA. IF they were serious about the quality of play it should be based on a referral system. Both the coach of the player and other coaches familiar with said player. It was very political back then and I think some players that may have wanted to didn't because they didn't want to let the coaches or teammates down. It should be an honor to try/play for such club. And players with real talent should have a fair opportunity to participate without recourse or financial burden. If not, then finding talented players isn't the real goal of the system. There should be plenty of money to allow players(not there fault) to play that financially couldn't participate.
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  #192  
Old 01-09-17, 02:24 PM
2731 2731 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Upper 90 View Post
The reason the DA's affiliated with MLS teams are so successful at getting the top talent is that they are tied to the MLS team. The boys want to play there, wear the gear, practice at the training grounds etc with the dream of playing at the club or another MLS club. Nothing obtuse about it. It is proving to be a very successful model for the boys. But the girls thus far only have NWSL and none of those are MLS affiliated. I am not sure why the MLS teams don't have girls teams, it would seem to make sense since the structure is already in place. In all honesty I hope it succeeds and brings a bright light to soccer in our area. I just don't see it basing it off two local clubs.
22 Mls teams soon to be 24. 150 boys DA clubs. You do the math. I just looked it up... even I didn't realize how many non MLS clubs had come on to the academy system on the boys side.

http://www.ussoccerda.com/all-clubs
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  #193  
Old 01-09-17, 04:17 PM
CitrusCrunch CitrusCrunch is offline
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2731 can you help me my sister said her daughter was told she cannot do hs soccer and da why can they do it on the boys side and the girls
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  #194  
Old 01-09-17, 05:36 PM
2731 2731 is offline
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Originally Posted by CitrusCrunch View Post
2731 can you help me my sister said her daughter was told she cannot do hs soccer and da why can they do it on the boys side and the girls
I'm sorry I can't help you. I never said you can do HS and DA, you can't.

When I said High School doesn't count, that was from a college recruiting perspective. The vast majority of colleges don't recruit high schools for soccer.
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  #195  
Old 01-17-17, 12:52 PM
Rohbino Rohbino is offline
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It appears that the USSF has decided to change the age groups of the GDA beginning in the inaugural year. They had originally intended to offer the age groups of 14/15, 16/17, and 18/19. The boys have recently gone to a single age group for the 15s and the new age groups for the boys DA are U11/U12, U13, U14, U15, U16/U17, and U18/U19. It looks like the GDA is following suit by making changes before it even begins and will have the age groups of U14, U15, U16/U17, and U18/U19.

Here is a release from the USSF on the change:

"Academy Directors and Club Leaders:

First off, thank you for your feedback. Since meeting in Chicago last month, your input has been instrumental in determining the next steps and planning future Academy programming. Specifically, your interest in adding additional age groups for the launch of the Girls’ Academy is aligned with the Academy philosophy for creating a clear player pathway.

With an eye towards an improved everyday environment where players can continue to grow, the U.S. Soccer Girls’ Development Academy plans to split the U-14/15 age group into two single-aged teams at U-14 (2004) and U-15 (2003) for its inaugural season in 2017/18. The strategic initiative to increase the player pool at the younger Academy ages, is part of a long-term goal of expanding to single age groups in order to further develop female players.

At the Girls’ Academy launch in Chicago on December 15th, the Academy sought feedback, input and questions in small-group settings from club presidents and Academy Directors. This plan to expand the base of the Academy structure addresses the topic most frequently discussed from the clubs."


I would guess that after the inaugural season that the USSF will plan to offer younger age groups in the GDA, starting at U11, as is currently offered in the boys DA.

This is going to put a lot of pressure on the ECNL to attract players and will probably hurt the league a great deal. I also believe that by expanding the number of age groups, which in essence will also bring a greater number of players to GDA teams, that the USSF is diluting the pool. This comes off to me as more territorial pissings and more politics in action. The USSF is devising ideas to further put the hurt on US Club Soccer and the ECNL. I'm all for it if it will help develop a broader range of players and be inclusive of underserved populations but I don't see a lot of benefits at this time.

High school soccer will also be hurt by the changes. Kids are freshmen at 14 or 15 years of age. Splitting the previous singular age group of 14/15 into 2 age groups of 14 and 15 respectively will take more players out of the high school pool.
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  #196  
Old 01-17-17, 05:09 PM
buckshooter5 buckshooter5 is offline
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Someone just hit that nail on the head !

This is about a pissing match with USSF, they don't like the fact the ECNL showed them how it should of been done.

So now they want what the ECNL has and they are doing anything to get it.

Development is a complete lie by the federation, the fat boys sitting back collecting the fat paychecks are afraid they might be losing their jobs !

SO yes Bottom line is that it is about Money as it always is.

this will end up as one of the biggest clusters anyone has ever seen.

Doesn't matter this will not end well for anyone ! especially the girls who are putting their heart and souls into this.

But I am sure the two local coaches here will get new cars and a fat paycheck out of it , Way to go !
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  #197  
Old 01-17-17, 08:51 PM
Gr8tS0ccr Gr8tS0ccr is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckshooter5 View Post
Someone just hit that nail on the head !



This is about a pissing match with USSF, they don't like the fact the ECNL showed them how it should of been done.



So now they want what the ECNL has and they are doing anything to get it.



Development is a complete lie by the federation, the fat boys sitting back collecting the fat paychecks are afraid they might be losing their jobs !



SO yes Bottom line is that it is about Money as it always is.



this will end up as one of the biggest clusters anyone has ever seen.



Doesn't matter this will not end well for anyone ! especially the girls who are putting their heart and souls into this.



But I am sure the two local coaches here will get new cars and a fat paycheck out of it , Way to go !


For once I agree. Pissing match, unnecessary, and about money, politics, and power. I am starting to really despise youth soccer.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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  #198  
Old 01-18-17, 12:21 PM
coachg coachg is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckshooter5 View Post
Someone just hit that nail on the head !

This is about a pissing match with USSF, they don't like the fact the ECNL showed them how it should of been done.

So now they want what the ECNL has and they are doing anything to get it.

Development is a complete lie by the federation, the fat boys sitting back collecting the fat paychecks are afraid they might be losing their jobs !

SO yes Bottom line is that it is about Money as it always is.

this will end up as one of the biggest clusters anyone has ever seen.

Doesn't matter this will not end well for anyone ! especially the girls who are putting their heart and souls into this.

But I am sure the two local coaches here will get new cars and a fat paycheck out of it , Way to go !

But couldnt is be said this way also?

This is about a pissing match with all other clubs, they don't like the fact the ECNL refuses to play them and refuses to let them join the ECNL no matter what.

So now the ECNL is mad that the other clubs are creating a system like theirs.

Development is a complete lie by the ECNL, the fat boys sitting back collecting the fat paychecks are afraid they might be losing their jobs should the DA be an improvement or if played and lost to the local DA clubs!

SO yes Bottom line is that it is about Money as it always is.

Failing to all new local clubs into the ECNL will end up as one of the biggest clusters anyone has ever seen.

Doesn't matter this will not end well for anyone! Especially the girls who are putting their heart and souls into this.

But I am sure the local ECNL coaches here will get new cars and a fat paychecks somehow , Way to go !
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  #199  
Old 01-19-17, 02:14 PM
sebbyb sebbyb is offline
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Originally Posted by Hoosier Parent View Post
Question about the Cinci DA(CUP/KHA). What is the competitive format for the teams below the DA? Is there a DA 2nd team?

I'm assuming it will be difficult for both clubs to host teams at a National League level with the DA team skimming the top 4 to 5 players from each team.

In the end OE might be the biggest winner with the DA coming to Cinci.
CUP/KHA to also have 6 combined Pre-DA teams.

Cincinnati United and Kings Hammer, under Cincinnati Development Academy, will also
offer another layer to the program, which will consist of Pre-Development Academy teams.
This gives players who want to continue to play high school and compete at the highest club
level, an opportunity to do both. These six pre-DA teams will compete in National League,
MRL, and other national level events and college showcases. The teams will have high
quality coaches from CUP and KHA.
These teams will be formed at these age groups for the 2017-2018 season:
- U14 Girls / 2004
- U15 Girls / 2003
- U16 Girls / 2002
- U17 Girls / 2001
- U18 Girls / 2000
- U19 Girls / 1999
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  #200  
Old 01-19-17, 02:23 PM
buckshooter5 buckshooter5 is offline
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CoachG
Really the ECNL teams refuse to play the local teams ?

Dude Last I checked The local ECNL Club is having a Showcase in Feb is that only for ECNL teams ? I don't think so.

So if your local team wants to play ECNL teams I suggest you sign up.

The KHA Pickup team always did !
But Hey I understand you are afraid, I get it, doesn't look good getting beat at a local event.

We all know it's about your image and your gotsoccer points.
But what I cannot figure out is what does Gotsoccer points have to do with development , I guess everything ?
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  #201  
Old 01-19-17, 02:30 PM
buckshooter5 buckshooter5 is offline
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Basically they changed the name of the teams that the Main DA teams have left behind ?
So they will not be called KHA RED or Cup GOLD anymore they will be called Pre-DA Teams Great marketing scheme.
DO you really think the parents are that stupid ? Well Maybe you do
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  #202  
Old 01-19-17, 04:07 PM
coachg coachg is offline
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Kinds like Pre-ECNL? I believe there will be a DA Team - Pre-DA team then a CUP Gold and Cup Black- I would think that KHA would do the samething.
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  #203  
Old 01-19-17, 05:33 PM
Gr8tS0ccr Gr8tS0ccr is offline
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What's really interesting is that the level of coaching hasn't really improved greatly. The number of coaches (aka: The "I used to be a good player so I know everything") has increased like crazy...however, those with passion for the game that crave knowledge, and want to constantly learn is still a relative few. Those coaches used to do it for free because they loved it. Some of those take money now, but would likely do it for free anyway. People seem to knock Bobby from CUP on here, but he seems to me to be an extremely hard worker that is constantly trying to improve. There is certainly some jealousy in play as he really has created quite a legacy at CUP from a humble soccer background. Sure, some of his cronies aren't great, but there are some other great coaches at CUP, whether you like them or not. Happens to be some great coaches at OE, whether you like them, or not. All of this bashing anonymously is stupid and childish. What does it do to advance soccer in Southern Ohio? I don't believe the DA is the answer, but I also don't think having the best players scattered all over the city at some big clubs and then the worst thing that has happened to soccer in town, the one off club of teams that exist because they didn't like some big club. I have seen way too many athletes at 13/14 that decide to go to a good club, or team and despite their athleticism...it is too late. Not everyone can be Alex Morgan...most can't catch up. If folks would set aside their egos, and own ambitions we could really have some phenomenal teams in Southern Ohio...Best in the Midwest if you ask me. This is one of the hotbeds of soccer...time we up our game.
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  #204  
Old 01-19-17, 05:37 PM
Conan73 Conan73 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckshooter5 View Post
Basically they changed the name of the teams that the Main DA teams have left behind ?
So they will not be called KHA RED or Cup GOLD anymore they will be called Pre-DA Teams Great marketing scheme.
DO you really think the parents are that stupid ? Well Maybe you do
From what I'm reading, the pre DA teams will be combined KH and CUP teams. So, this would be different. It would signal a much broader partnership between the two teams. Sounds like CUP Gold and KHA Red players not selected for or not wanting to go do to the DA would move to these combined teams. In effect, both the CUP and KHA programs would be weakened in favor of a stronger CDA.

This would create a regional powerhouse if you took the best kids from KHA and combined them with the best from CUP.
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  #205  
Old 01-19-17, 06:20 PM
Soccer Toe Soccer Toe is offline
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Originally Posted by Conan73 View Post
From what I'm reading, the pre DA teams will be combined KH and CUP teams. So, this would be different. It would signal a much broader partnership between the two teams. Sounds like CUP Gold and KHA Red players not selected for or not wanting to go do to the DA would move to these combined teams. In effect, both the CUP and KHA programs would be weakened in favor of a stronger CDA.

This would create a regional powerhouse if you took the best kids from KHA and combined them with the best from CUP.
This will be nothing other than 2 mediocre clubs combining to create twice as many mediocrely coached teams, twice as many rich coaches and twice as many disappointed players and twice as many pissed off parents.

If we could harness the energy from when this self implodes we could power the entire USA for a year and we would make America great again.

If I am slightly off base hear, don't worry, the ex-KGB spy, Bucky, will chime in and clear it all up.
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  #206  
Old 01-19-17, 06:53 PM
fearthekeeper fearthekeeper is offline
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Originally Posted by Soccer Toe View Post
This will be nothing other than 2 mediocre clubs combining to create twice as many mediocrely coached teams, twice as many rich coaches and twice as many disappointed players and twice as many pissed off parents.

If we could harness the energy from when this self implodes we could power the entire USA for a year and we would make America great again.

If I am slightly off base hear, don't worry, the ex-KGB spy, Bucky, will chime in and clear it all up.
2 mediocre clubs combining? I didn't realize CW and TFA were combining
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  #207  
Old 01-19-17, 08:22 PM
2731 2731 is offline
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This thread is absolutely hilarious. So much guess so little substance. Is the girls side always like this?

What if I told you the separation of age groups at the academy level was two years in the making AND the "birth year" movement at the club level was actually the first step in the process.


Y'all seem (not surprisingly) to be oblivious to the fact that US Club actually works for US Soccer and receives funding from it.

It is and always has been a pyramid. US Soccer on top with US Youth and US Club equal base components. Need a drawing?

The sunk cost fallacy has diluted your collective critical thinking abilities.

Last edited by 2731; 01-19-17 at 08:43 PM..
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  #208  
Old 01-23-17, 07:47 AM
Hoosier Parent Hoosier Parent is offline
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I think CUP parents had their DA meeting this weekend. It's about to get interesting.
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  #209  
Old 01-23-17, 08:31 AM
Soccer Toe Soccer Toe is offline
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Originally Posted by fearthekeeper View Post
2 mediocre clubs combining? I didn't realize CW and TFA were combining
Sorry my sarcasm was not obvious ... I was just trying to beat Buckhead to the punch.
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  #210  
Old 01-23-17, 05:17 PM
fearthekeeper fearthekeeper is offline
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Originally Posted by Hoosier Parent View Post
I think CUP parents had their DA meeting this weekend. It's about to get interesting.
The DA had a meeting for all girls/parents from all clubs who are interested in playing.
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