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View Poll Results: Who wins DI State Championship: Massillon Jackson (29-2) vs Strongsville (25-8)
Massillon Jackson 11 57.89%
Strongsville 8 42.11%
Voters: 19. You may not vote on this poll

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  #31  
Old 06-04-17, 09:57 PM
Mackinbiner Mackinbiner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cabezadecaballo View Post
That guy got hired in as a quick fix because you guys were jealous of your neighbors' success. You vetted all that was cared about down there, pure and simple. Always wanting the shortcuts.

I was first exposed to Jackson's youth program when Dingler, Nicolas, the Mottices et al were 12u. No shortcuts. They've earned this.

When you bring your poo-flinging act from monkey island, you can't call "troll". Just stop.
Very well said.
  #32  
Old 06-04-17, 10:01 PM
DB135 DB135 is offline
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Originally Posted by cabezadecaballo View Post
That guy got hired in as a quick fix because you guys were jealous of your neighbors' success. You vetted all that was cared about down there, pure and simple. Always wanting the shortcuts.
t
I was first exposed to Jackson's youth program when Dingler, Nicolas, the Mottices et al were 12u. No shortcuts. They've earned this.

When you bring your poo-flinging act from monkey island, you can't call "troll". Just stop.
You have absolutely no creditability in the ASSUMPTIONS you make and the poor administrative decision made has NOTHING to do with the long term performance of the Massillon baseball program.

You have no clue what you're talking about. Till Randy Cupari started the Jackson traveling team the best players (e.g.: Mike Hershberger,Jr. & Mallory) were transferring from Jackson to Central (If you had a clue what you're discussing, you'd know Jackson still hasn't surpassed the programs at Central & GlenOak). Maybe you think Gamble is a better coach than Gilhousen, Miller, or his father. I'm sure he isn't that arrogant. From that point on the Jackson varsity had a consistent flow of well coached and talented players going to the varsity level.

It's amusing to post with trolls and morons who think this is about a Massillon poster trying to take ANY credit for the Jackson success. IT ISN'T!

Last edited by DB135; 06-04-17 at 10:16 PM.
  #33  
Old 06-04-17, 10:02 PM
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Very well said.
And totally ignorant of the facts referenced.
  #34  
Old 06-04-17, 10:24 PM
Red Right 88 Red Right 88 is offline
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I used to coach against the Jackson Jayhawks awhile ago. If I remember correctly, they were far from being Jackson's "youth program". I believe they were one travel team per age group that carried 10-11 players. They've been extinct for several years, so I doubt any of these players ever was a Jackson Jayhawk. The guy before Gamble probably rostered a few of these extinct birds.

Another attempt may be needed to draw a Massillon connection to this team's success. Maybe some of the players have a relative that graduated from Massillon or certainly a few players have driven through town at some point.
  #35  
Old 06-04-17, 10:36 PM
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I used to coach against the Jackson Jayhawks awhile ago. If I remember correctly, they were far from being Jackson's "youth program". I believe they were one travel team per age group that carried 10-11 players. They've been extinct for several years, so I doubt any of these players ever was a Jackson Jayhawk. The guy before Gamble probably rostered a few of these extinct birds.

Another attempt may be needed to draw a Massillon connection to this team's success. Maybe some of the players have a relative that graduated from Massillon or certainly a few players have driven through town at some point.
The Jackson youth program had the team I spoke of as the beginning of the development of their youth program with traveling teams, hot stove teams, and in house teams in the program yearly. The program developed from there into where the program is now. As I stated earlier prior to the Jayhawk team, the best Jackson players were transferring elsewhere. Your sarcastic, witless response only makes you look foolish. The contribution of the Massillon grad was duly noted as was the current coaches. Your attempts to mischaracterize those FACTS are TRANSPARENT.

The organization of the youth program, keeping the best players, as well as the current coaches performance weren't discounted anymore than trying to validate the success of the program, is limited to the accomplishments of the current coach. The program currently is at the top of the state but has a ways to go to displace Glihousen's GlenOak and Miller's Central records.

Last edited by DB135; 06-05-17 at 03:16 AM.
  #36  
Old 06-04-17, 11:38 PM
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  #37  
Old 06-05-17, 03:08 AM
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  #38  
Old 06-05-17, 05:13 AM
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Only in Stark County.
  #39  
Old 06-05-17, 06:35 AM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Originally Posted by Red Right 88 View Post
I used to coach against the Jackson Jayhawks awhile ago. If I remember correctly, they were far from being Jackson's "youth program". I believe they were one travel team per age group that carried 10-11 players. They've been extinct for several years, so I doubt any of these players ever was a Jackson Jayhawk. The guy before Gamble probably rostered a few of these extinct birds.

Another attempt may be needed to draw a Massillon connection to this team's success. Maybe some of the players have a relative that graduated from Massillon or certainly a few players have driven through town at some point.
He's a desperate also-ran clutching at any excuse to attach his city to real success on the field by any link that he can.

I first saw those kids playing right across the street from Jackson HS. Bears Purple, Bears Black, Bears Gold. That's what I remember. And an awesome teaching umpire with a Greentown way of pronouncing his words behind the plate.


Congrats to Jackson, the City of Champions in Stark Co. No green tarnish to polish away on their trophies.
  #40  
Old 06-05-17, 06:38 AM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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The Jackson youth program had the team I spoke of as the beginning of the development of their youth program with traveling teams, hot stove teams, and in house teams in the program yearly. The program developed from there into where the program is now. As I stated earlier prior to the Jayhawk team, the best Jackson players were transferring elsewhere. Your sarcastic, witless response only makes you look foolish. The contribution of the Massillon grad was duly noted as was the current coaches. Your attempts to mischaracterize those FACTS are TRANSPARENT.

The organization of the youth program, keeping the best players, as well as the current coaches performance weren't discounted anymore than trying to validate the success of the program, is limited to the accomplishments of the current coach. The program currently is at the top of the state but has a ways to go to displace Glihousen's GlenOak and Miller's Central records.
Try asking yourself, "Why did the Massillon grad go to Jackson ?"
  #41  
Old 06-05-17, 07:03 AM
DB135 DB135 is offline
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Originally Posted by cabezadecaballo View Post
Try asking yourself, "Why did the Massillon grad go to Jackson ?"
You are an object lesson to the type of people who live to post assumptions you have no proof of, motivated by your hate of EVERYTHING connected to Massillon.

Ex. You ATTEMPT to refute first hand evidence by the compelling "comment" that you "saw" them play across the street from Jackson High School, so you know what happen. Check and see if Jackson resident Mike Hershberger, Jr. and a equally talented player by the name of Mallory, who were playing summer ball in the Jackson Hot Stove league, didn't play for Central Catholic. I witnessed the origin of the Jackson travel league program which was a primary reason for the later success of the high school program.

It is a mistake to attempt to reason with haters and trolls that play to a similar audience who will accept ANY idiotic response as refuting the truth / facts. I'm not obsessed with continuing to try to destroy a tradition and program to the point you have reached, where you have NO creditability.

I guess the Massillon grad moved to Jackson for the same reason many Jackson students transfer to Massillon to play football?!

Last edited by DB135; 06-05-17 at 07:16 AM.
  #42  
Old 06-05-17, 07:12 AM
White Lightning White Lightning is offline
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Originally Posted by DB135 View Post
The Jackson youth program had the team I spoke of as the beginning of the development of their youth program with traveling teams, hot stove teams, and in house teams in the program yearly. The program developed from there into where the program is now. As I stated earlier prior to the Jayhawk team, the best Jackson players were transferring elsewhere. Your sarcastic, witless response only makes you look foolish. The contribution of the Massillon grad was duly noted as was the current coaches. Your attempts to mischaracterize those FACTS are TRANSPARENT.

The organization of the youth program, keeping the best players, as well as the current coaches performance weren't discounted anymore than trying to validate the success of the program, is limited to the accomplishments of the current coach. The program currently is at the top of the state but has a ways to go to displace Glihousen's GlenOak and Miller's Central records.


I think it's highly doubtful that Gamble will come close to matching Gilhousen's record of two state championships in over 40 years of coaching - I mean, I just don't see that happening?


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  #43  
Old 06-05-17, 07:19 AM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Originally Posted by DB135 View Post
You are an object lesson to the type of people who live to post assumptions you have no proof of, motivated by your hate of EVERYTHING connected to Massillon.

Ex. You ATTEMPT to refute first hand evidence by the compelling "comment" that you lived across the street so you know what happen. Check and see if Jackson resident Mike Hershberger, Jr. and a equally talent player by the name of Mallory, who were playing summer ball in the Jackson Hot Stove league, didn't play for Central Catholic. I witnessed the origin of the Jackson travel league program which was a primary reason for the later success of the high school program.

It is a mistake to attempt to reason with haters and trolls that play to a similar audience who will accept ANY idiotic response as refuting the truth / facts. I'm not obsessed with continuing to try to destroy a tradition and program to the point you have reached, where you have NO creditability.

I guess the Massillon grad moved to Jackson for the same reason many Jackson students transfer to Massillon to play football?!
Are you outside your mind ? Delusional with jealousy ? You are making this^ stuff up. "Lived across the street"?

Back in 12u my kid's team played a few games down there. In Jackson, Jackson kids, in a complex and a program supported and sustained by Jackson parents. Doing what they did, at home, day in and day out, year in year out, to get to the pinnacle Sunday and earn another one in the Last Game.

Who cares about anything you are throwing around itt ? Not me. Your unhealthy fixation with ancient history is obviously not helpful.
  #44  
Old 06-05-17, 07:26 AM
DB135 DB135 is offline
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I think it's highly doubtful that Gamble will come close to matching Gilhousen's record of two state championships in over 40 years of coaching - I mean, I just don't see that happening?


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Nice cherry pick. Lets see, you forgot the 600 wins and back to back state championships. Keep making a fool of yourself though.
  #45  
Old 06-05-17, 07:32 AM
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Are you outside your mind ? Delusional with jealousy ? You are making this^ stuff up. "Lived across the street"?

Back in 12u my kid's team played a few games down there. In Jackson, Jackson kids, in a complex and a program supported and sustained by Jackson parents. Doing what they did, at home, day in and day out, year in year out, to get to the pinnacle Sunday and earn another one in the Last Game.

Who cares about anything you are throwing around itt ? Not me. Your unhealthy fixation with ancient history is obviously not helpful.
Anyone that has posted over 24,000 times in less than five years KNOWS about obsessions. You keep burying yourself with your idiotic rebutals to factual responses. What you saw in a "few" games is certainly slamdunk evidence proving your point. Your prove the troll / hater you are! The Jackson program is where it is at as result of a long process where a number of people deserve their share of the credit.
  #46  
Old 06-05-17, 07:41 AM
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DI State Championship: Massillon Jackson (29-2) vs Strongsville (25-8)

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Originally Posted by DB135 View Post
Nice cherry pick. Lets see, you forgot the 600 wins and back to back state championships. Keep making a fool of yourself though.


Well, honestly it appears you're the fool here bro. It's painfully obvious you know nothing about the current state of Jackson baseball, are making irrational connections to now defunct little league teams and are highlighting accomplishments of others you say won't be easy to meet yet that have already been met. You claim that the Massillon baseball success is based a lot on their great youth programs due in part to their high district rankings in the past? Let's make it easy for all to understand - how many district titles has the vaunted Massillon Tiger baseball program won in the last 10 or 20 years???


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  #47  
Old 06-05-17, 07:52 AM
DB135 DB135 is offline
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Well, honestly it appears you're the fool here bro. It's painfully obvious you know nothing about the current state of Jackson baseball, are making irrational connections to now defunct little league teams and are highlighting accomplishments of others you say won't be easy to meet yet that have already been met. You claim that the Massillon baseball success is based a lot on their great youth programs due in part to their high district rankings in the past? Let's make it easy for all to understand - how many distinct titles has the vaunted Massillon Tiger baseball program won in the last 10 or 20 years???


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it's obvious you are making factless assumptions about what I'm talking about choosing to jump on the bandwagon of haters / trolls and ignore the history of the program.

You make a fool of yourself discounting the accomplishments of a HOF coach and ignoring records few coaches can equal. Then you twist the information in the post that explained the Massillon traditional high seeded sectional position and qualifications for the district tournament. How many teams in the state have participated in the National Classic in Anaheim, Ca. where only the nations best teams are invited. Discussing a topic with trolls who have NO idea what they're talking about and are motivated to tear down a tradition they never will be able to clearly defines what you are.
  #48  
Old 06-05-17, 08:35 AM
White Lightning White Lightning is offline
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Originally Posted by DB135 View Post
it's obvious you are making factless assumptions about what I'm talking about choosing to jump on the bandwagon of haters / trolls and ignore the history of the program.

You make a fool of yourself discounting the accomplishments of a HOF coach and ignoring records few coaches can equal. Then you twist the information in the post that explained the Massillon traditional high seeded sectional position and qualifications for the district tournament. How many teams in the state have participated in the National Classic in Anaheim, Ca. where only the nations best teams are invited. Discussing a topic with trolls who have NO idea what they're talking about and are motivated to tear down a tradition they never will be able to clearly defines what you are.


So let's be clear here:
1.) you jumped on a post that basically stated that coach Gamble has turned the Jackson program into something quite different as evidenced by 4 straight district championships and 2 state championships. You alluded to the fact that this transformation was somehow linked to a change that happened in little league years ago instead of true transformation at the leadership level that has occurred.
2.) You then stated that Massillon's success in baseball can also be attributed to their strong youth programs. When you were asked to elaborate on the programs success, the only thing you could come up with is an invite to a tournament they were invited to (no mention of any success they've had in the tournament where they actually play in every year)
3.) You correctly do point out the success of legendary coaches Doug Miller and Smilin Joe Gilhousen. No argument there.


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  #49  
Old 06-05-17, 08:45 AM
Mackinbiner Mackinbiner is offline
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For the sake of the facts -

Gilhousen coached at Oakwood/GlenOak for 33 years and won 575 games. He won 17 Federal League titles, 10 district championships, and 2 state championships. He averaged 17 wins a season.

Gamble has coached at Jackson for 6 years and won 158 games. He has won 4 Federal League titles, 4 district championships, and 2 state championships. He has averaged 23 wins a season.
  #50  
Old 06-05-17, 09:00 AM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Anyone that has posted over 24,000 times in less than five years KNOWS about obsessions. You keep burying yourself with your idiotic rebutals to factual responses. What you saw in a "few" games is certainly slamdunk evidence proving your point. Your prove the troll / hater you are! The Jackson program is where it is at as result of a long process where a number of people deserve their share of the credit.
That^ is essentially what I've said from the beginning, and it's taken you a dozen-and-a-half posts itt to admit it. I merely cited my earliest experience with Jackson's youth program. I've seen the best of those kids around all summer long ever since.

All you wanted to do was bring the name of someone with a Massill00ney past into their accomplishments on the field, and you've lamely tried to defend that or deflect ever since. You just don't like getting called on it!
  #51  
Old 06-05-17, 09:08 AM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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new and improved
  #52  
Old 06-05-17, 09:12 AM
Mansfield Buckeye Mansfield Buckeye is offline
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I coached against the motices and dinglers etc back when they were 10u and up. They were good because they played top teams and won a lot. They learned to be champions a while ago. They were great players and the Jayhawk program was one of the best. If they never developed at such a high level early ...winning a state tile is exponentially more difficult. I don't live in Massillon but I have coached a few of your players so I am aware of the politics and hatred. Fact is it does start in your travel leagues at a young age. Especially at d1 high school. Jmo and wanted to give the Jayhawks a little credit. I coached ohio elite and mid ohio blaze and the jayhawks were tough. Congrats Jackson...you deserve all the credit
  #53  
Old 06-05-17, 09:31 AM
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So let's be clear here:
1.) you jumped on a post that basically stated that coach Gamble has turned the Jackson program into something quite different as evidenced by 4 straight district championships and 2 state championships. You alluded to the fact that this transformation was somehow linked to a change that happened in little league years ago instead of true transformation at the leadership level that has occurred.
2.) You then stated that Massillon's success in baseball can also be attributed to their strong youth programs. When you were asked to elaborate on the programs success, the only thing you could come up with is an invite to a tournament they were invited to (no mention of any success they've had in the tournament where they actually play in every year)
3.) You correctly do point out the success of legendary coaches Doug Miller and Smilin Joe Gilhousen. No argument there.





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I posted only to correct the credit not being correctly placed for the Jackson programs which you immediately attempted to refute with no evidence. You tried the hater response of assuming incorrectly this was a Massillon response that needed to be shouted down with NO factual rebuttal.

The Jackson program has been successful primarily through the establishment of a successful youth program. Nothing was mentioned about LL and you clearly know NOTHING about the history of the program. Jackson has since been successful through a "number" of head coaches due to that youth program and the talent they have.

Anyone that knows anything about baseball knows that success is primarily as a result of that program and talent which has translated through to other sports there. Mr. Gamble has had the fortune to be coaching an exceptional class. We will see over the long run if he exceeds the records of the legends of county high school baseball.

It is sad that EVERY thread where a Massillon link is involved in any manner leads to a rambling factless dissertation of the same tired arguments trying to destroy a tradition.
  #54  
Old 06-05-17, 09:41 AM
White Lightning White Lightning is offline
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Originally Posted by Mansfield Buckeye View Post
I coached against the motices and dinglers etc back when they were 10u and up. They were good because they played top teams and won a lot. They learned to be champions a while ago. They were great players and the Jayhawk program was one of the best. If they never developed at such a high level early ...winning a state tile is exponentially more difficult. I don't live in Massillon but I have coached a few of your players so I am aware of the politics and hatred. Fact is it does start in your travel leagues at a young age. Especially at d1 high school. Jmo and wanted to give the Jayhawks a little credit. I coached ohio elite and mid ohio blaze and the jayhawks were tough. Congrats Jackson...you deserve all the credit


Players who have recently moved through the Jackson program played on a # of different teams when they were younger. Jackson Purple, Black, Gold, Jayhawks and other programs all which contributed to their Development and success. Many even played for former Jackson Coach Kevin Miller during the summer. Many of these players also had access to the best off season trainers, hitting and pitching instruction. Being somewhat close to the program, when recent players return from their College Teams I would say the majority of these former players point out one key factor -- and that is Bill Gamble. He is a the key difference maker in the program transformation from good to great. Whether a kid sat the bench or started for Gamble, they loved playing for him. His influence is seen in every game they play. No hatred towards Massillon just happens to be the fact of the matter.


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  #55  
Old 06-05-17, 09:41 AM
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I posted......

It is sad that EVERY thread where a Massillon link is involved in any manner leads to a rambling factless dissertation of the same tired arguments trying to destroy a tradition.
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The foundation of the success of the Jackson varsity baseball program was laid many years ago with their youth program, the Jayhawks, by Massillon graduate Randy Cupari.
Climb down from your cross. You look like an idiot.
  #56  
Old 06-05-17, 09:44 AM
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That^ is essentially what I've said from the beginning, and it's taken you a dozen-and-a-half posts itt to admit it. I merely cited my earliest experience with Jackson's youth program. I've seen the best of those kids around all summer long ever since.

All you wanted to do was bring the name of someone with a Massill00ney past into their accomplishments on the field, and you've lamely tried to defend that or deflect ever since. You just don't like getting called on it!
I have coached summer ball and witnessed a Jackson program that took off with the establishment of their travel ball program. You refused to accept that Massillon could contribute anything positive in any situation because you hate Massillon which defines you as a hater / troll.

I offer direct evidence of two, of a number of players, that transferred from Jackson to other baseball programs prior to the establishment of that program. You continue to make a fool of yourself by offering no facts rebutting the points I have made. Only, since I'm from Massillon, they obviously are false for NO evidence that would legitimately stand up to any OBJECTIVE observer.

This board has become much better than it was but there with morons trolling their hate and they are programs that have found a way to beat the parochial advantage that are never called out. They were smarter about beating the rules than Massillon!
  #57  
Old 06-05-17, 09:48 AM
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Climb down from your cross. You look like an idiot.
You 24,000 post record and your style of ignoring facts and then trying to shout posters down with a hate Massillon agenda defines you.
  #58  
Old 06-05-17, 01:57 PM
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Massillon has been one of the better teams in the district (high seeded) and competed with GlenOak and Jackson at the districts. GlenOak has been clearly been the best program in the country up to this point winning back-to-back championships.
for years and won sectional titles along with GlenOak and Jackson for the district championship.
Glenoak has been the best team in the country? Now that is news I did not know.
  #59  
Old 06-05-17, 02:24 PM
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Glenoak has been the best team in the country? Now that is news I did not know.
http://www.cantonrep.com/sports/2017...t-the-distance
  #60  
Old 06-05-17, 04:06 PM
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I believe the post I responded to was to validate a successful formula for an athletic program. Of course you can't help but troll with your typical garbage. Tell me one problem Massillon has had with its baseball program. Attracting good players and coaches (Gilhousen) to a top program is common.

I coached in the high school summer program and there were NO recruiting problems.
You were the one trolling. Couldn't even congratulate them without bringing Massillon into the conversation, insinuating their success as a direct result of a Tiger.
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