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  #31  
Old 05-08-19, 05:35 PM
D4fan D4fan is offline
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I think the thing that drives me nuts about teaching or coaching is there is no end to the work that could be done and make improvements even if they are ever so subtle.


I work in a production type occupation. Sure I could overdue it with perfection but generally it is x number of widgets need produced and once I reach that threshold I am done for the day. I have zero vacation days, zero sick days, no paid time off and no 401k match. I do however set my time and week schedule, I would not trade that flexibility for all the other things mentioned.
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  #32  
Old 05-08-19, 07:32 PM
irish_buffalo irish_buffalo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smalls View Post
Not stating this because I think teaching is an easy job is or saying they are not under paid, but it seems like everyone thinks the private sector is all boats and "homes" (Step Brothers reference). Plus, I have encouraged my son to look into the profession and do his homework before he goes all in.

**************************

For 97% of employees where I work- maybe 1-3% raise each year, max out at 20 vacation days after 15 years, family of 4 = $525/month for health, dental and vision and plan on paying 100% of medical out of pocket until you hit $2,700 deductible and then 80/20 until you hit a $6,000 out of pocket max.

Work ~230 days a year (260-10 holidays-20 vacation days) and not counting coming in on weekends which is normal and part of salary.

Maybe 3% of employees become senior managers, work 60+ hours a week, have to relocate multiple times and make more than a school superintendent, but not typical.

**************************

Some additional info because my son researched it as part of his senior project;

Work 190 days a year - any sick or personal days

Teacher pension = 70% of highest pay in final 5 years. $85,000 x 70% = $59,500/yr

Plus they can pay into a 403B

15 sick days and 2 personal days a year (not counting major surgery to spouse/kids)

Sick days are worth $360/day and are paid out upon retirement at 70%, max out at 370 days (possibility of $93,240 "severance").

Health Insurance premium = $80 every 2 weeks, 80/20 until $500 deductible is met, then 100%

Union dues $45/pay until ~$850 is paid in a year

Cover someone else's class $125 on top of regular pay

Cover detention in the morning $25/hour
"Nachos and Lemonheads and my dad's boat..."

I get everything that you are saying but those numbers are ever changing and will change even more over the next 10-20 years.

The years of the teacher that has 3 "blocks" to teach, a couple planning periods, who is in at 7:30 and hitting the parking lot by 3:30 are going the way of the Dodo.

EIB refers to the pork and incest in many urban districts that gives teaching and administration a really bad name. These leeches are killing further generations in multiple ways. Oh yeah, and they refuse to retire because they have it so damned good. But they are slowly going away.

I know a local rural district where there is no "stadium crew" or "lawn maintenance" or "janitorial services" beyond the school and 40 hours. These coaches cut the grass, stripe the lines, clean the uniforms, and empty the trash. Kudos.
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  #33  
Old 05-08-19, 08:39 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Smalls View Post
Look if I could do it again I would go into teaching, my neighbors both teach and their cars are in the driveway when both my wife (Chemical Engineer) and I (Financial Analyst) leave in the morning and also when I come home at night. I also love that they invite us to their cottage multiple times throughout the summer in exchange for my son cutting their grass while they are gone.

I say good for them, they didn't have any impact on my chosen profession.......but it is not all about salaries. Work/family balance and premium benefits go way above and beyond the private sector and make it real attractive in my eyes. Especially if both spouses are teachers.
Absolutely. Every job has its downfalls and things one doesn't like (occasionally some time on a weekend according to someone earlier) but one cannot really dismiss the time off they get off with the summer, holidays, extended breaks, delays and cancellations, etc. I have three teachers in my immediate family and yeah they have zero complaints about the hours needed to get their jobs done when they compare it to 'the real world' as they say. My dad would go in an hour early to get things done, and add that to the planning period and taking advantage of his time he could easily leave soon after school and still have less than 8 hours in most days.

Nothing but respect for them, no doubt about that, but I wont fall for some of their 'woe is me' attitudes. While the rest of us have to hustle and take off early from work to go to kids events, the teachers are first to arrive.
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  #34  
Old 05-09-19, 02:43 PM
Akronite Akronite is offline
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WHat a sack of manure. With all due respect to the job they do, Teachers make very good money for their labor. They were u derpaid back in the 60s but not anymore and I get tired of hearing that mess about how underpaid they are...and I am one.

If you donít want to do the job then find other employment but donít go around whining that youíre underpaid when you work 180 some days a year and get benefits that are pretty good.
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  #35  
Old 05-09-19, 04:07 PM
Tallone Tallone is offline
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The reality is teachers are way underpaid.. Also coaches work 12 months a year.. The good news in Indiana Kentucky and Ohio is that you can be a Head Coach and not have to be a teacher. So you have the opportunity to have a job or your own business that generates a respectable income for you and your family and still get to coach and do something that you truly enjoy.
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  #36  
Old 05-10-19, 11:00 AM
dig it dig it is offline
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Take a drive thru the teacher parking lot and in general you'll find newer cars, so things must not be too bad. We all should have to start at the bottom and climb up the career ladder. Today's society has lost all sense of dedication and sacrifice. If you think you're getting screwed, by all means, move to another vocation. But don't whine and _itch about not being paid enough. The people who really love teaching and coaching will find a way to make ends meet. The financial reward in teaching is in the longevity. The financial reward in coaching, well there isn't any...so deal with it or don't do it. Anybody who doesn't know what they are getting into when they apply has only themselves to blame if its not the utopia they had hoped for....just like any job, public or private. If you take a job for money over passion, you will never be happy.
Teachers do just fine, if you are willing to stay for the long haul. Coaching is what is. I've lived this,so I know how it goes. My wife has taught for 31 years and I coached for the local school system for 11 years while being self employed. We live 17 miles from the school. It wasn't easy, or cheap, but we found a way....because we both loved it, not because we got rich.

Last edited by dig it; 05-10-19 at 11:29 AM.
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  #37  
Old 05-10-19, 01:33 PM
scbuckeye99 scbuckeye99 is offline
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This past wrestling season I kept the math on how many hours i put forth towards the wrestling team. Been coaching it for 15 years now but lately the topic of "fair compensation" has come up both in our district and around our state so I figured I'd see just if I was being fairly compensated.

I kept it to only in-season hours from day 1 to the last day of state. I even limited my study to only practices while school is in session and on top of it only counted hours spent at school or hours spent at another school. So no hours at home doing practice plans or watching tape at home, etc..... did not count the time spent on the bus or in hotels , etc..... just actual mat time / coaching from the corner time.

Now supplement is $2,400.00. Not sure how this compares but when was all was said and done I figured it out to $6.25 / hour to coach wresting. Essentially my school district is breaking federal law and paying me a good dollar below minimum wage haha.
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  #38  
Old 05-10-19, 08:29 PM
Stirred not Shaken Stirred not Shaken is offline
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I know a couple that live down the street from me that were teachers both retired in their mid to late 50's and my wife said together they take over 11 grand every month in pension. They buy a new car probably every 4 years. They make more in pension in a years time than most Americans make working ( avg. median Ohio household income is 52 grand ) I know other teachers who also retired in their mid 50's, must make a decent salary to retire that early. So cry me a river. Oh and by the way I had a brother who was a teacher worked his way up to super, have a nephew who is now a principal. Like anything else you want more pay work your way to the top.

Last edited by Stirred not Shaken; 05-10-19 at 08:42 PM.
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  #39  
Old 05-12-19, 11:09 AM
mustang fan mustang fan is offline
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My spouse retired from teaching recently much to the delight of both of us.
Unfortunately, not the same line of work as recently as a decade ago. Not even close. Just a shame what clueless politicians have done to public education. Knowing what she knows now, if my wife was just starting her work career, it would be in another field.
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  #40  
Old 05-14-19, 11:46 AM
Pigskin Pigskin is offline
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If you get into coaching expecting to make money, you are crazy. The only ones making any money at coaching are those who hold clinics, camps, etc in the off season.

Not to split hairs, but while most teachers LOVE to have their summers off, the reality is that their contract to teach is a 9 month contract. We get paid for 9 months work with payments spread out over a year. The idea that teachers get paid to do nothing in the summer is silly.
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  #41  
Old 05-14-19, 02:51 PM
DonJuanDeMarco DonJuanDeMarco is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Oh darn. An occasional weekend.
You have not a clue.
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  #42  
Old 05-14-19, 02:52 PM
DonJuanDeMarco DonJuanDeMarco is offline
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People who have active disdain for teachers are really weird.
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  #43  
Old 05-15-19, 07:49 AM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DonJuanDeMarco View Post
People who have active disdain for teachers are really weird.
Disdain?

Not at all. WIsh I went into that profession.

I have 4 immediate family members (and many friends) who are teachers and respect all they do, and by knowing them and hearing them have very few complaints about pay/time off/benefits I typically dismiss the whoa-is-me attitudes some teachers often proclaim.

When I hear someone on here whine about working on occasional Saturday or their days "off" (which usually only happens when they are clearing out for the summer or getting ready for school to start) all you have to do is look at the time off in the summers, delays, cancellations, extended Christmas breaks, many legal holidays that the general public aren't granted.

Who are the first people at their kids events/games/practices after school? It is not the average joes working, it is the teachers. Who has to take vacation/comp/non paid time off to get to their kids away games after school? Not teachers.

Tough job? Absolutely, but many people have tough jobs. You have to take the good with the bad in every job and those perks most def outweigh the minuses.
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  #44  
Old 05-15-19, 12:21 PM
mustang fan mustang fan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Disdain?
Not at all...
I failed to see where he specifically stated that you personally had "disdain"...Even though it clearly shows that you do.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
...WIsh I went into that profession...
Get going then...
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  #45  
Old 05-15-19, 12:38 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mustang fan View Post
I failed to see where he specifically stated that you personally had "disdain"...Even though it clearly shows that you do.


Get going then...
Pretty obvious whom he meant genius and also your reading comprehension skills need to be sharpened a bit as I gave ample explanations how I do NOT have disdain for the profession.

Too many people don't realize that one can criticize, critique some one or some thing but still be in support of them.

I have the upmost respect for teachers but it doesn't mean I have to buy in to their whoa-is-me act when it comes to their job. Every place has their positives and negatives and I believe the positives of the teaching profession far outweigh the negatives.


Oh, and it is a bit too late for me to change horses in mid stream!
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  #46  
Old 05-15-19, 01:13 PM
mustang fan mustang fan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
...I have the upmost respect for teachers....
Hardly, which is fine as you are entitled to your attitude...
Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
...Oh, and it is a bit too late for me to change horses in mid stream!
Just an excuse...And a lame one at that...Get going and pursue your "wish".
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  #47  
Old 05-15-19, 02:22 PM
DonJuanDeMarco DonJuanDeMarco is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
I have the upmost respect for teachers but it doesn't mean I have to buy in to their whoa-is-me act when it comes to their job.
"I respect them but I don't believe what they say about their job. I definitely know more about it than them."

(( resists urge to make spelling corrections ))
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  #48  
Old 05-15-19, 10:15 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mustang fan View Post
Hardly, which is fine as you are entitled to your attitude...

Just an excuse...And a lame one at that...Get going and pursue your "wish".
Nah, it is too late!

I did pursue a wish well beyond the normal age time frame with success that I am proud of though.


I dont know when it started that you cannot still support something but still be critical of it.
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  #49  
Old 05-16-19, 06:19 AM
dig it dig it is offline
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In today's day and age you can't be critical of anyone...not even yourself...some body will accuse you of being suicidal just for looking in the mirror.
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  #50  
Old 05-16-19, 06:30 AM
mustang fan mustang fan is offline
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Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
...well beyond the normal age time frame...
Whatever that vagueness means.
If you did "pursue a wish" later in life that would indicate that (per your assessment/opinion) the teaching profession wasn't as good of gig as you portray it to be here since you passed over that career option in favor of what you are doing now...Which is totally fine...However, regarding your "disdain" for teachers, if you are going to convey it here, at least be honest with yourself, and others, about your attitude when confronted about it.
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  #51  
Old 05-16-19, 07:21 AM
eastisbest eastisbest is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mustang fan View Post
Whatever that vagueness means.
If you did "pursue a wish" later in life that would indicate that (per your assessment/opinion) the teaching profession wasn't as good of gig as you portray it to be here since you passed over that career option in favor of what you are doing now...Which is totally fine...However, regarding your "disdain" for teachers, if you are going to convey it here, at least be honest with yourself, and others, about your attitude when confronted about it.
Simply put, you're losing your argument, badly. And coming off childish arguing insipid points and passed tedious at the last light.

You've pushed reasonable way out the window. He showed no disdain, no disrespect and he nor anyone else is obligated to glorify. Their motives would be suspect lacking objectivity if they did.
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  #52  
Old 05-16-19, 07:26 AM
scbuckeye99 scbuckeye99 is offline
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The "Golden Age" of teacher retirement especially in Ohio is long gone. My parents both began teaching in the 70s and retired 10 years ago making 66% of their best three years as a teacher of 30 years and 88% of his best 3 years as a teacher / admin of 35 plus years. Both my parents make over 6 figures in pension each year because the "old" system in Ohio allowed one to retire after 30 years and take home 66% of their best 3 years and if they stayed on for 35 years they could take home 88%. Those days are LONG gone and now one has to work until they are 60 and there is now only one retirement tier.
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  #53  
Old 05-16-19, 07:56 AM
dig it dig it is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by scbuckeye99 View Post
The "Golden Age" of teacher retirement especially in Ohio is long gone. My parents both began teaching in the 70s and retired 10 years ago making 66% of their best three years as a teacher of 30 years and 88% of his best 3 years as a teacher / admin of 35 plus years. Both my parents make over 6 figures in pension each year because the "old" system in Ohio allowed one to retire after 30 years and take home 66% of their best 3 years and if they stayed on for 35 years they could take home 88%. Those days are LONG gone and now one has to work until they are 60 and there is now only one retirement tier.
Still a hell of a lot better than social security, which is based on your "best 35 years" and available at 62 if you take the greatly reduced rate. STRS is not what it used to be, but its still one of the best retirement systems out there.
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  #54  
Old 05-16-19, 11:16 AM
mustang fan mustang fan is offline
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Originally Posted by dig it View Post
Still a hell of a lot better than social security...
As one would expect it to be considering the rate in which the employee and employer contribute towards STRS in comparison to Social Security. Currently, employees contribute over twice as much of their pay (14%) towards STRS than those that contribute towards Social Security.
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  #55  
Old 05-16-19, 12:26 PM
dig it dig it is offline
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Originally Posted by mustang fan View Post
As one would expect it to be considering the rate in which the employee and employer contribute towards STRS in comparison to Social Security. Currently, employees contribute over twice as much of their pay (14%) towards STRS than those that contribute towards Social Security.
Be careful how you twist the #s. I'm looking at my wife's last teaching stub. STRS board amount=14%, STRSANPK wife's share=10.7%. My share of social security= 12.4%(I'm self employed).

I'm 7 years older than my wife and have been paying into social security for 42 years, basically retired now. I'll start drawing ss check in a couple of years at age 62 with a monthly payment of roughly 1700.00 and a low limit on how much i can make in the future without being penalized. My wife plans on retiring at the age of 58 with 36 years in. Her projected retirement is just under 60,000.00 (5,000.00 per month) with no restrictions on double dipping or working in the private sector.

Over the course of our careers (with me working an additional 6 years) we have each made about the same amount of money. She will have probably made about 5-8% more and I will have easily worked 25% more hours per year.

So you tell me who has the better retirement situation. I'm very thankful she has the retirement she does. And even though she's unhappy about just missing the "golden age" of STRS, she knows how good she has it when it comes to pay, benefits, and retirement.
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  #56  
Old 05-16-19, 03:28 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Originally Posted by mustang fan View Post
Whatever that vagueness means.
If you did "pursue a wish" later in life that would indicate that (per your assessment/opinion) the teaching profession wasn't as good of gig as you portray it to be here since you passed over that career option in favor of what you are doing now...Which is totally fine...However, regarding your "disdain" for teachers, if you are going to convey it here, at least be honest with yourself, and others, about your attitude when confronted about it.
Yeah, it was intentionally vague. I had to get some age waivers to accomplish what I did/am doing. Although I have been told often times while I was coaching, and currently while I mentor younger people in my profession that I 'should have been a teacher' it just never happened.

We all have regrets in life, and one of mine was that I didn't pursue it but everything works itself out and I am doing well.

As I stated many times, I have no disdain for the teaching profession and realize it isn't easy but for those who totally dismiss all the perks and act as if their lives are miserable then I will call them out.

Many family members are in the profession and love it and cannot beat the hours/time off!
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  #57  
Old 05-21-19, 08:52 AM
starktops starktops is offline
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If you write that well, we need to fire that english teacher.
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