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  #1  
Old 09-10-18, 10:32 AM
EXPRESS EXPRESS is offline
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Two sport athletes

Soccer has now become a year round sport and clubs are punishing two sport athletes while colleges are encouraging it. For a soccer player playing basketball, the athlete is conditioning and training other muscles 5 to 6 days a weeks for 4 months. For soccer only athletes they're training most likely 1 maybe 2 days a week over the winter. The basketball player is going to be in much better shape and have trained a completely different set of muscle movements than the soccer only player. Club coaches should be more considerate of these two sport athletes and accommodate their once a week practice with the basket players which is not hard to do. Punishing a kid for playing two sports has got to stop. Thoughts..............
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Old 09-10-18, 10:40 AM
lovesallsports lovesallsports is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EXPRESS View Post
Soccer has now become a year round sport and clubs are punishing two sport athletes while colleges are encouraging it. For a soccer player playing basketball, the athlete is conditioning and training other muscles 5 to 6 days a weeks for 4 months. For soccer only athletes they're training most likely 1 maybe 2 days a week over the winter. The basketball player is going to be in much better shape and have trained a completely different set of muscle movements than the soccer only player. Club coaches should be more considerate of these two sport athletes and accommodate their once a week practice with the basket players which is not hard to do. Punishing a kid for playing two sports has got to stop. Thoughts..............


I agree 100%. There are some girls that play very high level soccer and do still play high school basketball. I know a couple of the DA girls that do it including the kid from West that plays on the National team.
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Old 09-10-18, 11:45 AM
Hoosier Parent Hoosier Parent is offline
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I've not seen it be an issue. I know several OE girls that played HS basketball in addition to our training. I also know several that missed time from basketball injuries, for whatever that's worth.

My daughter runs track in the spring. She went to practice after school, came home and ate, then made the 1:15 drive to Cinci for practice. She missed a few practices for meets. Doug only encouraged her.
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Old 09-10-18, 05:31 PM
Futbol2017 Futbol2017 is offline
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Ive always thought that soccer and basketball are 2 sports that alike. These are kids, they need and deserve to experience different sports. Glad to see OE agrees. (Wait for it, Coachg should be here any second, lol)
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Old 09-10-18, 07:43 PM
Philly_Cat Philly_Cat is offline
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Originally Posted by Futbol2017 View Post
Ive always thought that soccer and basketball are 2 sports that alike. These are kids, they need and deserve to experience different sports. Glad to see OE agrees. (Wait for it, Coachg should be here any second, lol)
Was this a pop shot at CUP? CUP, including the DA, encourages kids play other sports, particularly basketball. The CUP DA does however want them only playing soccer during the Fall and Spring.

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  #6  
Old 09-10-18, 07:47 PM
Futbol2017 Futbol2017 is offline
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No, Hoosier said OE allows it, I was responding to that...
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  #7  
Old 09-10-18, 09:00 PM
soccer21stcentury soccer21stcentury is offline
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I think it depends on how competitive the high school is. Div 1 competitive high schools are way more demanding of their players time with AAU offseason, preseason training and league games. Also, most D1 committed soccer players are not encouraged to play 2 sports(injuries).
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Old 09-10-18, 11:59 PM
onehotbobo onehotbobo is offline
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High School coaches miss out on tremendous athletes when they make them decide on one sport so a lot of schools have eliminated that rule. As far as wear and tear and injuries go there are more chances of that happening if two sports are played simultaneously. My daughter did AAU and club soccer and it was too much at the same time for her - both coaches emphasized a ton of running in practice. Some girls handle it just fine while others get injured or appear to have less energy available during practice and games. Id always encourage multi sports but too much physical demand can cause burn out or worse yet knee or leg problems. So it depends on the intensity of the programs.


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  #9  
Old 09-11-18, 07:53 AM
belied dat belied dat is offline
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This is an often tiring argument.

Not every athlete is the same. Lumping all athletes into "specialization" or "multi-sport" groups does not do anyone justice. Some athletes can do multiple sports at the same time and excel. Some athletes need to "specialize" for the benefit of their own ability. If one is looking at pure "health" or "athleticism," there's nothing that says a multi-sport athlete is "better."

Can one specialize but still cross-train? Absolutely. Just because someone chooses to specialize does not mean he/she fails to participate recreationally in other sports. This "specialization" phenomenon is largely an American discussion. Across the world, many kids play one sport, but still have fun with their friends doing other sports.

I don't encourage specialization on anyone. But, I also don't encourage multi-sport athletes. It's up to the athlete and family to determine what is best for the athlete/family. There's a lot of benefit of either decision. Neither decision is right/wrong, to some extent. Just understand, if one chooses to be a multi-sport athlete, he/she may end up behind in a certain sport/skill because of someone else choosing to specialize. That's just the facts of it.

Either way, REST is needed for ANY athlete whichever route one chooses. The body requires rest. To become better at any, and all, sport(s), the muscles will need recovery time. The mind needs recovery time. Families need recovery time.
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Old 09-11-18, 11:03 AM
Conan73 Conan73 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by belied dat View Post
this is an often tiring argument.

Not every athlete is the same. Lumping all athletes into "specialization" or "multi-sport" groups does not do anyone justice. Some athletes can do multiple sports at the same time and excel. Some athletes need to "specialize" for the benefit of their own ability. If one is looking at pure "health" or "athleticism," there's nothing that says a multi-sport athlete is "better."

can one specialize but still cross-train? Absolutely. Just because someone chooses to specialize does not mean he/she fails to participate recreationally in other sports. This "specialization" phenomenon is largely an american discussion. Across the world, many kids play one sport, but still have fun with their friends doing other sports.

I don't encourage specialization on anyone. But, i also don't encourage multi-sport athletes. It's up to the athlete and family to determine what is best for the athlete/family. There's a lot of benefit of either decision. Neither decision is right/wrong, to some extent. Just understand, if one chooses to be a multi-sport athlete, he/she may end up behind in a certain sport/skill because of someone else choosing to specialize. That's just the facts of it.

Either way, rest is needed for any athlete whichever route one chooses. The body requires rest. To become better at any, and all, sport(s), the muscles will need recovery time. The mind needs recovery time. Families need recovery time.
well said!
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Old 09-12-18, 10:48 AM
5x26 5x26 is offline
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Recovery time is important but the body does not need months or weeks off to recover. I was a D1 athlete in Football and played every sport I could at every chance I had from 8-18 years old. Listening to most of the Womens National team players (prior to the announcement of the Girls DA) they nearly all said they credit their multi sport athletics to their success. Even sports that appear similar (Track and Cross Country) enhance their soccer games. 3 years ago when Penn State won the NCAA title 80% of their players were awarded letters in multiple sports in high school, same with WV when they were runners up in '17.


From the national team interviews.

"A quick survey of members of the squad found that collectively they played at least 14 different sports competitively while growing up, as well as soccer. And significantly, all believe the other disciplines enhanced rather than hindered their soccer careers."

https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...iday/29665797/

I do believe that you have to place a priority on one sport, I know my girls all do many things but always place the focus on soccer.
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  #12  
Old 09-12-18, 11:18 AM
yapster2017 yapster2017 is offline
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Originally Posted by lovesallsports View Post
I agree 100%. There are some girls that play very high level soccer and do still play high school basketball. I know a couple of the DA girls that do it including the kid from West that plays on the National team.

The best athletes dominate every sport including soccer. Most of this is genetics and the rest comes from hard work. Multi sports athletes should be celebrated not relegated out of soccer. I see nothing wrong with focusing on one sport if you so choose. Every development path is different quit trying to make one size fits all.

When I watched the US vs Mexico match yesterday I saw more athletes than technical players on the US side. We talk about technical players in this country, but the players I keep seeing called up are the best athletes.
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  #13  
Old 09-12-18, 11:45 AM
cincysports4 cincysports4 is offline
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Originally Posted by yapster2017 View Post
The best athletes dominate every sport including soccer. Most of this is genetics and the rest comes from hard work. Multi sports athletes should be celebrated not relegated out of soccer. I see nothing wrong with focusing on one sport if you so choose. Every development path is different quit trying to make one size fits all.

When I watched the US vs Mexico match yesterday I saw more athletes than technical players on the US side. We talk about technical players in this country, but the players I keep seeing called up are the best athletes.
You still have to be athletic to play at the highest stage in the world. Can't just be technical and unathletic. Need to be both. I just think people mis-use the word "Athlete".
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  #14  
Old 09-12-18, 11:46 AM
belied dat belied dat is offline
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Originally Posted by 5x26 View Post
From the national team interviews.

"A quick survey of members of the squad found that collectively they played at least 14 different sports competitively while growing up, as well as soccer. And significantly, all believe the other disciplines enhanced rather than hindered their soccer careers."
This is often a route that "multi-sport" proponents go (not claiming that is you 5x26). The problem with this route is: not everyone is at the national team level. Take that to any level. Sure, many NFL players were multi-sport athletes. The fact of the matter is, very few at any school, any team, any sport, are at the level that those players are.

Playing multiple sports won't necessarily put you at THAT level. So, while people like to cite Urban Meyer's comments about recruiting multi-sport athletes, tOSU athlete is much different than most athletes.

Tangent: I hate how football players are lumped into it anyway. There's no football "club" that will allow football players to specialize and do that year-round. So, yes, they will probably get involved in any other sport because they have no option to focus on football. Every other sport will do SAQ and weights.

Quote:
Originally Posted by yapster2017 View Post
I see nothing wrong with focusing on one sport if you so choose. Every development path is different quit trying to make one size fits all.

When I watched the US vs Mexico match yesterday I saw more athletes than technical players on the US side.
Great stuff yapster. A lot of truth in these sentiments.
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Old 09-12-18, 11:55 AM
Iniesta Iniesta is offline
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Originally Posted by yapster2017 View Post
When I watched the US vs Mexico match yesterday I saw more athletes than technical players on the US side. We talk about technical players in this country, but the players I keep seeing called up are the best athletes.
For sure. Weve had great athletes for a long time and I wouldnt say that approach is necessarily getting it done.
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Old 09-12-18, 12:12 PM
belied dat belied dat is offline
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Originally Posted by cincysports4 View Post
You still have to be athletic to play at the highest stage in the world. Can't just be technical and unathletic. Need to be both. I just think people mis-use the word "Athlete".
This. So much of this.

When people start talking about needing the "athlete" to compete. I ask them what defines the athlete. How can one determine who is the "athlete." It always reverts back to the same thing: size.

Yes, speed and/or strength comes up, but size is the one that has trumped anything else. The 6'8" LeBron James. People won't argue speed much, they don't really know how fast many of the soccer players are. They also have no clue on the endurance of any soccer player.

They think that because someone "looks" like a freak athlete, that means it translates to soccer. Nevermind the time that every athlete has put into their trade being better at their sport. No one can truly argue that any USMNT player is any worse of an athlete than anyone in any other sport. They are all great athletes in their own sport.
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Old 09-14-18, 11:15 AM
coachg coachg is offline
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Originally Posted by Futbol2017 View Post
Ive always thought that soccer and basketball are 2 sports that alike. These are kids, they need and deserve to experience different sports. Glad to see OE agrees. (Wait for it, Coachg should be here any second, lol)
I played basketball and soccer the seasons over lapped just a bit but not by much. DA does seem to allow them to play basketball since its a seperate season. So what the issue?

Where I see problems come up are with young people trying to play two sports at the same time such as Cross Country and Soccer. I see a lot of overuse injuries and when I have players doing both I will watch my players and back them down to prevent the injuries but parents really need to look at what it does to them while the kids are growing a lot around that U13 to U15 age where we see a lot of growth plate issues.
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Old 09-14-18, 11:22 AM
coachg coachg is offline
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Originally Posted by 5x26 View Post
Recovery time is important but the body does not need months or weeks off to recover. I was a D1 athlete in Football and played every sport I could at every chance I had from 8-18 years old. Listening to most of the Womens National team players (prior to the announcement of the Girls DA) they nearly all said they credit their multi sport athletics to their success. Even sports that appear similar (Track and Cross Country) enhance their soccer games. 3 years ago when Penn State won the NCAA title 80% of their players were awarded letters in multiple sports in high school, same with WV when they were runners up in '17.
So at what age did the National Team players decide to focus in just soccer?

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Originally Posted by 5x26 View Post
From the national team interviews.

"A quick survey of members of the squad found that collectively they played at least 14 different sports competitively while growing up, as well as soccer. And significantly, all believe the other disciplines enhanced rather than hindered their soccer careers."
Not discrediting what they said but if I listed out all the sports I played growing up the list would be long. At what age do they believe a players need to determine what sport to focus on?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 5x26 View Post
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sport...iday/29665797/

I do believe that you have to place a priority on one sport, I know my girls all do many things but always place the focus on soccer.
I don't know your girls ages but if one was 13 and running CC and playing soccer and the started complaining about shin splints, or pain and you learned it was a growth plate and they had to take season off because the Doctor said to. So now your 10 year old turns 13 and wants to run both sports at the same time what would your advice be?

Last edited by coachg; 09-18-18 at 03:44 PM..
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Old 09-14-18, 04:45 PM
EXPRESS EXPRESS is offline
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Originally Posted by coachg View Post
I played basketball and soccer the seasons over lapped just a bit but not by much. DA does seem to allow them to play basketball since its a seperate season. So what the issue?

Where I see problems come up are with young people trying to play two sports at the same time such as Cross Country and Soccer. I see a lot of overuse injuries and when I have players doing both I will watch my players and back them down to prevent the injuries but parents really need to look at what it does to them while the kids are growing a lot around that U13 to U15 age where we see a lot of growth plate issues.
The issue is club coaches punishing kids in the winter months for missing practices that they schedule during the week at basketball practices times. This is an easy problem to solve but multiple coaches are punishing and discouraging them to play basketball. Its ridiculous in my opinion.
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Old 09-14-18, 04:56 PM
Philly_Cat Philly_Cat is offline
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Originally Posted by EXPRESS View Post
The issue is club coaches punishing kids in the winter months for missing practices that they schedule during the week at basketball practices times. This is an easy problem to solve but multiple coaches are punishing and discouraging them to play basketball. Its ridiculous in my opinion.
Where is this happening? Maybe what needs to start happening is people need to find more accommodating clubs.

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Last edited by Philly_Cat; 09-14-18 at 07:20 PM..
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  #21  
Old 09-15-18, 06:15 AM
Hoosier Parent Hoosier Parent is offline
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Originally Posted by EXPRESS View Post
The issue is club coaches punishing kids in the winter months for missing practices that they schedule during the week at basketball practices times. This is an easy problem to solve but multiple coaches are punishing and discouraging them to play basketball. Its ridiculous in my opinion.
I'm guessing it may come down to the level of the kid. If she's a borderline player and missing practices, I could understand it being an issue.
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Old 09-17-18, 08:55 AM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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Originally Posted by EXPRESS View Post
Soccer has now become a year round sport and clubs are punishing two sport athletes while colleges are encouraging it. For a soccer player playing basketball, the athlete is conditioning and training other muscles 5 to 6 days a weeks for 4 months. For soccer only athletes they're training most likely 1 maybe 2 days a week over the winter. The basketball player is going to be in much better shape and have trained a completely different set of muscle movements than the soccer only player. Club coaches should be more considerate of these two sport athletes and accommodate their once a week practice with the basket players which is not hard to do. Punishing a kid for playing two sports has got to stop. Thoughts..............
I don't see that happening
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Old 09-17-18, 11:50 AM
belied dat belied dat is offline
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I've been in numerous states. I've never once seen any kid punished for being a multi-sport athlete.

Not saying it doesn't happen. But, at what rate does it happen? I'm guessing it is an extremely small rate. I'm talking 4 states in the last 8 years, and never once seeing/hearing it happen with anyone I've had direct contact with -- either the athlete, family, or their own connections.
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Old 09-18-18, 10:51 AM
EXPRESS EXPRESS is offline
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I don't see that happening
Its happening at several clubs in Cincy but it seems to be coach driven rather than club. Club coaches either pushing mutlisport kids to different age group or making them play down a level for missing a winter practice. This at the elite level so maybe much different at a premier level.
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Old 09-18-18, 01:05 PM
Hoosier Parent Hoosier Parent is offline
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Originally Posted by EXPRESS View Post
Its happening at several clubs in Cincy but it seems to be coach driven rather than club. Club coaches either pushing mutlisport kids to different age group or making them play down a level for missing a winter practice. This at the elite level so maybe much different at a premier level.
Again, I think if the kid is able to perform at soccer while playing a second sport, coaches are inclined to be open to it. I bet that it's borderline players who are having issues most of the time.

I would think that a coach would be inclined to not relegate a girl (Just for spite) who would help his team play at a higher level. Seems counterproductive.

I can think of at least 8 or 9 girls at OE who do a variety of sports with no problem.
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Old 09-18-18, 02:16 PM
Philly_Cat Philly_Cat is offline
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Originally Posted by Hoosier Parent View Post
Again, I think if the kid is able to perform at soccer while playing a second sport, coaches are inclined to be open to it. I bet that it's borderline players who are having issues most of the time.

I would think that a coach would be inclined to not relegate a girl (Just for spite) who would help his team play at a higher level. Seems counterproductive.

I can think of at least 8 or 9 girls at OE who do a variety of sports with no problem.
This.

I think it really comes down to each individual player and not necessarily the coach. If a player can perform at a high level at a sport while playing another sport, I don't know many if any coaches that would force them to only play their sport. It's when you have a play that is just average or above average at a sport but wants to play other sports. At that point the coach begins to think they need that player to get better at their sport by giving it more time or they may need to replace them with someone else with more potential for their team.

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Old 09-18-18, 03:18 PM
Conan73 Conan73 is offline
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Originally Posted by Philly_Cat View Post
This.

I think it really comes down to each individual player and not necessarily the coach. If a player can perform at a high level at a sport while playing another sport, I don't know many if any coaches that would force them to only play their sport. It's when you have a play that is just average or above average at a sport but wants to play other sports. At that point the coach begins to think they need that player to get better at their sport by giving it more time or they may need to replace them with someone else with more potential for their team.

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Most club coaches will not stop an athlete from playing another sport. Instead, they will lay out the requirements associated with playing for his/her team. This will cover the number of practices per week, games, and any other team related item. If the athlete can fulfill his/her obligations and still play another sport, then so be it. It is when the athlete uses the fact that he/she plays another sport and should be excused from practices, show up late for games, etc that coaches get upset because it is that coach's team that ends up suffering.

The idea of playing multiple sports tends to be an American phenomenon that stems from the fact that we have always had a lot of sports to choose from. Out of this, we developed a seasonal framework where you play one sport in the Fall, another in the Winter, and another in the Spring.

With the exception of football, the other big sports can be played year-round; especially for the top, most-advanced players. It's not just soccer that is year round now (also, soccer has been year-round everywhere else in the world except the US). Both basketball and baseball are year-round for their elite athletes (hockey is as well up north). These sports all have technical components that demand repetition in order for players to excel to the highest levels.

Herein lies the problem. The American model used to involve playing one sport at a time. Now, as sports become year-round, you have soccer players trying to play basketball and vice versa at the same time. This leads to fatigue and over-use injuries.

The answer is not to make club soccer a one season sport, or have coaches that "allow" players to skip practice and/or games to play another sport. The solution is to have the athlete make some tough choices. If they have to play multiple sports, they can always play rec league or only play high soccer and not club soccer, etc.
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Old 09-18-18, 03:57 PM
coachg coachg is offline
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Originally Posted by EXPRESS View Post
The issue is club coaches punishing kids in the winter months for missing practices that they schedule during the week at basketball practices times. This is an easy problem to solve but multiple coaches are punishing and discouraging them to play basketball. Its ridiculous in my opinion.
But isn't also true of school coaches? Example A soccer player also runs cross country. The player misses a CC practice for a soccer game and the CC coach is upset because they missed training but if they really looked at it a starter in soccer that plays a lot of minutes runs about 3-4 miles per match so they did get their running in but yet the coach is upset or how about a HS basketball coach that is upset that a player misses a scrimmage due to a club match and tells the player they may not make a team because they are not dedicated. How is it really any different? I as a coach am as flexible as I can be but if a player misses a training session every week or really often due to another sport or activity and that player begins to fall behind what do you guys suggest be done? Shouldn't I tell the player they are falling behind and risk losing their starting position or is that considered threatening them? I would also like to hear the threats you guys are saying that are being said to these kids. Its a fine line and I believe a coach needs to be honest about where a player stands. I look forward to hearing all the input.
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Old 09-18-18, 04:01 PM
coachg coachg is offline
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Originally Posted by Conan73 View Post
Most club coaches will not stop an athlete from playing another sport. Instead, they will lay out the requirements associated with playing for his/her team. This will cover the number of practices per week, games, and any other team related item. If the athlete can fulfill his/her obligations and still play another sport, then so be it. It is when the athlete uses the fact that he/she plays another sport and should be excused from practices, show up late for games, etc that coaches get upset because it is that coach's team that ends up suffering.

The idea of playing multiple sports tends to be an American phenomenon that stems from the fact that we have always had a lot of sports to choose from. Out of this, we developed a seasonal framework where you play one sport in the Fall, another in the Winter, and another in the Spring.

With the exception of football, the other big sports can be played year-round; especially for the top, most-advanced players. It's not just soccer that is year round now (also, soccer has been year-round everywhere else in the world except the US). Both basketball and baseball are year-round for their elite athletes (hockey is as well up north). These sports all have technical components that demand repetition in order for players to excel to the highest levels.

Herein lies the problem. The American model used to involve playing one sport at a time. Now, as sports become year-round, you have soccer players trying to play basketball and vice versa at the same time. This leads to fatigue and over-use injuries.

The answer is not to make club soccer a one season sport, or have coaches that "allow" players to skip practice and/or games to play another sport. The solution is to have the athlete make some tough choices. If they have to play multiple sports, they can always play rec league or only play high soccer and not club soccer, etc.
Well said...
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Old 10-05-18, 03:49 PM
ZfishInMason ZfishInMason is offline
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Originally Posted by belied dat View Post
This is often a route that "multi-sport" proponents go (not claiming that is you 5x26). The problem with this route is: not everyone is at the national team level. Take that to any level. Sure, many NFL players were multi-sport athletes. The fact of the matter is, very few at any school, any team, any sport, are at the level that those players are.

Playing multiple sports won't necessarily put you at THAT level. So, while people like to cite Urban Meyer's comments about recruiting multi-sport athletes, tOSU athlete is much different than most athletes.
This. The "typical" HS athlete can (and often does) participate in multiple sports, if they so desire. As was mentioned above, if the school is highly competitive in that sport (eg, small school State powers or big D1 programs) it becomes less likely to occur.

That said, for the really elite kids who are shooting for D1 college scholarships, you will see extreme specialization dominate as the technical aspects of many sports have to be honed to the keenest edge, through extraordinary repetition, in order to compete at that level and it isn't usually possible (extreme genetic outliers in professional sports excluded) to put anything less than your heart and soul into that effort if you want to achieve the dream. Remember, big D1 programs (and alot of D2s) are recruiting internationally now. Kids are literally competing against the best in the world for that scholarship (and many of these international kids are older and more physically mature than our 18 yr old HS graduates).
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