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Old 08-19-14, 08:03 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Originally Posted by Look Ma No Hands View Post
If that's the case, can you quote this illegal act in the rule book. Not trying to be a smart aleck, I just want someone to show me there's a rule against intentionally breaking the rules. And if so, then why doesn't it apply to intentional fouling.
Rule 10-1-5 )Technical Fouls) -- "A team shall not.... allow the game to develop into an actionless contest." The action you describe, if permitted will result in a contest that become actionless. Remember, the team shooting is not required to score. They have done nothing wrong. The team violating is trying to force a team into doing something that by rule they are not required to do.

Originally Posted by Look Ma No Hands View Post
Accepted practice? Fouling is breaking the rules. Its against the rules and there is a penalty for it.
Agreed. The penalties have increased over the years. Remember when there was no double bonus? The double bonus is a direct result of fouling at the end of the game. In addition, increased emphasis has been placed on intentional fouls, particularly in the waning moments of a game.

Originally Posted by Look Ma No Hands View Post
And that's not always in the team's best interest. And the penalty of a FT violation is the team gets another chance to make the FT.
And again, they are not required to make the free throw. Your scenario forces them to score.

Originally Posted by Look Ma No Hands View Post
But it is not in the best interest of the team to shoot the FTs. They don't want to shoot the FTs. But they have to because the other team broke the rules. So when there's a FT violation, the other team gets to (has to) shoot the FT again. It shouldn't matter what the situation is.
Until the rule changes where under a team gets the option of shooting or retaining possession of the ball, this is what they have to deal with. At the same time, a team up 7 with 1:30 to play is going to try to make the attempts in order to increase their lead. If they are instructed to miss on purpose, the coach isn't going to be around long.

Originally Posted by Look Ma No Hands View Post
So its OK to make the other team shoot FTs at the end of the game by breaking the rules of fouling, but it is not OK to make the other team to shoot FTs at the end of the game because of a lane violation?
Yep. Again, with ample time remaining, missing the shots on purpose gives the opponent an opportunity. Missing the shots in the scenario you propose is not illegal.

Originally Posted by Look Ma No Hands View Post
Breaking rules is breaking rules. There are penalties for breaking rules.
Agreed again. Forcing a team to score because another team is violating intentionally makes no sense from a rules standpoint or a common sens standpoint. They are violating to gain an advantage. Therefopre, they are not penalized for their illegal actions.

Originally Posted by Look Ma No Hands View Post
The irony is you and I have had the discussion that there are coaches at the Division I level (and I gave you a name in an earlier private message) and at other levels that think it is wrong to tell young people to foul at the end of the game. They think it is a bad message to tell a young man to break the rules because it gives you a better chance to win. They don't think you should teach young people that the ends justifies the means. You don't believe those coaches exist. I know they do. I gave you a name. I can give you his phone number too. But those coaches are few. You might say that it is "accepted practice," but don't discount those who think there is a higher calling in the educational experience within the athletic experience.

Now don't get me wrong. I don't want to see intentional lane violations at the end of a game. On the contrary I really don't want to see kids intentionally breaking any rules at the end of a game. It bugs me that everyone is OK with the practice of breaking some of the rules, but only selected ones.

I'm done preaching for now.
Again, the penalties are such that more often than not, the team "breaking the rules" does not prevail.

"Accepted practice" is a term that comes right from the governing body that makes our rules. Wanna take a stab at the coach/administrator to official ratio is on the rules committee? (Answer: Overwhelmingly coaches/administrations. There are very few officials on the rules committee)

We don't make the rules, we just enforce them as they want us to enforce them.
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