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  #91  
Old 09-17-17, 10:47 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Originally Posted by Bball216 View Post
I can see why kids at times transfer from a school where their individual talent exceeds that of the program. Example: Had Higgins attended Wickliffe instead of VASJ. That program would not develop his game or allow him to test his abilities against the best the state and nation has to offer. That is not the case with the kids who transferred from VASJ. There is NOTHING another program can provide for these kids that has not already been or could be provided for them at Joe's. Remember Gaffney is getting all these offers and has not had a practice yet at Garfield. He is getting those offers off what he did at Joe's and in AAU.

I spoke with some of the VASJ players on Friday and they have the attitude that if you don't want to be here - leave. They are chomping at the bit to play. Joe's did lose some talent - but they still have talent as well. I have heard rumors that the kids didn't want to play for Coach Kwas. If true that is a shame because they will not realize how good they had it until they are gone. Is Kwas easy to play for - no. Name me one GREAT coach that is. Does he work you hard - yes, is he hard on you - yes, does he make you accountable- yes, does he make you attend class, be on time and get good grades - yes, does he expect more from you than you expect out of yourself - yes, does he make you a better person when you leave then you were when you arrived - yes and most importantly does he help and love his players - yes. Is he perfect - no. Name me anybody who is.

There are a lot of haters both outside the program and unfortunately some inside. I don't know how you can be a fan of Joe's yet say some of the things that I have heard. Pretty pathetic. That comes with the territory when you have the sucesss Joe's has. The coaching staff and the roster will look different - but the program and school remains elite. Some of these players have left to attend programs where all that matters is basketball. That might be ok for now but there is so much more to life than basketball. It will be interesting to see how successful these players are in their new homes and how they will act or feel if they fail to have the success they did at Joe's. No doubt the basketball season will be interesting this year with all the player and coaching changes all over NE Ohio. I for one cannot wait for all the drama to end and the playing to start.
Spot on.

Screw the Viking "fan" haters.
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  #92  
Old 09-18-17, 11:57 AM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Mug, I wish I had your passion. Don't get me wrong, I am happy that my Arcs beat Mayfield in football this past weekend, but it is just highschool sports. These transfer stories sadden me. When I was growing up, you went to school with your friends. Athletics was never a reason to transfer. My hope for this generation of highschool athletes is the same I had for my kids: that they receive a good education that will assist them in college, and that they are coached by honest, sincere, humble men. Wins were a bonus.
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  #93  
Old 09-18-17, 12:40 PM
spirit454 spirit454 is offline
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Originally Posted by MugnMaul78 View Post
Gaffney has been on ESPN twice, been to the state title game twice, and was a state champ last year. He hasn't played a minute at Garfield and yet he has several DI offers. Garfield has had lots of guys athletically like him that don't get noticed or get offers. You're high if you don't think he was well coached and prepared over those two years academically and athletically. My hope for him as a person is that he continues to progress in both areas.
I must not be "high" as I never said any of that. What I said was he could be well coached on many teams and experience great academics at many schools. the benefit goes both ways. If all the credit goes to VASJ they would be spitting out multiple players of his ability each year.
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  #94  
Old 09-18-17, 12:49 PM
spirit454 spirit454 is offline
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Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
These transfer stories sadden me. When I was growing up, you went to school with your friends. Athletics was never a reason to transfer. My hope for this generation of highschool athletes is the same I had for my kids: that they receive a good education that will assist them in college, and that they are coached by honest, sincere, humble men. Wins were a bonus.
I have similar feelings. I have nothing against private schools for a better education but IMO when athletics get involved it becomes a little questionable.
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  #95  
Old 09-18-17, 05:18 PM
Bball216 Bball216 is offline
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He won't get that education at Garfield Heights. Did you see last weeks ranking on what schools districts were the best Euclid and Garfield were toward the very bottom in the whole state. You cannot even say any of the transfers will get anywhere close to the same education at the schools they are attending. Let me know the last time Sonny Johnson with all his rankings and connections had a team on ESPN. He has however had several teams that had state championship caliber players and failed to get out of districts. When you talk about VASJ and basketball there are very few equals - SVSM is the only program that comes to mind. We will see how Garfield handles a very tough D1 District and possible Regional. There is a very good chance the only way Gaffney see the state tournament is if he buys a ticket.
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  #96  
Old 09-18-17, 06:54 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Originally Posted by spirit454 View Post
I must not be "high" as I never said any of that. What I said was he could be well coached on many teams and experience great academics at many schools. the benefit goes both ways. If all the credit goes to VASJ they would be spitting out multiple players of his ability each year.
What you said was "I would say Gaffney's offers have come from what he has accomplished, not from being on a VASJ roster.". I will take your word that what you said above that is what you meant.

I suppose from the outside looking in and seeing the semi finished product and his obvious physical skills, I can understand how you can have that perception. However, from the inside looking out and knowing what coaches and teachers did for this young man (and all of the young people in the school, regardless of whether they play basketball or not), I assure you VASJ gets a lot of credit. Again, as a young man who was well liked at our place and we considered family, we all wish him only the very very best.
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  #97  
Old 09-18-17, 08:25 PM
Bennies'01 Bennies'01 is offline
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Originally Posted by Bball216 View Post
He won't get that education at Garfield Heights. Did you see last weeks ranking on what schools districts were the best Euclid and Garfield were toward the very bottom in the whole state. You cannot even say any of the transfers will get anywhere close to the same education at the schools they are attending.
I think you're probably right in that VASJ offers a better education than what inner-ring suburban districts like Euclid and Garfield Heights offer. But let's be careful here in how we analyze a school's outputs on measurements like the state report cards without taking into consideration inputs. I'm not sure any school, even VASJ, could do significantly better in educating the students like those found in the enrollments at Euclid and Garfield, particularly the high concentrations of students in poverty and/or with special needs. Many students at Euclid and Garfield Heights are very successful, and the educational opportunities offered at each school are part of that. Report cards aside, these students are not affected by the fact that the challenges faced by their peers bring down overall scores. As I've said before, if this young man is a good student (and he must be since he was admitted to VASJ), he should be just fine at just about any school.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bball216 View Post
He has however had several teams that had state championship caliber players and failed to get out of districts. When you talk about VASJ and basketball there are very few equals - SVSM is the only program that comes to mind.
Garfield competes in Division I and has appeared in three State Final Fours in the past seven seasons. A couple of seasons saw them eliminated earlier than they probably should have been, but I'm not sure how anyone can argue that they aren't one of the top programs in the state based on their frequent recent trips to Columbus. VASJ has traditionally had as much talent as just about any school in the state, so while it's true they have had more overall success, they certainly have benefitted from playing in the lower divisions.

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Originally Posted by Bball216 View Post
We will see how Garfield handles a very tough D1 District and possible Regional. There is a very good chance the only way Gaffney see the state tournament is if he buys a ticket.
Garfield is loaded this year. Because they're in Division I and not Division III, it's usually a safe bet to take the field versus picking just one team, but they'll probably, at the very least, still be the favorite in their district.
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  #98  
Old 09-18-17, 08:38 PM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Originally Posted by MugnMaul78 View Post
What you said was "I would say Gaffney's offers have come from what he has accomplished, not from being on a VASJ roster.". I will take your word that what you said above that is what you meant.

I suppose from the outside looking in and seeing the semi finished product and his obvious physical skills, I can understand how you can have that perception. However, from the inside looking out and knowing what coaches and teachers did for this young man (and all of the young people in the school, regardless of whether they play basketball or not), I assure you VASJ gets a lot of credit. Again, as a young man who was well liked at our place and we considered family, we all wish him only the very very best.
Mug, it's great to see you taking the high road and wishing the young man well even if it is not for your beloved Vikings. I heard there were rumblings and even some news article that may have been written attempting to discredit the young man or even Garfield Hts. That would be a shame and certainly below the standard at VASJ I'd imagine. Since you have the inside perspective I'm refreshed to hear that it was not the case.
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  #99  
Old 09-18-17, 08:55 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
Mug, it's great to see you taking the high road and wishing the young man well even if it is not for your beloved Vikings. I heard there were rumblings and even some news article that may have been written attempting to discredit the young man or even Garfield Hts. That would be a shame and certainly below the standard at VASJ I'd imagine. Since you have the inside perspective I'm refreshed to hear that it was not the case.
Thanks Arc but it is true, he is a nice young man and by all accounts loved being at our school and didn't want to leave. We do wish him well. In regards to Garfield, early on in this string, I said this transfer wasn't on Sonny either. For those not familiar with the culture of our school, this is a new video (with a couple of seconds of Gaffney in it too);


Peace to you.
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  #100  
Old 09-19-17, 01:58 PM
coachablekid coachablekid is offline
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Will VASJ make it to Columbus in DII now without Gaffney? I think they will be in the same region as Akron SVSM. Whoa!
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  #101  
Old 09-19-17, 04:17 PM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Originally Posted by coachablekid View Post
Will VASJ make it to Columbus in DII now without Gaffney? I think they will be in the same region as Akron SVSM. Whoa!
Great question and yes, with competitive balance adjustment, now with SVSM. Not sure but there are still some good seniors and some really good kids coming up from last year's JV team. The guy i won't bet against is Higgins. The kid has heart and will put the team on his back if he has to.
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  #102  
Old 09-19-17, 07:14 PM
Bball216 Bball216 is offline
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SVSM is going to be good. Very athletic but very little height. Gaffney puts VASJ back in Columbus for a 6th year. You cannot count out Lake Catholic, CCC and some other D2 schools that are going to be pretty good. It's dangerous looking ahead. That being said VASJ still has some height and plenty of skill. They just need to get Gaffney's production from multiple players. Gene Higgins is a ferocious competitor and leader. As long as he has the ball in his hands VASJ has a shot against anybody. I would never wish a player who transferred out any harm physically but don't expect me to be rooting for Euclid or Garfield to have any success on the court. I have always been against high school to high school transfers before all these kids chose to leave anyway. Even back when an elite player VJ King was sniffing around coming to VASJ I was against it.
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  #103  
Old 09-20-17, 07:28 AM
spirit454 spirit454 is offline
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I understand the need for some students with HS to HS transfers. What makes me sick is the HS sports team to HS sports team transfers. If you want a better education fine. If you want a new school fine.
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  #104  
Old 09-20-17, 10:25 PM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Bball and Mug, I noticed that you both make mention of some opposition towards the basketball program. Mug, you went so far as to call these people haters. And Bball, you say some are inside the program? Is this opposition from the administration? Players? Coaches? Alums? It was an inside job a couple years back in the Brush program that led to the dismissal of our coach, who at the time had been one of the most successful in school history.
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  #105  
Old 09-21-17, 01:02 AM
MugnMaul78 MugnMaul78 is offline
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Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
Bball and Mug, I noticed that you both make mention of some opposition towards the basketball program. Mug, you went so far as to call these people haters. And Bball, you say some are inside the program? Is this opposition from the administration? Players? Coaches? Alums? It was an inside job a couple years back in the Brush program that led to the dismissal of our coach, who at the time had been one of the most successful in school history.
If we had breakfast, I would tell you more specifics but I personally don't want to air that out in public. I will say that every school, or for that matter every community, has politics and factions. The motivations of persons or groups varies based on their own self interests, jealousies, or loyalties or personalities. I personally base my energies and support on what is best for the school and students.
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  #106  
Old 09-21-17, 05:47 AM
Bball216 Bball216 is offline
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Nailed it Mug.
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  #107  
Old 09-21-17, 10:13 AM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Originally Posted by MugnMaul78 View Post
If we had breakfast, I would tell you more specifics but I personally don't want to air that out in public. I will say that every school, or for that matter every community, has politics and factions. The motivations of persons or groups varies based on their own self interests, jealousies, or loyalties or personalities. I personally base my energies and support on what is best for the school and students.
Loyalty is a dying characteristic in today's society and it is magnified in high school sports, unfortunately. Nothing worse than finding out a once thought loyal person is not who you thought they were. There is absolutely no room for taking shots at people who have been giving of their time, support, and maybe even money if it is a private school like yours. Retaining good people and building the alumni fan base is always going to fall at the feet of those people who are in the high profile positions within the school. Positions like an alumni relations director or the head basketball or football coach. I'm glad to hear your energy is focused on the students and the school and not some other agenda.

By the way, what happened to the Higgins kid? I have not seen his name in the stats for the football team. I hope he is not injured because I thought he would make a great running back for one of the local schools like John Carroll or Notre Dame College and would love to watch him play football for 4 more years.

Last edited by brusharc1986; 09-21-17 at 10:17 AM. Reason: update
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  #108  
Old 09-21-17, 11:23 AM
C'Town216 C'Town216 is offline
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Originally Posted by brusharc1986 View Post
Loyalty is a dying characteristic in today's society and it is magnified in high school sports, unfortunately. Nothing worse than finding out a once thought loyal person is not who you thought they were. There is absolutely no room for taking shots at people who have been giving of their time, support, and maybe even money if it is a private school like yours. Retaining good people and building the alumni fan base is always going to fall at the feet of those people who are in the high profile positions within the school. Positions like an alumni relations director or the head basketball or football coach. I'm glad to hear your energy is focused on the students and the school and not some other agenda.

By the way, what happened to the Higgins kid? I have not seen his name in the stats for the football team. I hope he is not injured because I thought he would make a great running back for one of the local schools like John Carroll or Notre Dame College and would love to watch him play football for 4 more years.


He's not playing this year. He's solely focusing on basketball for his senior year


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
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  #109  
Old 09-21-17, 08:04 PM
Bball216 Bball216 is offline
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Higgins is fine. I spoke to him Friday. He misses football but he now has to much to lose. Last year he hurt his ankle in football and it really effected his basketball season early on. He wants to go to medical school and has a chance to do so because of his skills on the basketball court.
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  #110  
Old 09-26-17, 11:06 AM
brusharc1986 brusharc1986 is offline
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Bball216, that is good news, as I thought he may have been one of the transfers. Do you know if he has any offers right now? Kwasniak has always had an excellent track record of developing players. In recent memory, I believe Sonny Johnson of Garfield Heights is the only coach to send more players to Division I than VASJ. Impressive given that VASJ was Division 3 (now 2) and given the fact that Johnson played Division I basketball himself, which probably helps him get his players into school as well.
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