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  #1  
Old 06-05-18, 09:45 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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ICE agents arrest 114 at Corso's in Sandusky Area

Will this be good or bad for Ohio that ICE has turned it's attention to our state?

Quote:
The Department of Homeland Security and the U.S. Border Patrol raided two local garden center locations Tuesday and arrested 114 employees.

Federal agents executed criminal search warrants at two Corso’s Garden Center establishments — in Perkins Township on Milan Road (U.S. 250) and in Castalia on Bardshar Road — said Steve Francis, special agent in charge of Homeland Security investigations.

The allegations involved harboring and hiring of “illegal aliens,” aggravated identity theft and impersonation of U.S. persons, Francis said.

Agents carried boxes out from the Corso’s Perkins location, which contained “a lot of documentary evidence,” Francis said.
Read more:
http://www.sanduskyregister.com/story/201806050007
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  #2  
Old 06-05-18, 10:01 PM
SeeYaSometime SeeYaSometime is offline
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Good!

I think it's laughable that lawn service employers are complaining that the now being enforced immigration laws are hurting their businesses. Hire citizens jerks.
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  #3  
Old 06-05-18, 10:57 PM
domi domi is offline
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This should be good for Ohio. Deport the illegals caught there and charge the business owners with whatever they can beyond the basic tax evasion. There's no way they didn't know 1/3 of their employees were illegal and should serve jail time.
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  #4  
Old 06-06-18, 07:08 AM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by domi View Post
This should be good for Ohio. Deport the illegals caught there and charge the business owners with whatever they can beyond the basic tax evasion. There's no way they didn't know 1/3 of their employees were illegal and should serve jail time.
Agreed. The owners of these businesses need to be held accountable to. It would help though if government made it easy to check the employ-ability of folks, something like e-verify for example.
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  #5  
Old 06-06-18, 07:32 AM
SWMCinci SWMCinci is offline
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If only there was a national registry of illegal aliens so companies could do background checks before hiring criminals or renting them apartments, or allowing them to get drivers licenses...….

This is a good thing. As others have said, get the criminals out of the country and then fine the employers, and jail time for the managers and executives that employ them.
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  #6  
Old 06-06-18, 07:39 AM
Taco MacArthur Taco MacArthur is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by domi View Post
This should be good for Ohio. Deport the illegals caught there and charge the business owners with whatever they can beyond the basic tax evasion. There's no way they didn't know 1/3 of their employees were illegal and should serve jail time.
Agreed, it's a good thing for Ohio that small businesses are shut down because the owners are in jail.
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  #7  
Old 06-06-18, 07:57 AM
ohiopup ohiopup is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SWMCinci View Post
If only there was a national registry of legal aliens so companies could do background checks before hiring criminals or renting them apartments, or allowing them to get drivers licenses...….

This is a good thing. As others have said, get the criminals out of the country and then fine the employers, and jail time for the managers and executives that employ them.
FIFY

Illegals wouldn't register. Legal 'green' card holders are already on a data base somewhere.

These summer jobs should be held by high school and college kids to offset
their college debt. Instead of owing 75K in loans they may only have 50K
in debt.

That being said, I know a guy that can't get good help from students because
they won't put down their damn phone and do some work.

:>---

EGA
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  #8  
Old 06-06-18, 08:27 AM
zeeman zeeman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Taco MacArthur View Post
Agreed, it's a good thing for Ohio that small businesses are shut down because the owners are in jail.
Drama Queen
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  #9  
Old 06-06-18, 08:47 AM
Taco MacArthur Taco MacArthur is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zeeman View Post
Drama Queen
I was definitely super serious
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  #10  
Old 06-06-18, 08:54 AM
dado6 dado6 is offline
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Businesses who hire (and often take advantage of) illegals should be punished. the punishments can be severe (see below)

They hire illegals at below market rate (sometimes below minimum wage), to the detriment of legal workers in the industry and companies who follow the law.

Back in 2006, builders in Northern KY were the subject of similar raids. I don't know how many company officials were convicted, but at least 4 were charged and arrested.

The penalties at the time could be $250,000 and 10 years in jail.

http://www.fox19.com/story/4880389/a...igrant-roundup

Quote:
Federal Immigrant and Customs Enforcement agents and IRS agents have entered a northern Kentucky homebuilder as part of a illegal immigrant roundup in the Tri-State.

The Fischer Homes Headquarters in Crestview Hills is at the center of the roundup. ICE agents apparently took 76 illegal immigrant workers who were allegedly employed by Fischer into custody.

The US Attorney's office has said that they have also arrested four Fischer Homes construction site supervisors.
•Timothy Cospy, Construction Manager
•Doug Witt, Superintendent
•William Allison, Superintendent
•Bill Ring, Assistant Superintendent

The four were charged with aiding and abetting, harboring illegal aliens for commercial advantage or private financial gain. If convicted each person could face up to 10 years in prison and a $250,000 fine.
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  #11  
Old 06-06-18, 09:47 AM
BlueJayFan BlueJayFan is offline
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Sounds like they got some real violent criminals there!
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  #12  
Old 06-06-18, 09:47 AM
Taco MacArthur Taco MacArthur is offline
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I don't know about violent, but they definitely got some real criminals.
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  #13  
Old 06-06-18, 09:54 AM
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MoeDude MoeDude is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SeeYaSometime View Post
Good!

I think it's laughable that lawn service employers are complaining that the now being enforced immigration laws are hurting their businesses. Hire citizens jerks.
Easier said than done. I'm not a proponent of illegal immigrants as you know, but I do see why Lawn Services and others hire whoever they can to fill the positions. I know of a Lawn Service owner who has really tried to stay away from hiring illegals but he can't find US Citizens willing to do the work in a dependable manner.

I also have a friend who owned a roofing business. By the time he finally retired he told me it was getting more and more difficult to staff his jobs with US Citizens or Green Card holders. He never did get into using illegals but he said he came close a couple times.

Too many US Citizens would rather collect welfare versus working.
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  #14  
Old 06-06-18, 09:55 AM
zeeman zeeman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueJayFan View Post
Sounds like they got some real violent criminals there!
So you condone crime if it’s not a serious crime
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  #15  
Old 06-06-18, 11:38 AM
Indiandad Indiandad is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoeDude View Post
Easier said than done. I'm not a proponent of illegal immigrants as you know, but I do see why Lawn Services and others hire whoever they can to fill the positions. I know of a Lawn Service owner who has really tried to stay away from hiring illegals but he can't find US Citizens willing to do the work in a dependable manner.

I also have a friend who owned a roofing business. By the time he finally retired he told me it was getting more and more difficult to staff his jobs with US Citizens or Green Card holders. He never did get into using illegals but he said he came close a couple times.

Too many US Citizens would rather collect welfare versus working.
The pay needs to go up.

Government assistance needs to be cut.
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  #16  
Old 06-06-18, 01:36 PM
Neopolitan Neopolitan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoeDude View Post
I know of a Lawn Service owner who has really tried to stay away from hiring illegals but he can't find US Citizens willing to do the work in a dependable manner.
So he hires illegals?
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  #17  
Old 06-06-18, 01:57 PM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Indiandad View Post
The pay needs to go up.

Government assistance needs to be cut.
And add to that a reliable & simple means for employers to check whether potential workers are legal and this problem largely goes away.

And for the record here's what will happen if wages do go up for manual labor jobs: more folks will line up to do the jobs and employers will see a rapidly expanding labor pool which will in turn lead to reduced costs and a better quality of worker. Sure it may cost me more for landscaping but then if they raise their prices to much I'll do the work myself.

The effect of allowing employers to hire illegals for these jobs has distorted the market and kept wages artificially low. And yes, by not enforcing immigration laws and allowing cities & counties to declare themselves sanctuaries the government has been allowing this to happen. And it's BOTH sides of the political divide - democrats get votes and republicans make the Chamber of Commerce happy!
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  #18  
Old 06-06-18, 02:08 PM
IcyCoolDevil IcyCoolDevil is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
And add to that a reliable & simple means for employers to check whether potential workers are legal and this problem largely goes away.
Maybe you've never heard of I9?
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  #19  
Old 06-06-18, 02:17 PM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by IcyCoolDevil View Post
Maybe you've never heard of I9?
No I haven't. Is it easy? Is it reliable? Is it robust?

Well I got curious and Googled it and here is what I found:

https://www.uscis.gov/i-9-central/acceptable-documents

It seems easy but I would give it a FAIL for reliable & robust. It seems all you need is a drivers license (Ca among other states is issuing driver licenses to illegals) and a birth certificate! So how hard would it be to get a Ca drivers license and a fake birth certificate.

How about a system that the employer sends in with the employees name & SS number and the feds get back to them about their legal employability.
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  #20  
Old 06-06-18, 02:21 PM
TylerDurden TylerDurden is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
And for the record here's what will happen if wages do go up for manual labor jobs: more folks will line up to do the jobs and employers will see a rapidly expanding labor pool which will in turn lead to reduced costs and a better quality of worker. Sure it may cost me more for landscaping but then if they raise their prices to much I'll do the work myself.
You just listed multiple items that contradict themselves.
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  #21  
Old 06-06-18, 02:29 PM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerDurden View Post
You just listed multiple items that contradict themselves.
No what I described is the dynamic state of free market capitalism. This is the kind of stuff that Libertarians are supposed to live & breath. It's simply a description (maybe not that good of one I'll admit) of supply & demand in a free labor market.

As a populist I want government restrictions on how "free" that labor market is to be controlled by whether a person is a LEGAL resident or citizen of this country. But within that framework (ONLY citizens & legal residents can work) adhering to free market principals is generally good for all involved.
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  #22  
Old 06-06-18, 02:32 PM
SWMCinci SWMCinci is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohiopup View Post
FIFY

Illegals wouldn't register. Legal 'green' card holders are already on a data base somewhere.

These summer jobs should be held by high school and college kids to offset
their college debt. Instead of owing 75K in loans they may only have 50K
in debt.

That being said, I know a guy that can't get good help from students because
they won't put down their damn phone and do some work.

:>---

EGA
I was using the logic of gun grabbers to make a point.....
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  #23  
Old 06-06-18, 02:53 PM
Neopolitan Neopolitan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
here's what will happen if wages do go up for manual labor jobs: more folks will line up to do the jobs and employers will see a rapidly expanding labor pool which will in turn lead to reduced costs and a better quality of worker.
Wow
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  #24  
Old 06-06-18, 03:25 PM
TylerDurden TylerDurden is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
No what I described is the dynamic state of free market capitalism. This is the kind of stuff that Libertarians are supposed to live & breath. It's simply a description (maybe not that good of one I'll admit) of supply & demand in a free labor market.
No that's not what you described. You said that an increase in labor cost would lead to an increase in labor supply, which would then lead to a decrease in overall cost, which I can only assume is due to a decrease in labor cost based on a larger pool of workers and therefore less pay offered. It makes no sense. You then go on to acknowledge that cost would in fact have to go up if pay is increased (contradicting your previous statement), but threw in that people would just start doing their landscaping themselves if that got too high. So if that happens you then have demand for the service going down, which means companies are reducing staffing, reducing staffing cost (decreasing pay) or going out of business. All great things. Basically you just tried to created an economic argument to back your predetermined political belief.
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  #25  
Old 06-06-18, 03:33 PM
ronnie mund ronnie mund is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerDurden View Post
No that's not what you described. You said that an increase in labor cost would lead to an increase in labor supply, which would then lead to a decrease in overall cost, which I can only assume is due to a decrease in labor cost based on a larger pool of workers and therefore less pay offered. It makes no sense. You then go on to acknowledge that cost would in fact have to go up if pay is increased (contradicting your previous statement), but threw in that people would just start doing their landscaping themselves if that got too high. So if that happens you then have demand for the service going down, which means companies are reducing staffing, reducing staffing cost (decreasing pay) or going out of business. All great things. Basically you just tried to created an economic argument to back your predetermined political belief.
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  #26  
Old 06-06-18, 03:35 PM
Arrogate Arrogate is offline
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I will throw this out here bc clearly some dont understand the real world when it comes to manual labor and hiring Americans
It is probably different in your white collar world but here in the blue collar world it is a different animal

My employer offers to pay for your rent, utilities, health care, will provide a vehicle if needed, he also pays about 14 bucks an hour after all this.

He interviews people weekly for positions (he employs over 200 people). This is labor in the heat working with cattle so not many people want to do it. He tries to hire Americans first but they dont seem to want the job.

The most common response when he offers a job to someone is will this job be available in x amount of months? Basically will it be available when my unemployment runs out. You cant hire any Americans to do real labor and the pay is good for the job. Probably take home around 40 grand a year with living paid for and no out of pocket expenses for health insurance.

Illegal immigrants are vital to many parts of the agriculture industry and it isnt bc we dont want to hire Americans or we dont pay enough. Quite the opposite.


We have incentivized not working so much that Americans would rather not work and suck off of the govt titz than actually work for a living.

This doesnt mean I am against immigration reform (enforcing the border). Quite the contrary I want immigration laws enforced and to incentivize working again.

To blame Mexicans or employers for our labor problems is very short sighted and shows you really dont understand the problem all that well.

My employer is also a BIG TIME Trump campaign donor who has dealt with the administration on agriculture initiatives/issues

To reiterate, the problem isnt illegal immigrants, it is the liberal way of incentivizing sitting on your azz. If we change that perception than not as many "open" jobs will be available for illegal immigrants.

I have long held the belief it doesnt matter what you pay, most wont take the job anyway, even if offered 6 figures a year. But yah business owners are to blame for this as you can see my employer offers a more than a fair living to his employees and has a labor shortage unless he uses illegals (which he eventually will pay for a visa or help with citizenship if you stay for 6 months)

What is a fair wage? +40 grand, living, health insurance? Id say so. Once you factor in benefits (especislly if he pays for your families insurance) you are clearing over 60 grand easy a year here. Does he need to pay more? Have fun paying extremely higher prices for beef bc we are dang near pricing ourselves out of any ag business market

Last edited by Arrogate; 06-06-18 at 03:50 PM.
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  #27  
Old 06-06-18, 03:51 PM
Arrogate Arrogate is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MoeDude View Post
Easier said than done. I'm not a proponent of illegal immigrants as you know, but I do see why Lawn Services and others hire whoever they can to fill the positions. I know of a Lawn Service owner who has really tried to stay away from hiring illegals but he can't find US Citizens willing to do the work in a dependable manner.

I also have a friend who owned a roofing business. By the time he finally retired he told me it was getting more and more difficult to staff his jobs with US Citizens or Green Card holders. He never did get into using illegals but he said he came close a couple times.

Too many US Citizens would rather collect welfare versus working.
Ding ding ding ding moedude gets it
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  #28  
Old 06-06-18, 03:53 PM
Arrogate Arrogate is offline
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Originally Posted by Indiandad View Post
The pay needs to go up.

Government assistance needs to be cut.
For some industries I am sure it does need to go up. But that isnt true for all, as stated earlier my employer offers more than a fair wage and we struggle to hire Americans. We have priced ourselves out of the market.

I take that back we havent priced ourselves out of the market, price doesnt matter they wont work no matter the pay. We dont want to do real labor, outside in the heat where you sweat. We want cushy inside AC jobs. Do we really even want that? I think most dont want to work at all and it is an easy life when you consider the help they get from not only the govt but charities.
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  #29  
Old 06-06-18, 05:48 PM
Indiandad Indiandad is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TylerDurden View Post
No that's not what you described. You said that an increase in labor cost would lead to an increase in labor supply, which would then lead to a decrease in overall cost, which I can only assume is due to a decrease in labor cost based on a larger pool of workers and therefore less pay offered. It makes no sense. You then go on to acknowledge that cost would in fact have to go up if pay is increased (contradicting your previous statement), but threw in that people would just start doing their landscaping themselves if that got too high. So if that happens you then have demand for the service going down, which means companies are reducing staffing, reducing staffing cost (decreasing pay) or going out of business. All great things. Basically you just tried to created an economic argument to back your predetermined political belief.
It is possible to increase pay AND decrease labor cost. If the higher prices labor is more efficient and can produce more than multiple people who are less efficient.
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  #30  
Old 06-06-18, 05:54 PM
Indiandad Indiandad is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Arrogate View Post
For some industries I am sure it does need to go up. But that isnt true for all, as stated earlier my employer offers more than a fair wage and we struggle to hire Americans. We have priced ourselves out of the market.

I take that back we havent priced ourselves out of the market, price doesnt matter they wont work no matter the pay. We dont want to do real labor, outside in the heat where you sweat. We want cushy inside AC jobs. Do we really even want that? I think most dont want to work at all and it is an easy life when you consider the help they get from not only the govt but charities.
This leads to the second part of my solutuon..... cutting Government benefits. People won't work if they aren't hungry.
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