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  #1591  
Old 06-21-19, 11:18 AM
winbypin winbypin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JcksnPlrBrs2002 View Post
If I'm going to learn something, I seriously doubt that it's going to come from the likes of someone as daft as you.

I have been extremely consistent with the general take that I have very little regard for the Democratic Party itself, and simply view them as a vehicle (when practicable) to be cynically used for the purpose of getting actual leftwing candidates elected. If you honestly think that the "lashback" against Biden is being driven by some sort of weird "progressive identity politics" thing that right-wing morons cooked up, then you're an even bigger idiot than I might have guessed. Most of us don't especially care if he's some old white dude - we care that he's an old white dude that's also a neoliberal Wall Street shill. If Joe Biden was instead "JoAnn Biden", a young, purple-skinned lesbian that randomly tossed out environmentally safe bags of marijuana and candy at campaign rallies, but was also still a neoliberal Wall Street shill, we'd ultimately despise her too.

Whether or not you "explained" something to me about the Democrats is irrelevant, because I do not care about them. As far as I'm concerned, they're only useful insofar as they are able to act as a 'placeholding blocker' for somehow even worse Republicans (and good grief do they ever suck at that -- their ONE job!), until something better can be figured out.
Good post mud! Complete with the overuse of quotation marks and some level of name calling we've come to expect from you. Wish you wouldn't have taken two years off. Would have been fun to see you whine during that period.

You're such a boob.
  #1592  
Old 06-21-19, 01:56 PM
JcksnPlrBrs2002 JcksnPlrBrs2002 is offline
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Originally Posted by jmog View Post
The problem is, for socialists like yourself, the more you do things like this the more the "middle of the road democrats" will vote republican or not vote at all. You keep pushing the DNC to the far left and you will basically guarantee the Rs keep control of the presidency. You are cutting off your nose to spite your face.
I'm not a socialist.

I'm also not especially worried about the possibility of what you're describing. Right-wing elements got a head start on doing something similar to the Republican Party, and they haven't exactly fallen apart because of it. Those "middle of the road Democrats" haven't really done much for us anyway, and we're sick of waiting around for them to grow a spine, so they can get the hell out of the way.
  #1593  
Old 06-21-19, 10:07 PM
my2sense my2sense is offline
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Originally Posted by JcksnPlrBrs2002 View Post
I'm not a socialist.
OK Mud. New screen name, new you!
  #1594  
Old 06-22-19, 01:10 AM
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Originally Posted by fish82 View Post
Man, it's starting to look like Obie did a pretty shtty job vetting Uncle Joe for Veep.
Yeah. The first black president had a racist VP...amazing.
  #1595  
Old 06-22-19, 11:34 AM
SWMCinci SWMCinci is offline
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Originally Posted by y2h View Post
Yeah. The first black president had a racist VP...amazing.
While Obie needed the liberal racist vote to get elected, it seems like he can be a little more choosy in who he supports to replace himself.....
  #1596  
Old 06-23-19, 04:22 PM
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Chuck Todd goes after Buttigieg: The South Bend police department has gotten 'whiter' under him

Quote:
'Meet the Press' host Chuck Todd offered a scathing review of Democratic presidential hopeful Mayor Pete Buttigieg on Sunday morning.

"Who had the worst week in the Democratic primary; is it Joe Biden, or is it Pete Buttigieg?" Todd asked his panel of political commentators.

While Joe Biden has been mired in controversy the past week for comments he made about his positive relationships with segregationist senators, Pete Buttigieg faced harsh criticism of his reaction to the fatal police shooting death of Eric Logan in South Bend, Indiana. Buttigieg, who currently serves as the mayor of South Bend, left the campaign trail when Logan, a black man, was allegedly shot and killed by a white police officer.
Read more:
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/n...iter-under-him
  #1597  
Old 06-23-19, 05:12 PM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yappi View Post
Chuck Todd goes after Buttigieg: The South Bend police department has gotten 'whiter' under him



Read more:
https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/n...iter-under-him

There are a lot of reasons not to vote for Buttigieg most of which involve his left wing policy positions. But it seems disturbing that Chuck Todd and others in the MSM would call out the South Bend police department getting "whiter" while he's in office as one of them.
  #1598  
Old 06-23-19, 08:11 PM
SWMCinci SWMCinci is offline
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Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
There are a lot of reasons not to vote for Buttigieg most of which involve his left wing policy positions. But it seems disturbing that Chuck Todd and others in the MSM would call out the South Bend police department getting "whiter" while he's in office as one of them.
It's not about accomplishment or record to Democrats, it's about perception. If you aren't a left wing radical socialist SJW, you ain't a Democrat anyone wants to see win. Reality is only what they perceive it to be.
  #1599  
Old 06-24-19, 06:52 AM
nwwarrior09 nwwarrior09 is offline
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Much like 2016, liberals/progressives are doing an awful lot of the leg work for Trump. In the last week we've had congressional hearings on reparations, congressional representatives refer and draw equivalence between illegal immigrant detention centers to concentration camps, and a professional sports league (NBA) take an absurdly painful SJW stance of referring to team "owners" as "governors" from this point forward...because apparently we can't differentiate between owning a sports franchise where the average athlete/employee is now in the top fraction of the 1% in income/wealth, earning an average of $7.8M per year, versus being a plantation owner in the 18th or 19th century owning slaves as property.

Barring a catastrophe such as an unjustified and unpopular war with Iran, a stock market collapse and concurrent major economic recession, or a successful impeachment witch hunt, much like the last go around, excessive PC and SJW wokeness will be worth untold numbers of votes at the polls in key swing states for Trump, resulting in a similar election result to 2016 IMO.

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  #1600  
Old 06-24-19, 07:47 AM
JcksnPlrBrs2002 JcksnPlrBrs2002 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nwwarrior09 View Post
Much like 2016, liberals/progressives are doing an awful lot of the leg work for Trump. In the last week we've had congressional hearings on reparations, congressional representatives refer and draw equivalence between illegal immigrant detention centers to concentration camps, and a professional sports league (NBA) take an absurdly painful SJW stance of referring to team "owners" as "governors" from this point forward...because apparently we can't differentiate between owning a sports franchise where the average athlete/employee is now in the top fraction of the 1% in income/wealth, earning an average of $7.8M per year, versus being a plantation owner in the 18th or 19th century owning slaves as property.

Barring a catastrophe such as an unjustified and unpopular war with Iran, a stock market collapse and concurrent major economic recession, or a successful impeachment witch hunt, much like the last go around, excessive PC and SJW wokeness will be worth untold numbers of votes at the polls in key swing states for Trump, resulting in a similar election result to 2016 IMO.

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I think there's a mistake being made in this post that is common across the entire political spectrum (conservatives and liberals and everyone in between does this, all the time) : assuming that something will necessarily have an effect across the entire electorate in direct proportion to their own level of personal distaste for it.

It doesn't work that way. I'm not picking on your specific point of view for this either (arguing the actual content is a separate discussion) --- I see fellow liberal friends do it all the time. They'll say, "oh, Trump and/or The Republicans did [x] and [x] and so on and surely THAT will do him in, blah blah blah", or something to that effect, and they completely overestimate how much their own levels of personal anger or disapproval of various things will project into the general population.
  #1601  
Old 06-24-19, 08:24 AM
nwwarrior09 nwwarrior09 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JcksnPlrBrs2002 View Post
I think there's a mistake being made in this post that is common across the entire political spectrum (conservatives and liberals and everyone in between does this, all the time) : assuming that something will necessarily have an effect across the entire electorate in direct proportion to their own level of personal distaste for it.

It doesn't work that way. I'm not picking on your specific point of view for this either (arguing the actual content is a separate discussion) --- I see fellow liberal friends do it all the time. They'll say, "oh, Trump and/or The Republicans did [x] and [x] and so on and surely THAT will do him in, blah blah blah", or something to that effect, and they completely overestimate how much their own levels of personal anger or disapproval of various things will project into the general population.
I can respect this opinion, but from my perspective as a libertarian leaning swing voter the PC/SJW stuff is exactly why Trump won in 2016. The people that have distaste for this sort of SJW thing are far more likely to show up to vote against it than the people who are for it are likely to show up to vote for their perceived lesser of two evils (a Hillary or Biden type). People towards the middle of the spectrum that would be embarrassed to publicly admit they support or would squeeze their nose to vote for Trump don't get plucked in polling IMO, while unreliable opinionated liberal leaners (youths, certain minority voting blocks, etc.) are often over represented. I see the Trump election being very much about the Midwest and parts of the south that are chock full of Midwestern transplants pushing the large social justice swing we've had over the last 10-15 years back towards equilibrium because it's moved too quickly for them, while liberals/progressives sit out because establishment Dems don't do enough to appease them on the same issues.

Social justice issues have shoved a horde of blue collar voters (that ALWAYS vote) that were a dominant Democrat voting block for decades into the Republican column. Between family and family friends the only "blue dog"/moderate type that I know that still votes a straight Democrat ticket is my father, and it's only because he's been a union worker for 40 years. Everyone else has jumped ship.

If I was asked 10 years ago as a young voter, I would have said it's the Republican party that has a major identity and voting coalition problem. Today, I see that as being far more accurate of the Democrats. There's too many hats in the coalition group to appease everyone, and they have to decide if they're really a liberal/progressive party or if they're going to be a moderate/left leaning blue collar/working Americans party that partakes a few select liberal/progressive causes. Right now, it seems that they offer nowhere near enough to appease voters such as yourself, while offering too much for the liking of the Boomer aged working man. Something has to give, or I see a couple more decades where they're susceptible to the narrow popular vote margin/decisive electoral college defeat problem.

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  #1602  
Old 06-24-19, 03:15 PM
JcksnPlrBrs2002 JcksnPlrBrs2002 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nwwarrior09 View Post
I can respect this opinion, but from my perspective as a libertarian leaning swing voter the PC/SJW stuff is exactly why Trump won in 2016. The people that have distaste for this sort of SJW thing are far more likely to show up to vote against it than the people who are for it are likely to show up to vote for their perceived lesser of two evils (a Hillary or Biden type).
I think the reason Hillary lost is much simpler -- she was a mediocre and deeply flawed candidate that ran a stunningly lousy campaign. She probably would've lost to Sanders in the first place if she didn't have her people leaning on the levers in the Democratic primary from the beginning.


Quote:
Originally Posted by nwwarrior09 View Post
People towards the middle of the spectrum that would be embarrassed to publicly admit they support or would squeeze their nose to vote for Trump don't get plucked in polling IMO, while unreliable opinionated liberal leaners (youths, certain minority voting blocks, etc.) are often over represented.
The polling was ultimately "wrong", but I think it's been kind of overstated how "off" they were. Most of the results were actually well within a standard deviation. They were generally giving Trump somewhere between a 1/7 and 1/5 shot, which, while it was a "surprise" to many that he won, having an event with those kinds of odds actually happen isn't exactly what I would think of as the stuff of miracles and wonder. As someone who deals directly with odds constantly, it didn't even really raise an eyebrow from me.


Quote:
Originally Posted by nwwarrior09 View Post
I see the Trump election being very much about the Midwest and parts of the south that are chock full of Midwestern transplants pushing the large social justice swing we've had over the last 10-15 years back towards equilibrium because it's moved too quickly for them, while liberals/progressives sit out because establishment Dems don't do enough to appease them on the same issues.

Social justice issues have shoved a horde of blue collar voters (that ALWAYS vote) that were a dominant Democrat voting block for decades into the Republican column. Between family and family friends the only "blue dog"/moderate type that I know that still votes a straight Democrat ticket is my father, and it's only because he's been a union worker for 40 years. Everyone else has jumped ship.
Those of us to the left of the Democratic Party are far more frustrated with them on economic and international policy than any sort of perceived problems with their stances on social issues. It's true that we think they're too slow on social issues, but when you're talking about someone like, let's say... ...Joe Biden, something like his history of literal advocacy for credit card companies is far more infuriating to us than his history of dithering on social justice topics.

As far as the "Boomer Generation" goes - to hell with them.

Worst. Generation. Ever.

My attitude towards them is "get on board or get run over". If they're really as fickle as you're implying, then those people were never really going to truly help us achieve anything worth talking about anyway. Zero interest in waiting around to accomplish things just because it makes some stubborn Boomers feel uncomfortable. If that means we burn it down, then we burn it down. There's also some general sentiment, on some issues (like climate change, for instance), that we're essentially doomed if we don't address it immediately, so there's absolutely no sense to us in humoring any dissent on it anyway.


Quote:
Originally Posted by nwwarrior09 View Post
If I was asked 10 years ago as a young voter, I would have said it's the Republican party that has a major identity and voting coalition problem. Today, I see that as being far more accurate of the Democrats. There's too many hats in the coalition group to appease everyone, and they have to decide if they're really a liberal/progressive party or if they're going to be a moderate/left leaning blue collar/working Americans party that partakes a few select liberal/progressive causes. Right now, it seems that they offer nowhere near enough to appease voters such as yourself, while offering too much for the liking of the Boomer aged working man. Something has to give, or I see a couple more decades where they're susceptible to the narrow popular vote margin/decisive electoral college defeat problem.

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Both of the major parties deal with this all of the time, in ebbs and flows. It's simply the nature of our electoral system. The way it's structured, you're inevitably going to end up with two "poles" that have varying degrees of gravity to them. It's a little bit more pronounced than usual with the Democrats lately in part because elements outside decided to go into full on hijack mode, but the current "civil war" they're having isn't one bit unprecedented or unusual. To be honest, both major parties are a fractured mess - you just don't see it as much from the Republicans right now because they control the Presidency (sort of) and the Senate. Their own deep fractures would become much more visible very quickly if and when either of those two things change.
  #1603  
Old 06-24-19, 03:43 PM
BlueJayFan BlueJayFan is offline
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Beto's war tax what an idiot
  #1604  
Old 06-24-19, 03:46 PM
chs1971 chs1971 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JcksnPlrBrs2002 View Post
As far as the "Boomer Generation" goes - to hell with them.

Worst. Generation. Ever.

My attitude towards them is "get on board or get run over". ...

..., so there's absolutely no sense to us in humoring any dissent on it anyway.
But we have guns.


Quote:
Originally Posted by JcksnPlrBrs2002 View Post
on some issues (like climate change, for instance), that we're essentially doomed if we don't address it immediately,
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahaha

"Doomed"

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahaha
  #1605  
Old 06-24-19, 04:45 PM
Harrycrane Harrycrane is offline
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Arrow

Quote:
Originally Posted by chs1971 View Post
But we have guns.


hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahaha

"Doomed"

hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahaha hahahahahahahahaha
Former self regarded legendary teacher is reduced to this ? What goes through the mind of a pompous azzwhole when he goes 10000 ha's?

Do you feel you won something . What would former students think of your act here? I realize you don't care about much but they would be embarrassed for you .
  #1606  
Old 06-24-19, 04:45 PM
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Yet another gushing article today in the NY Times about Elizabeth Warren: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/24/u...gtype=Homepage

And another op ed about how Biden is the wrong candidate complete with a lousy photo of the guy: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/24/o...gtype=Homepage

The elitist mainstream media looks like they have their candidate picked.
  #1607  
Old 06-24-19, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JcksnPlrBrs2002 View Post
As far as the "Boomer Generation" goes - to hell with them.

Worst. Generation. Ever.

My attitude towards them is "get on board or get run over". If they're really as fickle as you're implying, then those people were never really going to truly help us achieve anything worth talking about anyway.
Mud - a couple thoughts:

1. Its easy to kick someone in the head when you're standing on their shoulders.
2. The things that generation already achieved for you is more than anything your generation seems likely to produce.
3. This is the most desperate Yappi plea for attention I've seen in awhile. Hope no one responds or takes you seriously.
  #1608  
Old 06-24-19, 06:14 PM
chs1971 chs1971 is offline
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Originally Posted by Harrycrane View Post
What goes through the mind of a pompous azzwhole when he goes 10000 ha's?
In my mind, it was hilarious.
  #1609  
Old 06-24-19, 07:23 PM
nwwarrior09 nwwarrior09 is offline
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Originally Posted by BlueJayFan View Post
Beto's war tax what an idiot
Saw that this morning...man, he sure went from media appointed rockstar to being a political burnout awfully quickly.

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  #1610  
Old 06-24-19, 08:08 PM
nwwarrior09 nwwarrior09 is offline
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Originally Posted by JcksnPlrBrs2002 View Post

As far as the "Boomer Generation" goes - to hell with them.

Worst. Generation. Ever.
I try to not blanket stereotype groups, but in my experience there seems to be a lot of "I got mine" attitudes in that age group and not a whole lot of "pay it forward" (i.e. greatest generation) -- regardless of party/ideology.

The folks in the older part of that generation (post WWII-Korean War era) struck the jackpot and have enjoyed probably the highest standard of living anyone in this country will ever have relative to their time in history. Advent of the modern consumer economy, ample blue collar jobs as Europe rebuilt post WWs and we were fairly closed off to the communist world, cheap college and home prices, the ability to make one job a "career job" that leads to retirement and provides sufficiently as a single income for 4-5 people...they've enjoyed pretty much the best America ever offered and have said tough chit to the Xers, Millennials and now Zers who have followed.

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  #1611  
Old 06-24-19, 08:16 PM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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Originally Posted by nwwarrior09 View Post
I try to not blanket stereotype groups, but in my experience there seems to be a lot of "I got mine" attitudes in that age group and not a whole lot of "pay it forward" (i.e. greatest generation) -- regardless of party/ideology.

The folks in the older part of that generation (post WWII-Korean War era) struck the jackpot and have enjoyed probably the highest standard of living anyone in this country will ever have relative to their time in history. Advent of the modern consumer economy, ample blue collar jobs as Europe rebuilt post WWs and we were fairly closed off to the communist world, cheap college and home prices, the ability to make one job a "career job" that leads to retirement and provides sufficiently as a single income for 4-5 people...they've enjoyed pretty much the best America ever offered and have said tough chit to the Xers, Millennials and now Zers who have followed.

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Yep this is a pretty gross stereotype of the Boomers. First off boomers are incredibly generous to their families. From paying for college to co-signing for that first mortgage boomers have NOT as a group been stingy with their money.

Second, Boomers are very generous with respect to charitable donations. They've poured trillions of dollars into every charity imaginable.

If you're going to generalize about my generation it's that we boomers were spoiled by our parents & grand parents. But even that is easily understandable as what parents or grandparents from the "greatest generation" would wish their suffering & struggles on their own children & grandchildren?
  #1612  
Old 06-24-19, 08:16 PM
BlueJayFan BlueJayFan is offline
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Buttigieg is really shooting himself in the foot with the way he's handling the shooting in South Bend. The town hall he held was really bad.
  #1613  
Old 06-24-19, 08:19 PM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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Originally Posted by BlueJayFan View Post
Buttigieg is really shooting himself in the foot with the way he's handling the shooting in South Bend. The town hall he held was really bad.
You mean the fact that he's not condemning the officer forcibly & publicly enough? Even though it looks like it was a justified shooting? I'm curious to know what you think he should be doing?
  #1614  
Old 06-24-19, 08:47 PM
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You mean the fact that he's not condemning the officer forcibly & publicly enough? Even though it looks like it was a justified shooting? I'm curious to know what you think he should be doing?
That isn't it at all. His demeanor at the town hall and then telling that woman "I'm not trying to get your vote" are both idiotic.

He looked like he would rather be 39083490538 different places other than that Town Hall in the town he is in charge of. He showed no empathy and came across as cold and nonchalant.

He already has a problem with not attracting much of the black vote, and he can't win without it.
  #1615  
Old 06-24-19, 09:08 PM
nwwarrior09 nwwarrior09 is offline
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Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
Yep this is a pretty gross stereotype of the Boomers. First off boomers are incredibly generous to their families. From paying for college to co-signing for that first mortgage boomers have NOT as a group been stingy with their money.



Second, Boomers are very generous with respect to charitable donations. They've poured trillions of dollars into every charity imaginable.



If you're going to generalize about my generation it's that we boomers were spoiled by our parents & grand parents. But even that is easily understandable as what parents or grandparents from the "greatest generation" would wish their suffering & struggles on their own children & grandchildren?
Most of the folks that I know that have had expansive funding for school, etc. have been because of grandparents' ("greatest generation") giving. One of my childhood friends rolled up around 80k in student loan debt and his grandparents/owners of their small family business paid off 60k or so of it when he graduated. A lot of the generational family kids that I went to Catholic grade school with had grandparents that funded having several grandkids receive K-12 Catholic education "because it mattered" and helped financially support them so they could go to UD or X for college. One of the core reasons Catholic education costs have skyrocketed has been these folks dying off resulting in a big drop in weekly giving and parishs having less ability to fund their grade schools as their staffing costs have risen with the decline of ordained faculty.

Generous "greatest generation" spoils have definitely been prominent in my family life. One grandmother that passed before I came of school age dropped stacks on "back to school" shopping for all seven of her grandkids (including my older half-siblings, i.e. non-biological grandkids) every year. I've heard a whole lot as I've aged that cost would not have been a prohibitive factor for Catholic high school had she not passed so early, and that a nice chunk of college tuition probably would have been covered as well. Incredible treatment from my "grandma" (non-biological, mom's first marriage) as well.

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  #1616  
Old 06-24-19, 09:14 PM
nwwarrior09 nwwarrior09 is offline
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Originally Posted by BlueJayFan View Post

He already has a problem with not attracting much of the black vote, and he can't win without it.
Since I'm on fire with stereotypical hot takes today, I would be surprised if an openly gay white man was the candidate of choice for more than a sliver of the black Dem voting block. Whether it's socially conservative religious beliefs or machismo inner-city culture, it should no surprise to anyone that Buttigieg has a drawing power problem with this block.

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  #1617  
Old 06-24-19, 09:15 PM
BlueJayFan BlueJayFan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nwwarrior09 View Post
Since I'm on fire with stereotypical hot takes today, I would be surprised if an openly gay white man was the candidate of choice for more than a sliver of the black Dem voting block. Whether it's socially conservative religious beliefs or machismo inner-city culture, it should not surprise anyone that Buttigieg has a drawing power problem with this block.

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I think a lot of it has to do with Biden being in the race. He is very very well-liked by African American voters.

Bernie is doing better this go-around as well.
  #1618  
Old 06-24-19, 09:20 PM
arizonawildcat arizonawildcat is offline
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Who drops out first? Uncle Joe or Mayor Pete? I say Pete.
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Old 06-24-19, 09:44 PM
my2sense my2sense is offline
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MSM builds someone up then tears them down. Last month they loved Mayor Bootyguy and Uncle Joe. Now Liz and Bernie getting the good pub.

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  #1620  
Old 06-24-19, 09:56 PM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlueJayFan View Post
That isn't it at all. His demeanor at the town hall and then telling that woman "I'm not trying to get your vote" are both idiotic.

He looked like he would rather be 39083490538 different places other than that Town Hall in the town he is in charge of. He showed no empathy and came across as cold and nonchalant.

He already has a problem with not attracting much of the black vote, and he can't win without it.
Well, any Dem that panders to black voters or LGBTUVWXYZs is not getting back those former Dem voters who went to Trump. Pretty tough spot, electorally.

No wonder you clowns want to let in a bunch of unskilled illegal aliens.
 

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