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  #1  
Old 12-19-13, 01:35 AM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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Ask the Ref?

We've had several threads like this in the various forums and we have a certified official that is willing to answer questions about the rules of the game. Feel free to ask the questions in this thread.
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  #2  
Old 12-19-13, 01:38 AM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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I'll get this started. Player A shoots the ball from the top of the key towards his goal. Ball hits the rim and goes almost straight up and over the backboard. It does not touch anything on it's way up or down and lands in-bounds behind the backboard.

Is this a violation or play-on?
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  #3  
Old 12-19-13, 03:03 AM
dmaphukn dmaphukn is offline
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If it goes over the backboard its a dead ball
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  #4  
Old 12-19-13, 05:48 AM
Purple66 Purple66 is offline
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Cool

Is it over and back if a player catches the ball in the air and the lands on their side of the court?
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  #5  
Old 12-19-13, 06:58 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Purple66 View Post
Is it over and back if a player catches the ball in the air and the lands on their side of the court?
It depends. There are number of variables to consider regarding back court violations.

On a throw-in or a jump ball...... no violation

If the opponent had team control while the ball was in the air....no violation

If the player's team was in control of the ball and he jumped from the front court, and landed with the ball in the back court, it is a back court violation.
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  #6  
Old 12-19-13, 07:03 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dmaphukn View Post
If it goes over the backboard its a dead ball
Provided that backboard is a rectangular shaped board.

Not many of those out that are used for live play, but in the event that you are playing in a gym where a fan shaped board is used, the rule applies.
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  #7  
Old 12-19-13, 10:41 AM
NEOHGTI NEOHGTI is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Purple66 View Post
Is it over and back if a player catches the ball in the air and the lands on their side of the court?
I know AllSports has answered this - but you may (or may not ) find it helpful to know the 'why' of this - in addition to the straight answers.

Similar to a player who is throwing-in or has gone out of bounds during live ball play, a player must establish him/herself in bounds, or in this case - in the front court before he/she can legally touch the ball (assuming his/her team has control of the ball for front court). Both feet are required to be 'down' in order to establish this position. So in the case of a midair leap from back court to front - the player's feet were last established in the back court. He/she is technically in the back court until both feet touch down in the front court.

That makes the rest of the variables easy - which AllSports addresses in his three scenarios. Team control comes into play as well, as to whether or not a violation occurs. There is no team control on a jump ball tip or throw in (at least not for the purpose of a back court violation), so no back court violation can occur. There's also no team control once a shot is tried. So in the unlikely event a rebound bounces long and uncontrolled into the back court, even the shooting team would not be in violation of the back court rule if they first touch/gain control.
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  #8  
Old 12-19-13, 03:12 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NEOHGTI View Post
I know AllSports has answered this - but you may (or may not ) find it helpful to know the 'why' of this - in addition to the straight answers.

Similar to a player who is throwing-in or has gone out of bounds during live ball play, a player must establish him/herself in bounds, or in this case - in the front court before he/she can legally touch the ball (assuming his/her team has control of the ball for front court). Both feet are required to be 'down' in order to establish this position. So in the case of a midair leap from back court to front - the player's feet were last established in the back court. He/she is technically in the back court until both feet touch down in the front court.
Not a requirement for establishing a position on the floor, whether it be in bounds, out of bounds, front court, or back court.
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  #9  
Old 12-19-13, 03:30 PM
NEOHGTI NEOHGTI is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
Not a requirement for establishing a position on the floor, whether it be in bounds, out of bounds, front court, or back court.
Cripes - sorry. You're right. They just have to 'touch'...usually it's going to be a foot that is touching. Sorry if I created any confusion. That mid air leap being in the backcourt ends when one foot (or any part of his body) hits the floor in the front court. I was thinking one foot front/one foot back = backcourt. But the main concept I was getting at still applies - the player is considered to be in the back court while in mid air. I believe that was one of the main concepts the poster was asking about, and important to address.

Last edited by NEOHGTI; 12-19-13 at 05:17 PM.
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  #10  
Old 12-20-13, 11:13 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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On a FT attempt, both teams simultaneously have a lane violation (shooter and lowman on the lane). What is the call in these situations:

- 1st shot of two FT attempts
- 2nd shot
- 1st shot on 1-and-1 attempt
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  #11  
Old 12-20-13, 11:40 PM
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Kyle_E_Woyote Kyle_E_Woyote is offline
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I've heard it said that "The hand is part of the ball." So if a defensive player hits the hand of the offensive player with the ball, is this a foul or not? BTW, thanks for dong this thread, it's a great idea.
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  #12  
Old 12-21-13, 12:26 AM
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I know this one has been discussed in prior years, but I forgot the explanation:

Let's say that a held ball occurs and that Team A is awarded the ball on the alternating possession. Team A attempts to inbound the ball but ends up throwing it out of bounds, and it was never touched by anyone in play. Obviously, the ball goes back to Team B, but my question is this:

Does Team A retain the possession arrow because the ball was never actually put in play, or will Team B be awarded the next held ball?

I hope I'm making sense here. I asked this question to a few people last year and never arrived at a consensus.
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  #13  
Old 12-21-13, 12:36 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yappi View Post
On a FT attempt, both teams simultaneously have a lane violation (shooter and lowman on the lane). What is the call in these situations:

- 1st shot of two FT attempts
- 2nd shot
- 1st shot on 1-and-1 attempt
Simultaneous violations are easy to enforce....

- 1st shot of two FT attempts - Ball is dead immediately, no point can be scored. Resume play by attempting the second of the two free throws.

- 2nd shot & 1st shot on 1-and-1 attempt - In both of these, the ball is dead immediately and the ball is put back into play using the Alternating Possession Arrow.
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  #14  
Old 12-21-13, 12:42 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyle_E_Woyote View Post
I've heard it said that "The hand is part of the ball." So if a defensive player hits the hand of the offensive player with the ball, is this a foul or not? BTW, thanks for dong this thread, it's a great idea.
Not a foul.....

From the rule book...

It is legal use of hands to reach to block or slap the ball controlled by a dribbler or a player throwing for goal or a player holding it and accidentally hitting the hand of the opponent when it is in contact with the ball
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  #15  
Old 12-21-13, 12:46 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Slippery View Post
I know this one has been discussed in prior years, but I forgot the explanation:

Let's say that a held ball occurs and that Team A is awarded the ball on the alternating possession. Team A attempts to inbound the ball but ends up throwing it out of bounds, and it was never touched by anyone in play. Obviously, the ball goes back to Team B, but my question is this:

Does Team A retain the possession arrow because the ball was never actually put in play, or will Team B be awarded the next held ball?

I hope I'm making sense here. I asked this question to a few people last year and never arrived at a consensus.
When team A violates on an alternating possession throw-in, they lose the ball and the arrow. (Rule 6-4-5)

In your play, Team A violated by throwing the ball out of bounds, therefore B gets the ball for the ball out of bounds, and gets the arrow because of the violation.
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  #16  
Old 12-21-13, 11:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
When team A violates on an alternating possession throw-in, they lose the ball and the arrow. (Rule 6-4-5)

In your play, Team A violated by throwing the ball out of bounds, therefore B gets the ball for the ball out of bounds, and gets the arrow because of the violation.
Very good. Thank you!
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  #17  
Old 12-21-13, 12:14 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Conversely, if Team B violates during an alternating possession throw-in, (kicks the ball before it touches someone on the floor) Team A gets a throw-in because of the violation, and keeps the arrow.

You don't let either team have benefit of the arrow after violating on a throw-in.
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  #18  
Old 12-21-13, 07:06 PM
Big time fan Big time fan is offline
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So the offensive team player drives to the basket while out of control gets hammered by the defensive players. The offensive player does not run into anyone only the defensive players while smacking at the ball hit the offensive player.
Is this no foul?
Is this defensive foul?
Is this charging?
Is this a no call even tho he was hammered?
Is this a out of control offensive foul?

I would understand if he would get a charging call if he ran into the defensive players while "out of control".


Any thoughts?
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  #19  
Old 12-21-13, 10:13 PM
Purple66 Purple66 is offline
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Cool

This is what happened on the refs over and back call.

[A] players throws the ball in to [B] player...[B player dribbles the ball near mid-court and throws ball to [c] player which is over mid-court. Before [B ]player can get over mid court [c] player throws it back to him and he catches it in the air and comes down with control of the ball and lands about a foot over mid court. The ref called over and back??????????????

Did the ref make the right call?
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  #20  
Old 12-21-13, 11:06 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Big time fan View Post
So the offensive team player drives to the basket while out of control gets hammered by the defensive players. The offensive player does not run into anyone only the defensive players while smacking at the ball hit the offensive player.
Is this no foul?
Is this defensive foul?
Is this charging?
Is this a no call even tho he was hammered?
Is this a out of control offensive foul?

I would understand if he would get a charging call if he ran into the defensive players while "out of control".


Any thoughts?
What you describe is a foul on the defense.

Just because a player is out of control does not gi e the opponent license to "hammer" him.

Many times a player out of control will create the contact and an official will pass on said contact. (not call it a foul)
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  #21  
Old 12-21-13, 11:11 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Purple66 View Post
This is what happened on the refs over and back call.

[A] players throws the ball in to [B] player...[B player dribbles the ball near mid-court and throws ball to [c] player which is over mid-court. Before [B ]player can get over mid court [c] player throws it back to him and he catches it in the air and comes down with control of the ball and lands about a foot over mid court. The ref called over and back??????????????

Did the ref make the right call?
If the players (A, B, C) are all teammates and player B last touched the floor in the back court, caught the ball in mid-air, and landed in the front court, then the official's call was correct
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  #22  
Old 12-21-13, 11:17 PM
NEOHGTI NEOHGTI is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Purple66 View Post
This is what happened on the refs over and back call.

[A] players throws the ball in to [B] player...[B player dribbles the ball near mid-court and throws ball to [c] player which is over mid-court. Before [B ]player can get over mid court [c] player throws it back to him and he catches it in the air and comes down with control of the ball and lands about a foot over mid court. The ref called over and back??????????????

Did the ref make the right call?
If B's last touch on the court was in the back court before he caught the ball, it's a back court violation. B isn't in the front court until he touches down.

Rule 4-35: "ART. 1 . . . The location of a player or nonplayer is determined by where the player is touching the floor as far as being:
a. Inbounds or out of bounds.
b. In the frontcourt or backcourt......

ART. 3 . . . The location of an airborne player with reference to the three factors of Article 1 is the same as at the time such player was last in contact with the floor...
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  #23  
Old 12-22-13, 04:10 PM
flexz69 flexz69 is offline
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What is the hand rule for a defender guarding a player with the ball?

Is there a no hand contact at all or is a light contact allowed without arm extended? THX
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  #24  
Old 12-22-13, 05:48 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flexz69 View Post
What is the hand rule for a defender guarding a player with the ball?

Is there a no hand contact at all or is a light contact allowed without arm extended? THX
Two hands to the dribbler should be a foul each and every time. A forearm (armbar) on the dribbler should be a foul each and every time.

In a nutshell, any contact that interrupts the dribbler's rythym, speed, balance, or quickness should be called a foul. Continued contact with the hand, or the defender extending the arm (hand) while in contact is a good way to view it.

Merely placing a hand on the dribbler is not a foul.

In the end.... it's all in the eyes of the covering official.
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  #25  
Old 12-22-13, 06:03 PM
NEOHGTI NEOHGTI is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by flexz69 View Post
What is the hand rule for a defender guarding a player with the ball?

Is there a no hand contact at all or is a light contact allowed without arm extended? THX
The rule pertaining to the illegal use of hands contact foul that is commonly called a 'hand check' is short and sweet:

10.6.3 - "A player shall not use his/her hands on an opponent in any way that inhibits the freedom of movement of the opponent or acts as an aid to a player in starting or stopping."

Allsports does an excellent job of describing what how we generally discuss this rule in the interpretation meetings. Note - contact of the hands is not necessarily a foul, by rule...but we generally will call it if two hands get on the body, regardless of whether or not it 'inhibits the freedom of movement'. It may not be the literal interpretation of the rule, but it's pretty consistent throughout every officiating association.
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  #26  
Old 12-23-13, 10:33 AM
Purple66 Purple66 is offline
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Cool

Quote:
Originally Posted by NEOHGTI View Post
If B's last touch on the court was in the back court before he caught the ball, it's a back court violation. B isn't in the front court until he touches down.

Rule 4-35: "ART. 1 . . . The location of a player or nonplayer is determined by where the player is touching the floor as far as being:
a. Inbounds or out of bounds.
b. In the frontcourt or backcourt......

ART. 3 . . . The location of an airborne player with reference to the three factors of Article 1 is the same as at the time such player was last in contact with the floor...
Thanks
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  #27  
Old 12-27-13, 02:33 PM
BigWorm BigWorm is offline
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Whether if a shot is attempted as time expires, the ball hits the floor and bounces in? I assume this is a no shot because it hit the floor...

2) Shot is attempted beyond the three point line the ball bounces inside the three point line and goes in, is it a 2 pointer?
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  #28  
Old 12-27-13, 02:41 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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One of the ways a try (shot) ends is the ball touches the floor. In your first example, if the ball is in the air on a try, the horn goes off, then the ball hits the floor, the ball is dead an no points can be scored.

In your second example, score two points. The three point try ended when the ball hit the floor inside the arc.
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  #29  
Old 01-02-14, 12:01 AM
Hungry Bears Hungry Bears is offline
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Time out

Can a player saving a ball from going out of bounds, go airborne in bounds catch the ball and while in mid air yell time out and its granted?
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  #30  
Old 01-02-14, 10:35 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Originally Posted by Hungry Bears View Post
Can a player saving a ball from going out of bounds, go airborne in bounds catch the ball and while in mid air yell time out and its granted?
Yes.

As long as he last touched the floor in bounds and he has control of the basketball when he requests the time out.
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