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  #1  
Old 05-28-18, 12:56 AM
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Lancermania Lancermania is offline
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Track & Field Investigative Team (TFIT) Case #1

The track and field forum on Yappi now has its own "i" team to investigate items important for track and field. Charter members are SLS, Mr. Slippery, JAVMAN83, Altor, and Lancermania. The case now before this committe is that of Ricky Thomas II and his situation involving his eligibility. Let's look at some facts that we have here.

#1. Oyler high school where Ricky attends was placed on probation for failing to have two winter sports team. We are still looking for factural data regarding the suspension and when it occurred.

#2. The was an appeal filed on behalf of Ricky Thomas II which was denied on May 3, 2018. We have this as factural data. http://ohsaa.org/Portals/0/Eligibili...nelMinutes.pdf

#3. Ricky was given permission by the OHSAA to compete as an individual but not allowed to score points for Oyler. This was reported by Scott Springer of the Cincinnati Enquirer. We have a link to this article. https://www.cincinnati.com/story/spo...eam/626529002/

#4. Ricky has not only been competing but also scoring points for Oyler in the OHSAA STATE TOURNAMENT which seems to contradict the reporter's story in #3.

Oyler is listed here scoring 28 points as Ricky gets a second in the 100 and wins the 400 and 200 moving on to the Troy regional. http://www.baumspage.com/tf/sw/2012/...%20Results.htm

Oyler is listed here scoring 14 points by Ricky winning the 400 advancing to state but finishing seventh in both the 100 and 200 at the DIII Troy Regional here. http://www.baumspage.com/rtrack/2012...%20Results.htm

Last edited by Lancermania; 05-28-18 at 01:28 AM..
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  #2  
Old 05-28-18, 06:14 AM
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#2 is the curious one.
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  #3  
Old 05-28-18, 06:31 AM
ccrunner609 ccrunner609 is offline
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#1 seems curious...didnt know you had some sort of probation for not having a sport.
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  #4  
Old 05-28-18, 07:23 AM
psycho_dad psycho_dad is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccrunner609 View Post
#1 seems curious...didnt know you had some sort of probation for not having a sport.
Must participate in 2 sports per season. 2 Fall, 2 winter and 2 Spring to be in the OHSAA.

It is also important to note that the referendum item from May 2017, concerning continued membership in the OHSAA, did pass. Effective with the 2017‐18 school year, schools that wish to have the privilege of continued full membership in the OHSAA must sponsor a minimum of two OHSAA sanctioned interscholastic sports per sport season, compete in at least 50% of the
maximum allowable regular season contests permitted in those respective sports, as well as participate in the OHSAA post season tournament in those respective sports.
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  #5  
Old 05-28-18, 07:31 AM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Unless there is some missing piece of information to which we are not all privy, either the suspension information is faulty or has been lifted, OR Mr. Springer's information is incorrect, OR someone never passed this information along to the respective district & region meets in order for them to properly adjust the scoring in the results.
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  #6  
Old 05-28-18, 08:01 AM
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Some of you may not remember but several years ago, Oyler high school asked the Coaches Association for assistance in purchasing uniforms, and the Association bought their uniforms and donated them to the Oyler cross country and track teams. Almost everyone who attends Oyler is below the poverty level. The point is that the Association sort of adopted the team. As the statistician/historian for the Assoication, I am going to pay a visit to Oyler high school this week. Two individuals who are employed there were at the hearing where their appeal was denied.

Last edited by Lancermania; 05-28-18 at 11:43 AM..
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  #7  
Old 05-28-18, 01:28 PM
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Neither Mr. Slippery nor Lancermania have been able to located in the Board of Directors Full Minutes any mention of Oyler being under suspension. That may be the loophole which is allowing Ricky Thomas II to compete this spring in track and field and score points for Oyler.
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  #8  
Old 05-29-18, 11:30 PM
hammer89 hammer89 is offline
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Youíre misunderstanding item 2. It was not an appeal for the athlete. It was an appea for the school to not be on probation. That appeal was denied. Any special agreement allowing the athlete to participate is still in play and no way affected by item 2.

Check the June minutes after the board meeting next week, could easily be in there. Many of these infractions take time to get listed in the minutes (see- Dayton Dunbar basketball)
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  #9  
Old 05-30-18, 04:16 PM
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What do the i team members say about this?. Should I go to Oyler high school tomorrow morning and chat with the principal Amy Randolph who was at the Appeal Hearing held earlier this month? Just to try to understand what I would be getting into, I am researching what I can about Oyler, now a high school also. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/education/oyler-school
https://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...nati/18090143/
https://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...ates/85285392/

Last edited by Lancermania; 05-30-18 at 05:00 PM..
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  #10  
Old 05-30-18, 08:00 PM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancermania View Post
What do the i team members say about this?. Should I go to Oyler high school tomorrow morning and chat with the principal Amy Randolph who was at the Appeal Hearing held earlier this month? Just to try to understand what I would be getting into, I am researching what I can about Oyler, now a high school also. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/education/oyler-school
https://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...nati/18090143/
https://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...ates/85285392/
If you do it, be sure to make sure you're doing it as a member of the press that will be attending this weekend's meet and are looking for clarity on Thomas' status and whether the school's status has any bearing on his ability to score team points at state. Given what has happened at district & regional with their not removing team points from him, I think there's more to this story than meets the ear (pun intended - an old Peter Sellers' Clouseau remark).
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Old 05-30-18, 09:29 PM
hammer89 hammer89 is offline
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Isnít the answer pretty obvious? Or am I oversimplifying things? Itís like when Russia was kicked out of the olympics for doping, but they let some athletes participate under a neutral flag. Oyler was kicked out/put on probation/whatever, but in an effort to not cause undue harm to the athlete for mistakes adults made, heís allowed to compete as a neutral, essentially.

Doesnít that sum it up?
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  #12  
Old 05-30-18, 09:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hammer89 View Post
Isnít the answer pretty obvious? Or am I oversimplifying things? Itís like when Russia was kicked out of the olympics for doping, but they let some athletes participate under a neutral flag. Oyler was kicked out/put on probation/whatever, but in an effort to not cause undue harm to the athlete for mistakes adults made, heís allowed to compete as a neutral, essentially.

Doesnít that sum it up?
It might, but I still want to know the details. I'm trying to understand exactly how or why this particular situation differs from the 8 schools that were placed on probation and were told back in January that they could not participate in the postseason again until after next school year after failing to field enough athletic teams in the fall. Those schools also have kids who are paying for mistakes that others made. If there is something different about Oyler's situation, I would think it in the OHSAA's best interest to make it known, or else those other 8 schools are getting the shaft and should pursue a class action suit to be reinstated in the OHSAA ASAP.

I'm inspired by the challenges Ricky Thomas has overcome to compete at the state level, but does that alone make him exempt from OHSAA regulations? Just want someone to please set me straight on the details here.
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  #13  
Old 05-30-18, 09:55 PM
hammer89 hammer89 is offline
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So sounds like the questions are more for the OHSAA than for Oyler. Anyone tried emailing the OHSAA media guy? Iím sure theyíre busy with state tournaments in 5 sports currently but worth a shot.
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  #14  
Old 05-31-18, 07:22 AM
SLS SLS is offline
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I have sent another email, this time to a correct address (I believe) and am awaiting a response from Tim Stried at OHSAA who was Scott Springer's source.
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  #15  
Old 05-31-18, 08:05 AM
mrroosevelt mrroosevelt is offline
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Nice story. I will be rooting for this kid.
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  #16  
Old 05-31-18, 10:13 AM
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Detective Mania arrived at Oyler continuing his investigation for the Track & Field "i" team, was admitted into the building, and talked to a secretary who knew the decision to bar Ricky Thomas II from post season competition had been overturned sometime this month. The school year was over at Oyler. Neither the principal nor the athletic director were in the building at the time. I can speculate that the decision to allow Ricky to compete was because the lateness of the decision to put Oyler on probation came some time in April. I'm assuming that their probation starts with the next school year but that has not been confirmed. JAVMAN83 has taught me that you have to be relentless in your pursuit and can't give up until success is achieved. More to come in this case.
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  #17  
Old 05-31-18, 11:16 AM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Thanks for the update, Mr. Mania. Interesting case indeed. Wish the kid and his coach well at state. Next year might be difficult, though, for any kids wishing to compete for Oyler if they can't field sufficient numbers of teams/season.
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  #18  
Old 05-31-18, 02:12 PM
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My pursuit of the facts continues. The timing company who did the DIII district meet says there were never told by the OHSAA not to score Oyler. They also said that their software would have allowed them not to score Oyler
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Old 05-31-18, 02:19 PM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lancermania View Post
My pursuit of the facts continues. The timing company who did the DIII district meet says there were never told by the OHSAA not to score Oyler. They also said that their software would have allowed them not to score Oyler
That's good information. I always suspected the software could be tweaked as such, but it's good to know for sure.
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  #20  
Old 06-01-18, 10:34 AM
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Ricky Thomas II qualified to the DIII finals in the 400m with his second time under 50. I could see him finishing no lower than third, not sure he can run in the 48 range which will probably take to win it. http://live.finishtiming.com/#/resul...vent/16/Prelim

Now that he is competing in Columbus at the state championships with many of the OHSAA big wigs there, we will see if Oyler scores or not. If they do, we will know that Scott Springer reported incorrectly in the Enquirer and local newspapers on the west side that Oyler couldn't score.
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Old 06-02-18, 09:44 AM
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Congrats to the young man. He finished 4th today.
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  #22  
Old 06-02-18, 09:57 AM
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Oyler is also listed scoring 5 points which are awarded for 4th place. This tells me that what Scott Springer posted in the Enquirer was not correct about Oyler not being able to score. I see two choices here:

1. Oyler was indeeed suspended but their suspension won't start until next school year in the fall.
2. I've had two people tell me the suspension was overturned. What if Oyler tried to have two teams in the winter but no kids came out for one or more of the teams. If they make a bona fide effort to field a team but can't because no students at the school want to participate should that count against them.

Last edited by Lancermania; 06-02-18 at 12:33 PM..
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  #23  
Old 06-02-18, 12:21 PM
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Great job with this story guys. Good luck to Ricky Thomas
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  #24  
Old 06-02-18, 12:28 PM
said_aouita said_aouita is offline
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Because of this thread I searched Google maps and checked out a few blocks around Oyler HS, a shame so many beautiful old brick buildings going to waste.

Could definitely see a younger and more hipster-artsy crowd moving into that area.

Last edited by said_aouita; 06-02-18 at 12:41 PM..
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Old 06-02-18, 05:59 PM
yj_runfan yj_runfan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by said_aouita View Post
Because of this thread I searched Google maps and checked out a few blocks around Oyler HS, a shame so many beautiful old brick buildings going to waste.

Could definitely see a younger and more hipster-artsy crowd moving into that area.
My family went to church in that neighborhood when I was young. One of the poorest areas in Cincinnati.
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  #26  
Old 06-04-18, 12:12 PM
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My message To OHSAA was read May 31st, but I have no other response yet.
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  #27  
Old 06-04-18, 01:04 PM
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Here is an email that I received from Josh Hardin, Athletics Manager for Cincinnati Public Schools.

"From my understanding, Oyler should not receive any team/school points. I would follow up accordingly with members of OHSAA to get anything resolved. Thanks!"
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Old 06-04-18, 02:17 PM
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It seems that it should be Mr. Hardin's responsibility to follow up. He should have said "I will" in stead of "I would."
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Old 06-04-18, 03:15 PM
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Quote:
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It seems that it should be Mr. Hardin's responsibility to follow up. He should have said "I will" in stead of "I would."
I disagree. I think the responsibility is 100% on OHSAA to get this resolved.
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Old 06-04-18, 05:43 PM
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I disagree. I think the responsibility is 100% on OHSAA to get this resolved.
That it is; however, if one has the title of "Athletic Manager" for a school system,I think it would be using due diligence to address the OHSAA on behalf of a school in its district if the OHSAA has failed to take appropriate action.
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