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  #1  
Old 10-21-13, 01:52 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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Ask The Ref?

We've had several threads like this in the various forums and we have a certified official that is willing to answer questions about the rules of the game. Feel free to ask the questions in this thread.
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  #2  
Old 10-21-13, 03:00 PM
HoHumming HoHumming is offline
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What are the current rules regarding a quarterback throwing the ball out of bounds / intentionally grounding a ball?

When I played, there had to be a receiver near the ball, regardless of position in the pocket, etc.. Has that changed?
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  #3  
Old 10-21-13, 03:03 PM
SW OH Official SW OH Official is offline
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Essentially, there is no "pocket" in Ohio HS football. The rule of thumb is that an eligible receiver needs to be within 10 yards of where the ball lands.

Throwing out of bounds is generally speaking accepted as long as there is an eligible receiver in the direction of the pass.
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  #4  
Old 10-21-13, 03:29 PM
kingdaddy kingdaddy is offline
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I read here recently that there is a rule addressing "leaping"... If there is a pile of bodies under you, are you required to run around them? Do you know the background regarding this rule, and can you expound on it? thank you in advance!!
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  #5  
Old 11-22-13, 08:33 PM
purplenova purplenova is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SW OH Official View Post
Essentially, there is no "pocket" in Ohio HS football. The rule of thumb is that an eligible receiver needs to be within 10 yards of where the ball lands.

Throwing out of bounds is generally speaking accepted as long as there is an eligible receiver in the direction of the pass.
Listening to trotwood vs tipp game. Tipp got penalty for IG even though a receiver was near the ball as it went out of bounds.
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  #6  
Old 11-23-13, 12:01 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by purplenova View Post
Listening to trotwood vs tipp game. Tipp got penalty for IG even though a receiver was near the ball as it went out of bounds.
No way to tell by listening to the radio.
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  #7  
Old 10-21-13, 03:35 PM
SW OH Official SW OH Official is offline
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You usually see it on extra points and field goals. Defensive players would jump on top of D-linemen's back or players in the pile to block kicks. This is a safety issue. Most states are re-charging officials into calling these types of penalties.
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  #8  
Old 10-21-13, 03:38 PM
HoHumming HoHumming is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SW OH Official View Post
You usually see it on extra points and field goals. Defensive players would jump on top of D-linemen's back or players in the pile to block kicks. This is a safety issue. Most states are re-charging officials into calling these types of penalties.
Doesn't this also now apply to ball carriers jumping over an upright defender? I saw it called in-game once this year.
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  #9  
Old 10-21-13, 03:48 PM
serpico serpico is offline
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Late game situation. Team A is leading and has the ball. Team B is out of timeouts. If Team A is called for procedure and the play blown dead, a) does the clock re-start before the next snap, b) isn't this an easy way to milk some clock, or c) do the referees have the discretion to NOT start the clock after the penalty is marked off?
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  #10  
Old 10-21-13, 06:37 PM
SW OH Official SW OH Official is offline
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Hohumming- yes, hurdling penalty occurs when a ball carrier jumps over a defender making an attempt to make a tackle.

Serpico- a) the clock would start on the ready whistle or at the snap, depending on previous clock status, b) yes,, c) the referee can invoke illegally conserving or consuming time and start the clock on the snap to prevent it further.
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  #11  
Old 10-21-13, 08:16 PM
tallmadge H2 dad tallmadge H2 dad is offline
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Is there a new HS rule that when a team misses a FG attempt inside the 20, the ball is spotted on the 20 rather than where the FG was attempted?
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  #12  
Old 10-21-13, 08:27 PM
mixerman1616 mixerman1616 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallmadge H2 dad View Post
Is there a new HS rule that when a team misses a FG attempt inside the 20, the ball is spotted on the 20 rather than where the FG was attempted?
Its a touchback if the kick crosses the goal line. But this isnt a new rule. BTW that goes for all field goal attempts, not just ones inside the 20.
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  #13  
Old 10-22-13, 12:08 PM
tallmadge H2 dad tallmadge H2 dad is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mixerman1616 View Post
Its a touchback if the kick crosses the goal line. But this isnt a new rule. BTW that goes for all field goal attempts, not just ones inside the 20.
Wait a minute. So if team A attempts a FG from the 35 yard line and misses it, but the ball crosses the goal line, Team B gets the ball at the 20 instead of the 35??? I have never heard of such a thing. In college and NFL, if a FG is missed, the other team gets the ball from the spot of the kick.
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  #14  
Old 10-22-13, 12:14 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tallmadge H2 dad View Post
Wait a minute. So if team A attempts a FG from the 35 yard line and misses it, but the ball crosses the goal line, Team B gets the ball at the 20 instead of the 35??? I have never heard of such a thing. In college and NFL, if a FG is missed, the other team gets the ball from the spot of the kick.
A field goal attempt is a scrimmage kick. (commonly referred to a a punt)

Under High School (Federation) rules, anytime a kick (scrimmage or free) crosses the plane of the goal line it is a touch back and by rule the ball is placed at the 20 yard-line.
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  #15  
Old 10-22-13, 09:16 PM
hsfan60 hsfan60 is offline
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Funny I guess?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tallmadge H2 dad View Post
Wait a minute. So if team A attempts a FG from the 35 yard line and misses it, but the ball crosses the goal line, Team B gets the ball at the 20 instead of the 35??? I have never heard of such a thing. In college and NFL, if a FG is missed, the other team gets the ball from the spot of the kick.
Sometimes when scouting it's hilarious to hear fans yelling at officials calls when they don't even understand HS rules to begin with.
This kicking down rule has been around for a while, it's not new.
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  #16  
Old 10-21-13, 08:50 PM
hsfan60 hsfan60 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SW OH Official View Post
Hohumming- yes, hurdling penalty occurs when a ball carrier jumps over a defender making an attempt to make a tackle.
Doesn't the position of the defender head make a difference as to whether it is hurdling or not? It use to?
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  #17  
Old 10-21-13, 08:38 PM
bb9 bb9 is offline
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A field goal is a punt essentially.

Regarding hurdling, the player being hurdled pretty much needs to have both feet on the ground for it to be a penalty. The ball carrier can jump over defenders that are already laying on the ground without penalty.

Regarding the clock starting at the referee's discretion, this is a point of emphasis this year and the referee has more flexibility to stop the clock if he feels the team is trying to do it to milk the clock like in your situation above.
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  #18  
Old 10-21-13, 08:45 PM
nupanther nupanther is offline
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Is a personal foul on the defense an automatic 1st down? I thought I saw a situation where it was 3rd & 20, the foul was called and it was marked off to 3rd & 5
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  #19  
Old 10-21-13, 08:47 PM
bb9 bb9 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nupanther View Post
Is a personal foul on the defense an automatic 1st down? I thought I saw a situation where it was 3rd & 20, the foul was called and it was marked off to 3rd & 5
Roughing the passer and roughing the kicker are the only two automatic first downs. Pass interference was until this year but now is changed to 15 yards only.
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  #20  
Old 10-22-13, 08:45 AM
GRPride86 GRPride86 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bb9 View Post
Roughing the passer and roughing the kicker are the only two automatic first downs. Pass interference was until this year but now is changed to 15 yards only.
What about roughing the snapper or holder?
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  #21  
Old 10-22-13, 11:16 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bb9 View Post
Roughing the passer and roughing the kicker are the only two automatic first downs. Pass interference was until this year but now is changed to 15 yards only.
Roughing the snapper and the holder result in automatic first downs as well.

Edit.... oops !! sorry GR, didn't see your post.

Last edited by AllSports12; 10-22-13 at 11:27 AM.
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  #22  
Old 12-03-15, 03:40 PM
HornetFanatic HornetFanatic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bb9 View Post
A field goal is a punt essentially.

Regarding hurdling, the player being hurdled pretty much needs to have both feet on the ground for it to be a penalty. The ball carrier can jump over defenders that are already laying on the ground without penalty.

Regarding the clock starting at the referee's discretion, this is a point of emphasis this year and the referee has more flexibility to stop the clock if he feels the team is trying to do it to milk the clock like in your situation above.
if the FG attempt does not cross the goal line it can be returned or downed by the kicking team?
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  #23  
Old 12-03-15, 03:48 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HornetFanatic View Post
if the FG attempt does not cross the goal line it can be returned or downed by the kicking team?

FG's in HS are a very, very different animal compared to all other levels. Will let allsports give the details but it is much diff than what ya see and the rare occurance that one is kicked and doesnt make it to the end zone/out of the end zone
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  #24  
Old 12-03-15, 04:12 PM
HornetFanatic HornetFanatic is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
FG's in HS are a very, very different animal compared to all other levels. Will let allsports give the details but it is much diff than what ya see and the rare occurance that one is kicked and doesnt make it to the end zone/out of the end zone
I realize that it's rare for a FG attempt to not make it over the goal line, I was actually thinking more strategically. Line up for a FG so the opposition does not put a return guy back, pooch it and down it inside the 10 or snap directly to the kicker to pooch punt it. If it's a LONG attempt they will most likely have someone back there anyway
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  #25  
Old 12-03-15, 04:14 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HornetFanatic View Post
I realize that it's rare for a FG attempt to not make it over the goal line, I was actually thinking more strategically. Line up for a FG so the opposition does not put a return guy back, pooch it and down it inside the 10 or snap directly to the kicker to pooch punt it. If it's a LONG attempt they will most likely have someone back there anyway
Oh I agree, it is an underutilized tool that is for sure. Missed FG, believe goes to the 20 so its like a TB. I just think when weighing the options most teams rather try and go for it, keep their TD possibility in tack, rather than attempt a FG they may have practically zero chance at making.
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  #26  
Old 12-03-15, 04:15 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by HornetFanatic View Post
I realize that it's rare for a FG attempt to not make it over the goal line, I was actually thinking more strategically. Line up for a FG so the opposition does not put a return guy back, pooch it and down it inside the 10 or snap directly to the kicker to pooch punt it. If it's a LONG attempt they will most likely have someone back there anyway
Oh I agree, it is an underutilized tool that is for sure. Missed FG that goes to the EZ , believe goes to the 20 so its like a TB. I just think when weighing the options most teams rather try and go for it, keep their TD possibility in tack, rather than attempt a FG they may have practically zero chance at making.
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  #27  
Old 10-21-13, 08:52 PM
bb9 bb9 is offline
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If he's standing it's hurdling, if not it's not hurdling. Head position doesn't matter.
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  #28  
Old 10-22-13, 09:17 PM
hsfan60 hsfan60 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bb9 View Post
If he's standing it's hurdling, if not it's not hurdling. Head position doesn't matter.
Thanks for the reminder~!
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  #29  
Old 10-21-13, 08:57 PM
COLTCOUNTRY COLTCOUNTRY is offline
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How come refs don't consistently enforce the band rule?? My understanding is a band can play from when the play is whistled dead until the offense breaks huddle and starts to line up. I have been to some games over the last few years where the bands play nonstop. I love what bands bring to the HS game atmosphere but some of them are completely obnoxious. The rule exists and is fairly clear so what's up with the inconsistency??
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  #30  
Old 10-21-13, 09:02 PM
bb9 bb9 is offline
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Don't quote me on this one. It's more of a state regulation and the refs really don't want to get involved in what is going on in the stands. You are right about the regulation but that is one of those things that really would open up a can of worms and if it can be avoided will be avoided.
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