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  #781  
Old 06-01-19, 07:59 PM
Old Wildcat Old Wildcat is offline
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What's the ruling
Base's loaded. Batter hits slow ground ball to the S.S.
He flips it to the second baseman but it wasn't even close the runner on first was there very fast. So does the batter get. A hit? or A Fielders Choice.
I always thought to be a fielders choice there had to be an out made. So is it a fielder's choice or hit. The batter definitely would of beat out a throw to first. Ttb
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  #782  
Old 06-01-19, 08:02 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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This question would probably be better here:

http://yappi.com/forums/showthread.php?t=322959

I'll move a copy of it to there...
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  #783  
Old 06-01-19, 09:39 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Question:

Runner at second. He takes off for third and the pitcher wheels and throws it to the shortstop who is playing the 'norma' SS spot well from the base.

I know a pitcher can throw it directly to third contrary to what some thing, but is the throw to the SS who is not near the base at all okay?>
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  #784  
Old 06-02-19, 08:15 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Question:

Runner at second. He takes off for third and the pitcher wheels and throws it to the shortstop who is playing the 'norma' SS spot well from the base.

I know a pitcher can throw it directly to third contrary to what some thing, but is the throw to the SS who is not near the base at all okay?>
As long as there is a legal step and the pitcher gains ground, this is legal.

Only on a pick off at 1st Base is there a requirement to have the throw near or in the proximity of the base.

Last edited by AllSports12; 06-02-19 at 11:02 AM.
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  #785  
Old 06-03-19, 09:49 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Remember the discussion we had about a 1B not giving much of the base for the runner to go back to the base about?

Similar play this weekend at HP. Catcher blocked the plate great, runner slid into it and bounced off and tagged out. Heard the umpire tell the coach that the catcher gave the runner part of the plate.

Is your ruling still the same for plays at the plate? Catcher did a great job in blocking it, and was there well before the ball.

Personally, I give the catcher kudos even though I am thinking it was against the rules.


What say you?
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  #786  
Old 06-04-19, 05:12 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Remember the discussion we had about a 1B not giving much of the base for the runner to go back to the base about?

Similar play this weekend at HP. Catcher blocked the plate great, runner slid into it and bounced off and tagged out. Heard the umpire tell the coach that the catcher gave the runner part of the plate.

Is your ruling still the same for plays at the plate? Catcher did a great job in blocking it, and was there well before the ball.

Personally, I give the catcher kudos even though I am thinking it was against the rules.


What say you?
The rule applies to home plate as well.

If the umpire judged that access to the plate was afforded by the catcher, then his ruling was a proper application of the rule.
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  #787  
Old 06-04-19, 07:34 AM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
The rule applies to home plate as well.

If the umpire judged that access to the plate was afforded by the catcher, then his ruling was a proper application of the rule.
Good to know.

I have heard it more than once the last couple of years of coaches complaining about blocking the plate. I think some get it confused with that rule MLB had a number of years ago, that THANKFULLY WAS CHANGED/TWEAKED, where blocking the plate at all before the ball was illegal.


Man, was that an embarrassing rule and thankfully it was altered which I think was done in season.


Thanks.
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  #788  
Old 06-12-19, 07:08 AM
Peak Peak is offline
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So my son and I watched this last night and he said he wanted to do this on his next start. My question for the umps here, is this a legal pitch? I'm assuming it is with no runners on base, but with runners is it a balk? Does the pitcher have to come set with the ball in the glove?

https://twitter.com/jeffbajenaru/sta...02966392963073
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  #789  
Old 06-12-19, 08:20 AM
bb9 bb9 is offline
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It is going to depend on what rule set your son is playing by.
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  #790  
Old 06-12-19, 08:45 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peak View Post
So my son and I watched this last night and he said he wanted to do this on his next start. My question for the umps here, is this a legal pitch? I'm assuming it is with no runners on base, but with runners is it a balk? Does the pitcher have to come set with the ball in the glove?

https://twitter.com/jeffbajenaru/sta...02966392963073
First an illegal pitch is an illegal pitch. The penalties differ depending on the existence of runners. With a runner(s) on, the penalty is a balk. With no runners on, a ball is awarded to the batter. Under NFHS Rules, the ball becomes dead immediately. Under Official Baseball Rules, this is a delayed dead ball and the offense has options depending on the outcome of the entire play.

In the video you refer to, the action is not legal under NFHS Rules. The pitcher must come to a set position with his hands together in front of his body (at or below the chin) before he delivers the ball to the plate.

This is legal under Official Baseball Rules, as evidenced by the fact that the umpire simply replaced the ball that was fouled off.
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  #791  
Old 06-12-19, 08:49 AM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
First an illegal pitch is an illegal pitch. The penalties differ depending on the existence of runners. With a runner(s) on, the penalty is a balk. With no runners on, a ball is awarded to the batter. Under NFHS Rules, the ball becomes dead immediately. Under Official Baseball Rules, this is a delayed dead ball and the offense has options depending on the outcome of the entire play.

In the video you refer to, the action is not legal under NFHS Rules. The pitcher must come to a set position with his hands together in front of his body (at or below the chin) before he delivers the ball to the plate.

This is legal under Official Baseball Rules, as evidenced by the fact that the umpire simply replaced the ball that was fouled off.
It is interesting this came up because I was discussing this over the weekend.

With your explanation, even with no runners on a pitcher must pause, correct?

I saw it a couple of times in JV games in 2018 where a balk/ball was called while a pitcher was in the stretch, not pausing, when no one was on base and the coach mentioned it had been called a few times already that spring as I had never seen that before.


Correct?
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  #792  
Old 06-12-19, 09:51 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
It is interesting this came up because I was discussing this over the weekend.

With your explanation, even with no runners on a pitcher must pause, correct?

I saw it a couple of times in JV games in 2018 where a balk/ball was called while a pitcher was in the stretch, not pausing, when no one was on base and the coach mentioned it had been called a few times already that spring as I had never seen that before.


Correct?
Correct

Rule 6-1-3

PENALTY (Arts. 1, 2, 3):

The ball is dead immediately when an illegal pitch occurs. If there is no runner, a ball is awarded the batter. If there is a runner, such illegal act is a balk. In both situations, the umpire signals dead ball.
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  #793  
Old 06-12-19, 11:05 AM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
Correct

Rule 6-1-3

PENALTY (Arts. 1, 2, 3):

The ball is dead immediately when an illegal pitch occurs. If there is no runner, a ball is awarded the batter. If there is a runner, such illegal act is a balk. In both situations, the umpire signals dead ball.
Just to clarify for everyone:

NFHS 6-1-3

If there are no runners and a pitcher is using the stretch position, and the pitcher fails to come set before delivering the pitch to the batter, it is an illegal pitch. The umpire should call time and add a ball to the count.




Hope you don't mind, as I imagine most people do not know this is a thing.
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  #794  
Old 06-12-19, 11:34 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Just to clarify for everyone:

NFHS 6-1-3

If there are no runners and a pitcher is using the stretch position, and the pitcher fails to come set before delivering the pitch to the batter, it is an illegal pitch. The umpire should call time and add a ball to the count.




Hope you don't mind, as I imagine most people do not know this is a thing.
Which is what happened in the twitter video reference above.

Most people don't know it and many, many (one is too many) umpires won't call it because they don't think (incorrectly) it puts anyone at a disadvantage.
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  #795  
Old 06-17-19, 08:31 AM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Believe I know the answer but I always want to verify.


Runner on second. Takes off early. Pitcher lifts his leg in the delivery and steps to third, keep the ball and runs at the base runner. (Balk called)

I know he is allowed to step and throw to third to push back an advancing runner, but is he allowed to just step TO THIRD when a runner is stealing and not throw it?

Same example as above the runner is NOT going and he steps to third and doesn't throw it. (Balk not called).


What say you?


One other thing on obstruction.
Hit to the OF. Hitter/Runner get to first and runs into the 1st baseman. Is an obstruction call automatic even if there really is no attempt or no chance at going to second base? For instance, twice over the weekend a routine hit to RF. No chance to go to take two and wasn't being aggressive to even attempt it. Call obstruction and get second?
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  #796  
Old 06-17-19, 03:41 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Believe I know the answer but I always want to verify.


Runner on second. Takes off early. Pitcher lifts his leg in the delivery and steps to third, keep the ball and runs at the base runner. (Balk called)

I know he is allowed to step and throw to third to push back an advancing runner, but is he allowed to just step TO THIRD when a runner is stealing and not throw it?
This is not a balk. It is not illegal to feint to second or third base in an attempt to put out a runner.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Same example as above the runner is NOT going and he steps to third and doesn't throw it. (Balk not called).


What say you?
This is a balk as feinting to an unoccupied base is illegal if not during an attempt to put out a runner.


Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post

One other thing on obstruction.
Hit to the OF. Hitter/Runner get to first and runs into the 1st baseman. Is an obstruction call automatic even if there really is no attempt or no chance at going to second base? For instance, twice over the weekend a routine hit to RF. No chance to go to take two and wasn't being aggressive to even attempt it. Call obstruction and get second?
Classic "had to be there"..... Here's my take...

You say "runs into the 1st baseman"...... If than happens, I'm awarding 2nd base to the runner.

If the 1st baseman is standing in his path, but the runner has pulled up well before he gets to 1st, then I'm not getting anything on this. (if the outfielder bobbles the ball and the runner decides to kick it in but then hesitates because of the 1st baseman..... you can still get the obstruction)
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  #797  
Old 06-17-19, 08:38 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
This is not a balk. It is not illegal to feint to second or third base in an attempt to put out a runner.



This is a balk as feinting to an unoccupied base is illegal if not during an attempt to put out a runner.




Classic "had to be there"..... Here's my take...

You say "runs into the 1st baseman"...... If than happens, I'm awarding 2nd base to the runner.

If the 1st baseman is standing in his path, but the runner has pulled up well before he gets to 1st, then I'm not getting anything on this. (if the outfielder bobbles the ball and the runner decides to kick it in but then hesitates because of the 1st baseman..... you can still get the obstruction)
Thank you.
I thought it was odd the umpire called a balk when the pitcher faked/stepped to third on the steal attempt but didnt when he wasn't stealing.
Great info, thanks.

I realize the other was a had to be there instance, I guess I was asking if the contact would/should get an obstruction call even on a basic hit (this was to RF, lefty hitter) and if there had to be any thought he may try for second.


In sad news, a long time local umpire, Ed Oberlander of New Knoxvilled, who had umped for over 40 years, died at his residence over the weekend.

Mr. Oberlander was a main stay in West Central ohio for decades. Prayers out to his family. His daughter runs the game day promotions for the Columbus Clippers so baseball was always near and dear to that family
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  #798  
Old 06-17-19, 11:13 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Thank you.
I thought it was odd the umpire called a balk when the pitcher faked/stepped to third on the steal attempt but didnt when he wasn't stealing.
Great info, thanks.

I realize the other was a had to be there instance, I guess I was asking if the contact would/should get an obstruction call even on a basic hit (this was to RF, lefty hitter) and if there had to be any thought he may try for second.


In sad news, a long time local umpire, Ed Oberlander of New Knoxvilled, who had umped for over 40 years, died at his residence over the weekend.

Mr. Oberlander was a main stay in West Central ohio for decades. Prayers out to his family. His daughter runs the game day promotions for the Columbus Clippers so baseball was always near and dear to that family
I hadn't heard that Ed had passed, but I knew he was fighting cancer. Was inducted into the officiating hall of fame last year, joining his father who I believe was inducted in the early 90's....

Prayers to the family.... much too young to go,
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