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  #61  
Old 05-23-18, 12:22 PM
CC Track Fan CC Track Fan is offline
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One thing to note there are only 20 schools with less than 40 boys, 37 under 50 (many don't have track teams) that have to complete against schools with up to 150.

While in D1 there are 22 schools over 800 while there are 81 school (400 and under) are half the size or less of the top 20 schools.

So in D1 there are greater number of schools that have the large disadvantage with having to compete against significantly bigger schools.
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  #62  
Old 05-23-18, 02:01 PM
yj_runfan yj_runfan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RunnerAdespota View Post
Right, ENA. I'm not saying we should do what NY is doing or anything, and what works for them might not necessarily work best for us etc. But I did think it was interesting and worth noting that all these states try to give good performances a shot.

Also, I didn't use any of the info from the link, I went to each of the 8 states' organization and looked at how they qualified. I stumbled on milesplit's link after the fact. But I do like how it lists all 50.

Sidenote, I was also struck by how many of these states punish kids who withdraw from events after they qualify. Such a normal thing here in Ohio. Like, if I do a distance triple in these other states, but drop one of them at the state meet, I would be disqualified from all my events. Sheesh.

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk
Is not finishing a race the same as dropping the event?
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  #63  
Old 05-23-18, 02:03 PM
yj_runfan yj_runfan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ENA2 View Post
Although I think we are straying form the original post, I like Mr. Slippery's second idea. I thnk he should write it up and make an official propoal to the OATCCC to set up a super division of the largest 100 schools (that offer track) and devide the other 3 divisions equitably.
I will sign it in support.
Have the 100 largest schools been dominating the D1 team titles?
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  #64  
Old 05-23-18, 02:12 PM
RunnerAdespota RunnerAdespota is offline
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Depends on the state. California has an "honest effort" rule, so in that case, I guess so.
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Is not finishing a race the same as dropping the event?
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  #65  
Old 05-23-18, 05:16 PM
Hammerdrill Hammerdrill is offline
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The one thing this new rule doesn't help, are the kids who get 5th in their District, yet are still one of the top 8 fastest in the state.
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  #66  
Old 05-23-18, 10:32 PM
cvctrackfan cvctrackfan is offline
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Mr Slippery your girl’s made the 4X800 Relay....
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  #67  
Old 05-23-18, 11:18 PM
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Mr. Slippery Mr. Slippery is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cvctrackfan View Post
Mr Slippery your girl’s made the 4X800 Relay....
Oh, the irony...

I'm glad the wildcard berths exist, but I hoped to never have to need it to make the state, let alone the very first year in the very first running event. Adding to the irony is the fact that I mentioned to the kids the very 1st day of practice that these at-large bids were being added this year.

All else being equal, would've much rather have made it the old-fashioned way. Girls left the stadium not knowing if they qualified or not (they were done for the night after the 400, and they're all underclassmen with lots of year-end homework). Things looked OK after seeing the Troy and Lancaster results, but Tiffin had no live results, and that region worried me the most. Those NWO teams always run fast 800s and 4x8s. It wasn't until right before the girls 4x4 that the Tiffin results were posted to baumspage, and we figured out we were in.

We went to great lengths to try and find those Tiffin results earlier. I had 1 of my alums text a college teammate whose younger sister was on 1 of the 4x8s that qualified out of Tiffin. The alum was on her way to Charlotte to watch NCAA DII Nationals, so she texted her parents at Tiffin who eventually texted back that no results were being posted at the meet. Strike one.

I had a college coach call his head coach to see if he could get in touch with any HS coaches at Tiffin who would know 6th place's time. I figured the college coach likely recruited the area at some point, so I thought he might know someone at one of the perennial powerhouse programs up there. Strike two.

I then had one of our boys' older brothers who does some freelance sports writing for the local paper call his editor and see if he could contact anyone who might be covering the meet at Tiffin. Strike three.

Last edited by Mr. Slippery; 05-23-18 at 11:37 PM..
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  #68  
Old 05-25-18, 10:27 PM
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Make that 2 at-large qualifications for Canton CC.
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  #69  
Old 05-25-18, 11:04 PM
cvctrackfan cvctrackfan is offline
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We had two also for the girls in the 800 and 200 meters
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  #70  
Old 05-25-18, 11:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cvctrackfan View Post
We had two also for the girls in the 800 and 200 meters
Very good!

I notice 1 major difference between your at-large qualifiers and ours: Yours were already qualified in other events (relays).

In the case of our qualifiers, the OHSAA stands to make additional money because ours would not be there otherwise. Our qualifiers are the poster children for the at-large berths. ENA2, where should they go to get their pictures taken for that poster, or can the photographer meet them at the Jesse Owens statue on Thurs. afternoon?
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  #71  
Old 05-26-18, 12:19 AM
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  #72  
Old 05-26-18, 09:06 AM
mathking mathking is online now
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We stood around for 20ish minutes after the boys 4x400 at Pickerington waiting to see if our boys got in. Which they did. The at large bids changed our meet strategy somewhat. I probably would have pulled Bons from the 800 (he had already won the 1600) if I didnít know we could qualify by at-large. We knew it would likely take sub 3:20 to get out.
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  #73  
Old 05-26-18, 10:19 AM
galesxc galesxc is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mathking View Post
We stood around for 20ish minutes after the boys 4x400 at Pickerington waiting to see if our boys got in. Which they did. The at large bids changed our meet strategy somewhat. I probably would have pulled Bons from the 800 (he had already won the 1600) if I didnít know we could qualify by at-large. We knew it would likely take sub 3:20 to get out.
Personally, I was glad I got to watch Bons run that 800M! Super impressive, especially on a hot day. The best closing effort, under the circumstances, I've seen since 2012.
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  #74  
Old 05-26-18, 12:38 PM
mathking mathking is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by galesxc View Post
Personally, I was glad I got to watch Bons run that 800M! Super impressive, especially on a hot day. The best closing effort, under the circumstances, I've seen since 2012.

Thanks coach. Lucas was in the stands watching that effort by Brannon in 2012.

The race was actually pretty much by plan. He didnít want to risk burning out for the 4x400. So we planned to be toward the back (not necessarily all the way, but thatís how it worked out). So the plan was to hold back, and if he felt good race the last 300.
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  #75  
Old 05-26-18, 02:29 PM
SOTT SOTT is offline
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Both the girls and the boys 4x400s from Medina made it on time qualifiers. We knew a central regional team had already secured one spot and that none from Austintown had run faster than us. That meant that it came down to the SW region. Thank you FinishTiming/Mike Chatfield for having an awesome platform and live results as finishers crossed the line. It was nervewracking but made for a pretty cool scene. We were all on the bus with the coaches watching their phones. The bus went crazy for the girls, and then the boys, when they knew they got in. It was a pretty cool thing.
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  #76  
Old 05-29-18, 10:15 PM
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Article from my local paper about the at-large qualifiers, including quotes from one of the main champions of the proposal:

http://www.cantonrep.com/sports/2018...rge-qualifiers
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  #77  
Old 05-30-18, 08:56 AM
Seppo Kaitainen Seppo Kaitainen is offline
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Relays really show how much advantage mega schools have over smaller D1 schools. I'm less worried about a team title in track than xc, but trying to compete with mega D1 schools at a small D1 school that offers lax, softball, baseball, and club soccer is tough.

I'm all for filling the 9th lane in the sprints at regionals and state. I worry about the 4x8, 800, and 1600 events with all those runners trying to occupy the same space. No other championship format that I know of puts 18 athletes in an 800 race.
All week with my athletes we've talked about how to avoid the fall that will probably happen at the cut ins. I'd love to move to a Thursday, Friday, Saturday format with 4 divisions and prelims for the 800 and 1600 based on time. Maybe 12 runners to finals run in alleys? Probably far too expensive, but a guy can dream.
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  #78  
Old 05-30-18, 11:27 AM
jktrack jktrack is offline
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Imagine the emotions when you finish 6th and then find out you miss out by .01 of a second in a relay. Last year no problem, this year it hurts.
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  #79  
Old 05-30-18, 01:39 PM
peebles peebles is offline
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Haley Rozeski from Salem received one of the at large bids in the girls Div II 800. She finished fifth in 2:19.58 at the Austintown Regional. She will also be running the 4x4 and 4x8.
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  #80  
Old 05-30-18, 08:34 PM
psycho_dad psycho_dad is offline
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Quick glance at D2, and nearly half the wild cards came from Austintown. Has anyone looked at the distribution?

How many of the wild cards are in the top 6 overall times? How many are in top 8?

Going forward, is someone tracking the final outcomes at the state meet?

Tracking as much info as possible would allow for tweaks down the road.

I do not like at all that field events were excluded. E art event should be weighted the same. Excluding some taints them all in my opinion.
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  #81  
Old 05-31-18, 08:33 AM
yj_runfan yj_runfan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by psycho_dad View Post
Quick glance at D2, and nearly half the wild cards came from Austintown. Has anyone looked at the distribution?

How many of the wild cards are in the top 6 overall times? How many are in top 8?

Going forward, is someone tracking the final outcomes at the state meet?

Tracking as much info as possible would allow for tweaks down the road.

I do not like at all that field events were excluded. E art event should be weighted the same. Excluding some taints them all in my opinion.
Agree 100%. I like this idea but the field events should have been worked in before it was started.
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  #82  
Old 05-31-18, 09:52 AM
CC Track Fan CC Track Fan is offline
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Would an option for the HJ and PV to break the tie between athletes at different regions be to use their districts results? So if two or more athletes were tied for the 2nd extra spot at state the person that went the highest or had the fewest misses at districts get the state invite.

I know this is not ideal but is there a better/more fair option?
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  #83  
Old 05-31-18, 10:33 AM
ENA2 ENA2 is offline
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That is one of the proposed tie breakers... there are about 7 or 8 steps to break ties for those tied "at large" marks for the verticals... With them, there is a greater chance that their would be a tie in running events or the thows (being all 6 attempts were exactly the same.) In ohter words, If they chose to adopt the tie breaker(s), there would not be any ties. Hopelfully, feild events would start with the at large next year.
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  #84  
Old 05-31-18, 12:18 PM
CC Track Fan CC Track Fan is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ENA2 View Post
That is one of the proposed tie breakers... there are about 7 or 8 steps to break ties for those tied "at large" marks for the verticals... With them, there is a greater chance that their would be a tie in running events or the thows (being all 6 attempts were exactly the same.) In ohter words, If they chose to adopt the tie breaker(s), there would not be any ties. Hopelfully, feild events would start with the at large next year.
Thanks for the response. Is there a tie-breaker in place right now for running events. If two runner in the 100 for the last at-large spot had same time what would they have done?
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  #85  
Old 05-31-18, 03:13 PM
peebles peebles is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CC Track Fan View Post
Thanks for the response. Is there a tie-breaker in place right now for running events. If two runner in the 100 for the last at-large spot had same time what would they have done?
At the Second Sole Elite Invite they went out to a thousandth of a second to break a tie in boys 100 prelim (8th-9th place). I've seen the same thing at other meets. I imagine they would do something like that.

Last edited by peebles; 05-31-18 at 03:27 PM..
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  #86  
Old 05-31-18, 04:25 PM
cvctrackfan cvctrackfan is offline
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I, think I met Mathking this afternoon at his track
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  #87  
Old 05-31-18, 04:43 PM
mathking mathking is online now
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Time qualifiers to State Tournament

Yes. After I got on the bus to Jesse Owens I wondered
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  #88  
Old 05-31-18, 04:54 PM
mathking mathking is online now
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We were pretty impressed with how many qualifiers you had.
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  #89  
Old 05-31-18, 08:13 PM
Altor Altor is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CC Track Fan View Post
Thanks for the response. Is there a tie-breaker in place right now for running events. If two runner in the 100 for the last at-large spot had same time what would they have done?
The OHSAA Track and Field manual detailed this. I believe they will look at the 1000th of a second, then if it's still a tie, they will add a 19th qualifier (and run 3 heats).
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  #90  
Old 05-31-18, 10:06 PM
cvctrackfan cvctrackfan is offline
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Thank you...and I was very impressed to meet Abby and Lucas....your record board is impressive ....
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