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  #601  
Old 05-19-18, 07:34 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bugsy8875 View Post
Thank you guys ^^^^^

Here is something from tonight that had me thinking.

I had a Summer League game tonight at a park where the backstops are pretty close which is common. At times a foul ball would come from the other field and we would call time and retrieve the ball.

Here is what I am wondering and never had this happen, but I know the day is coming.

- Umpiring a game and as a ball is put into play during our game, a foul ball from the other field lands in play at the same time. I am going to think we play the play through and when the action stops, call time and get the other ball out of play?
In these situations you need to address the potential of outside balls entering the field of play during ground rules. Give the coaches the option of killing the play and re-setting the action (a "do-over"), killing the play and having the umpires place runners or declare outs as they judge would have occurred absent the second ball entering the field, or ignoring the ball and letting play continue until your action ends and then declare the ball dead.

Some complexes and umpires choose to employ the first option. While frustrating at times, it's the safest option. It's a product of the complex set up and resetting the action takes all judgement and argument out of the equation. (it also can turn a base clearing, stand-up triple into a "do-over")

I personally would choose the second option. It allows for a common sense application of what did and what was going to happen. We employ this situation with fan interference, so why not treat the second ball the same? (again, it needs to be discussed in ground rules and emphasized that there will be no debate on the placement of runners or declaration of outs)

The third option is one that I would stay away from. We don't need to be adding confusion to the sport or jeopardizing the safety of the kids.

Whatever you choose, make sure that it's covered before the game and everyone is understanding of what will happen should this occur.
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  #602  
Old 05-21-18, 10:10 AM
cshs81 cshs81 is offline
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Originally Posted by Bugsy8875 View Post
Had this tonight.

On the plate, pitcher comes set and started to pick his foot up, the batter puts his back had up for time, I did not grant it. After the pitch, I said something to him that it was a little late and that's why I didn't grant it. The AB ended and between innings the player approached me very respectfully and asked that should he of said "time"? I told him it would be better if you asked for time and keep both hands on the bat. He then replied to me that an umpire told him in another game to never say "Time"....

Thoughts?
What did the batter do when he realize you didn't grant the request? It seems to be one of the requirements for an automatic strike per 6-2-4 d1.
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  #603  
Old 05-21-18, 10:33 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Originally Posted by cshs81 View Post
What did the batter do when he realize you didn't grant the request? It seems to be one of the requirements for an automatic strike per 6-2-4 d1.
Only if the pitcher stops or hesitates in his delivery. The original post mentions neither.
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  #604  
Old 05-21-18, 10:47 AM
cshs81 cshs81 is offline
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Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
Only if the pitcher stops or hesitates in his delivery. The original post mentions neither.
1. If the pitcher, with a runner on base, stops or hesitates in his delivery because the batter steps out of the box (a) with one foot or (b) with both feet or (c) holds up his hand to request “Time,” it shall not be a balk. In (a) and (c), there is no penalty on either the batter or the pitcher. The umpire shall call “Time” and begin play anew. In (b), a strike shall be called on the batter for violation of
7-3-1. In (a), (b) and (c), if the pitcher legally delivers the ball, it shall be called a strike and the ball remains live. Thus, Two strikes are called on the batter in (b).

If F1 pitches it's a strike if batter holds his hand up to request time.
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  #605  
Old 05-21-18, 10:54 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Originally Posted by cshs81 View Post
1. If the pitcher, with a runner on base, stops or hesitates in his delivery because the batter steps out of the box (a) with one foot or (b) with both feet or (c) holds up his hand to request “Time,” it shall not be a balk. In (a) and (c), there is no penalty on either the batter or the pitcher. The umpire shall call “Time” and begin play anew. In (b), a strike shall be called on the batter for violation of
7-3-1. In (a), (b) and (c), if the pitcher legally delivers the ball, it shall be called a strike and the ball remains live. Thus, Two strikes are called on the batter in (b).

If F1 pitches it's a strike if batter holds his hand up to request time.
You are ignoring the first sentence of the rule.

I'm all for guys posting responses to questions......... As long as they are correct.

The matter is closed.
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  #606  
Old 05-21-18, 01:30 PM
cshs81 cshs81 is offline
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Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
You are ignoring the first sentence of the rule.

I'm all for guys posting responses to questions......... As long as they are correct.

The matter is closed.
First time posting in here so I'm not sure what "this matter is closed" means as far as responses so I'll take a chance that I'm still allowed to respond.

The first section of the rule deals with the pitcher stopping/hesitating. it lists 3 scenarios for the batter a)stepping out with one foot b)with two feet or c)holding his hand up for time. We are to ignore the balk and it's nothing.

However, the 2nd part lists the same 3 scenarios by the batter but says the pitcher not only didn't hesitate or stop his delivery but instead delivered the pitch. In all 3 it's a strike.

That's how I read the rule. You read it differently?
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  #607  
Old 05-21-18, 02:06 PM
cshs81 cshs81 is offline
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Originally Posted by cshs81 View Post
First time posting in here so I'm not sure what "this matter is closed" means as far as responses so I'll take a chance that I'm still allowed to respond.

The first section of the rule deals with the pitcher stopping/hesitating. it lists 3 scenarios for the batter a)stepping out with one foot b)with two feet or c)holding his hand up for time. We are to ignore the balk and it's nothing.

However, the 2nd part lists the same 3 scenarios by the batter but says the pitcher not only didn't hesitate or stop his delivery but instead delivered the pitch. In all 3 it's a strike.

That's how I read the rule. You read it differently?

I will concede it is definitely an odd rule as it's worded.

Last edited by AllSports12; 05-21-18 at 08:21 PM.
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  #608  
Old 05-21-18, 06:32 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Originally Posted by cshs81 View Post

The first section of the rule deals with the pitcher stopping/hesitating. it lists 3 scenarios for the batter a)stepping out with one foot b)with two feet or c)holding his hand up for time. We are to ignore the balk and it's nothing.

However, the 2nd part lists the same 3 scenarios by the batter but says the pitcher not only didn't hesitate or stop his delivery but instead delivered the pitch. In all 3 it's a strike.

That's how I read the rule. You read it differently?
Reading the rule as you do prohibits the batter from ever holding his hand up...... which effectively prohibits him from requesting time....

It also creates this situation..... Count 0-1, 2 outs, bases loaded.....Hand goes up, pitch is delivered without hesitation or stopping. Batter swings at the pitch and grounds it into center field scoring two runs... Or, he grounds into a double play..... by your interpretation this is a strike and the play re-sets. There simply is no provision to support this whatsoever. The purpose of the rule is to prevent the batter from causing the pitcher to violate his pitching regulations. ('continuous motion")

If you want to discuss this offline, I'll engage you there when I'm available. I'm not however, going to debate this on here.

Last edited by AllSports12; 05-22-18 at 06:19 AM.
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  #609  
Old 05-21-18, 06:40 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Originally Posted by Bugsy8875 View Post
Mechanic question #2.

When working the plate, it is suggested the call "Ball" if it's a ball. What are some guidelines for this? Sometimes there are obvious pitches that everyone at the game knows is a ball. Should it just be the ones that are close?
Funny this gets asked....
This weekend a scenario happened where an Ump told the coach that he does not have to say or make the call if it is a BALL.

Scenario was this:
2 strikes. Pitcher throws one in the dirt. Batter tries to check his swing. He knows he went. Catcher tags the batter/runner. Batter heads to the dugout assuming he is out. PLate umpire waits until he enters the dugout and calls "OUT"

Ump says it was a ball and batter was not out until he entered the dugout. He did not call the batter out when he was tagged. Batter assumed it (granted...he did go...and if it was checked by the base ump he woulda said so likely as it was apparent)

Coach questions why he didn't call BALL. Ump says he does not have to make a verbal call on a BALL and then confines the coach to the dugout for "not knowing the rules" that he doesn't have to call a ball. I was right there to hear it all.






I did talk to this umpire after the game. I went up to him 20 mins or so afterwards and asked if I could give him some advice, he just looked at me. I didn't mention any calls, I just told him to ignore fans and don't partake in banter/questioning of calls. From inning one he would argue, state his point to fans bhind the backstop. It started by a fan mentioning something to someone next to him, fairly loud and not really for the umpire and he chimed in to engage him. I just told him to ignore and don't talk to the fans about calls...it just opens up a can of worms. He agreed.
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  #610  
Old 05-22-18, 05:35 AM
Bugsy8875 Bugsy8875 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Funny this gets asked....
This weekend a scenario happened where an Ump told the coach that he does not have to say or make the call if it is a BALL.

Scenario was this:
2 strikes. Pitcher throws one in the dirt. Batter tries to check his swing. He knows he went. Catcher tags the batter/runner. Batter heads to the dugout assuming he is out. PLate umpire waits until he enters the dugout and calls "OUT"

Ump says it was a ball and batter was not out until he entered the dugout. He did not call the batter out when he was tagged. Batter assumed it (granted...he did go...and if it was checked by the base ump he woulda said so likely as it was apparent)

Coach questions why he didn't call BALL. Ump says he does not have to make a verbal call on a BALL and then confines the coach to the dugout for "not knowing the rules" that he doesn't have to call a ball. I was right there to hear it all.






I did talk to this umpire after the game. I went up to him 20 mins or so afterwards and asked if I could give him some advice, he just looked at me. I didn't mention any calls, I just told him to ignore fans and don't partake in banter/questioning of calls. From inning one he would argue, state his point to fans bhind the backstop. It started by a fan mentioning something to someone next to him, fairly loud and not really for the umpire and he chimed in to engage him. I just told him to ignore and don't talk to the fans about calls...it just opens up a can of worms. He agreed.
Good story and it validates whatI was told earlier that it should be called. Was this a HS game?

I was also taught to not have rabbit ears and get offended. Now there is a line that shouldn't be crossed, but I understand the fan bases passion for wanting their team to do well. You are of course going to hear things. I had a heated varsity contest this year and the place was packed behind me. Every close pitch, 50% agreed and 50% didn't. Just have to focus and be a s consistent as possible.

One thing I do try to do so fans hear me and I am sincere with the kids when I do this. At the beginning when I meet the catcher, I will ask about school and how he is doing (I am a teacher myself). I also am very clear and audible when I say thank you as a foul ball is given to me. If a batter is hit, i will yell down to the first base coach to check on the kid to make sure he is ok... things like that. I have had some parents/coaches tell me later that appreciate things like that. I don't get buddy buddy, just want them to know I am enjoying being part of the game to.

I do smile and laugh a little behind my masks as fans say some funny things. Of of my favorites was someone yelled out that the plate must be round because he felt I wasn't calling the corners.
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  #611  
Old 05-22-18, 09:57 AM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bugsy8875 View Post
Good story and it validates whatI was told earlier that it should be called. Was this a HS game?

I was also taught to not have rabbit ears and get offended. Now there is a line that shouldn't be crossed, but I understand the fan bases passion for wanting their team to do well. You are of course going to hear things. I had a heated varsity contest this year and the place was packed behind me. Every close pitch, 50% agreed and 50% didn't. Just have to focus and be a s consistent as possible.

One thing I do try to do so fans hear me and I am sincere with the kids when I do this. At the beginning when I meet the catcher, I will ask about school and how he is doing (I am a teacher myself). I also am very clear and audible when I say thank you as a foul ball is given to me. If a batter is hit, i will yell down to the first base coach to check on the kid to make sure he is ok... things like that. I have had some parents/coaches tell me later that appreciate things like that. I don't get buddy buddy, just want them to know I am enjoying being part of the game to.

I do smile and laugh a little behind my masks as fans say some funny things. Of of my favorites was someone yelled out that the plate must be round because he felt I wasn't calling the corners.

Good ole rabbit ears. Don't hear many say that anymore as when I brought it up this weekend I was looked at like I had 3 eyes.

No, this was a 12 yr old game. Yeah..and the first batter of the game to boot so it wasn't like anyone really was in tune with how the umpire was calling the game.

Just seemed like bush league for that umpire. He could have at least vocaled 2-2 after the pitch but no....he just let the kid walk to the dugout.

Now....he did swing. How this ump missed it I don't know.

In a later game that next day I saw him make a horrible call on another field in the last inning. Coaches went wild........he ended up tossing one...after the game was over.

But yeah....don't get rabbit ears. I see that so often. As an ump you don't have to answer to the fans. Now, if they get personal then yeah but the original comments by the fans weren't even meant to be AT the umpire, just to another fans.
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  #612  
Old 05-22-18, 10:56 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Gents....

Let's try to keep the conversation rules and mechanics based on here.

Beating up on umpires and fans isn't what I want to do here.
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  #613  
Old 06-04-18, 09:50 AM
Field-judge Field-judge is offline
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Situation: runner on second attempts to steal third base, third basemen straddles the base in preparation to field the throw from catcher. As the base runner slides into third, the throw from catcher is a little off causing the fielder to dive toward second base to stop the ball. the base runner and fielder collide and in the collision the fielder stops the ball and tags the runner on shoulder before the runner hits the bag. Is the runner safe because the third basemen didn't allow a clear base path?
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  #614  
Old 06-04-18, 10:36 AM
Buck_98 Buck_98 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Field-judge View Post
Situation: runner on second attempts to steal third base, third basemen straddles the base in preparation to field the throw from catcher. As the base runner slides into third, the throw from catcher is a little off causing the fielder to dive toward second base to stop the ball. the base runner and fielder collide and in the collision the fielder stops the ball and tags the runner on shoulder before the runner hits the bag. Is the runner safe because the third basemen didn't allow a clear base path?
He was "standing" in the basepath without the ball but according to you it didn't impede the runner because he had to field the ball which caused the runner to come up short and get tagged out. This is a had to be there call but it sounds like the runner is out.
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  #615  
Old 06-04-18, 11:16 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Originally Posted by Field-judge View Post
Situation: runner on second attempts to steal third base, third basemen straddles the base in preparation to field the throw from catcher. As the base runner slides into third, the throw from catcher is a little off causing the fielder to dive toward second base to stop the ball. the base runner and fielder collide and in the collision the fielder stops the ball and tags the runner on shoulder before the runner hits the bag. Is the runner safe because the third basemen didn't allow a clear base path?
Under NFHS Rules, the defensive player not in possession of the baseball must allow the runner to have access to the base. This access is not guaranteed to be the most favorable for the runner, but access must be provided......

As Buck_98 indicated, it sounds like a HTBT play. (had to be there) Some may view it as an out, and some may view it as obstruction..... It's a play where we earn our game fee.
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  #616  
Old 06-04-18, 12:02 PM
Field-judge Field-judge is offline
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Thanks for response, ump called runner safe, saying he can't call him out because the fielder technically blocked base path without the ball. We didn't know if the fielder had any "rights" for going for the ball as he had no where else to go to avoid the runner and make a play. definitely a HTBT
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  #617  
Old 06-04-18, 02:15 PM
thePITman thePITman is offline
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Saw this in the Division I state championship game over the weekend. Pitcher was taking "quick pitching" to the next level. I understand, once a batter is set and asks for time, the umpire is not required to give it to him. But what IS the batter entitled to when it comes to getting into the box and getting set? It got to the point where one team's batters hadn't even had their 2nd foot on the ground and couldn't even get their 2nd hand on their bat before the pitcher was throwing the ball. It got so bad, and umpire kept letting it happen, that the team had to stop taking signs from coaches just so they could get in the batters box and get both hands on the bat before the pitch was thrown.

Don't get me wrong: I coach 14U baseball and talk to my pitchers all the time about setting tempo (fast or slow, whatever it be) and making the batter/baserunners uncomfortable, but this was borderline ridiculous (and what I hope would be illegal).
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  #618  
Old 06-04-18, 09:58 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Originally Posted by thePITman View Post
Saw this in the Division I state championship game over the weekend. Pitcher was taking "quick pitching" to the next level. I understand, once a batter is set and asks for time, the umpire is not required to give it to him. But what IS the batter entitled to when it comes to getting into the box and getting set? It got to the point where one team's batters hadn't even had their 2nd foot on the ground and couldn't even get their 2nd hand on their bat before the pitcher was throwing the ball. It got so bad, and umpire kept letting it happen, that the team had to stop taking signs from coaches just so they could get in the batters box and get both hands on the bat before the pitch was thrown.

Don't get me wrong: I coach 14U baseball and talk to my pitchers all the time about setting tempo (fast or slow, whatever it be) and making the batter/baserunners uncomfortable, but this was borderline ridiculous (and what I hope would be illegal).
The batter is afforded a reasonable amount of time to get ready..... Now what, you may, ask is reasonable?

That's up to the Plate Umpire. He/She controls the flow when that comes into question.
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  #619  
Old 06-05-18, 12:25 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Field-judge View Post
Situation: runner on second attempts to steal third base, third basemen straddles the base in preparation to field the throw from catcher. As the base runner slides into third, the throw from catcher is a little off causing the fielder to dive toward second base to stop the ball. the base runner and fielder collide and in the collision the fielder stops the ball and tags the runner on shoulder before the runner hits the bag. Is the runner safe because the third basemen didn't allow a clear base path?
That is why you teach the fielder to NOT straddle the bag to be able to get an errant throw cleanly.


ALLSPORTS<
What is a base coach's responsibility on a pop up in foul territory when it comes to avoiding the fielder from making the catch?

Does he HAVE to move even if he is in the coaches box? Can he just stand his ground in the box and not move, sort of like right handed hitter on a steal of third in staying where he is in the batters box?

I know what the right thing to do is, but I want to know the rule.
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  #620  
Old 06-05-18, 03:25 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
That is why you teach the fielder to NOT straddle the bag to be able to get an errant throw cleanly.


ALLSPORTS<
What is a base coach's responsibility on a pop up in foul territory when it comes to avoiding the fielder from making the catch?

Does he HAVE to move even if he is in the coaches box? Can he just stand his ground in the box and not move, sort of like right handed hitter on a steal of third in staying where he is in the batters box?

I know what the right thing to do is, but I want to know the rule.
The bolded part of Rule 3-2-3 covers this......

"No offensive team personnel, other than the base coach, shall be near a base for which a runner is trying so that a fielder may be confused; nor be on or near the baseline in such a way as to draw a throw; nor shall the base coach or members of the team at bat fail to vacate any area needed by a fielder in his attempt to put out a batter or runner."

In short, the base coaches, on-deck hitters, bullpen personnel, etc... must vacate any area needed by the fielder while he/she is attempting to put out a batter or runner.

As in all interference situations...... it's up to the umpire to judge whether or not the fielder was hindered by the action or inaction of his opponent.
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  #621  
Old 06-05-18, 03:42 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
The bolded part of Rule 3-2-3 covers this......

"No offensive team personnel, other than the base coach, shall be near a base for which a runner is trying so that a fielder may be confused; nor be on or near the baseline in such a way as to draw a throw; nor shall the base coach or members of the team at bat fail to vacate any area needed by a fielder in his attempt to put out a batter or runner."

In short, the base coaches, on-deck hitters, bullpen personnel, etc... must vacate any area needed by the fielder while he/she is attempting to put out a batter or runner.

As in all interference situations...... it's up to the umpire to judge whether or not the fielder was hindered by the action or inaction of his opponent.
Thanks.
One instance the fielder ran into the base coach who didn't move, and a second time the fielder had to move around him.

Go figure....it happened a few other teams in the game with other base coaches and they all got out of the way. I figured that was the case, and is this a general rule for every level?

Reason I ask is many levels have banned the fake to third on a first and third situation. NFHS it is still legal, correct?

I know people really like to rag on umpires but I want to give a shoutout to I believe the main ump at the Upper Arlington Tournament for youth this past weekend. He was absolutely fantastic in all aspects of controlling the games, explanations and just assisting the kids. He even stopped for a few minutes to allow a kid to collect himself after an error.

I have seen some very good, and a few bad ones, but mostly good including one at Berliner Park a few weeks ago. A team was WAY Overmatched and never should have been playing there and a kid was having a terrible time on the mound with balks and knowing what to do and was getting NO HELP from his coaches. He called time, went to the mound and actually gave the pitcher a lesson on balks, pickoffs and such. I did track that umpire down after the game and told him that he was a class act in doing that.

So my question....first and third...NFHS can still fake to third correct and just to justify my own thoughts when talking to someone this past weekend....an pitcher CAN throw to an unoccupied base to force back a runner on a steal, correct?
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  #622  
Old 06-05-18, 04:39 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
So my question....first and third...NFHS can still fake to third correct and just to justify my own thoughts when talking to someone this past weekend....an pitcher CAN throw to an unoccupied base to force back a runner on a steal, correct?
Yes and Yes to your questions...... and to clarify for the second question...

He can throw to an unoccupied base for the purpose of making a play on a runner. If the runner feints a steal, that throw to the unoccupied base he feinted towards is legal.

And thank you for stepping forward to thank the umpire. While we don't do it for the accolades, we certainly appreciate a genuine "thanks". Especially at the youth levels.
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  #623  
Old 06-05-18, 06:43 PM
Bugsy8875 Bugsy8875 is offline
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[QUOTE=..And thank you for stepping forward to thank the umpire. While we don't do it for the accolades, we certainly appreciate a genuine "thanks". Especially at the youth levels.[/QUOTE]

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  #624  
Old 06-11-18, 09:14 PM
Bugsy8875 Bugsy8875 is offline
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Mechanic Question.

Had this tonight. I think I learned a lesson, but would like some input.

I had the bases and there was a runner on first. The pitcher was awesome and throwing in the low 90's. Here is the scenario:

Pitcher comes set, then as he goes home, I can hear R1 taking off for second. The pitch is thrown (Very fast) and the catcher is coming up out of his stance as he receives the ball to throw down to second. I am seeing this and when he throws,, I follow the ball and the runner is safe. No argument from anyone.

Here is what happened. As things settled down, the plate umpire gives the count of 1-1. The defensive coach yells out, "He swung" and it should be 0-2. My partner calls time, walks towards me and asked me if I saw the swing because as the catcher was coming up, he said he was blocked. I didn't see it, because I was following the catcher and his throw and didn't keep eyes on the plate area for a split second. after the pitch crossed the plate.

As the base umpire, should I of been focused on the plate area a little longer knowing I will be able to catch up to the throw to second?
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  #625  
Old 06-12-18, 11:49 AM
Buck_98 Buck_98 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bugsy8875 View Post
Mechanic Question.

Had this tonight. I think I learned a lesson, but would like some input.

I had the bases and there was a runner on first. The pitcher was awesome and throwing in the low 90's. Here is the scenario:

Pitcher comes set, then as he goes home, I can hear R1 taking off for second. The pitch is thrown (Very fast) and the catcher is coming up out of his stance as he receives the ball to throw down to second. I am seeing this and when he throws,, I follow the ball and the runner is safe. No argument from anyone.

Here is what happened. As things settled down, the plate umpire gives the count of 1-1. The defensive coach yells out, "He swung" and it should be 0-2. My partner calls time, walks towards me and asked me if I saw the swing because as the catcher was coming up, he said he was blocked. I didn't see it, because I was following the catcher and his throw and didn't keep eyes on the plate area for a split second. after the pitch crossed the plate.

As the base umpire, should I of been focused on the plate area a little longer knowing I will be able to catch up to the throw to second?
I have all the respect in the world for good umpires. I wouldn't want your job for anything. As a coach I often have to ask what the count was because I've sent a runner and missed the swing due to being focused on the catcher's throw. I would think the plate umpire could still see the follow though of the batter's swing and make a call letting you focus on the throw and tag.
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  #626  
Old 06-12-18, 03:08 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bugsy8875 View Post
Mechanic Question.....


As the base umpire, should I of been focused on the plate area a little longer knowing I will be able to catch up to the throw to second?
Yes

While I agree with Buck_98 that the PU should have been able to see the aftermath of the play, sometimes catchers do crazy things that cause us not to. Then again, you could have a normal situation where the batter tries to stop his attempt at the ball and your partner comes to your for help on that attempt...... That's where you come in as the BU.

You are already looking at the plate, so stay with the batter until the throw is released. The average "pop time" to second base for an average catcher is about 2.2 seconds. That leaves you plenty of time to see the batter's actions with regards to the pitch and be able to pick the ball up out of the cacther's hands and follow it to the bag.

Don't get ahead of yourself on something like this as once you do, you lose the priority of your calls..... On this play it is "ball / strike" followed by "safe /out"... not the other way around.

Experience will help you master this.

Last edited by AllSports12; 06-13-18 at 06:06 AM.
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  #627  
Old 06-15-18, 10:47 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Question. I have always heard of the 1 from the mound, 2 from the field in terms of balls going out of play.

SCENARIO:

WP/PB by the pitcher. The ball trickles out of play by the dugout gate which, ironically, does not function to be closed. RUNNER ON SECOND AT THE TIME OF PITCH. Where does that runner end up?

ALso, does that scenario change if that runner was stealing on the play?

THank you.
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  #628  
Old 06-16-18, 07:38 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Question. I have always heard of the 1 from the mound, 2 from the field in terms of balls going out of play.

SCENARIO:

WP/PB by the pitcher. The ball trickles out of play by the dugout gate which, ironically, does not function to be closed. RUNNER ON SECOND AT THE TIME OF PITCH. Where does that runner end up?

ALso, does that scenario change if that runner was stealing on the play?

THank you.
This is a pitch that becomes dead because it went out of play.

Therefore, Rule 8-3-3 (d) applies to this situation.

"Each runner is awarded..."

"d) one base if a pitch or any throw by the pitcher from his pitching position
on his plate goes into a stand or bench or over or through or lodges in a fence or backstop"........


The award is determined from the base the runner legally occupied at the time of the pitch. The time of the pitch is determined when the pitcher has committed himself to delivering the pitch to the batter. The pitch ends when the pitched ball is secured by the catcher, comes to rest, goes out of play, becomes dead, or the batter hits the ball 9other than a foul tip)

The runner's attempt to steal while this play occurs has no bearing on the base award, as the award is determined from the time pf the pitch.

Hope that helps.
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  #629  
Old 06-16-18, 09:52 AM
Bugsy8875 Bugsy8875 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thavoice View Post
Question. I have always heard of the 1 from the mound, 2 from the field in terms of balls going out of play.

SCENARIO:

WP/PB by the pitcher. The ball trickles out of play by the dugout gate which, ironically, does not function to be closed. RUNNER ON SECOND AT THE TIME OF PITCH. Where does that runner end up?

ALso, does that scenario change if that runner was stealing on the play?

THank you.
Allsports stated the rule.

The "one from the mound, two from the field" can be misleading as I also use to hear that one as a player and from others. If the pitcher disengages the rubber by stepping back and trying to pick off a runner at 1B and the ball goes out, that runner is getting 3B because the pitcher now becomes an infielder by stepping back. Sometimes this will need to be explained to some coaches.

There is a whole chart of time of pitch and time of throw on awards.

Here is a scenario I had in a game: Runners on 1B and 2B. As the pitch was being thrown, both runner take off. The ball is hit to F5 and he sprints to 3B to get the force out of the runner. after he gets him out, he throws to 1B trying to get the batter-runner. The ball sails out of play.

As the plate umpire, I am watching the action and as the throw to first is being made, the runner from 1B was at 2B, so when the ball when out of play, that runner was awarded home. So, for the casual fan, they see this all happen and might be confused how a kid got from 1B and scored on a throw out of play, but where they were (Base legally occupied) at the time of the throw is important.
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  #630  
Old 06-16-18, 07:10 PM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bugsy8875 View Post
Allsports stated the rule.

The "one from the mound, two from the field" can be misleading as I also use to hear that one as a player and from others. If the pitcher disengages the rubber by stepping back and trying to pick off a runner at 1B and the ball goes out, that runner is getting 3B because the pitcher now becomes an infielder by stepping back. Sometimes this will need to be explained to some coaches.

There is a whole chart of time of pitch and time of throw on awards.

Here is a scenario I had in a game: Runners on 1B and 2B. As the pitch was being thrown, both runner take off. The ball is hit to F5 and he sprints to 3B to get the force out of the runner. after he gets him out, he throws to 1B trying to get the batter-runner. The ball sails out of play.

As the plate umpire, I am watching the action and as the throw to first is being made, the runner from 1B was at 2B, so when the ball when out of play, that runner was awarded home. So, for the casual fan, they see this all happen and might be confused how a kid got from 1B and scored on a throw out of play, but where they were (Base legally occupied) at the time of the throw is important.
Yep, that is correct and allsports...that is what I had thought. The runner from second was awarded home and I was a bit surprised about it as no one said anything.

At times i get parents think a player should get 3rd on a normal play to first base that goes out of play as you get "2 bases" but the two bases are...first and second.


Thinking about taking a run at this umpiring thing next year.
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