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  #1  
Old 02-08-19, 07:42 PM
LCL LCL is offline
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Licking County League...any updates?

Hi, first post been reading awhile. After Zanesville's recent admission into the LCL one has to believe that another team will soon join to even out the conferences. To that end, I would not expect the likes of New Albany to join as the league does not offer enough diversity of sports, but I do believe these are some contenders:

Strong:
Newark - OCC competition and natural rival with ZHS
Mt. Vernon - southern most school in their new conference
Big Walnut - Geography, could strengthen small school division

Mild to Moderate:
Liberty Union - juxtsposition in the MSL
Bexley - MSL's future
Fisher Catholic -MSL's future

Little to No Chance:
Canal Winchester - Geographically good fit, relatively new to OCC
Logan - TOO FAR
Granville Christian - no football
Licking County Christian Academy - no football

Just some thoughts on potential candidates.
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  #2  
Old 02-08-19, 07:56 PM
LCL LCL is offline
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Idea LCL Conference Alignment:

"BIG SCHOOL"
ZANESVILLE
NEWARK
MOUNT VERNON
WATKINS MEMORIAL
LICKING HEIGHTS
GRANVILLE
LICKING VALLEY

"SMALL SCHOOL"
BIG WALNUT
JOHNSTOWN
NEWARK CATHOLIC
NORTHRIDGE
HEATH
LAKEWOOD
UTICA
GCA* not OHSSA certified
LCCA* not OHSSA certified

-1 crossover game (football)
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  #3  
Old 02-08-19, 08:51 PM
teach1coach2 teach1coach2 is offline
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Unless a future OCC realignment pisses off some of those schools near (or in Licking County), I don't see anyone wanting in the LCL except Logan.

Of course, I could always be wrong
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Old 02-08-19, 10:59 PM
LCL LCL is offline
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Doing a little a research over the past 4 years...
The LCL is 9-4 against the OCC.

Of the three teams listed as idea candidates for LCL membership (Newark, Big Walnut, and Mount Vernon [former OCC member], none has a winning record in OCC play.
Over the previous 4 years...
Newark is 8-32 (4-25 vs OCC)
Big Walnut is 10-30 (9-25 vs OCC)
Mt. Vernon is 14-26 (4-8 vs OCC)

I think it is possible to persuade some teams because of their recent struggles. I still say Newark would be an idea candidate, despite basketball's prominence.
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  #5  
Old 02-08-19, 11:09 PM
Kent Brockman Kent Brockman is offline
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Fisher Catholic may be a reach of a expansion candidate, but I like it. I am a mid 1990s graduate of Fisher and the thought of playing Heath and Newark Catholic again excites me. I remember when FC played against Granville and Scott McMullen. As a very small Catholic school we always took pride as a community and a student body in the games against bigger dogs that we played and won. There is a lot of pride, esteem and tradition to be had in Fisher Catholic, the smaller and admittedly less successful version of Newark Catholic in Lancaster.

I think Fisher could compete well with Utica, Northridge, NC, Lakewood, and Heath. Johnstown would be very tough but hell what’s sports without a challenge?
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  #6  
Old 02-09-19, 08:59 PM
JHSfan JHSfan is offline
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As a Johnstown graduate and fan I have followed the LCL expansion talk closely. At this point I think it is very unrealistic to find 5 schools to get to two eight team divisions. They need to find one more school to make two six team divisions. In my opinion, they should make a strong pitch to land Mount Vernon for the large division or Liberty Union for the small division. For sports other than football, you would have 10 league games, could play each of the other six teams as non conference games, and still would have room to schedule other non conference games. For football, everyone would be paired up for league games within their divisions for weeks 6 - 10. The MVL will be going to two six team divisions beginning in 2020, so there would be opportunities for cross over games between the leagues in weeks 4 and 5. The two leagues have played an all-star football game for nearly 40 years. Struggling teams like Northridge, Utica, and Lakewood vs West M, River View, and Crooksville could produce some competitive games. Northridge and River View have played the last two seasons. Just my two cents worth.
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  #7  
Old 02-09-19, 09:41 PM
The Dock The Dock is offline
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FC and the LCL just has a lot of pro’s and cons. I think FC would be foolish to not at the very least consider it, but such a move would be a big roll of the dice. They do need to do something about their league situation, though.

LU, like others have said, is the better option of the two. Only obstacle is LU community would likely prefer to stay in the MSL because of tradition and rivalries.

I still think what will happen with FC is, five years from now, they’ll find themselves in a reconfiguration of the MSL that has them with Grandview, Cols. Academy, Worthington Christian and Wellington. That may be as simple as moving to the MSL-Ohio, which could be a possibility since the Buckeye Valley/MSL situation is going to be very problematic and supposedly already is.
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  #8  
Old 02-09-19, 11:20 PM
LCL LCL is offline
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I can remember the old Cardinal when there was West Jefferson to Berne Union trips. The Cardinal was a bit of a jumbled mess then with 'Port, Harvest, Grandview, etc...It would be great to see a Fairfield County school in the LCL. FC may not be the perennial playoff team it used to be, but I could see NC and FC games being big at the gate.
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  #9  
Old 02-10-19, 04:42 PM
gils gils is offline
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If they would add Big Walnut to the league it will be in the Buckeye division. Their numbers are similar to Watkins and Heights.This year they have 413 boys. Watkins has 469, Heights has 451, Granville has 331, Zanesville has 349, Valley has 266, and Lakewood has 250. Lakewood will go to the Cardinal when Zanesville joins in the league 2020-21 school year. Granville Christian Academy is a member of OSHAA and they participate in state tournaments. There will no crossover games in football when expansion is finished. FWIW I remember the Advocate article stating that there will be announcement about expansion some time in June after school is out.

Last edited by gils; 02-10-19 at 06:54 PM.
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  #10  
Old 02-11-19, 01:21 AM
teach1coach2 teach1coach2 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHSfan View Post
As a Johnstown graduate and fan I have followed the LCL expansion talk closely. At this point I think it is very unrealistic to find 5 schools to get to two eight team divisions. They need to find one more school to make two six team divisions. In my opinion, they should make a strong pitch to land Mount Vernon for the large division or Liberty Union for the small division. For sports other than football, you would have 10 league games, could play each of the other six teams as non conference games, and still would have room to schedule other non conference games. For football, everyone would be paired up for league games within their divisions for weeks 6 - 10. The MVL will be going to two six team divisions beginning in 2020, so there would be opportunities for cross over games between the leagues in weeks 4 and 5. The two leagues have played an all-star football game for nearly 40 years. Struggling teams like Northridge, Utica, and Lakewood vs West M, River View, and Crooksville could produce some competitive games. Northridge and River View have played the last two seasons. Just my two cents worth.
The MVL has two mandatory cross division games (many neighboring school rivalries) so the MVL teams only have non-MVL games weeks 1-3 (and some of the bigger small schools and smaller big schools not scheduled to play weeks 4-10 are playing weeks 1-3.
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  #11  
Old 02-11-19, 09:03 AM
JU-ICE JU-ICE is offline
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Enrollment #'s per OHSAA of current LCL teams (Although not starting till 20/21, i have included Zanesville).

TEAM #
Watkins 465
L. Heights 449
Zanesville 341
Granville 331
L. Valley 257
Lakewood 249
Utica 204
Heath 196
Johnstown 194
Northridge 173
N. Catholic 113
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  #12  
Old 02-11-19, 10:12 AM
RollingTrain RollingTrain is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JU-ICE View Post
Enrollment #'s per OHSAA of current LCL teams (Although not starting till 20/21, i have included Zanesville).

TEAM #
Watkins 465
L. Heights 449
Zanesville 341
Granville 331
L. Valley 257
Lakewood 249
Utica 204
Heath 196
Johnstown 194
Northridge 173
N. Catholic 113
All of which show the complete dismal state of Watkins football program. Biggest fish in the pond and they've gone 6-4, 2-8, 4-6, 4-6 the last two years. Some city league wins, Canadian win, Lakewood, etc.....pretty poor
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  #13  
Old 02-11-19, 11:33 AM
JU-ICE JU-ICE is offline
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Enrollment for other schools mentioned or who are in the surrounding area that might be approached:
Lancaster 729
Newark 659
Mt. Vernon 507
Logan 500
Big Walnut 404
Liberty Union 184
East Knox 128
Danville 75
Millersport 74
F. Catholic 59
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  #14  
Old 02-12-19, 10:25 AM
The Dock The Dock is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JU-ICE View Post
Enrollment for other schools mentioned or who are in the surrounding area that might be approached:
Lancaster 729
Newark 659
Mt. Vernon 507
Logan 500
Big Walnut 404
Liberty Union 184
East Knox 128
Danville 75
Millersport 74
F. Catholic 59
Id think Centerburg would make the most sense of any Knox County school.
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  #15  
Old 02-12-19, 02:41 PM
FootballDNA FootballDNA is offline
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I'm hearing some rumblings about Newark, Watkins, Heights and Zanesville trying to get 2-4 more big schools like New Albany, Big Walnut, Mount Vernon, Canal, Lancaster, Groveport, Franklin Heights, Hamilton Township or Teays Valley to try to get an 8 team league, if not Newark probably not going to be part of the LCL. If something happens the league would probably not be called LCL anymore tho. Granville and Valley would be bubble/swing teams that could be up or down depending on who gives it serious consideration. I can see 8 in big and 6 in small and if they found 2 more teams it could bump valley and Granville down. Utica and ridge gets heights and Watkins off and but could end up still having to play Valley and Granville

Last edited by FootballDNA; 03-05-19 at 10:48 AM.
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  #16  
Old 02-12-19, 03:42 PM
LCL LCL is offline
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Alright, supposing New Albany turns up their nose to joining the LCL, let's think crazy, really, really crazy about the future....

BUCKEYE DIVISION
1. Newark
2. Zanesville
3. Licking Heights
4. Watkins Memorial
5. Big Walnut
6. Mount Vernon
7. Canal Winchester

CARDINAL DIVISION
1. Licking Valley
2. Granville
3. Johnstown
4. Heath
5. Lakewood
6. Newark Catholic
7. Liberty Union

OHIO DIVISION???
1. Utica
2. Northridge
3. Fisher Catholic
4. Millersport
5. Harvest Prep
6. Fairfield Christian
7. West Muskingum

The MSL crumbles, teams are left scrambling, West Muskingum rejects the future of the MVL, the OCC's lack of continuity all factor into a crazy new LCL, now renamed the Tri-County Conference (Licking, Muskingum, Fairfield) as those are where the majority of the teams come from. All of a sudden, the LCL is sort of the new MSL.

Well, what do you think?...I did say crazy!
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  #17  
Old 02-12-19, 04:34 PM
The Dock The Dock is offline
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The Buckeye and Cardinal Divisions look fine. I have a hard time seeing the proposed Ohio division coming together, though, and I just see it personally as a very weird, unbalanced and in general an alignment that wouldn’t produce many spirited affairs (rah rah... Utica vs Millersport? HP vs WM?). Three of those teams (FCA, MP and WM) have combined for one football win since January 2017. Eeek! But hey, that’s okay: a first draft is a first draft — thanks for taking the time to come up with one for us to discuss. My turn!

Buckeye
Watkins Memorial
Licking Heights
Zanesville
Teays Valley
Canal Winchester
Groveport-Madison
Newark
New Albany OR Whitehall-Yearling

I think this is what’s most likely to come of WM and LH’s future. I just don’t see Mt.Vernon finding their way back into a Central Ohio league. Big Walnut would just shift the geography of an LH-WM-ZV based alliance too far north for ZV.

Cardinal
Bexley
Granville
Heath
Johnstown
Lakewood
Liberty Union
Licking Valley
Northridge

I think Newark Cath. could maybe fit in Northridge’s stead (how cool to see a revival of the old MSL-Ohio), but I don’t think Northridge would be that great of a fit in the third division below – and think instead NC would be better suited in the alignment below better than they would the one above.

Ohio
Cols. Academy
Grandview Heights
Harvest Prep
Fisher Cath.
Newark Cath.
Worthington Christian

maybe
Utica??? OR Berne Union???
Bishop Ready??? OR Bishop Rosecrans???

I think Utica could take the place of Sparta Highland, should they defect the KMAC for the MOAC. My version of the Ohio could survive fine with six, but any two of Berne Union, Ready or Rosecrans would do as well.

Last edited by The Dock; 02-12-19 at 07:34 PM.
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  #18  
Old 02-13-19, 09:53 PM
LCL LCL is offline
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Alright...LCL Custom Divisions, Part 2. LCL and MSL Cardinal and Ohio merge...plus a couple OCC teams. Sorry Grove City Christian, Worthington Christian and Buckeye Valley you didn't make the cut. Liberty Union good luck with the MSL-Buckeye again in football.

BUCKEYE
Zanesville
Licking Heights
Watkins Memorial
Whitehall
Big Walnut
Newark

CARDINAL
Lakewood
Licking Valley
Granville
Johnstown
Columbus Academy
Bexley

OHIO
Heath
Newark Catholic
Harvest Prep
Fisher Catholic
Grandview Heights
Bishop Ready

EAST
Utica
Northridge
Millersport
Bishop Rosecrans
Fairfield Christian
Berne Union

Crossovers...or not you choose.
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  #19  
Old 02-17-19, 11:25 AM
The Dock The Dock is offline
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Yeah, those look good!

Funny you mention GCC and WC as being out - supposedly Grove City Christian is looking to form a new league with KIPP (has football), Tree of Life (who is adding football soon), Wellington and a couple other similar profile schools.
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  #20  
Old 02-24-19, 11:28 AM
gils gils is offline
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New enrollment numbers came out for the 2019-21 years per OSHAA:
Including Zanesville's numbers.
Watkins Memorial-530 (+65)
Licking Heights-493 (+44)
Zanesville-344 (+3)
Granville-342 (+8)
Licking Valley-249 (-8)
Lakewood-228 (-21)
Heath-216 (+20)
Johnstown-203 (+ 9)
Utica-200 (- 4)
Northridge-150 (-23)
Newark Catholic-87 (-26)

Last edited by gils; 02-24-19 at 11:50 AM.
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  #21  
Old 02-25-19, 12:46 PM
OUcats82 OUcats82 is offline
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Not super familiar with the dynamics of the MSL. What might be suggesting that the league has stability challenges?

Has always struck me as a similar organization as the OCC just for smaller schools around central Ohio.
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  #22  
Old 02-26-19, 03:42 PM
OUcats82 OUcats82 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OUcats82 View Post
Not super familiar with the dynamics of the MSL. What might be suggesting that the league has stability challenges?

Has always struck me as a similar organization as the OCC just for smaller schools around central Ohio.
Nevermind-found some good information from another thread that was started. Thanks anyways!
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  #23  
Old 03-05-19, 10:53 AM
FootballDNA FootballDNA is offline
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I really think for now the LCL just needs to focus on finding 1 more school. If Newark wants to join and grow the league that would be great, but not likely. What are the odds Watkins and Heights just leave the LCL and join the OCC or another conference? They can still play LC teams in weeks 1-3. Thoughts?
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Old 03-05-19, 01:31 PM
LCL LCL is offline
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Given how fluid the OCC makes changes in their conferences I can't really see those two leaving. If they were paired with the likes of Canal Wichester, Newark, New Albany, Big Walnut, then I could see it be tempting. However could you see LH and WM getting stuck with the Hilliards, Dublins or Pickeringtons. If anything it would be idea for these two schools to try get something rolling with Whitehall and any disgruntled OCC schools to form a conference. No way this would ever happen, but it would be an interesting conference with Heights, Watkins, Whitehall, Newark, Zanesville, New Albany, Big Walnut, and Mount Vernon. Lots of traveling, but would be a fun conference from a division/regional point of view.
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  #25  
Old 03-05-19, 06:05 PM
gils gils is offline
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Just found out the LCL is talking to Fisher Catholic and Liberty Union. They are both listening. Would be great additions to the Cardinal Division.
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  #26  
Old 03-05-19, 08:53 PM
LCL LCL is offline
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Definitely would be great additions, both respectable. Now find a dancing partner for Zanesville...huh um, Newark...and there are two seperate divisions.
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  #27  
Old 03-07-19, 11:39 AM
JU-ICE JU-ICE is offline
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Those two would be good additions and close out the small division.
Would adding Lancaster and Mt. Vernon be enough to draw Newark to the Big School Division? Or do they forget about Newark and look for another school altogether?
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  #28  
Old 03-07-19, 12:37 PM
gils gils is offline
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I think that they are looking at Big Walnut and Mt. Vernon for the big division. I do not think Newark and Lancaster would come to the LCL because they are to big. I do not think either Granville or Licking Valley would be to thrilled playing them.

Last edited by gils; 03-07-19 at 03:20 PM.
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  #29  
Old 03-07-19, 01:10 PM
Buckey Backer Buckey Backer is offline
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I would love to see the LCL go after Newark, Mt Vernon, Big Walnut and Tri Valley. Pair them with Zanesville, Licking Heights, Watkins and possibly Granville for the Big School division, then go after a school like Sheridan for the Small School division. Ideally that would be a great league from a competitive standpoint and a travel standpoint. Farthest drives would be Zanesville to Big Walnut.


Big School:

Newark
Big Walnut
Granville
Licking Heights
Mt Vernon
Tri Valley
Watkins Memorial
Zanesville

Small School:

Heath
Johnstown
Lakewood
Licking Valley
Newark Catholic
Northridge
Sheridan
Utica
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  #30  
Old 03-07-19, 01:14 PM
Buckey Backer Buckey Backer is offline
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Oh and one more thing, has anybody noticed Newark's rapid enrollment growth? According to OHSAA figures Newark's enrollment has gone up sharply in the last few counts:

2015-17' (583 boys)
2017-19' (659 boys)
2019-21' (729 boys)

That's a pretty solid increase in enrollment? I guess Newark is growing though as the city population is likely to pass 50,000 residents in the upcoming census estimate release in a few weeks.

https://ohsaa.org/school-resources/school-enrollment
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