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  #31  
Old 01-29-19, 10:42 AM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irish_buffalo View Post
Trump hysteria? You need to trust your common man a little more.

99.9% of people want the same as everyone else man.
No IB this is not "Trump hysteria" it's human nature. It seems the norm these days to casually go against human nature and just assume everything else will work out. But sometimes it doesn't.

I can agree with your statement that we're more alike then different while at the same time pointing out that at this time in our history we are as divided as we've ever been. And IMO further dividing us along language lines could very well be the straw that broke the camels back and plunge us into national dissolution.

Having a common language is crucial to having a bedrock foundation supporting the rest of our culture. Not having this is like only digging your footers down 12 inches rather then digging them four feet deep and then making matters worse by not using concrete to lock the footers in. Sure you can build your structure that way but it will be a whole lot more likely to blow down in the first windstorm.
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  #32  
Old 01-29-19, 11:10 AM
Crusaders Crusaders is offline
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Even the Romans made people learn Latin and they really did not particularly care what people did within their empire so long as they did not try to rebel (one of the reasons it lasted so long). They didn't even particularly care if people converted to their religion. In many ways, their style of governance inspired British imperial rule (or begnin neglect), our ideal of freedom of religion, and American pragmatism (which really needs to make a comeback). But there has to be a common language. If people cannot communicate effectively, they are not of one society.
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  #33  
Old 01-29-19, 11:27 AM
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Here is an interesting piece on Nationalism. I bring it up here because I think that is what Yappi is trying to get at with the question he posed. By being "more American" I believe it means taking pride in the US and it's history and traditions. Flying the Stars & Stripes not the flag from the country you are fleeing. That doesn't mean you can't have pride in your heritage but you need to adopt the fact that you've decided to leave your homeland and start a new life in the USA.

Anyway here's the link

Do we need our country?

Last edited by MoeDude; 01-29-19 at 03:57 PM.
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  #34  
Old 01-29-19, 11:55 AM
NewOldBlood NewOldBlood is offline
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Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
So you would agree that beyond a short single generation effort designed to bridge the gap between Spanish & English, bilingualism has NO PLACE in American culture?

One people and one language is common sense to me. Deviate from this norm and you risk national disintegration. Because what else actually unites us?
I don't know that I would say that bilingualism has no place. I think it has a place within the education system and in the roles of interpretation for new immigrants, but I would agree that the overall goal would be for the people who live in this country to speak one common language.

I don't have an overall distrust for what others are saying in another language because for the most part I just don't care. At the end of the day, I think learning the language is a generational thing. I thing we are in the early stages of this large Hispanic migration, especially outside of the Southwest region of our country and California. In 15-20 years, as this generation of immigrant's children become teenagers and adults, I believe a good majority of the Hispanic immigrants will speak English fluently.
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  #35  
Old 01-29-19, 04:50 PM
irish_buffalo irish_buffalo is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
No IB this is not "Trump hysteria" it's human nature. It seems the norm these days to casually go against human nature and just assume everything else will work out. But sometimes it doesn't.

I can agree with your statement that we're more alike then different while at the same time pointing out that at this time in our history we are as divided as we've ever been. And IMO further dividing us along language lines could very well be the straw that broke the camels back and plunge us into national dissolution.

Having a common language is crucial to having a bedrock foundation supporting the rest of our culture. Not having this is like only digging your footers down 12 inches rather then digging them four feet deep and then making matters worse by not using concrete to lock the footers in. Sure you can build your structure that way but it will be a whole lot more likely to blow down in the first windstorm.
All of the Mexicans I know, and I know a bunch, have assimilated just fine. Kids speak English and grow up with American culture and values. This notion that these heathens are crossing the border and refusing to learn our language or adjust to our culture is plain BS.

The founding fathers understood the dangers of mandating a language.
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  #36  
Old 01-29-19, 05:27 PM
bigkat bigkat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yappi View Post
Should Hispanics work harder at assimilation into American culture?
yes.....
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  #37  
Old 01-29-19, 08:26 PM
irish_buffalo irish_buffalo is online now
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Should the Amish?
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  #38  
Old 01-29-19, 08:37 PM
lotr10 lotr10 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irish_buffalo View Post
Should the Amish?
Fair and interesting question IB. Of course with the Amish you're bringing a profoundly religious element into the question.

I guess my answer would be that I would have a problem with millions of Amish entering this country and refusing to assimilate. In a more rational world we wold have a sane immigration policy that would include the likelihood & desire to assimilate as a key component in selecting people for immigration into the USA.
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  #39  
Old 01-29-19, 08:44 PM
gneiss rocks gneiss rocks is offline
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My buddie Jose will not go to Toco Bell with me, I told him he is not even trying to assimilate!
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  #40  
Old 01-29-19, 08:54 PM
JcksnPlrBrs2002 JcksnPlrBrs2002 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
Fair and interesting question IB. Of course with the Amish you're bringing a profoundly religious element into the question.

I guess my answer would be that I would have a problem with millions of Amish entering this country and refusing to assimilate. In a more rational world we wold have a sane immigration policy that would include the likelihood & desire to assimilate as a key component in selecting people for immigration into the USA.
...based on who's sense of the phrase "likelihood and desire to assimiliate" though? It would be really hard to have a criteria for entry that involved something so inherently subjective.
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  #41  
Old 01-29-19, 09:58 PM
SWMCinci SWMCinci is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lotr10 View Post
F....I guess my answer would be that I would have a problem with millions of Amish entering this country and refusing to assimilate. ...
I'm trying to remember the last time the Amish marched in the city streets to protest the treatment of illegal Amish while carrying the Amish flag to identify as Amish...

Or the last time the Amish demanded special treatment with regards to college tuition...

Or the last time the Amish decided that America's laws were very inconvenient to their lifestyle.....
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  #42  
Old 01-29-19, 11:02 PM
gobluetom gobluetom is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SWMCinci View Post
I'm trying to remember the last time the Amish marched in the city streets to protest the treatment of illegal Amish while carrying the Amish flag to identify as Amish...

Or the last time the Amish demanded special treatment with regards to college tuition...

Or the last time the Amish decided that America's laws were very inconvenient to their lifestyle.....
NEVER bring logic or facts to a debate, Leftists won't tolerate that.
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  #43  
Old 01-30-19, 06:33 AM
Chop Stix Chop Stix is online now
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A better question is should white people of European ancestry work harder to assimilate to Native American culture?
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  #44  
Old 01-30-19, 08:56 AM
TigerPaw TigerPaw is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SWMCinci View Post
I'm trying to remember the last time the Amish marched in the city streets to protest the treatment of illegal Amish while carrying the Amish flag to identify as Amish...

Or the last time the Amish demanded special treatment with regards to college tuition...

Or the last time the Amish decided that America's laws were very inconvenient to their lifestyle.....
How stupid. Amish don't go to college but they do speak dutch, ride freaking horses down public streets, and we bend over backwards to accommodate their rules and culture. Other than that they assimilate well, lol.

We all know what the difference is.
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  #45  
Old 01-30-19, 09:14 AM
fish82 fish82 is offline
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TigerPew making a strong challenge to Happy lately in the "Most Vaginal White Guilt" contest.
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  #46  
Old 01-30-19, 09:22 AM
Taco MacArthur Taco MacArthur is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerPaw View Post
We all know what the difference is.
Yup, numbers. There's ~250 thousand (number from 2012) Amish in the US and Canada. There's about 56.6 million (number from 2015) Hispanic people in the US.
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  #47  
Old 01-30-19, 10:18 AM
SWMCinci SWMCinci is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chop Stix View Post
A better question is should white people of European ancestry work harder to assimilate to Native American culture?
I thought we assimilated them quite well. We defeated them on the battlefield, we offered them an education to our ways, etc. We had no intention of moving to this country to be native Americans, we came as conquerors.

Today that would not be acceptable on the world stage, but 400 years ago it was. Just like the Romans conquering Europe, Alexander conquering the middle east, and Genghis Khan conquering Asia...

The people moving here today want to be Americans, if they don't we should stop them at the borders, forcibly if necessary. We are a different world than we were 400 years ago, even 50 years ago......
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  #48  
Old 01-30-19, 10:23 AM
SWMCinci SWMCinci is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerPaw View Post
How stupid. Amish don't go to college but they do speak dutch, ride freaking horses down public streets, and we bend over backwards to accommodate their rules and culture. Other than that they assimilate well, lol.

We all know what the difference is.
They pay their taxes, they follow our laws whether inconvenient to them or not, recognize the legal system, and don't view themselves as anything but Americans. They appreciate the freedoms and rights offered by American society. Being Amish is a combination of lifestyle and religion.
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  #49  
Old 01-30-19, 11:53 AM
gneiss rocks gneiss rocks is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chop Stix View Post
A better question is should white people of European ancestry work harder to assimilate to Native American culture?
One of the main reasons we defeated them is that they became dependent on our technology in a very short period of time. They liked our stuff better so they were forced to assimilate or go without.
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  #50  
Old 01-30-19, 05:41 PM
bigkat bigkat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irish_buffalo View Post
Should the Amish?

all the ones that I know...and that is a bunch....they all speak English
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  #51  
Old 01-30-19, 05:43 PM
bigkat bigkat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerPaw View Post
How stupid. Amish don't go to college but they do speak dutch, ride freaking horses down public streets, and we bend over backwards to accommodate their rules and culture. Other than that they assimilate well, lol.

We all know what the difference is.
I have never had to bend over backwards for any Amish....how have you?
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  #52  
Old 01-30-19, 05:46 PM
fish82 fish82 is offline
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Fair to say that using the Amish probably isn't the greatest analogy ever.
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  #53  
Old 01-30-19, 08:54 PM
irish_buffalo irish_buffalo is online now
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Originally Posted by fish82 View Post
Fair to say that using the Amish probably isn't the greatest analogy ever.
Not at all but just as big a joke as typecasting Mexican's as a whole not assimilating enough.

In all fairness, I've met some Amish people who are nothing more than trash but will hold out from typecasting the entire lot.
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  #54  
Old 01-31-19, 12:31 AM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Originally Posted by Chop Stix View Post
A better question is should white people of European ancestry work harder to assimilate to Native American culture?
Because 18th century Euro-trash came here to live simply, off of the land, I suppose ?


I guess it depends why one comes here. If one wishes to maximize their opportunities, they should probably work hard to assimilate.

If you're here illegally, you should probably lay low.

If you are wanting to run a Padrone game, you should work hard to cultivate an attitude that assimilation is akin to being a "Tio Tomas"

If you just come here to get on the dole, don't worry about it. The libs will buy your vote with bi-lingual help.
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  #55  
Old 01-31-19, 12:35 AM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SWMCinci View Post
I thought we assimilated them quite well. We defeated them on the battlefield, we offered them an education to our ways, etc. We had no intention of moving to this country to be native Americans, we came as conquerors.

Today that would not be acceptable on the world stage, but 400 years ago it was. Just like the Romans conquering Europe, Alexander conquering the middle east, and Genghis Khan conquering Asia...

The people moving here today want to be Americans, if they don't we should stop them at the borders, forcibly if necessary. We are a different world than we were 400 years ago, even 50 years ago......
Make no mistake - many of them are coming to "conquer", on one level or another.
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  #56  
Old 01-31-19, 08:04 AM
y2h y2h is offline
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Originally Posted by irish_buffalo View Post
Trump hysteria? You need to trust your common man a little more.

99.9% of people want the same as everyone else man.
The new wave of immigrants don't. They want to become North Mexico. Refuse to learn English, call the American flag racist, wave their countries flag at political rallies, demand American taxpayers fund interpreters in schools.
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  #57  
Old 01-31-19, 08:10 AM
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I'm the first generation born here from my dad's side. He was born in Cuba as was the rest of that side. They speak Spanish to each other but ALL of them came here legally and all of them learned to speak English

It's not racist to say you should come here legally and learn the language / assimilate


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  #58  
Old 01-31-19, 08:23 AM
irish_buffalo irish_buffalo is online now
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The new wave of immigrants don't. They want to become North Mexico. Refuse to learn English, call the American flag racist, wave their countries flag at political rallies, demand American taxpayers fund interpreters in schools.
Please do not share your extremes with me. Better yet, who is telling you this BS? Purely ridiculous.
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  #59  
Old 01-31-19, 08:27 AM
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Maybe this is a joke and I didn't get it, but ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerPaw View Post
How stupid. Amish don't go to college but they do speak dutch,
They speak German, not dutch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerPaw View Post
...ride freaking horses down public streets,
Do Amish ride horses? I've seen their horses pulling buggies many times. In either case, I've seen people other than Amish riding horses on public roads, anybody can if they want.

Quote:
Originally Posted by TigerPaw View Post
...and we bend over backwards to accommodate their rules and culture.
Other than avoiding collisions with their slow moving buggies I can't think of any other accommodation made to the Amish.
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  #60  
Old 01-31-19, 08:38 AM
chs1971 chs1971 is offline
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Originally Posted by Chop Stix View Post
A better question is should white people of European ancestry work harder to assimilate to Native American culture?
Abandon modern science and technology and return to a simpler semi-nomadic, hunter-gatherer, slash-and-burn culture? A few people chose to do so. Most did not.
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