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  #1  
Old 09-10-17, 07:36 PM
Pantherontheporch Pantherontheporch is offline
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Week 4 - Elder (3-0) at Lakewood St. Edward (3-0)

Something’s gotta give as the Panthers again hit the road on Saturday to take on the LSE Eagles. The Eagles have beaten McDowell (PA) 40-10, Glenville 41-6, and Howard D. Woodson (DC), 45-20. Kickoff will be at 7:00 p.m. at Bedford High School stadium.
Here is a brief preseason article on the Eagles; I don’t know how things have turned out so far this year for those mentioned, if anyone has been injured, etc.:

St. Edward Short on Experience, Again Full of Potential
The mood at St. Edward is similar to 2015, when few starters returned but the Eagles emerged as state champion.
Those lofty expectations have not changed, and this team enters the season with proven talent on defense and potential on offense.
Start with senior cornerback Michael Dowell, a Michigan State recruit who last year learned safety and will try to double this year as a receiver. The secondary remains a strong point with Cincinnati commit Darnell Shields and junior Caden Kolesar, while Omar Fattah again leads the defense at linebacker. All four appeared at The Opening this spring in Berea.
Offensively, though, St. Edward does not have a returning starter on the offensive line.
“That’s definitely the biggest inexperienced piece,” coach Tom Lombardo said. “There’s a lot of good players, but they’re waiting their turn.”
Take the rest of the offense for example. Receiver Damerisse Freeman is the most experienced player. He scored four touchdowns last year. Junior running back Jordan Castleberry earned more playing time as last season wore on, and senior Tylan Rice also is in the fold to replace Curtis Szelesta’s production at running back.
Junior Garrett Dzuro stepped in late during St. Edward’s regional final loss when starting quarterback Kevin Kramer broke his tibia. The offense called for deep passes despite Dzuro’s inexperience, and he is back with senior Zachary Kincaid in contention for the starting spot.
Defensive end William Henry, a 6-foot-5 edge rusher, holds a few college offers. Punter Mason Lawler has a scholarship offer from Bowling Green.
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  #2  
Old 09-10-17, 09:01 PM
Descartes Descartes is offline
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Pretty simple, if the Secondary plays like garbage again, they'll lose. However, if they play with any degree of competency, Elder will have a shot.
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  #3  
Old 09-10-17, 09:13 PM
ELDERfbfan ELDERfbfan is offline
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Hate to say it but this will probably be a lopsided game something like 45-14...Elder O will struggle worst than they did against GL, the secondary will get destroyed and it will be too much for Elder to make any kind of comeback, add the long bus ride and I just don't see how this game will be close....but I really hope I'm wrong.
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  #4  
Old 09-10-17, 10:00 PM
Descartes Descartes is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ELDERfbfan View Post
Hate to say it but this will probably be a lopsided game something like 45-14...Elder O will struggle worst than they did against GL, the secondary will get destroyed and it will be too much for Elder to make any kind of comeback, add the long bus ride and I just don't see how this game will be close....but I really hope I'm wrong.
IMO, the Offense struggled on Friday bc the play calling was atrocious. Way too many short passes and draw plays. Mix it up!

A key factor will be how this team shows up early. It took then 1.5 quarters before they snapped out of a daze. If they start sluggish like that again on Sat, it will be over quickly.

Last edited by Descartes; 09-11-17 at 04:52 AM.
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  #5  
Old 09-11-17, 07:46 AM
?????? ?????? is offline
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Descartes, quit be captain obvious on the DB thing, yes they struggled and probably will most of the season. All dbs get toasted that's what they do, much less when they are overmatched. It's a young defense who is facing a plethora of D1 talent this yr. Ask that db who watched fallaice go get a ball for a game winner ,while he stood flat footed, how tough it can be. Maybe the atrocious playcalling requires a little deeper thinking than you are capable off. The won, they are 3-0
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  #6  
Old 09-11-17, 08:02 AM
adselder09 adselder09 is offline
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A 2-hour bus ride right after school on Friday, should be different than the 4-hour Saturday morning bus ride they'll have this week. They should have plenty of time to wake up and be ready to play. Elder has played Eds well at home the past couple of times, but have struggled when they hit the road. Ramsey and staff seem to have their best game plans against St Edward. We'll see if that holds true this weekend.
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  #7  
Old 09-11-17, 08:02 AM
Descartes Descartes is offline
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Originally Posted by ?????? View Post
Descartes, quit be captain obvious on the DB thing, yes they struggled and probably will most of the season. All dbs get toasted that's what they do, much less when they are overmatched. It's a young defense who is facing a plethora of D1 talent this yr. Ask that db who watched fallaice go get a ball for a game winner ,while he stood flat footed, how tough it can be. Maybe the atrocious playcalling requires a little deeper thinking than you are capable off. The won, they are 3-0
You want to have a conversation about the game w/o talking about the biggest issue for Elder? I understand they're limited in ability, but there's no excuse for that kind of play. Ppl like you need to leave if you want to keep burying your head in the sand like this.

And the Playcalling was bad. How many times can you run a friggin draw or 2 yard out route? They took 3 deep shots down the field and ended up with 2 TDs.
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  #8  
Old 09-11-17, 08:14 AM
?????? ?????? is offline
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Offense was efficient and ate clock, which assisted the defense in holding that team to 23 points on the road. Seems like they are committed to stopping the run and rolling the dice down field. I personally like that style and accept some struggles down field.Not trying to bury my head in the sand, just not a big fan of captain obvious crud.
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  #9  
Old 09-11-17, 08:22 AM
Descartes Descartes is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ?????? View Post
Offense was efficient and ate clock, which assisted the defense in holding that team to 23 points on the road. Seems like they are committed to stopping the run and rolling the dice down field. I personally like that style and accept some struggles down field.Not trying to bury my head in the sand, just not a big fan of captain obvious crud.
It's not even so much the cvg, as is it is the missed tackles. How many YAC did the Miller kid have? Close to 100, I'm guessing.
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  #10  
Old 09-11-17, 08:30 AM
?????? ?????? is offline
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No doubt they have to improve on defense. I will say that when you look at the pic of game winning TD, you would think fallaice warrants a few more jump balls down field. That's getting a ball at the Apex
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  #11  
Old 09-11-17, 08:39 AM
trey2k trey2k is offline
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DB is the toughest job on the field.
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  #12  
Old 09-11-17, 08:55 AM
adselder09 adselder09 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trey2k View Post
DB is the toughest job on the field.
No one is arguing that, it's absolutely true. I wasn't at the game Friday, but listened to the PSRN broadcast so I can't say what the problem was against Lincoln, however typically Elder's secondary struggles with the following: speed, finding the ball, and some years tackling. It usually is not a matter of being out of position, moreso the player they're defending being more athletic and knowing where and when to make a play on the ball. One way to fix that is to make sure the CB has safety help over top or by making sure the CB or S stays on top of the WR. Much easier to make a play on the ball facing the entire play than with your back to it.
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  #13  
Old 09-11-17, 09:29 AM
Jteegardner Jteegardner is offline
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Originally Posted by ELDERfbfan View Post
Hate to say it but this will probably be a lopsided game something like 45-14...Elder O will struggle worst than they did against GL, the secondary will get destroyed and it will be too much for Elder to make any kind of comeback, add the long bus ride and I just don't see how this game will be close....but I really hope I'm wrong.
I believe you are wrong. I don't think the secondary was as bad as people think. The tackling was bad allowing yardage after the catch. Fix that and they have a chance. I too think the play calling was bad....too predictable. I like Elder in this one as this team has confidence and never gave up this past week. I can guarantee the are up for the challenge for next five weeks. It should be fun and Go Panthers!
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  #14  
Old 09-11-17, 09:46 AM
trey2k trey2k is offline
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In 6 of the remaining 7 games, the best talent on the field is going to be on the other side of the ball. I'm not saying that means anything...but if you've never tried to or had to guard a potential D-1 receiver with great speed and length, or tackle a back with 4.4 speed and amazing quickness in the open field, you really have zero clue what you're talking about.

Yeah, just throw cover 2 or a deep safety on them and all is good. SMH.

The Elder kids will compete, as they always do, and perhaps win 1 or 2 of these very tough games, but the odds are stacked against them. They will be underdogs in every one of them.

Let's also not go crazy and think the coaches need to go when they most likely will lose most of these upcoming games. To be honest, it's a testament to the football coaches that they get out of these kids what they do.

Yeah, I know, I'm a fool. Let's talk again in 6 weeks, and then I'll listen to how I was wrong and everyone else was right, even when that happens. Backwards.

Because in the Elder forum, even when you're right, you're wrong.

Last edited by trey2k; 09-11-17 at 11:07 AM.
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  #15  
Old 09-11-17, 09:51 AM
Jteegardner Jteegardner is offline
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Originally Posted by trey2k View Post
, or tackle a back with 4.4 speed and amazing quickness in the open field, you really have zero clue what you're talking about.
Ever heard of Drew Metz? He did it often, even brought down the infamous Maurice Clarett in the open field one on one. Were you there to see that? I was.
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  #16  
Old 09-11-17, 10:11 AM
Descartes Descartes is offline
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I'm actually more worried about them playing against more competent QBs. Lincoln's QB has almost zero coaching. Every pass play he'd stare down the 2-3 Options he had on the strong side of the Formation. No reading the Defense, No Progressions. You put Woyke on that Lincoln team and they'd easily be the favorites to win R3. Lincoln was as fast and athletic as the Pick Central team from last year. I'm not sure they were a better "team", but pretty close in terms of talent.
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  #17  
Old 09-11-17, 10:22 AM
Don Flamenco Don Flamenco is offline
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Originally Posted by Jteegardner View Post
Ever heard of Drew Metz? He did it often, even brought down the infamous Maurice Clarett in the open field one on one. Were you there to see that? I was.
Metz was a great tackler, but he never played against Clarett. His first varsity season was 2002, a year after Clarett graduated HS. He went against the Elder teams with Brown and Ackerman in the secondary.
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  #18  
Old 09-11-17, 11:12 AM
trey2k trey2k is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Flamenco View Post
Metz was a great tackler, but he never played against Clarett. His first varsity season was 2002, a year after Clarett graduated HS. He went against the Elder teams with Brown and Ackerman in the secondary.
How dare you!!!

Another self awareness moment that will go unrecognized by the original poster.

Must be Taco's brother.
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  #19  
Old 09-11-17, 04:48 PM
Descartes Descartes is offline
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If Elder plays the way they did in the 3rd Quarter, they can beat anyone on their schedule. At the same time, if they play like they did in the first half, they could lose to anyone on their schedule (sans Broward).
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  #20  
Old 09-12-17, 09:56 PM
SMARTY22 SMARTY22 is offline
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Seems to me that Secondary play has been a pretty consistent problem for Elder. The kids will compete a little this weekend but end result I think will be an L.
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  #21  
Old 09-13-17, 10:07 AM
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Hey Elder fans. Always look forward to this annual match-up. Unfortunately, Lakewood stadium is always booked for this particular week, so the venue has been different every year. Location this year is Bedford, which is a nice stadium, but not much to do in immediate vicinity.

Not sure what to make of this Eagle team quite yet. Offense rotates 2 QBs. Kincaid, the senior is a more traditional pocket passer, and Junior Dzuro is a smaller QB who will run the ball regularly. Both have had success moving the office.

Running backs Rice and Castleberry are good 1-2 punch. Castleberry is a smaller scat-back type, with Rice getting more of the red-zone carries.

Offensive line is big, but perhaps not as athletic as some recent Eagle lines. Seem to be coming along.

Defensive secondary is once again a strength with a few DI types.

I think the area to attack the Eagles is the front 7. The DL and LB's are a bit smaller than we are used to seeing, and don't really have the established maulers. MLB Fatah is a stud, but undersized. That being said, they limited a USC signed RB to about 9 yards last week.

Hoping for good weather and a good contest. Best of luck Panthers.
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Old 09-13-17, 11:51 AM
Descartes Descartes is offline
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Weather conditions appear to be great... Mostly sunny, high of 81, low of 61
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Old 09-13-17, 12:08 PM
trey2k trey2k is offline
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Elder plays a game management style of offense, because they lack the big play ability. If they can do that AND convert some clock management into points, they have a chance to steal this.

If they can't, or have 2-3 turnovers, it could get ugly.
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Old 09-13-17, 12:52 PM
Purplemojo Purplemojo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Descartes View Post
If Elder plays the way they did in the 3rd Quarter, they can beat anyone on their schedule. At the same time, if they play like they did in the first half, they could lose to anyone on their schedule (sans Broward).
Obviously they can play that way as they did last week. I would like to think they will and will earn a win in a close one. I can't believe all the negativity on this thread.
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Old 09-13-17, 01:02 PM
SSS SSS is offline
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Elder most definitely has a shot to win this one. Ed's seems to have talent, but if they commit turnovers and penalties like last week it's anyone's game.
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Old 09-13-17, 01:12 PM
trey2k trey2k is offline
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Originally Posted by Purplemojo View Post
Obviously they can play that way as they did last week. I would like to think they will and will earn a win in a close one. I can't believe all the negativity on this thread.
Once again...how many people would agree that St Eds probably has the better team this year? Probably 80-90% (the other 10-20% would never admit anyone or anything is better than Elder, ever)?

If that's the case, please explain to me how Elder fans rationally thinking they could lose this game is negativity? How is someone making a prediction off of rational, solid information negative?

Eds rationally has the better team and the better talent...nope, can't have that. Elder will win everything, every single time...or you're nothing but a hater.

How stupid.

Last edited by trey2k; 09-13-17 at 02:53 PM.
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  #27  
Old 09-13-17, 02:03 PM
Descartes Descartes is offline
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Obviously they can play that way as they did last week. I would like to think they will and will earn a win in a close one. I can't believe all the negativity on this thread.
The bulk of negativity is from posters who are casual fans at best. The Secondary is the most pressing weakness, and the QB play needs to be more consistent. However, this is still a good to very good team. The OL play has been miles and miles better than last year, the run game is solid, and the Front 7 and WRs are still very good.
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Old 09-13-17, 02:12 PM
adselder09 adselder09 is offline
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If Elder can pull this one off it will be in similar fashion to their previous two victories in the series 21-14 and 15-9. Long-sustaining drives that keep the Eagle offense off the field. Also will need to have a fast start, can't afford to dig a 7-0 or 14-0 hole again. If that happens, I see a 28-7, 31-14 type win for St Edward.
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Old 09-13-17, 02:26 PM
SMARTY22 SMARTY22 is offline
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As I said before, the end result will be an L (I think) but I don't see a Blowout either! Did Ramsey say anything last night that worries or really jumps out at him on film from Eds?
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  #30  
Old 09-13-17, 02:55 PM
trey2k trey2k is offline
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Did Ramsey say anything last night that worries or really jumps out at him on film from Eds?
The obvious talent disparity, maybe?
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