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  #31  
Old 02-03-17, 11:53 AM
Ville-ified Ville-ified is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Slippery View Post
East Canton wouldn't, but at a time of levy woes, there was talk of dissolving the Osnaburg Local SD. In that case, Osnaburg would've been split between Louisville, Minerva, and Canton South.
Son of a......well our 89 kid bump is down to 29 and two thirds.
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  #32  
Old 02-03-17, 12:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Ville-ified View Post
Son of a......well our 89 kid bump is down to 29 and two thirds.


Louisville might have ended up with the better portion of that deal. I would assume that Louisville would've gotten the village. Minerva and Canton South would've ended up with the less populated areas.
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  #33  
Old 02-03-17, 01:41 PM
Andy27 Andy27 is offline
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Originally Posted by Cardinal Nation View Post
Go all in and call them the ECL Leopard-Hornets. Give local artists some drugs and have a logo contest. A leopard hornet would frighten me.
Thanks for making me almost spit out a mouthful of chili at work.

Why not just make it the Horny Leopards?
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  #34  
Old 02-03-17, 04:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Bluestreakoffice View Post
The expense is more than you think...in a conversation with some people at GlenOak...they were told Green has cut transportation costs by joining the Fed by $300,000. If you factor in middle school along with high school girls and boys sports...that number could happen.
Your number is crazy. Not even close just think about what that number represents.

There are about 200 away trips that would use a bus for a 7-12 sports school like Louisville. If the average trip is an extra 20 miles each way that is an extra 8000 miles. $300K says that those miles each cost $38. I would sy you are off by a factor of 10.
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  #35  
Old 02-03-17, 05:02 PM
BGFalcons86 BGFalcons86 is offline
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Originally Posted by Mr. General View Post
Still wish something could've been done with a new league with Louisville, Dover, New Philly, Wooster, CCC, etc.
Mr. General... That is exactly the league I wanted. I would liked to have picked off Alliance or maybe Marlington from the NBC, but I don't know that either would've been interested in that league.
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  #36  
Old 02-03-17, 05:21 PM
SteelValley SteelValley is offline
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Any interest out of Louisville to join the Youngstown-based AAC? I think school size-wise it's s good fit. And I'd think the drive is no worse than Suburban league? Louisville would likely be in a tier with Boardman, Fitch, Warren Harding, Canfield, Howland, Youngstown East and Lakeside.
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  #37  
Old 02-03-17, 05:23 PM
Lynus24 Lynus24 is offline
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Louisville fields 21-22 varsity sports depending if you count gymnastics.
Football
Boys BB
Girls BB
Baseball
Softball
Wrestling
Boys soccer
Girls soccer
Boys tennis
Girls tennis
Boys lacrosse
Girls lacrosse
Boys swimming
Girls swimming
Boys cross country
Girls cross country
Volleyball
Boys golf
Girls golf
Boys track
Girls track
And gymnastics
Some sports share a bus, some have varsity, jv, and frosh teams. Doing the "math" using 7-12 sports isn't gonna get you close to the answer your looking for.
These are just sports teams and travel...factor in all groups including band and that's a huge chunk of change. The $300,000 Green claimed to save is totally believable.
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  #38  
Old 02-03-17, 05:51 PM
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First Louisville, then FED AD's will seek Massillon to somehow 'agree' to join and the split into two divisions with two or three cross over games with one more opening to fill out. (Insert Canton Central)

For the sake of argument....
(Grouped by enrollment and competitive balance numbers per OHSAA bi=annually as they COULD shake out)
"FED AAA"
McKinley, GlenOak, Jackson, Hoover and Washington
"FED AA"
Perry, Green, Lake, Louisville, Central Catholic

(6 conference games each season, 4 divisional, 2 that are not) first four weeks of each season are open dates.
Existing season ending rivalries remain in place every season:
McKinley-Massillon; GlenOak-Perry; Jackson-Hoover; Lake-Green (or Louisville); Central-Louisville (or Green).

It's the most logical move for the Stark County schools involved, but the furthest from happening today. Maybe not tomorrow...
But you never know.

Something has to jive for the puzzle pieces that are moving if the Leps get an invitation handed to them, after all, they were in discussion to make a new conference with Washington as a member and they are planning on a home/home series to take place because both schools know what they are up against as independents. It's not the same any more as it was 20 years ago.

Does this make the FED better or worse? It depends on how you see the competition. Louisville, Lake just don't have the numbers to face McK, GO, Jax and WAS week in and week out for 7 straight games unless they are loaded.
A split will be necessary and two more invites are also.
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  #39  
Old 02-03-17, 06:16 PM
kingpin2010 kingpin2010 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteelValley View Post
Any interest out of Louisville to join the Youngstown-based AAC? I think school size-wise it's s good fit. And I'd think the drive is no worse than Suburban league? Louisville would likely be in a tier with Boardman, Fitch, Warren Harding, Canfield, Howland, Youngstown East and Lakeside.
Well in all sports but football. Football I'd assume they'd be in a tier with Canfield, Howland, Niles, Poland, and East. Which would be a solid tier. Travel would still be pretty rough, closest being Canfield at 44 minutes according to Google maps.
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  #40  
Old 02-03-17, 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted by SteelValley View Post
Any interest out of Louisville to join the Youngstown-based AAC? I think school size-wise it's s good fit. And I'd think the drive is no worse than Suburban league? Louisville would likely be in a tier with Boardman, Fitch, Warren Harding, Canfield, Howland, Youngstown East and Lakeside.
No way. Never.
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  #41  
Old 02-03-17, 09:18 PM
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Originally Posted by joelmama View Post
Your number is crazy. Not even close just think about what that number represents.

There are about 200 away trips that would use a bus for a 7-12 sports school like Louisville. If the average trip is an extra 20 miles each way that is an extra 8000 miles. $300K says that those miles each cost $38. I would sy you are off by a factor of 10.
Have you factored in that some trips require more than 1 bus? That's a large chunk of the expense whether that bus travels 1 mile or 100 miles.

When football travels to an away game, how many buses does it require to transport the team? I would assume 1 bus for the cheerleaders. How many buses for the band? Don't forget that if the varsity is home, the freshmen are usually traveling during the week, and the JVs are usually traveling on Saturday...

When cross country goes to a meet, do the boys and girls teams travel on separate buses? How many buses does it take to get the boys and girls track teams to a dual meet?

I ask because Jackson needs 7 buses to transport their boys and girls track teams to a dual meet. It takes them 6 or 7 buses to travel to a cross country meet. Heaven knows how many they need for football with the size of their team and band.

Is Louisville going to save $300,000 on transportation by joining the Fed? Probably not. They probably don't require as many buses as the average Fed school. Plus, the mileage difference between what Louisville would have in the Fed versus the NBC is probably much smaller than what Green had in the Suburban versus what Green has in the Fed.
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  #42  
Old 02-03-17, 09:42 PM
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Some more checking via Mapquest:

Green's total mileage 1-way in the Suburban (7 locations): 162.3 miles
Green's total mileage 1-way in the Fed (6 locations): 64.6 miles
If you want, add in the 26.5 mile trip Green made to Highland in 2015 during their non-league week during the Fed schedule. They still come out way ahead in football and would do so in any sport unless the extra nonleague contests they have to fill require them to travel a long way.

Also of surprise is that Green's longest Fed trip (Perry) is .2 miles shorter than their shortest Suburban trip (Tallmadge).

Louisville's mileage 1-way in the NBC (7 locations): 117.2 miles
Louisville's mileage 1-way in the Fed (7 locations): 97.7 miles

Less mileage in the Fed which could reduce Louisville's travel costs by a small amount, but nowhere near the reduction Green experienced from moving to the Fed. Travel time in the Fed might not be much better than what Louisville had in the NBC. Outside of Alliance and the area around Canton South, there isn't much congestion nor many traffic controls to slow travel to the NBC schools. By contrast, travel from Louisville to the Fed schools is 1 traffic light after another (except perhaps for the trip to GlenOak) which negates some of the shorter travel distances.
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  #43  
Old 02-03-17, 10:22 PM
Bluestreakoffice Bluestreakoffice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lynus24 View Post
Louisville fields 21-22 varsity sports depending if you count gymnastics.
Football
Boys BB
Girls BB
Baseball
Softball
Wrestling
Boys soccer
Girls soccer
Boys tennis
Girls tennis
Boys lacrosse
Girls lacrosse
Boys swimming
Girls swimming
Boys cross country
Girls cross country
Volleyball
Boys golf
Girls golf
Boys track
Girls track
And gymnastics
Some sports share a bus, some have varsity, jv, and frosh teams. Doing the "math" using 7-12 sports isn't gonna get you close to the answer your looking for.
These are just sports teams and travel...factor in all groups including band and that's a huge chunk of change. The $300,000 Green claimed to save is totally believable.

Appreciate the breakdown and support! Made the explanation very easy!
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  #44  
Old 02-03-17, 10:30 PM
Bluestreakoffice Bluestreakoffice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Slippery View Post
Some more checking via Mapquest:

Green's total mileage 1-way in the Suburban (7 locations): 162.3 miles
Green's total mileage 1-way in the Fed (6 locations): 64.6 miles
If you want, add in the 26.5 mile trip Green made to Highland in 2015 during their non-league week during the Fed schedule. They still come out way ahead in football and would do so in any sport unless the extra nonleague contests they have to fill require them to travel a long way.

Also of surprise is that Green's longest Fed trip (Perry) is .2 miles shorter than their shortest Suburban trip (Tallmadge).

Louisville's mileage 1-way in the NBC (7 locations): 117.2 miles
Louisville's mileage 1-way in the Fed (7 locations): 97.7 miles

Less mileage in the Fed which could reduce Louisville's travel costs by a small amount, but nowhere near the reduction Green experienced from moving to the Fed. Travel time in the Fed might not be much better than what Louisville had in the NBC. Outside of Alliance and the area around Canton South, there isn't much congestion nor many traffic controls to slow travel to the NBC schools. By contrast, travel from Louisville to the Fed schools is 1 traffic light after another (except perhaps for the trip to GlenOak) which negates some of the shorter travel distances.
Mr. Slippery appreciate the breakdown and your support! I was using the Green info to show how being closer and not being in the Suburban helped reduce costs to their total sport program. Just think of the costs Louisville would incur by joining the Suburban and then have to deal with reduced crowds too.
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  #45  
Old 02-03-17, 10:46 PM
Bluestreakoffice Bluestreakoffice is offline
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Originally Posted by DaveDawg View Post
First Louisville, then FED AD's will seek Massillon to somehow 'agree' to join and the split into two divisions with two or three cross over games with one more opening to fill out. (Insert Canton Central)

For the sake of argument....
(Grouped by enrollment and competitive balance numbers per OHSAA bi=annually as they COULD shake out)
"FED AAA"
McKinley, GlenOak, Jackson, Hoover and Washington
"FED AA"
Perry, Green, Lake, Louisville, Central Catholic

(6 conference games each season, 4 divisional, 2 that are not) first four weeks of each season are open dates.
Existing season ending rivalries remain in place every season:
McKinley-Massillon; GlenOak-Perry; Jackson-Hoover; Lake-Green (or Louisville); Central-Louisville (or Green).

It's the most logical move for the Stark County schools involved, but the furthest from happening today. Maybe not tomorrow...
But you never know.

Something has to jive for the puzzle pieces that are moving if the Leps get an invitation handed to them, after all, they were in discussion to make a new conference with Washington as a member and they are planning on a home/home series to take place because both schools know what they are up against as independents. It's not the same any more as it was 20 years ago.

Does this make the FED better or worse? It depends on how you see the competition. Louisville, Lake just don't have the numbers to face McK, GO, Jax and WAS week in and week out for 7 straight games unless they are loaded.
A split will be necessary and two more invites are also.
The effort to start a new league for Louisville is there, but Lake said no from the beginning. Wooster has been listening but won't commit. I think what has happened is the scheduling as an independent has become very difficult. I do know that Louisville has scheduled everyone in the Fed for the 2018 season but GlenOak and McKinley. I am including Green on their schedule but am not sure about this.
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  #46  
Old 02-03-17, 10:55 PM
Mackinbiner Mackinbiner is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr. Slippery View Post
Some more checking via Mapquest:

Green's total mileage 1-way in the Suburban (7 locations): 162.3 miles
Green's total mileage 1-way in the Fed (6 locations): 64.6 miles
If you want, add in the 26.5 mile trip Green made to Highland in 2015 during their non-league week during the Fed schedule. They still come out way ahead in football and would do so in any sport unless the extra nonleague contests they have to fill require them to travel a long way.

Also of surprise is that Green's longest Fed trip (Perry) is .2 miles shorter than their shortest Suburban trip (Tallmadge).

Louisville's mileage 1-way in the NBC (7 locations): 117.2 miles
Louisville's mileage 1-way in the Fed (7 locations): 97.7 miles

Less mileage in the Fed which could reduce Louisville's travel costs by a small amount, but nowhere near the reduction Green experienced from moving to the Fed. Travel time in the Fed might not be much better than what Louisville had in the NBC. Outside of Alliance and the area around Canton South, there isn't much congestion nor many traffic controls to slow travel to the NBC schools. By contrast, travel from Louisville to the Fed schools is 1 traffic light after another (except perhaps for the trip to GlenOak) which negates some of the shorter travel distances.
Comparing Green's move from the Suburban to the Federal League to Louisville's going from the NBC to the Fed isn't the right way to look at it. Louisville and the NBC are essentially no longer affiliated. I feel you should make the comparison to Louisville's travel as an independent.
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  #47  
Old 02-04-17, 08:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Mackinbiner View Post
Comparing Green's move from the Suburban to the Federal League to Louisville's going from the NBC to the Fed isn't the right way to look at it. Louisville and the NBC are essentially no longer affiliated. I feel you should make the comparison to Louisville's travel as an independent.
Fair point, but without knowing what Louisville's independent schedule will ultimately look like, I have no basis to make that comparison at this time.

The closest we can come right now is to compare Northwest's travel in the NBC to their travel as an independent.
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  #48  
Old 02-04-17, 08:43 AM
19AL63 19AL63 is offline
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In most cases a school should pay the AD a lot more money than a school in a conference. Reason for above statement? Over the years of watching HS sports the AD of independents works much harder finding teams to fill out a schedule each year, not a thing I would want to face day in and day out.
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  #49  
Old 02-04-17, 10:21 AM
joelmama joelmama is offline
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Originally Posted by Lynus24 View Post
Louisville fields 21-22 varsity sports depending if you count gymnastics.
Football
Boys BB
Girls BB
Baseball
Softball
Wrestling
Boys soccer
Girls soccer
Boys tennis
Girls tennis
Boys lacrosse
Girls lacrosse
Boys swimming
Girls swimming
Boys cross country
Girls cross country
Volleyball
Boys golf
Girls golf
Boys track
Girls track
And gymnastics
Some sports share a bus, some have varsity, jv, and frosh teams. Doing the "math" using 7-12 sports isn't gonna get you close to the answer your looking for.
These are just sports teams and travel...factor in all groups including band and that's a huge chunk of change. The $300,000 Green claimed to save is totally believable.
Sorry do the math you cannot justify that number in any possible way.
So Football has Varsity, JV, Freshman and Jr High 4 teams with five trips each 20 trips. Assume 5 busses for varsity and 1 for all other levels.
Basketball has trips for Varsity, Freshman and Jr High trips same for girls about 11 trips for varsity and about 9 for the others. Total trips is 58.
Baseball and Softball has Varsity and JV and has about 10-12 trips for each say a total of 44 trips for both sports.
Wrestling has Varsity and Jr High and most trips are group meets that would not change a lot with a league change lets assume that you would have 7 longer trips in each for a total of 14 trips.
Soccer has Varsity JV together and Jr High. About 8 trips for each total of 32 for both boys and girls.
Lacrosse is not sponsored by Suburban league so that should not change at all.
Swimming, cross country and track both genders travel together and would have about 7 travels for each sport. I do not think there is sponsored swimming below high school so for JR High and Varsity there are a total of 5 sports with a total of 35 trips.

That is only slightly above 200 trips. Football certainly takes extra buses.
If they did take buses for Golf, Tennis etc add another 50 trips. Add an extra 4-5 busses for football. that still is less than 300 trips.

Mr Slippery did the math and the extra mileage for Green Suburban vs. Fed was 100 miles per sport per season. Lets double that difference and make it 200 miles difference per sport and say there is 25 sports for 5000 miles are you then trying to say that each mile costs $60? That is what it takes to reach $300K difference. Or if you take my 300 trips and say each trip is now 20 miles longer that is 6000 miles so each mile would only cost $50. Of course you need to factor in that your current OOC matches and games are now probably closer than they were previously so take something like 20% off that and you are back to $60 per mile.

I stand by what I say and will tell you that $300,000 difference is completely and utterly wrong.


Mr. Slippery said 6-7 buses for a coed track meet is out of his mind. That would mean that they are transporting 250 people? Do the meets take 12 hours?
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  #50  
Old 02-04-17, 11:56 AM
Spread All Day Spread All Day is offline
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From a numbers standpoint it doesn't look good.

Would Louisville be able to continue to compete in the future?

Are they competitive in other sports?
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  #51  
Old 02-04-17, 12:35 PM
BGFalcons86 BGFalcons86 is offline
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Given the current configuration of the FL, in what sports would Louisville have a realistic shot at a league championship? At a very quick glance, I'll say boys cross country, perhaps softball (?), but I didn't go through the list sport-by-sport. My quick guess is you're looking a whole lot of lower half (5-8) finishes.
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  #52  
Old 02-04-17, 12:50 PM
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I'm very happy to see Louisville looking at the FED but I'll be surprised if it happens. I've played softball and bowled there since I was young and I also had the privilege to coach in the Little Leopard program for a hand full of years. I know a lot of Louisville folks and my best friends are old Leopards and most of them suffer from the same thing... Extreme PRIDE. We all believe the Leopards could compete but winning League titles every 5-10 years in any sport won't be enough.
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  #53  
Old 02-04-17, 12:50 PM
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I'd agree with that. Softball,CC, and football some years. But in years where the football talent just isn't there like 2011-2012, it could get really ugly.
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  #54  
Old 02-04-17, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BGFalcons86 View Post
Given the current configuration of the FL, in what sports would Louisville have a realistic shot at a league championship? At a very quick glance, I'll say boys cross country, perhaps softball (?), but I didn't go through the list sport-by-sport. My quick guess is you're looking a whole lot of lower half (5-8) finishes.
you dont think theyd compete in football?

they would win less titles than they currently do in any given sport but be better prepared for the post season. which is more important ?
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  #55  
Old 02-04-17, 03:21 PM
Stack Attack Stack Attack is offline
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Originally Posted by BGFalcons86 View Post
Mr. General... That is exactly the league I wanted. I would liked to have picked off Alliance or maybe Marlington from the NBC, but I don't know that either would've been interested in that league.
It's a shame too this all happened to Louisville right after NW joined the PAC. They would have been a duo combo to start a new league.

NW
Louisville
Marlington
Alliance
Canton South
Central

Throw in someone like Coventry or Dover/New Philadelphia and go play ball or if the NBC would have split into two divisions and created a west vs east division
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  #56  
Old 02-04-17, 04:03 PM
BGFalcons86 BGFalcons86 is offline
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Originally Posted by y2h View Post
you dont think theyd compete in football?

they would win less titles than they currently do in any given sport but be better prepared for the post season. which is more important ?
They would compete in football most years (a down year could get ugly), but winning a title would be a long shot. Lake hasn't won a FLC in football since '98. My guess is it would look similar for Louisville.
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  #57  
Old 02-04-17, 04:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BGFalcons86 View Post
Given the current configuration of the FL, in what sports would Louisville have a realistic shot at a league championship? At a very quick glance, I'll say boys cross country, perhaps softball (?), but I didn't go through the list sport-by-sport. My quick guess is you're looking a whole lot of lower half (5-8) finishes.
Outside of football, boys and girls basketball that's McKinley.
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  #58  
Old 02-04-17, 04:06 PM
BGFalcons86 BGFalcons86 is offline
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Originally Posted by Stack Attack View Post
It's a shame too this all happened to Louisville right after NW joined the PAC. They would have been a duo combo to start a new league.

NW
Louisville
Marlington
Alliance
Canton South
Central

Throw in someone like Coventry or Dover/New Philadelphia and go play ball or if the NBC would have split into two divisions and created a west vs east division
This isn't going to happen, because Alliance, Marlington and Canton South have already decided they don't want to be in the same league as Louisville. I can understand South and Minerva wanting Louisville out, but Alliance and Marlington is a different matter, IMHO.
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  #59  
Old 02-04-17, 04:09 PM
BGFalcons86 BGFalcons86 is offline
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Originally Posted by The Butler View Post
Outside of football, boys and girls basketball that's McKinley.
Quite true. In the All-Sports standings, Louisville would probably finish ahead of McKinley on a fairly regular basis, but I'd guess that football and basketball are the major drivers in decisions like this.
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  #60  
Old 02-04-17, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by y2h View Post
you dont think theyd compete in football?

they would win less titles than they currently do in any given sport but be better prepared for the post season. which is more important ?
It's hard to say -- sometimes programs can get exposed pretty badly by changing leagues. Winning begets winning and all that, and you go from 9-1 every year to having some 5-5 type years and a couple losing seasons sprinkled in. Depth issues could be a problem. I agree though, I think Louisville would be fine in the Fed. They hang with Hoover always, and there's not much difference between the all of the Fed football squads (other than Green) these days. As long as they get to 6-4 they're good to make the postseason in D3, and very well prepared.

The other sports are going to be a wipeout, though. That's going to stir up some problems.
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