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  #1  
Old 03-20-17, 01:33 PM
dion dion is offline
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OAC Parental Behavior

Very disappointed and disgusted by the behavior of a few parents (coaches) at the OAC tournament this weekend. Too well run and organized to merit security having to remove at least 3 parents/coaches that I'm aware of. The most abusive behavior that I observed was by a parent/coach sitting in the chair at a 74 lb semi final match. When the match ended the profanity leveled at the the referee officiating would rival just about any tirade I have ever heard. Being on the floor I saw nothing even controversial. I know the asst. official is a state official and supported the officials calls. Regardless, it was sad to see that display as a role model.
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  #2  
Old 03-20-17, 02:14 PM
tkdn_wizard tkdn_wizard is offline
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That surprised? We hear about this all the time, becoming more frequent too. Unfortunate.
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  #3  
Old 03-20-17, 02:52 PM
jmog jmog is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dion View Post
Very disappointed and disgusted by the behavior of a few parents (coaches) at the OAC tournament this weekend. Too well run and organized to merit security having to remove at least 3 parents/coaches that I'm aware of. The most abusive behavior that I observed was by a parent/coach sitting in the chair at a 74 lb semi final match. When the match ended the profanity leveled at the the referee officiating would rival just about any tirade I have ever heard. Being on the floor I saw nothing even controversial. I know the asst. official is a state official and supported the officials calls. Regardless, it was sad to see that display as a role model.
Happens much more often when dad is in the corner rather than coach.

Not that it never happens in HS, but I have been to many HS tournaments and the occurrence is FAR less often than youth and junior high.

News flash, parents, on average, are idiots, especially when the game/match deals with their kid.
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Old 03-20-17, 04:00 PM
bucksman bucksman is offline
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Which goes back to why it's hard to retain officials across sports, especially with the newer officials asked to officiate contests where parents are the coaches in order to gain experience (this is not specific to any sport, since I am a baseball umpire, and most of my work as a younger official was with 10U, 12U, 14U where parents were coaches - though luckily for me, they were generally civil and not belligerent).
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  #5  
Old 03-20-17, 04:14 PM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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One of the real problems with this sort of event is that there is no suitable punishment for acting like an idiot.
In a HS or JH event, there are a range of penalties possible (depending on severity) up to Flagrant Misconduct on the individual. When that happens the the offender is out of the building, will miss several contests, and have to take an OHSAA mandated course. There may also be a fine and there are occasions when the offender has to travel to Columbus to meet with the Commissioner. Most often their Principal or Superintendent has to make the trip as well. You can imagine how happy they are when that is required. All of this contributes to keeping folks in line.
The OAC has no such procedure. Because of this the coach/parent is either in the gym or they are out.
IMO, they really need to address this before it gets more out of hand.
BTW, there is absolutely no reason any official should have to deal with this sort of abuse.
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  #6  
Old 03-20-17, 04:28 PM
MPhillips MPhillips is offline
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Quote:
74 lb semi final match.
I saw this one on FLO, dead center of the webcast....The "adult" got booted.

Quote:
BTW, there is absolutely no reason any official should have to deal with this sort of abuse.
None.
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  #7  
Old 03-20-17, 04:42 PM
innoshape innoshape is offline
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If not being civil were a crime, then our streets would be empty. Some just don't know about good manners.
Serious question for Jim, do the referees charge enough to put up with the abuse when they know what they are getting into? I agree the OAC needs to get on the ball with the bad dads but it's about $ and tolerating the small % of bad dads perhaps.
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  #8  
Old 03-20-17, 04:42 PM
Lambeau Fields Lambeau Fields is offline
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Like they say about fights between college faculty: "They fights are so vicious because the stakes are so low.
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  #9  
Old 03-20-17, 04:51 PM
innoshape innoshape is offline
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unless you are an associate professor or the other faculty member tattles?
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  #10  
Old 03-20-17, 04:59 PM
88 Indian 88 Indian is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmog View Post

News flash, parents, on average, are idiots, especially when the game/match deals with their kid.
No, parents on average are not idiots. The idiots are a very small minority of parents.
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  #11  
Old 03-20-17, 05:18 PM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by innoshape View Post
Serious question for Jim, do the referees charge enough to put up with the abuse when they know what they are getting into? I agree the OAC needs to get on the ball with the bad dads but it's about $ and tolerating the small % of bad dads perhaps.
By "charge enough", I assume you mean what we are paid?
Well, I worked the Brecksville District event and they were always good with us. I got away from it as with advancing age, the three days in a row was really hard to do.
I am not sure that more money would change anything at all. The worst offenders, at least to me, were the Dads who think they are a qualified coach. There are several problems with this.
First, how many kids want to listen to anything Dad has to say?
Then, they "think" they know the rules. Generally they are so far off that it is hard to take them seriously. Add the fact that they have no idea what the proper procedure is for asking questions AND the fact that they think they can question anything and everything. It can make for a very long day should the official not be strong.
Brecksville always had two officials per mat so that really helps minimize problems.
I want to stress no OAC event is going to be awarding a college scholarship and most people are not a problem. It is the very few who act like fools that give youth events a bad name.
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  #12  
Old 03-20-17, 05:18 PM
MPhillips MPhillips is offline
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Originally Posted by 88 Indian View Post
No, parents on average are not idiots. The idiots are a very small minority of parents.

Who reflect poorly on the whole group.... One 'bad' soldier...Everyone is to blame. Pretty common these days.
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  #13  
Old 03-20-17, 05:33 PM
Eagle112 Eagle112 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bucksman View Post
Which goes back to why it's hard to retain officials across sports, especially with the newer officials asked to officiate contests where parents are the coaches in order to gain experience (this is not specific to any sport, since I am a baseball umpire, and most of my work as a younger official was with 10U, 12U, 14U where parents were coaches - though luckily for me, they were generally civil and not belligerent).
My 16yo daughter went thru that this weekend. She was at a soccer tournament and refereeing and is usually a sideline ref with limited Center/primary experience. This tournament encouraged her to center ref and get experience and placed her in some lower level matches. Overall it went well but she had a couple of games with parents/coaches getting out of hand and her not having the experience to handle it. I know she probably made some mistakes but that is how the officials learn just like the coaches and competitors.(Experience). This is why it is hard to retain new officials.
Lucky she has thick skin and thinks they don't know what they're talking about!! Haha
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  #14  
Old 03-20-17, 05:34 PM
MPhillips MPhillips is offline
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Quote:
Then, they "think" they know the rules. Generally they are so far off that it is hard to take them seriously. Add the fact that they have no idea what the proper procedure is for asking questions AND the fact that they think they can question anything and everything.
Dad 'coaches' are a hard nut to crack. "Unfair" in their eyes many times is driven by emotion. I know this because I've lived it. I coached many other people's kids and I remember times when my Pop was out of line. I was never that coach. I don't have children, so the 'emotional' part was never there. My kids won or lost. I questioned a call now and then...but only from a coaches perspective. 'Dad's' in the corner brought too much 'emotion' and too much 'anxiety' for their kids.
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Old 03-20-17, 05:37 PM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPhillips View Post
Dad 'coaches' are a hard nut to crack. "Unfair" in their eyes many times is driven by emotion. I know this because I've lived it. I coached many other people's kids and I remember times when my Pop was out of line. I was never that coach. I don't have children, so the 'emotional' part was never there. My kids won or lost. I questioned a call now and then...but only from a coaches perspective. 'Dad's' in the corner brought too much 'emotion' and too much 'anxiety' for their kids.
So VERY, VERY true.
Sounds like you figured it out pretty well.
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  #16  
Old 03-20-17, 05:52 PM
MPhillips MPhillips is offline
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Originally Posted by Jim Behrens View Post
So VERY, VERY true.
Sounds like you figured it out pretty well.
My Pop was my biggest fan, but he never saw a wrestling mat until I was eleven! We wrestled all year round, every year until I was eighteen. Not that he wasn't 'learned', but he was still 'new' even after eight yrs!
He was a passionate, 'Dad.' I loved him for it. But I knew more about wrestling than he did. We laughed about it later in life.
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  #17  
Old 03-20-17, 06:19 PM
innoshape innoshape is offline
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Jim, Yes, Charge enough, i.e, how much you get paid. I mean many of us who have everyday jobs and careers on here have to put up with difficult people on a daily, hourly or every minute basis to earn a living. How many refs make a living at reffing wrestling? Safe to say none so that leaves those who volunteer and love the sport or the very few others who may have other reasons. I respect referees. It is an oftentimes thankless job. I also figured out a long time ago that there isn't a nexus between the money a ref makes and the decline in asinine coaches/fans so we agree on that. My point was after this long intro is that if you can't penalize the bad dads, coaches or fans, that refs have a choice too. Some may charge or require payment of a premium to deal with the Aholes or some may have thicker skin and just deal with it.
Edit: To be clear, I respect all refs unless I find out they are in it for the wrong reasons (use your imagination)
I also don't condone any abusive behavior at any sporting events particularly when kids are present.
Expressio unius est exclusio alterius does not apply to my post

Last edited by innoshape; 03-20-17 at 06:36 PM. Reason: Clarification
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  #18  
Old 03-20-17, 07:00 PM
dion dion is offline
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[QUOTE=MPhillips;6732270]I saw this one on FLO, dead center of the webcast....The "adult" got booted.


Was allowed back in but had to be in the stands, just couldn't coach. What does this say for the OAC's support for their officials. FACT!
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  #19  
Old 03-20-17, 07:40 PM
darthmalice darthmalice is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 88 Indian View Post
No, parents on average are not idiots. The idiots are a very small minority of parents.
Thank you.
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  #20  
Old 03-20-17, 08:29 PM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Originally Posted by innoshape View Post
Jim, Yes, Charge enough, i.e, how much you get paid. I mean many of us who have everyday jobs and careers on here have to put up with difficult people on a daily, hourly or every minute basis to earn a living. How many refs make a living at reffing wrestling? Safe to say none so that leaves those who volunteer and love the sport or the very few others who may have other reasons. I respect referees. It is an oftentimes thankless job. I also figured out a long time ago that there isn't a nexus between the money a ref makes and the decline in asinine coaches/fans so we agree on that. My point was after this long intro is that if you can't penalize the bad dads, coaches or fans, that refs have a choice too. Some may charge or require payment of a premium to deal with the Aholes or some may have thicker skin and just deal with it.
Edit: To be clear, I respect all refs unless I find out they are in it for the wrong reasons (use your imagination)
I also don't condone any abusive behavior at any sporting events particularly when kids are present.
Expressio unius est exclusio alterius does not apply to my post
I am not entirely sure I understand your point but I will give you my thoughts on this.

If anyone gets into officiating for the money, they will be sadly disillusioned. I guess I do okay but I have been at this for a long time. I have no complaints. I get the best seat in the house and I get to see some really talented kids up close plus they pay me. What could be better?

That said, this was a post about one parent/coach who was apparently out of control. That happens. What I posted was the difference between a sanctioned HS or JH event with clearly defined rules concerning behavior versus what appears to be permitted at OAC events. The difference keeps the coaches (real coaches and not wanna-bees) from doing something like swearing at me or acting out.

No official I know takes the decision to toss a coach lightly. When it happens, it is serious. I expect the management to do what is needed, escort the individual out, and keep them out. Anything less is not acceptable.

Knowing the people who run the OAC events, I doubt that they have any "rookies" out there. The events are far too important for that. I know that many of the officials they have just did a State Championship a week or two before. They know what they are doing.

One of the posters above alluded to the loss of officials. This is not in wrestling only. It is occurring for a number of reasons but we are losing guys at an alarming rate.

In closing, I enjoy what I do. When I take a contract, I know what I am getting into. I know my responsibilities but I also know what to do when things go south.
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