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  #31  
Old 07-08-19, 06:06 PM
haveaclue haveaclue is offline
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Crestwood BOE voting tomorrow to stay or leave. Sounds like the current County schools not having the full offering of sports is a major issue. I think they’re gone. For a born and bred Red Devil, feels very strange to see CVC.
  #32  
Old 07-08-19, 07:44 PM
wildcat71 wildcat71 is offline
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As a former Crestwood employee...hard to believe they are leaving long time rivalries. Garfield, Mogadore, Rootstown, Southeast. But of course their main rival Streetsboro has been gone for a while. Hard to see change....it will increase their transportation costs like Waterloo and Windham have experienced. For districts with problems passing levies this certainly doesn't help.
  #33  
Old 07-08-19, 10:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wildcat71 View Post
As a former Crestwood employee...hard to believe they are leaving long time rivalries. Garfield, Mogadore, Rootstown, Southeast. But of course their main rival Streetsboro has been gone for a while. Hard to see change....it will increase their transportation costs like Waterloo and Windham have experienced. For districts with problems passing levies this certainly doesn't help.
On top of that, according to the Record Courier, the league fees for the PTC is less than $3000 per school, the CVC is over $8000.

Their extra travel wouldn’t be that much, an average of like 4 or 5 miles more per away game. Remember Crestwood is basically the furthest north team in the PTC. They already average about 24 miles each way for away games (all numbers from the RC).
  #34  
Old 07-09-19, 07:22 AM
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Didn't realize the high cost of joining a league...can anyone provide any insight as to what these costs go towards? Just looking at numbers the PTC had 15 schools at $3,000 per schools is $45,000 a year - CVC 24 schools at $8,000 per school is $192,000! If districts are footing bill on transportation, officials, coaching salaries, etc just wondering how they justify that fee.
  #35  
Old 07-09-19, 08:13 AM
jmog jmog is offline
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Originally Posted by PTC Junky View Post
Didn't realize the high cost of joining a league...can anyone provide any insight as to what these costs go towards? Just looking at numbers the PTC had 15 schools at $3,000 per schools is $45,000 a year - CVC 24 schools at $8,000 per school is $192,000! If districts are footing bill on transportation, officials, coaching salaries, etc just wondering how they justify that fee.
I don't know about the PTC, but the CVC runs a website that tracks standing/stats/etc for all/most sports PLUS they have a 3rd party (assume part time, not full time) league commissioner that gets paid something. The PTC just has a committee of the Superintendents I believe so no one getting paid by the league.

Again, all from the Record Courier article, I didn't know any of that myself (didn't know leagues had league fees until I read the article).
  #36  
Old 07-09-19, 02:47 PM
wildcat71 wildcat71 is offline
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Mantua Crestwood BOE meets tonight. Have a feeling it may be a split vote but probably passes.
  #37  
Old 07-09-19, 06:27 PM
wildcat71 wildcat71 is offline
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CVC commissioner is presenting to BOE. One board member so far expressing support. One questions loss of rivalries...we'll see...
  #38  
Old 07-09-19, 06:41 PM
open24 open24 is offline
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Felt like Waterloo not coming back was the final nail. Put Crestwood in a tough spot.

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  #39  
Old 07-09-19, 07:04 PM
kingpin2010 kingpin2010 is offline
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Crestwood votes to join CVC
  #40  
Old 07-09-19, 07:18 PM
CoventryTrackXCguy CoventryTrackXCguy is offline
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The final nail in the ptc. The metro schools will move on to bigger and better things (hopefully), and the county is crumbling. Feels like the end of an era.

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  #41  
Old 07-09-19, 07:47 PM
jmog jmog is offline
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Originally Posted by CoventryTrackXCguy View Post
The final nail in the ptc. The metro schools will move on to bigger and better things (hopefully), and the county is crumbling. Feels like the end of an era.

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Serious question, how did the Metro move to bigger and better things when they are the same league with the same teams.
  #42  
Old 07-09-19, 08:34 PM
wildcat71 wildcat71 is offline
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Will the remaining members shun Crestwood and not play them as most did to Waterloo?? Think they should. Also Crestwood will have fun beating up on Berkshire, Middlefield, Grand Valley and such before getting drilled by Kirtland!! A charter member of the original Portage County league as it was Mantua-Shalersville before Hiram District was added in the 60's . What a shame when out of town and county superintendents and athletic directors come, change everything and leave ( see Waterloo). Well at least 1 board member stood for the community wishes....
  #43  
Old 07-10-19, 01:11 AM
Buckeye Elite Buckeye Elite is offline
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How will this affect their OOC games the next couple
Years? Will there be any scheduling difficulties
  #44  
Old 07-10-19, 07:41 AM
CoventryTrackXCguy CoventryTrackXCguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmog View Post
Serious question, how did the Metro move to bigger and better things when they are the same league with the same teams.
Idk if it will be bigger and better things, but rather, thats what im hoping for.

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  #45  
Old 07-10-19, 07:52 AM
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Originally Posted by CoventryTrackXCguy View Post
Idk if it will be bigger and better things, but rather, thats what im hoping for.

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But they have the exact same teams, what is the hope that will be bigger/better?
  #46  
Old 07-10-19, 07:58 AM
CoventryTrackXCguy CoventryTrackXCguy is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmog View Post
But they have the exact same teams, what is the hope that will be bigger/better?
Well, it seems that the woodridge superintendant, who was the architect of this move, is going on about "education based athletics". Not entirely sure what this means. But it sounds good, I guess.


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  #47  
Old 07-10-19, 08:12 AM
jmog jmog is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CoventryTrackXCguy View Post
Well, it seems that the woodridge superintendant, who was the architect of this move, is going on about "education based athletics". Not entirely sure what this means. But it sounds good, I guess.


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He is pulling the wool over people's eyes. Education based athletics is just the term used on how we do it in the US. Athletics based around your school rather than club teams like most of Europe does it (proof in the link below as to what EBA means).

Once again, it will be the exact same teams they already play minus the county which gets brought in during smaller sports (tennis, wrestling, bowling, etc).

They gained nothing and lost teams for smaller sports.

I 100% understand why Crestwood just left with the Metro gone, but the Metro leaving in the first sense makes zero logical sense at all.

https://www.nfhs.org/articles/defini...vity-programs/
  #48  
Old 07-10-19, 09:19 AM
wildcat71 wildcat71 is offline
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I remember when they broke up the old PCL people saying it was the beginning of the end for local rivalries. May have taken longer than some thought...but looks like it has come true. Mogadore and Rootstown to the PAC, don't like that idea. Somehow the four remaining members need to reach out to Western Reserve, McDonald, Newton Falls...and Waterloo who of course would say no because of Mogadore.....
  #49  
Old 07-10-19, 09:31 AM
CDL92 CDL92 is offline
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Originally Posted by jmog View Post
He is pulling the wool over people's eyes. Education based athletics is just the term used on how we do it in the US. Athletics based around your school rather than club teams like most of Europe does it (proof in the link below as to what EBA means).

Once again, it will be the exact same teams they already play minus the county which gets brought in during smaller sports (tennis, wrestling, bowling, etc).

They gained nothing and lost teams for smaller sports.

I 100% understand why Crestwood just left with the Metro gone, but the Metro leaving in the first sense makes zero logical sense at all.

https://www.nfhs.org/articles/defini...vity-programs/
The Metro schools left because there were several issues they had been raising and changes they had been proposing over the last few years that a faction of County Superintendents and ADs blocked (or lobbied to be blocked). When the Metro schools realized they all wanted the same things - separating became the obvious choice over continued battles.

There are several county schools who look to the direction of one man when making decisions at the league level. Metro schools were tired of this person making decisions for them.
  #50  
Old 07-10-19, 09:38 AM
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Fairport leaves, Crestwood joins. If there are no other changes between now and 2020-2021, any guesses as to how the football/basketball alignments will look change? Will Crestwood join Cardinal, Berkshire, Kirtland, etc. in Valley? Makes the most sense in terms of geography. If they do, one of the Valley teams (Wickliffe, Hawken or Beachwood) would need to leave the Valley and join the Metro. For basketball, it will be a pretty easy swap as Fairport was in the Valley Division with Kirtland, Wickliffe, Berskhire, Cardinal, and Grand Valley.
  #51  
Old 07-10-19, 11:10 AM
jmog jmog is offline
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Originally Posted by CDL92 View Post
The Metro schools left because there were several issues they had been raising and changes they had been proposing over the last few years that a faction of County Superintendents and ADs blocked (or lobbied to be blocked). When the Metro schools realized they all wanted the same things - separating became the obvious choice over continued battles.

There are several county schools who look to the direction of one man when making decisions at the league level. Metro schools were tired of this person making decisions for them.
First real answer. What things did the metro want that the county schools kept voting down?
  #52  
Old 07-10-19, 11:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardzfan1234 View Post
Fairport leaves, Crestwood joins. If there are no other changes between now and 2020-2021, any guesses as to how the football/basketball alignments will look change? Will Crestwood join Cardinal, Berkshire, Kirtland, etc. in Valley? Makes the most sense in terms of geography. If they do, one of the Valley teams (Wickliffe, Hawken or Beachwood) would need to leave the Valley and join the Metro. For basketball, it will be a pretty easy swap as Fairport was in the Valley Division with Kirtland, Wickliffe, Berskhire, Cardinal, and Grand Valley.
And where does the rumored Lake Catholic addition fit into this picture?
  #53  
Old 07-10-19, 12:11 PM
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Originally Posted by jmog View Post
First real answer. What things did the metro want that the county schools kept voting down?
I don't know the full answer or all the details. I know one example is officiating - several schools were not happy with the pool of officials that were continually being assigned in certain sports - discussions to explore new ideas were typically immediately shot down - some believed to preserve friendships between a number of veteran officials and school/league administrators.
  #54  
Old 07-10-19, 04:45 PM
bucksman bucksman is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardzfan1234 View Post
Fairport leaves, Crestwood joins. If there are no other changes between now and 2020-2021, any guesses as to how the football/basketball alignments will look change? Will Crestwood join Cardinal, Berkshire, Kirtland, etc. in Valley? Makes the most sense in terms of geography. If they do, one of the Valley teams (Wickliffe, Hawken or Beachwood) would need to leave the Valley and join the Metro. For basketball, it will be a pretty easy swap as Fairport was in the Valley Division with Kirtland, Wickliffe, Berskhire, Cardinal, and Grand Valley.
Football is the only sport in a three division set-up of 8-7-7. I am speculating that Crestwood will go into the group of smaller schools in the east, while Beachwood will go to the smaller schools in the west (could be Wickliffe or Hawken as well).
BIG: Chagrin, Orange, West G, Perry, Lakeside, Geneva, Harvey, Edgewood
EAST: Berkshire, Cardinal, Crestwood, Grand Valley, Hawken, Kirtland, Wickliffe
WEST: Beachwood, Brooklyn, Cuyahoga Hts, Independence, Lutheran West, Richmond Hts, Trinity

Soccer also has a three division configuration
BIG: Chagrin, Orange, West G, Perry, Hawken, Harvey
EAST: Berkshire, Cardinal, Grand Valley, Kirtland, Lakeside, Geneva, Edgewood
WEST: Beachwood, Brooklyn, Cuyahoga Hts, Independence, Lutheran West, Trinity, Wickliffe
**with Crestwood joining, I would theorize a 7-7-7 scenario. However, there's some weird politics that have to get settled

Most of the other sports have four divisions (notably basketball and baseball), which are geographic/enrollment driven. Teams will play home-and-home
WEST: Brooklyn, Cuyahoga Hts, Lutheran West, Independence, Trinity
CENTRAL: Chagrin, Orange, West G, Beachwood, Hawken
NORTH: Harvey, Geneva, Perry, Lakeside, Edgewood
EAST: Richmond Hts, Wickliffe, Cardinal, Berkshire, Kirtland
**I think these were the groups, with Fairport either in the East or the North. There will have to be some shifting to accommodate Crestwood
  #55  
Old 07-11-19, 07:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bucksman View Post
Most of the other sports have four divisions (notably basketball and baseball), which are geographic/enrollment driven. Teams will play home-and-home
WEST: Brooklyn, Cuyahoga Hts, Lutheran West, Independence, Trinity
CENTRAL: Chagrin, Orange, West G, Beachwood, Hawken
NORTH: Harvey, Geneva, Perry, Lakeside, Edgewood
EAST: Richmond Hts, Wickliffe, Cardinal, Berkshire, Kirtland
**I think these were the groups, with Fairport either in the East or the North. There will have to be some shifting to accommodate Crestwood
Divisions were originally set as follows:

CHAGRIN - Beachwood, Chagrin Falls, Hawken, Orange, West Geauga
LAKE - Edgewood, Geneva, Harvey, Lakeside, Perry
METRO - Brooklyn, Cuyahoga Heights, Independence, Lutheran West, Richmond Heights, Trinity
VALLEY - Berkshire, Cardinal, Fairport, Grand Valley, Kirtland, Wickliffe

I imagine for these divisions, Crestwood would just plug in where Fairport was.
  #56  
Old 07-11-19, 10:28 AM
chemlab chemlab is offline
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Originally Posted by jmog View Post
He is pulling the wool over people's eyes. Education based athletics is just the term used on how we do it in the US. Athletics based around your school rather than club teams like most of Europe does it (proof in the link below as to what EBA means).

Once again, it will be the exact same teams they already play minus the county which gets brought in during smaller sports (tennis, wrestling, bowling, etc).

They gained nothing and lost teams for smaller sports.

I 100% understand why Crestwood just left with the Metro gone, but the Metro leaving in the first sense makes zero logical sense at all.

https://www.nfhs.org/articles/defini...vity-programs/
It makes a ton of logical sense.

The league was operated essentially on a one size fits all decision making model. That model made little sense to start and even less once schools like LCC and Valley Christian were brought into the mix. Now the metro schools are free to operate in a manner that works best for 8 fairly similarly situated districts.
  #57  
Old 07-11-19, 11:45 PM
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The PTC became a league that quality officials would not deal with. How they contracted and paid officials was out of date. They were so slow in the process that by the time they got around to things, 90% of officials were booked.

Scheduling of league events was also unacceptable in many sports. Schedules would not get changed from year to year and home and away games would just stay the same. Middle school might have same schools going against each other multiple times and not competing against other teams in the league at all in a season. Sports that have league tournaments had a bunch of issues where attention to detail type things just were not happening. Things were not progressing.

I do not agree with how things were done, but the league as an organization refused to meet the needs of the majority of it's members.

Crestwood getting out makes no sense though. They should be in the Metro anyway. Good luck.
 

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