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  #1  
Old 06-12-19, 12:20 PM
radiodaveagain radiodaveagain is offline
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Pennsylvania Bill Introduced To Separate Public & Private Schools State Championships

Pennsylvania Bill Introduced To Separate Public and Private Schools State Championships
https://statelinesportsnetwork.net/2...-championships

Don't expect this to happen in Ohio anytime soon...
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  #2  
Old 06-12-19, 01:04 PM
tom 48 tom 48 is offline
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Why does the govt need to get involved? Don't they have better things to do?
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  #3  
Old 06-12-19, 01:20 PM
arizonawildcat arizonawildcat is offline
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I thought that there was a general consensus on Yappi to never reply to anything radiodaveagain posts.
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  #4  
Old 06-12-19, 03:21 PM
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Mr. Slippery Mr. Slippery is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arizonawildcat View Post
I thought that there was a general consensus on Yappi to never reply to anything radiodaveagain posts.
Not quite. Each of his threads should have at least 1 response to provide a direct link to the story:

https://www.pennlive.com/highschools...e-details.html
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  #5  
Old 06-12-19, 03:32 PM
StateChampion2012 StateChampion2012 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tom 48 View Post
Why does the govt need to get involved? Don't they have better things to do?
Anything the government gets involved with usually gets wrecked. This sounds no different.
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  #6  
Old 06-12-19, 04:56 PM
tom 48 tom 48 is offline
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Originally Posted by StateChampion2012 View Post
Anything the government gets involved with usually gets wrecked. This sounds no different.
Some legislator's kid didn't win a championship , so the lawnmower parent is trying to " correct" it. After all, nothing is more important than that championship sweatshirt.
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  #7  
Old 06-12-19, 08:37 PM
Sykotyk Sykotyk is offline
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PA legislature passed a law in 1972 dictating the PIAA couldn't exclude private schools from membership. Prior to 72, PIAA was public schools only. It was actually private school legislators that complained and passed the law.

And it's been determined as long as that law is still in effect the PIAA must include them in the same championships as the public schools. No splitting.
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  #8  
Old 06-12-19, 08:48 PM
radiodaveagain radiodaveagain is offline
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If any of you read the story...The bill has the support of the Pennsylvania Catholic Conference (PCC) and Pennsylvania Interscholastic Athletic Association (PIAA) - on the link provided you can actually watch the press conference on the presentation of the bill.

This has been brewing for quite a few months...it is an issue nationwide if you would like to comment on the story on SSN Facebook page - https://www.facebook.com/statelinesportsnetwork/ -
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  #9  
Old 06-12-19, 11:01 PM
BASESWIMPARENT BASESWIMPARENT is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by radiodaveagain View Post
Pennsylvania Bill Introduced To Separate Public and Private Schools State Championships
https://statelinesportsnetwork.net/2...-championships

Don't expect this to happen in Ohio anytime soon...
I wish it would and I am a private school guy. Different models, different missions, different resources.
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  #10  
Old 06-12-19, 11:57 PM
Sykotyk Sykotyk is offline
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Since PA doesn't have open enrollment, transfers are much less common. A kid switching from one public to another must physically be moving. But to transfer to a private only had to say it's for a better education. Unlike Ohio, if the reason you switch schools is for athletics you can be barred from playing for your new team. But saying your transferring for a better education at a private school is the ultimate trump card. Public schools don't have such a benefit.
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  #11  
Old 06-13-19, 11:39 AM
aged jock aged jock is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sykotyk View Post
Since PA doesn't have open enrollment, transfers are much less common. A kid switching from one public to another must physically be moving. But to transfer to a private only had to say it's for a better education. Unlike Ohio, if the reason you switch schools is for athletics you can be barred from playing for your new team. But saying your transferring for a better education at a private school is the ultimate trump card. Public schools don't have such a benefit.
Of course they do. A kid can transfer from any private to his local public for any reason, with no restriction. And transferring public to private for any reason causes a 50% ineligibility.
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  #12  
Old 06-13-19, 12:37 PM
bkmk1 bkmk1 is offline
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I've said forever PA is way behind Ohio when it comes to High school sports.
First off, currently in PA there is a transfer rule just like Ohio. It says that if you transfer from a "boundary school" to a different boundary school (provided they prove you have truly moved), there is no penalty. But if you transfer from a "boundary school" to private, you can play the first 5 games, then you can not play the last 5 or in the playoffs for 1 year. Same if you transfer from a private to a public. (again exception: if you truly moved). Also PIAA made a huge mistake that pretty much everyone knows was a revenue driven decision. PA does not have nearly the amount of bigger cities that Ohio has. So there are less teams in PA. With that being said, schools are closing, less kids playing sports, so PA decided 2 years ago to expand most sports from 4 classes to 6 classes. (all for the extra gate $). PA has now really become a "give every one a medal". Also everyone can make the playoffs. No computer points like in Ohio. Every classification 6A, 5A, 4A, 3A, 2A, 1A is very watered down. I've mentioned this before, but PA runs everything through a district format. There are districts that are very small, and districts like the WPIAL- District 7 (Pittsburgh) that are quite large. But PA only allows each districts winner to make it to the PIAA state tournament. So the bigger districts will have their 2nd, 3rd, 4th place teams (etc...) out of the state playoffs, and smaller districts get their team in that stinks and would get blown out by other bigger districts 5th place team. Some districts may only have 1 or 2 teams in the entire district in certain classifications. While some bigger districts may have 16 teams in a classification. It is a joke and a farce. As far as Non boundary vs boundary schools (or Public vs .Private), and forcing them to have separate playoffs, it has really gained steam and momentum. I, like many in PA are glad and hope it happens. I will also say that I hope it never happens in Ohio. As a fan of Ohio HS football, it would ruin for me some of the best and biggest HS football playoff games I've ever seen. So my selfish side is hoping it happens in PA, and hoping it never happens in Ohio.
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  #13  
Old 06-13-19, 12:41 PM
bkmk1 bkmk1 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sykotyk View Post
Since PA doesn't have open enrollment, transfers are much less common. A kid switching from one public to another must physically be moving. But to transfer to a private only had to say it's for a better education. Unlike Ohio, if the reason you switch schools is for athletics you can be barred from playing for your new team. But saying your transferring for a better education at a private school is the ultimate trump card. Public schools don't have such a benefit.
Transfers are a lot more common than your think. And most are very much athletic driven. Also you can read my post number 13 just above this post.
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  #14  
Old 06-15-19, 12:19 PM
goldentornado goldentornado is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aged jock View Post
Of course they do. A kid can transfer from any private to his local public for any reason, with no restriction. And transferring public to private for any reason causes a 50% ineligibility.
The PIAA approved a new transfer rule that will force student-athletes who transfer in the 10th grade or later to sit out the next year's postseason in their respective sport unless they can prove a hardship. With few exceptions, any students who transfer after playing a sport in their 10th grade year shall not be eligible to participate in the ensuing PIAA tournament in that sport. The student, if otherwise eligible, may participate in that sport only during the regular season.
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  #15  
Old 06-15-19, 01:26 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by goldentornado View Post
The PIAA approved a new transfer rule that will force student-athletes who transfer in the 10th grade or later to sit out the next year's postseason in their respective sport unless they can prove a hardship. With few exceptions, any students who transfer after playing a sport in their 10th grade year shall not be eligible to participate in the ensuing PIAA tournament in that sport. The student, if otherwise eligible, may participate in that sport only during the regular season.
Looks like they may have been reading Yappi.com. I've proposed this rule several times. Simply let every kid transfer to any school without repercussions for their regular season. For the playoffs, all transfers are ineligible.

Make the regular season about the student/athlete. Take nothing away from them. Let the playoffs be about the school. Let the schools that do the best job developing their talent have the best chance at winning.

I know that alot of people don't like this idea but the reality is that well over 1/2 the high school student athletes will miss ONE game or less. It keeps the integrity of the athletic association intact and doesn't punish the student athlete.

Interestingly, our Little League baseball organization has something that is somewhat similar. We let kids from the area play in our local Little League but when it comes to All-Stars, Little League International mandates that each league have specific boundaries. Those that live within those boundaries are eligible to play All-Stars. Those that live outside the boundaries, their season comes to an end when the regular season ends. Even though they can't play All-Stars, they still have a great experience in the regular season.
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  #16  
Old 06-15-19, 02:10 PM
Cali_Eagle Cali_Eagle is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BASESWIMPARENT View Post
I wish it would and I am a private school guy. Different models, different missions, different resources.
This sums up the whole conflict better than anything I have ever seen posted here, including my own past posts on the topic. You can boil the millions of words on the 10,000 or so (hyperbole) post thread on competitive balance started by (I think) Mr. Wolf or Wolfe right down to the above IMHO.

Sort of like the Gettysburg Address. Short bittersweet and right to the heart of the matter.
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  #17  
Old 06-15-19, 06:04 PM
1965maw 1965maw is offline
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Good job PA!!!! Let's hope Ohio moves in the same direction!
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  #18  
Old 06-15-19, 07:30 PM
Sykotyk Sykotyk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aged jock View Post
Of course they do. A kid can transfer from any private to his local public for any reason, with no restriction. And transferring public to private for any reason causes a 50% ineligibility.
I don't considering going back to the public district you live in from a private school to be transferring. But you can go from Girard to Mercyhurst Prep to Cathedral Prep to Kennedy Catholic without much issue. But Girard to Fairview? Good luck without actually moving to the new district.

Don't get me wrong, I know players who moved from one district to another, on paper, just to go to the other school and still have their home and where they sleep in the other district. But, a change of address was always what was needed. And scrutinized.

if it's proven for athletic intent, though, it can still be denied.

The new rules just passed are going to change that, some.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bkmk1 View Post
I've said forever PA is way behind Ohio when it comes to High school sports.
First off, currently in PA there is a transfer rule just like Ohio. It says that if you transfer from a "boundary school" to a different boundary school (provided they prove you have truly moved), there is no penalty. But if you transfer from a "boundary school" to private, you can play the first 5 games, then you can not play the last 5 or in the playoffs for 1 year. Same if you transfer from a private to a public. (again exception: if you truly moved). Also PIAA made a huge mistake that pretty much everyone knows was a revenue driven decision. PA does not have nearly the amount of bigger cities that Ohio has. So there are less teams in PA. With that being said, schools are closing, less kids playing sports, so PA decided 2 years ago to expand most sports from 4 classes to 6 classes. (all for the extra gate $). PA has now really become a "give every one a medal". Also everyone can make the playoffs. No computer points like in Ohio. Every classification 6A, 5A, 4A, 3A, 2A, 1A is very watered down. I've mentioned this before, but PA runs everything through a district format. There are districts that are very small, and districts like the WPIAL- District 7 (Pittsburgh) that are quite large. But PA only allows each districts winner to make it to the PIAA state tournament. So the bigger districts will have their 2nd, 3rd, 4th place teams (etc...) out of the state playoffs, and smaller districts get their team in that stinks and would get blown out by other bigger districts 5th place team. Some districts may only have 1 or 2 teams in the entire district in certain classifications. While some bigger districts may have 16 teams in a classification. It is a joke and a farce. As far as Non boundary vs boundary schools (or Public vs .Private), and forcing them to have separate playoffs, it has really gained steam and momentum. I, like many in PA are glad and hope it happens. I will also say that I hope it never happens in Ohio. As a fan of Ohio HS football, it would ruin for me some of the best and biggest HS football playoff games I've ever seen. So my selfish side is hoping it happens in PA, and hoping it never happens in Ohio.
Only football does that come up. In every other sport, multiple teams from each district make it and it's based on number of teams in each district. Football, due to the number of weeks and how infrequently you can play, only basically take 1 team per district. EXCEPT for District 8, which is the PCL which has some rather odd quirks to their scheduling and playoffs.


Quote:
Originally Posted by bkmk1 View Post
Transfers are a lot more common than your think. And most are very much athletic driven. Also you can read my post number 13 just above this post.

But it was always much easier for players to transfer among public-private or private-to-home-district than public-to-public. Which is what you see much more of in Ohio due to open enrollment making it easy and transparent.

The new rules in PA are going to making things interesting, and we're still waiting to see how things shape up once it's at least one full cycle in.
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