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  #211  
Old 02-13-15, 09:07 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yakyak View Post
Can we get a definition on illegal screen. Is it shoulder width apart and arms not outside the body?

To me the illegal screen is like holding in football. You could point out some violation every possession in the half court. It seems illegal screens on the pick and roll are much more common than screens during other offensive execution.

Some aspects I need clarity:

1) Physical position of the body
2) Space needed to provide the defense
3) any other detail
In a nutshell...

- the screener must maintain a position within the vertical plane of his body.
- the screener must be stationary, except when both are moving in the same path and direction
- if the screen is set outside the visual field of the defender, timeand distance is a factor.

Because of the nature of the action, screening, like the holding example in football and the block/charge call in basketball, is always subject to debate.

There are 8 articles under the definition of a screen in the rule book and what the screener can and cannot do depends on the actions and locations of the defender........ It's a part of the rules that takes time to understand because the limitations change based on the events that take place leading up to the actual screen....



SECTION 40 SCREEN

ART. 1 . . .
A screen is legal action by a player who, without causing contact,
delays or prevents an opponent from reaching a desired position.

ART. 2 . . .
To establish a legal screening position:
a. The screener may face any direction.
b. Time and distance are relevant.
c. The screener must be stationary, except when both are moving in the same
path and the same direction.
d. The screener must stay within his/her vertical plane with a stance
approximately shoulder width apart.

ART. 3 . . .
When screening a stationary opponent from the front or side (within
the visual field), the screener may be anywhere short of contact.

ART. 4 . . .
When screening a stationary opponent from behind (outside the
visual field), the screener must allow the opponent one normal step backward
without contact.

ART. 5 . . .
When screening a moving opponent, the screener must allow the
opponent time and distance to avoid contact by stopping or changing direction.
The speed of the player to be screened will determine where the screener may
take his/her stationary position. The position will vary and may be one to two
normal steps or strides from the opponent.

ART. 6 . . .
When screening an opponent who is moving in the same path and
direction as the screener, the player behind is responsible if contact is made
because the player in front slows up or stops and the player behind overruns
his/her opponent.

ART. 7 . . .
A player who is screened within his/her visual field is expected to
avoid contact by going around the screener. In cases of screens outside the visual
field, the opponent may make inadvertent contact with the screener and if the
opponent is running rapidly, the contact may be severe. Such a case is to be ruled
as incidental contact provided the opponent stops or attempts to stop on contact
and moves around the screen, and provided the screener is not displaced if
he/she has the ball.

ART. 8 . . .
A player may not use the arms, hands, hips or shoulders to force
his/her way through a screen or to hold the screener and then push the screener
aside in order to maintain a guarding position on an opponent.
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  #212  
Old 02-13-15, 09:58 PM
yakyak yakyak is offline
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Allsport thank you so much for all the time you put in this for us.

Great info.
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  #213  
Old 02-13-15, 11:37 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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I know this has been covered but I've seen it so many times lately just want to get confirmation.

The ball is in the front-court. Pass from the free-throw line towards half-court. Ball is slapped up in the air by a defender. Ball bounces near the half-court line (still in the front court). Before the ball hits for a second time, the offensive player catches the ball with both feet in the back-court. The ball had clearly gone into the back-court before it was caught but it had never touched anything.

Is this a back-court violation?
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  #214  
Old 02-14-15, 09:22 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yakyak View Post
Allsport thank you so much for all the time you put in this for us.

Great info.
You're welcome.....
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  #215  
Old 02-14-15, 09:36 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yappi View Post
I know this has been covered but I've seen it so many times lately just want to get confirmation.

The ball is in the front-court. Pass from the free-throw line towards half-court. Ball is slapped up in the air by a defender. Ball bounces near the half-court line (still in the front court). Before the ball hits for a second time, the offensive player catches the ball with both feet in the back-court. The ball had clearly gone into the back-court before it was caught but it had never touched anything.

Is this a back-court violation?
Yes, and here's why.....

First, the slap of the ball by the defender does not constitute a change in team control.

Next, since the ball never touched the back court, it still retains front court status.

Because of this, the offensive players catching of this ball in the air, in the back court, creates the violation.

Not a popular call and quite honestly a much debated amongst officials because it's somewhat contrary to the written rule, however, the identifying National Federation issued an interpretation a number of years ago ruling this exact play as a violation.
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  #216  
Old 02-23-15, 09:50 AM
zebrastripes zebrastripes is offline
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Here is the 2007-08 interpretation for that backcourt situation:

A1, in the team's frontcourt, passes to A2, also in the team's frontcourt. B1 deflects the ball toward Team A's backcourt. The ball bounces only in Team A's frontcourt before crossing the division line. While the ball is still in the air over Team A's backcourt, but never having touched in Team A's backcourt, A2 gains possession of the ball while standing in Team A's backcourt. RULING: Backcourt violation on Team A. Team A was still in team control and caused the ball to have backcourt status. Had A2 permitted the ball to bounce in the backcourt after having been deflected by B1, there would have been no backcourt violation. (4-4-1; 4-4-3; 9-9-1)

Always remember: “A ball which is in flight retains the same location as when it was last in contact with a player or the court.”
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  #217  
Old 03-19-15, 05:54 AM
BF Pride BF Pride is offline
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Are refs required to address a coach that is irate and calls them over for an explanation? I mean I've seen refs give coaches waaaay too much time in my opinion they shouldn't have to explain anything at all to them.
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  #218  
Old 03-19-15, 06:40 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BF Pride View Post
Are refs required to address a coach that is irate and calls them over for an explanation? I mean I've seen refs give coaches waaaay too much time in my opinion they shouldn't have to explain anything at all to them.

There's no requirement for this, however, it's important to communicate with the coaches. Just how much depends on the situation. That's a skill that's developed over the years by officials.

Some are good at it and some aren't.
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  #219  
Old 03-19-15, 09:17 AM
madworld madworld is offline
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Thought I posted this earlier but I'll try again. What is the protocol for a coach touching an official? What are the rules? Can a coach touch an official?

Last edited by AllSports12; 03-19-15 at 09:35 AM.
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  #220  
Old 03-19-15, 09:31 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by madworld View Post
Thought I posted this earlier but I'll try again. What is the protocol for a coach touching an official? What are the rules? Can a coach touch an official?
First your post was deleted because of the accusation that was implied, just like I edited this one. Ask questions on here, but don't use the thread to bash officials. It is not going to be permitted.

Now to answer your question....

You have to take into consideration the situation and the type of contact.

If it happens when a coach is expressing displeasure, it's going to be addressed in an adverse manner for the coach. If he does it in a way to show up the official, it again should be dealt with harshly.

Quite honestly, this type of situation is extremely rare for an official.
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  #221  
Old 03-19-15, 09:39 AM
madworld madworld is offline
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My intent wasn't to bash but I apologize if that is how it came off. I just wanted verification if a rule existed and supplied an actual situation I saw occur as an example.
I appreciate the feedback but again I wasn't attempting to bash but gave an actual example to paint the picture. Thanks I believe you've answered my question.
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  #222  
Old 07-31-15, 09:03 PM
firsttake firsttake is offline
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Good clarification of the does and don'ts of sports. you will never get to the next level without understanding 50% of why you play Knowing the rules is half the battle
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  #223  
Old 10-08-15, 01:30 PM
clueless clueless is offline
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On a baseline out of bounds in which the ref says you have a spot, is there no such thing as traveling while the inbounder has the ball? Thanks in advance!
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  #224  
Old 10-08-15, 08:18 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clueless View Post
On a baseline out of bounds in which the ref says you have a spot, is there no such thing as traveling while the inbounder has the ball? Thanks in advance!
There is no violation for traveling while a player has the ball for a throw-in.

There is no pivot foot for the thrower. He can hop on one foot, do the two step, or even the Ickey Shuffle ("I'm gonna get some cold cuts") as long as he keeps at least one foot in a 3 foot wide area that surrounds the "spot".

Heck, he can even dribble the ball if he wants....
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  #225  
Old 10-09-15, 08:29 AM
multisportdad multisportdad is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
There is no violation for traveling while a player has the ball for a throw-in.

There is no pivot foot for the thrower. He can hop on one foot, do the two step, or even the Ickey Shuffle ("I'm gonna get some cold cuts") as long as he keeps at least one foot in a 3 foot wide area that surrounds the "spot".

Heck, he can even dribble the ball if he wants....
If the player does leave the three foot area, what's the term for this type of violation? And the associated hand signal (if it's not an usual one).

thanks.
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  #226  
Old 10-09-15, 11:38 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by multisportdad View Post
If the player does leave the three foot area, what's the term for this type of violation? And the associated hand signal (if it's not an usual one).

thanks.
It's simply a throw-in violation. The official should point to the spot, announce "that's a violation", and then point in the direction (the basket) that the ball will be now going.

Using the traveling violation signal (rolling fists) is incorrect in this situation.
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  #227  
Old 11-20-15, 06:26 PM
BulldogBob BulldogBob is offline
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Here's an unusual hypothetical situation: Team A scores. Team B inbounds the ball with a lob that misses everyone, hits the backboard and ricochets in. Does play continue or is the whistle blown for a violation?
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  #228  
Old 11-23-15, 12:58 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BulldogBob View Post
Here's an unusual hypothetical situation: Team A scores. Team B inbounds the ball with a lob that misses everyone, hits the backboard and ricochets in. Does play continue or is the whistle blown for a violation?
If you are meaning that the ball goes in the basket......

You have a violation here.
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  #229  
Old 11-27-15, 06:54 PM
Wadz06 Wadz06 is offline
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How many qtrs per night can a player play?
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  #230  
Old 11-28-15, 08:47 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wadz06 View Post
How many qtrs per night can a player play?
Regular Season Limitations

22 Games
5 Quarters per day
110 Quarters Total
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  #231  
Old 11-28-15, 09:03 AM
ohiopup ohiopup is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
Regular Season Limitations

22 Games
5 Quarters per day
110 Quarters Total
Just to clarify ~ All Over Times (OT) are considered an extension of the 4th quarter.

:>---

Successful = ALT
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  #232  
Old 11-28-15, 11:39 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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http://www.ohsaa.org/sports/bk/bkmanual.pdf

Page 12 of the manual lists the limitations for all levels of play, Varsity down through 7th & 8th grade.
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  #233  
Old 12-23-15, 11:33 PM
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eastside_purple eastside_purple is offline
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Curious on your opinion of the quote below and if you can give the basis for the rule in this circumstance on calling a foul like this intentional or not. My understanding is if a defensive player makes a normal basketball move and fouls (obviously intentionally to put the ball handler on the ft line), no intentional foul is called....just bonus fts (if in the bonus).

Quote:
I am the kind of official who always calls the intentional foul against basketball players on the team that is trailing, when they intentionally foul to put the opposing team at the foul line, depriving them of the opportunity to score three.

I don't care if they try to make it look like they are going for the ball. the rule calls for the official to call it intentional, when he believes it to be intentional. (the coach is yelling FOUL HIM FOUL HIM LOL)
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  #234  
Old 12-24-15, 10:51 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eastside_purple View Post
Curious on your opinion of the quote below .........

"I am the kind of official who always calls the intentional foul against basketball players on the team that is trailing, when they intentionally foul to put the opposing team at the foul line, depriving them of the opportunity to score three.

I don't care if they try to make it look like they are going for the ball. the rule calls for the official to call it intentional, when he believes it to be intentional. (the coach is yelling FOUL HIM FOUL HIM LOL)"
.......

and if you can give the basis for the rule in this circumstance on calling a foul like this intentional or not. My understanding is if a defensive player makes a normal basketball move and fouls (obviously intentionally to put the ball handler on the ft line), no intentional foul is called....just bonus fts (if in the bonus).

First, I'll start with the simple definition of an intentional foul. This in itself blows up the quote from the guy.....

4-19-3 INTENTIONAL FOUL

An intentional fouls is a personal or technical foul that may or may not be premeditated and is not based solely on the severity of the act. intentional fouls include, but are not limited to....

- Contact that neutralizes an opponent's obvious advantageous position.
- Contact away from the ball with an opponent that is clearly not involved with a play.
- Contact that is not a legitimate attempt to play the ball/player specifically designed to stop the clok or keep it from starting.
- Excessive contact with an opponent while playing the ball.
- Contact with a thrower-in as in 9-2-10 Penalty 4.


As most of what we do, it's in the judgment of the covering official.....

Now, my opinion of the quote (consider the source) is that he is an official that makes things up to suit his point of view or that he's an official that does not study the rules of our game. (please note..... this guy is not a registered official in Ohio)

Prior to 2005, the part about when a coach yelled to foul an opponent, we were instructed to call an intentional foul. That all changed prior to the 2005-2006 season with the following Point of Emphasis from the National Federation....... This POE still holds today and is talked frequently.....

"B. Late in the game: Fouling is an accepted coaching strategy and is utilized by nearly all coaches in some form. It is viewed as a chance for a team behind in the score to get back in the game while the clock is stopped. There is widespread belief that it works or it wouldn’t be coached.

There is a right way and a wrong way to foul. Coaches must instruct their players in the proper technique for strategic fouling. “Going for the ball” is a common phrase heard, but intentional fouls should still be called on players who go for the ball if it is not done properly. Conversely, a coach who yells, “Foul!” instructions to his or her team does not mean the ensuing foul is “automatically” an intentional foul — even though it is a strategic foul designed to stop the clock. Coaches, officials, players, fans and administrators must accept fouling as a legitimate coaching strategy.

With that, officials must have the courage to enforce the intentional foul rule. Far too often, officials do not whistle fouls as intentional when the act clearly meets the criteria. Officiating philosophies should not change because of the time remaining in the game or the score differential. The correct call should be made — not the popular one."


In other words........

You are correct in your understanding of the rule.

Sorry to be so long winded

Last edited by AllSports12; 12-27-15 at 03:59 PM.
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  #235  
Old 12-24-15, 01:11 PM
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eastside_purple eastside_purple is offline
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Not long winded at all. Thanks for the information!
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  #236  
Old 12-24-15, 10:40 PM
vamp2syd vamp2syd is offline
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There were two incidents in the Wayne/Fairmont game where I felt the intentional foul should of been called but was not.

A Wayne player steals the ball and is at half court with no one in front of him and the defender who is behind him grabs and holds his arm stopping him...

A Wayne player is going for a break away dunk and the defending player grabs him by the waste keeping him from jumping...
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  #237  
Old 12-24-15, 10:43 PM
vamp2syd vamp2syd is offline
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Question about pregame warm ups....

Dunking? What actually constitutes a dunk in pre-game? I've seen several players drop it in without contact with the rim.... does that matter or does it just depend on who is officiating and is a judgement cal....

thanks
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  #238  
Old 12-25-15, 07:59 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vamp2syd View Post
Question about pregame warm ups....

Dunking? What actually constitutes a dunk in pre-game? I've seen several players drop it in without contact with the rim.... does that matter or does it just depend on who is officiating and is a judgement cal....

thanks
Dunking is the act of driving, forcing (or attempting to force), or pushing the ball through the basket with one or both hands.

Most dunks are easy to spot. Judgment kicks in, especially during warm-ups when the kids know that it is illegal, but try not to make it obvious. Typically when that happens, an official will step in and tell the player or a captain to "stay away from the top of the basket". That tells them that they are being watched and another act like that will result in a penalty to both him and the head coach.
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  #239  
Old 12-25-15, 08:03 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by vamp2syd View Post
There were two incidents in the Wayne/Fairmont game where I felt the intentional foul should of been called but was not.

A Wayne player steals the ball and is at half court with no one in front of him and the defender who is behind him grabs and holds his arm stopping him...

A Wayne player is going for a break away dunk and the defending player grabs him by the waste keeping him from jumping...
If both happened exactly as you describe, then it sounds like an intentional foul should have been called.

However, absent being there to witness this or having clear video to examine, there is a chance the officials were correct in their assessment and you were incorrect. Let's just leave this as it is as........

Thanks
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  #240  
Old 01-01-16, 09:32 PM
vamp2syd vamp2syd is offline
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The intentional foul seems to be following me and another strange case happened and I was curious if you have ever witness this....

This was a game between St. James MD and David Crockett TN. We are in the 3rd over time with seconds left with St. James up by 3. When the ball was in bounded the St. James player fouled the David Crockett player as soon as he hit mid court with about 2 seconds left (obviously trying to keep him from eventually shooting a 3 to tie the game). The official called it an intentional foul.... David Crockett got 2 free throws plus the ball. Fortunately St. James still won the game....
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