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  #481  
Old 01-22-18, 04:51 PM
eyes r burning eyes r burning is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Behrens View Post
Keep in mind that the points have been earned and will be awarded the next time the action is stopped. It might be at that time if the official feels it is required but it might not be until the next time they go out of bounds or the period ends.
How entirely true is this? I thought officials were required to stop the match and award the points once the pinning situation ends? Are you saying the match can actually continue after the pinning situation has ended and it could be awarded 1 minute later? I'm a little confused by how you wrote this response.
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  #482  
Old 01-22-18, 05:59 PM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eyes r burning View Post
How entirely true is this? I thought officials were required to stop the match and award the points once the pinning situation ends? Are you saying the match can actually continue after the pinning situation has ended and it could be awarded 1 minute later? I'm a little confused by how you wrote this response.
Sorry I wasn't as clear as I should have been.
As a rule of thumb, you are correct. The primary reason is so no points are scored when they should not be scored by the defensive wrestler. Stopping when the pinning situation ends makes it much easier to keep track of the points and when they were scored.
However there can be times when that situation might end but go straight into another pinning situation. As a coach, I would guess that you would prefer not to have your wrestler taken out of a possible fall scenario.
This is assuming that the defensive wrestler was not doing something in a dangerous manner. In a case like that, stop it immeadiately.
Again, I was not clear and in most cases, what you wrote is the way to do it.
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  #483  
Old 01-22-18, 10:06 PM
350zjk 350zjk is offline
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An additional point of emphasis that appears to confuse some coaches and fans alike is the awarding of near fall pts. as the pinning combination changes. It is not necessarily the change by the offensive wrestler from one combination to another that allows the official to award near fall pts., but rather in the officials judgement, was the defensive wrestler able to defend himself adequately before the second combination was applied. It seems that many fans, and some coaches are not understanding this principle.
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  #484  
Old 01-23-18, 01:19 PM
coolguy coolguy is offline
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Wrestler "A" has shoe come off during match.

Wrestler "A" had zero tape or velcro covering the tied knot of shoes but was not discovered until after the shoe comes off.


Is Wrestler "B" awarded 1 or 2 penalty points upon stoppage? (Logic behind 2 is penalty for lack of tape/velcro and penalty for shoe coming off)
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  #485  
Old 01-23-18, 01:54 PM
350zjk 350zjk is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolguy View Post
Wrestler "A" has shoe come off during match.

Wrestler "A" had zero tape or velcro covering the tied knot of shoes but was not discovered until after the shoe comes off.


Is Wrestler "B" awarded 1 or 2 penalty points upon stoppage? (Logic behind 2 is penalty for lack of tape/velcro and penalty for shoe coming off)

This would be my ruling: 1 pt. TV and injury time would continue until shoe(s) are properly secured.
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  #486  
Old 01-23-18, 03:08 PM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by coolguy View Post
Wrestler "A" has shoe come off during match.

Wrestler "A" had zero tape or velcro covering the tied knot of shoes but was not discovered until after the shoe comes off.


Is Wrestler "B" awarded 1 or 2 penalty points upon stoppage? (Logic behind 2 is penalty for lack of tape/velcro and penalty for shoe coming off)
In addition to what 350jzk wrote, in this case there would be a one point penalty, regardless of tape or velcro, because the logic is that if the shoe came off it was not "secured" as required by rule. No shoe that is properly laced and taped should ever come off.
Funnier still, at least to me, was watching a shoe come off (I think in the OSU/ Iowa match) and the wrestler put it back on without unlacing it. How well "secured" do you think that was??
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  #487  
Old 01-27-18, 02:52 PM
Shoot and Sprawl Shoot and Sprawl is offline
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Are ohsaa over time rules different in junior high than high school?
In junior high, what is supposed to happen after the first sudden victory period?
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  #488  
Old 01-27-18, 03:54 PM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shoot and Sprawl View Post
Are ohsaa over time rules different in junior high than high school?
In junior high, what is supposed to happen after the first sudden victory period?
30 second ultimate tie breaker (the same as in HS).
There are not two 30 second alternating periods in MS.
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  #489  
Old 01-27-18, 11:46 PM
jmog jmog is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Behrens View Post
30 second ultimate tie breaker (the same as in HS).
There are not two 30 second alternating periods in MS.
Correct. To clarify.

After 1 min SV:
MS goes right to 30 sec ultimate tie breaker
HS does 30/30 alternating that you wrestle the whole thing, both 30s unless a fall happens. If still tied THEN 30 second ultimate tie breaker.

So basically JH does not have those 2 “extra” 30 second periods that you wrestle the whole thing unless there is a fall.
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  #490  
Old 01-28-18, 07:12 AM
Coach S. Coach S. is offline
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Queation for you all. Junior high match goes into overtime. One wrestler gets an unsportsmanlike point against him. Should the match be over? Ref said the overtime still continues. I thought once a point was awarded, the match was over.
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  #491  
Old 01-28-18, 08:40 AM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jmog View Post
Correct. To clarify.

After 1 min SV:
MS goes right to 30 sec ultimate tie breaker
HS does 30/30 alternating that you wrestle the whole thing, both 30s unless a fall happens. If still tied THEN 30 second ultimate tie breaker.

So basically JH does not have those 2 “extra” 30 second periods that you wrestle the whole thing unless there is a fall.
That is why, when a match goes to the two 30 second periods, I tell the wrestlers to wrestle the 30 seconds to completion. Actually it is a reminder to me as well so that I don't go brain dead and stop a match when points are scored.
That is not good.
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  #492  
Old 01-28-18, 08:46 AM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Coach S. View Post
Queation for you all. Junior high match goes into overtime. One wrestler gets an unsportsmanlike point against him. Should the match be over? Ref said the overtime still continues. I thought once a point was awarded, the match was over.
The match should have ended. Points scored are points scored regardless of how they happened.
Many years ago a State Championship was won by a wrestler from Waterloo HS when, as they were to go OT, his opponent walked to the edge of the mat to clear his nose (which is USC). You could see that the official was not happy to call the penalty as it ended the match on that call.
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  #493  
Old 01-30-18, 10:44 PM
Penguin Penguin is offline
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A couple clarifications please
1. Injury at the end of match, wrestler gets 1 1/2 min injury and a couple minutes recovery. What determines if he receives recovery ?
2. in MS meet, in sudden victory, does ref flip coin or first points for choice?
3. Ref leaning down to check for a pin, gets kicked falls backward, blinking eyes, wobbling for 30-45 seconds. wrestlers stopped. coaches come out to check on him He comes to and says he had a pin in his brain before he got kicked but couldn't call it and match was over its a pin. I called for a concussion protocol but he would not go.
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  #494  
Old 01-30-18, 11:15 PM
wjjsj wjjsj is offline
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Recovery time is if he was hurt when an illegal move or technical violation occurred. He gets 2 minutes.
First point
Ref has a pin then it's over.
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  #495  
Old 01-30-18, 11:49 PM
wjjsj wjjsj is offline
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I don't actually ref Jr. high anymore so someone may need to jump in on the choice in the ultimate. I thought for certain at our meetings each year that it was said first point gets choice. I could be wrong as I may be confusing this with high school.
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  #496  
Old 02-01-18, 11:56 AM
bulldowg_Wrestling19 bulldowg_Wrestling19 is offline
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Does anyone know why the OHSAA 2017-2018 handbook has lines through pages 5-10?

http://www.ohsaa.org/Portals/0/Sport...HSWRManual.pdf
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  #497  
Old 02-03-18, 08:14 AM
OaSgUr2013 OaSgUr2013 is offline
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I have a weight question. We have a kid who hit scratch at 132, he is wrestling 145 today. He weighed in at 140.7, this tournament is scratch plus 3. So he still made weight for 138, does he need to hit scratch at 132 again?
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  #498  
Old 02-03-18, 10:52 AM
Rob_Jennings Rob_Jennings is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OaSgUr2013 View Post
I have a weight question. We have a kid who hit scratch at 132, he is wrestling 145 today. He weighed in at 140.7, this tournament is scratch plus 3. So he still made weight for 138, does he need to hit scratch at 132 again?
No. He is permitted to weigh in 1 wt. class above lowest minimum and does not lose certification. Your wrestler does not have to make scratch again. If he were to have weighed in at 145 he would have forfeited his lowest minimum and been a 38 w/out the option of going back down to 32.
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  #499  
Old 02-03-18, 11:20 PM
jfide650 jfide650 is offline
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Correction On Recovery Time

Quote:
Originally Posted by wjjsj View Post
Recovery time is if he was hurt when an illegal move or technical violation occurred. He gets 2 minutes.
First point
Ref has a pin then it's over.
Two minutes of recovery time is ONLY given if a wrestler is injured due to illegal holds/maneuvers, unnecessary roughness or unsportsmanlike conduct (8.2.2). If a wrestler is injured from a technical violation, false start or any other legal way and no unnecessary roughness or unsportsmanlike conduct was involved, the wrestler is only given 1:30 of injury time. If he cannot continue after the injury time has expired, he would lose by default. Illegal holds/maneuvers (7.1) are very different than technical violations (7.3).
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  #500  
Old 02-06-18, 12:51 PM
jmog jmog is offline
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Can someone explain when a figure 4 on leg turns illegal (over scissor)?

I have been watching for years and this maybe the only "illegal" move I didn't know was illegal. Seen a kid who has run legs/figure 4s for years and he got called for it this past weekend and he didn't know what he did wrong at the time either (ref was good to explain it to him).

It didn't change the match as the kid won by tech, but just for future reference I would like to know when/why it becomes illegal.
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  #501  
Old 02-06-18, 12:55 PM
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Refman Refman is offline
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Its all about pressure to the joint
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  #502  
Old 02-06-18, 12:59 PM
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  #503  
Old 02-06-18, 02:58 PM
dion dion is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Refman View Post
Its all about pressure to the joint
Correct, but some coaches think it's illegal by application, like a full nelson or figure four. But like Refman said, it is illegal and a penalty pt. if any pressure to the joint is applied, and should be stopped (PD) immeadiately if observed with no pressure.
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  #504  
Old 02-08-18, 10:58 PM
wrestlfan wrestlfan is offline
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looking for a rule in writing..
for a dual meet
team A has to report first- they are odd and its their turn
team B sends a guy to table first and checks in
team A says we are bumping our guy up a weight class
team B pulls the guy and says we are putting someone else in the spot
The way it has been explained to me is that this is ok for team B to do
Paul Bukky showed this to me in writing and for the life of me I cant remember where it was
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  #505  
Old 02-08-18, 11:28 PM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrestlfan View Post
looking for a rule in writing..
for a dual meet
team A has to report first- they are odd and its their turn
team B sends a guy to table first and checks in
team A says we are bumping our guy up a weight class
team B pulls the guy and says we are putting someone else in the spot
The way it has been explained to me is that this is ok for team B to do
Paul Bukky showed this to me in writing and for the life of me I cant remember where it was
This is covered by Rule 6-2-2.

Basically this states that the wrestlers must report in the proper sequence.
In this case A was to report first (based on the coin flip). Wrestler B reported first BUT not in the proper sequence. Because of this, when team A forfeited, wrestler B could be withdrawn without penalty.

This is also covered in the Case Book under 6-2-2 Situation B on page 33.
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  #506  
Old 02-08-18, 11:32 PM
wrestlfan wrestlfan is offline
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thank you Jim!
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  #507  
Old 02-14-18, 08:24 AM
Unstacked Unstacked is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Behrens View Post
This is covered by Rule 6-2-2.

Basically this states that the wrestlers must report in the proper sequence.
In this case A was to report first (based on the coin flip). Wrestler B reported first BUT not in the proper sequence. Because of this, when team A forfeited, wrestler B could be withdrawn without penalty.

This is also covered in the Case Book under 6-2-2 Situation B on page 33.
So if you choose ODD, your team has to report first for all ODD matches based on the weight the match begins so if match begins at 113, then 113 is first ODD match? I'm guessing depends on what weight the match starts on.
So you win the toss and pick ODD- you send out first on all ODD matches and get your choice to begin second period for all those matches too? Does this mean that if you want your opponent to present or send out first, then you don't want your choice for that particular match, correct?
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  #508  
Old 02-14-18, 08:37 AM
Jim Behrens Jim Behrens is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Unstacked View Post
So if you choose ODD, your team has to report first for all ODD matches based on the weight the match begins so if match begins at 113, then 113 is first ODD match? I'm guessing depends on what weight the match starts on.
So you win the toss and pick ODD- you send out first on all ODD matches and get your choice to begin second period for all those matches too? Does this mean that if you want your opponent to present or send out first, then you don't want your choice for that particular match, correct?
The first match to be wrestled, regardless of the weight chosen in the random draw, is "odd" by definition. The odd and even does not change regardless of forfeits, DQ's, or anything else.
It is also true that if the wrestler that has to present first will also have choice of position at the start of the second period.
If I understand what you are asking in the last question (which I might not), that is accurate.

Last edited by Jim Behrens; 02-14-18 at 09:28 AM.
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  #509  
Old 02-15-18, 09:18 AM
Campolongo Campolongo is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Behrens View Post
This is covered by Rule 6-2-2.

Basically this states that the wrestlers must report in the proper sequence.
In this case A was to report first (based on the coin flip). Wrestler B reported first BUT not in the proper sequence. Because of this, when team A forfeited, wrestler B could be withdrawn without penalty.

This is also covered in the Case Book under 6-2-2 Situation B on page 33.
Not trying to dig too deep.....


Using your example ---- Team B does indeed withdraw without penalty. Is Team A "locked in" to that forfeit they presented even though it was out of sequence?

OR... due to Team B withdrawing, can Team A essentially restart the process and then decide to check in a wrestler?
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  #510  
Old 02-15-18, 09:28 AM
dion dion is offline
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Would like some clarity on what makes a flip illegal with one leg in the air. Is a gramby (sp) legal? Can it be a sideways kick and tuck? Saw one where a short squat wrestler, maybe 220, kicked sideways and did kind of a somersault. They were pretty close to the mat, not standing straight up. The referee did not make the call while the other coach insisted it was illegal. The referee said it did not meet the criteria of being illegal.
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