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  #61  
Old 06-22-17, 09:59 PM
vamp2syd vamp2syd is offline
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I would not mind if they just got rid of the offside rule in soccer....
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  #62  
Old 06-22-17, 10:02 PM
Sig Hansen Sig Hansen is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by buckeye53 View Post
The tickets were a birthday-fathers day gift. There is no way in hell I'll buy all that stuff, other than a beer or 2. Just showing what costs are, to have the semi- complete ballpark experience. When I was a kid 50's&60's, we were not rich, had 6 kids in the family. My Dad, who didn't make a lot, would take me and my 3 brothers to Tribe games, 4-5 times a season,and we could afford to have that experience. Professional sporting events have gotten very expensive, especially for a blue collar family.
I've lived in Ohio, Oregon, SoCal, and NorCal, and travelled all over the U.S., I'll take the NorCal mountains hands down over any other place I've been. We all have our own preferences, those are mine and I'm sure everyone else has theirs, which is good or we'd all be living in the same place.
Another all time "back in my day" post
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  #63  
Old 06-22-17, 10:20 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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Originally Posted by Taco MacArthur View Post
The complete ballpark experience is going to the game and having a good time with the people you're with. Having really good seats at professional sporting events have gotten very expensive. It's already been shown that it is only an expensive experience if you make it that way. Take your NorCal mountains, just don't b*tch about not being close to an MLB stadium. Sounds like you just want to complain to complain.
Are you saying that MLB games are appropriately priced? I have no problem with someone putting it out there that prices are too high. When I go to a movie theater, I see a tub of popcorn for $7 and a large drink at $5 and think that is crazy high too. Concessions are crazy high prices and has gotten to the point that people have to find work arounds instead of paying those type of prices.

If you go to a Little League game, you can get a hot dog, popcorn, and drink for less than $5. It's probably around $25 at a MLB game and the food isn't really that much different.

As to the seat prices, there are some cheap seats and some expensive ones. Getting closer costs more money to be near the action that makes it worth while to attend the game rather than watch a better view on television. Personally, I don't mind sitting in the outfield bleachers but it's more for the experience of being in the ballpark than actually getting a good view of the game.
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  #64  
Old 06-22-17, 10:30 PM
buckeye53 buckeye53 is offline
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Originally Posted by Sig Hansen View Post
Another all time "back in my day" post
You know what Mr.G sez !
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  #65  
Old 06-22-17, 10:47 PM
Zezzo! Zezzo! is offline
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Originally Posted by 14Red View Post
Good stuff, really enjoy reading everyone's different ideas....


NBA - I'd like to see zone defenses allowed in the NBA. Really not sure why they are not legal. Most teams could not play zone anyway, because the shooters are too good, but why not allow weakside help into the lane?
You can play zone in the NBA that rule was changed within the last 10 years.

In baseball go back to best record having home field advantage for the World Series and the best players playing in the All-Star game and eliminate every team has to have a representative,if you're not good enough so be it!
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  #66  
Old 06-23-17, 12:01 AM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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Originally Posted by Zezzo! View Post
You can play zone in the NBA that rule was changed within the last 10 years.
Except that there is now a defensive 3 seconds. The defender can't be in the lane for 3 seconds without guarding a man.

So that leads to another suggestion of mine, get rid of the defensive 3-second rule. Just let them play a normal zone like HS and college.
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  #67  
Old 06-23-17, 06:21 AM
Taco MacArthur Taco MacArthur is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yappi View Post
Are you saying that MLB games are appropriately priced? I have no problem with someone putting it out there that prices are too high. When I go to a movie theater, I see a tub of popcorn for $7 and a large drink at $5 and think that is crazy high too. Concessions are crazy high prices and has gotten to the point that people have to find work arounds instead of paying those type of prices.

If you go to a Little League game, you can get a hot dog, popcorn, and drink for less than $5. It's probably around $25 at a MLB game and the food isn't really that much different.

As to the seat prices, there are some cheap seats and some expensive ones. Getting closer costs more money to be near the action that makes it worth while to attend the game rather than watch a better view on television. Personally, I don't mind sitting in the outfield bleachers but it's more for the experience of being in the ballpark than actually getting a good view of the game.
Yeah. I'm not sure I'd classify buying a bottle of water and bag of peanuts right outside the stadium as a work around.

Of course Little League games will have cheaper concessions. They don't have a multi hundred million dollar stadium they play in.
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  #68  
Old 06-23-17, 06:25 AM
irish_buffalo irish_buffalo is offline
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Originally Posted by Sykotyk View Post
MLB: 154 game season. Scheduled doubleheaders. More off days for players/pitchers especially. Go back to 2 divisions in each league. Top four in each make playoffs (best of 3 first round). Division Series 5 games, LCS and WS 7 games. (And at least ONE day WS game on Saturday or Sunday in the first five games of playoffs.
This. They also need to speed up the game. Hitters need to get in the box and hit. No more stepping out after every pitch to readjust gloves, jersey, helmet, etc...The MLB strike zone has essentially become a platter for hitters. Expand it. This would alter the hitters approach from today's stand in there and swing high for the fences mantra.

Invest heavily in urban communities. There is a HUGE block of athletes that USED to play this game that no longer can afford it. Hockey is the same way but hockey never had these folks in the first place.

Ban 8U, 9U, & 10U "travel" ball.
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  #69  
Old 06-23-17, 08:28 AM
Zunardo Zunardo is offline
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Originally Posted by irish_buffalo View Post

Invest heavily in urban communities. There is a HUGE block of athletes that USED to play this game that no longer can afford it. Hockey is the same way but hockey never had these folks in the first place.
With all due respect, I'm not buying the "too expensive" argument - it's just a bat, a glove, and a ball. If you want to play the game, picking up used equipment should be no more than what it costs to have a good basketball and some Air Jordans - right?

Football is the prohibitively expensive sport, with all its equipment requirements - yet black youth seem to continue participating in sufficient numbers that continues to impact the racial makeup of the NFL. Why is that?

Check out this link of demographic makeup by year of major league baseball. Note that blacks cracked the 10% mark in 1962, peaking at 18% in the early 1980's, then starting the downward trend around 1994, falling below 10% in 2005.

https://sabr.org/bioproj/topic/baseb...hics-1947-2012

And yet, blacks comprised roughly 10% of the population in Jackie Robinson's day, and today are still only 12% of the population.

If not the cost, than what reasons are driving the trend today? Here are a few I think that are more relevant:

- kids today are more perceptive of race than ever before, so they will tend to gravitate to where they think they belong based on the color of their skin. If they see a trend, instinctively they will follow it. Like it or not, race still matters in America, especially in the minds of younger players - and their parents.

- Latino ballplayer demographic, jumping from 15% to 25%, 1990-2000

- Interestingly, white players dropped from 70% to 60% in the 1990's.

- The proliferation of soccer among youth of all races.

And I'm sure there are others factors involved that are driving the change. It's going to take a lot more than the MLB flooding the urban areas with free bats, balls, and gloves to see a significant change.

Remember when it used to be a game? Remember when it used to be fun?
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  #70  
Old 06-23-17, 09:42 AM
irish_buffalo irish_buffalo is offline
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Kids can play football at no cost. Schools provide equipment and sports heroes of the day play football.

Kids can play basketball at no cost. Schools not only provide what little equipment is required but also pay for teams (like football). Is all is needed is a ball and a court and a couple kids.

Baseball requires 9 on 9. If you want less you can certainly get away with it but you still need numbers. You also need a field without glass and ruts in it that is maintained by a lawn mower on a regular basis. MUCH easier just to grab a basketball.

In America, in today's world, kids like Yoggi Berra and Babe Ruth no longer play baseball. It has become a money sport and therefore locked out a large block of potential participants. Period.
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  #71  
Old 06-23-17, 09:56 AM
queencitybuckeye queencitybuckeye is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irish_buffalo View Post
Kids can play football at no cost. Schools provide equipment and sports heroes of the day play football.

Kids can play basketball at no cost. Schools not only provide what little equipment is required but also pay for teams (like football). Is all is needed is a ball and a court and a couple kids.

Baseball requires 9 on 9. If you want less you can certainly get away with it but you still need numbers. You also need a field without glass and ruts in it that is maintained by a lawn mower on a regular basis. MUCH easier just to grab a basketball.

In America, in today's world, kids like Yoggi Berra and Babe Ruth no longer play baseball. It has become a money sport and therefore locked out a large block of potential participants. Period.
Meh, we played baseball in some form whether we had 18 or as little as three. That we didn't have a pristine surface and we had to deal with bad bounces didn't stop us. You need a glove, a bat, and a ball. Period.

Last edited by queencitybuckeye; 06-23-17 at 10:22 AM.
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  #72  
Old 06-23-17, 10:14 AM
Taco MacArthur Taco MacArthur is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irish_buffalo View Post
Kids can play football at no cost. Schools provide equipment and sports heroes of the day play football.

Kids can play basketball at no cost. Schools not only provide what little equipment is required but also pay for teams (like football). Is all is needed is a ball and a court and a couple kids.

Baseball requires 9 on 9. If you want less you can certainly get away with it but you still need numbers. You also need a field without glass and ruts in it that is maintained by a lawn mower on a regular basis. MUCH easier just to grab a basketball.

In America, in today's world, kids like Yoggi Berra and Babe Ruth no longer play baseball. It has become a money sport and therefore locked out a large block of potential participants. Period.
Not in urban communities.

Not in urban communities.

Football requires 11 on 11. If you want less you can certainly get away with it. But you still need numbers. You also need a field without glass and ruts in it that is maintained by a lawn mower on a regular basis.
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  #73  
Old 06-23-17, 11:13 AM
irish_buffalo irish_buffalo is offline
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Originally Posted by queencitybuckeye View Post
Meh, we played baseball in some form whether we had 18 or as little as three. That we didn't have a pristine surface and we had to deal with bad bounces didn't stop us. You need a glove, a bat, and a ball. Period.
I played baseball all the time. 9 on 9 "lob" on a parking lot or strikeout with my buddy. Didn't matter. My dad got me interested. My grandpa bought me my glove.

Who is getting these kids interested now? Who is buying them a glove? A bat? Explaining rules?
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  #74  
Old 06-23-17, 11:16 AM
irish_buffalo irish_buffalo is offline
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Originally Posted by Taco MacArthur View Post
Not in urban communities.

Not in urban communities.

Football requires 11 on 11. If you want less you can certainly get away with it. But you still need numbers. You also need a field without glass and ruts in it that is maintained by a lawn mower on a regular basis.
WTF are you talking about? What urban community? If ANYONE in urban Toledo WANTS to play football or basketball they can. For free. The same cannot be said of baseball.

I played football in a street. 3 on 3. 4 on 4. Smear the queer. Didn't matter. Less skill, more athletic ability and toughness. Far easier. Baseball is a game of skill. Thanks for pointing out the obvious. Always HAS to be someone on here to do so.

The BOTTOM LINE is MLB has lost what used to be a large demographic and I'm not talking race.

Like I said, Babe Ruth would not play baseball if he was born today.
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  #75  
Old 06-23-17, 11:49 AM
Taco MacArthur Taco MacArthur is offline
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Originally Posted by irish_buffalo View Post
WTF are you talking about? What urban community? If ANYONE in urban Toledo WANTS to play football or basketball they can. For free. The same cannot be said of baseball.

I played football in a street. 3 on 3. 4 on 4. Smear the queer. Didn't matter. Less skill, more athletic ability and toughness. Far easier. Baseball is a game of skill. Thanks for pointing out the obvious. Always HAS to be someone on here to do so.

The BOTTOM LINE is MLB has lost what used to be a large demographic and I'm not talking race.

Like I said, Babe Ruth would not play baseball if he was born today.
No they can't. For pick up ball, they need a way to get to and from the playing area. Shoes/cleats. A ball. For schools, most schools have a pay to play fee. Even if they don't have a fee, kids still need shoulder pads and football pants, cleats, mouthguards for practice. Basketball still needs shoes and a ball. Even if it were true that it's completely free to play basketball and football in Toledo (it's not), there are hundreds of schools across the state, let alone the country, that require a pay to play fee. You never specified Toledo and they aren't the only city in the state or country with urban communities, so that point is irrelevant. On top of that, Cincinnati Public Schools and Northwest School District schools to not offer the following for their players: mouthguards, helmets, facemasks, shoulder pads, practice jersey, practice pants, cleats.

I played baseball in a street and on a tennis court. 5 on 5. Doesn't matter. No skill. Didn't need athletic ability or toughness. Far easier. Incredible to suggest you need a full baseball diamond and 9 players to play pick up baseball.

It is literally impossible for you to say that as fact.
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  #76  
Old 06-23-17, 12:12 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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Personally, I think MLB missed the mark with their RBI Initiative (Reviving Baseball in Inner Cities).

Baseball is a struggling youth sport everywhere. Plenty of local Little Leagues and youth organizations folding up over the last two decades. Most rec leagues that are still playing are just hanging on. MLB should have been working with these organizations to build up youth baseball for everyone, not just the innercities.
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  #77  
Old 06-23-17, 12:15 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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And as for backyard baseball, we played one-on-one homerun derby with a tennis ball on a tennis court or in someone's backyard. We played it for hours until our arms were too sore to pitch anymore. Had an automatic strike if it hit the box on the wall behind the batter. Plenty of chances to play baseball if you want as long as there is at least one other person that wants to play.
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  #78  
Old 06-23-17, 12:35 PM
clarkgriswold clarkgriswold is offline
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Originally Posted by Yappi View Post
Personally, I think MLB missed the mark with their RBI Initiative (Reviving Baseball in Inner Cities).

Baseball is a struggling youth sport everywhere. Plenty of local Little Leagues and youth organizations folding up over the last two decades. Most rec leagues that are still playing are just hanging on. MLB should have been working with these organizations to build up youth baseball for everyone, not just the innercities.
The scourge of travel ball hasn't helped. There was a time when the travel teams were the best of the best. Anymore, they're filled with the kids of parents with more money than sense that think junior is an elite player. When I stop by local fields occasionally to watch these teams, I come away with the impression that many of them are on the level of the good rec teams of 20 to 30 years ago (but they sure have spiffy uniforms).
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  #79  
Old 06-23-17, 12:37 PM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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"500" or "5 dollars" and stupid little "pitcher's poison" games were always fun with just a few players.
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  #80  
Old 06-23-17, 12:38 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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Originally Posted by clarkgriswold View Post
The scourge of travel ball hasn't helped. There was a time when the travel teams were the best of the best. Anymore, they're filled with the kids of parents with more money than sense that think junior is an elite player. When I stop by local fields occasionally to watch these teams, I come away with the impression that many of them are on the level of the good rec teams of 20 to 30 years ago (but they sure have spiffy uniforms).
Agreed. That is why MLB should have been working with the Suburban youth baseball leagues. That is where the majority of these travel ball players have come from and left their leagues in shambles. These were strong leagues that were producing solid players every year. Now those same communities are producing half as many players. The quality of the top players in these communities hasn't changed too much, it's just that the lower tier players really don't exist anymore. No more late bloomers either because they are playing other sports now.
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  #81  
Old 06-23-17, 12:40 PM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Originally Posted by Yappi View Post
Personally, I think MLB missed the mark with their RBI Initiative (Reviving Baseball in Inner Cities).

Baseball is a struggling youth sport everywhere. Plenty of local Little Leagues and youth organizations folding up over the last two decades. Most rec leagues that are still playing are just hanging on. MLB should have been working with these organizations to build up youth baseball for everyone, not just the innercities.
NFL's "Play 60" was pretty all-inclusive, iirc.
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  #82  
Old 06-23-17, 02:06 PM
Yappi Yappi is offline
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Originally Posted by cabezadecaballo View Post
"500" or "5 dollars" and stupid little "pitcher's poison" games were always fun with just a few players.
Yes, we played both "500" and "pitcher's poison" all the time. Not familiar with "5 dollars".
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  #83  
Old 06-23-17, 02:19 PM
Taco MacArthur Taco MacArthur is offline
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I always loved Pickle.
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  #84  
Old 06-23-17, 03:07 PM
irish_buffalo irish_buffalo is offline
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Agreed. Played it constantly.

Back to my original point, if a kid has zero support at home he is far less likely to play baseball than football or basketball.

There have been some great ideas in this thread to quell that. I believe it is a combo of things but there is a large demographic lost that used to play.
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  #85  
Old 06-24-17, 08:57 AM
eastisbest eastisbest is offline
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Originally Posted by irish_buffalo View Post
WTF are you talking about? What urban community? If ANYONE in urban Toledo WANTS to play football or basketball they can. For free. The same cannot be said of baseball.

I played football in a street. 3 on 3. 4 on 4. Smear the queer. Didn't matter. Less skill, more athletic ability and toughness. Far easier. Baseball is a game of skill. Thanks for pointing out the obvious. Always HAS to be someone on here to do so.

The BOTTOM LINE is MLB has lost what used to be a large demographic and I'm not talking race.

Like I said, Babe Ruth would not play baseball if he was born today.
Demographic: urban? Yep but

I think I probably disagree with your reason as stated in your paragraph. Baseball is alive and healthy, it's just moved "out." Lots of the same last names we grew up with, playing in the burbs or in one of the Locals. Every FREE baseball field I grew up with, still exists. I can think of more courts and football fields gone.

Waite Bowl, had TWO football fields laid out and a baseball diamond, it is now exclusively baseball. The diamonds at Ravine and Navarre still exist. We lost the b-ball and tennis courts under the High Level Bridge and at Sacred Heart. There are football fields that didn't exist when we were kids, out by the old LOF, now school property, nice to build them where no one lives. The asphalt elementary playgrounds where we'd lay down bases are mostly still there.

Football has taken a big hit. Neighborhood used to have a team at every elementary, public or catholic, which is now down to what, two middle school?

It's not the fields that are gone, and he was right, places we used to play have glass, needles,....


What's missing is the father led family. The predominance of two parent families, with single earner support in which kids got their needs taken care of and fathers had time to coach teams. More of these exist in the burbs.


Reddish's (local sports store) as it used to be is gone and I imagine it is similar in urban areas every where. You can by a trophy but have to head to the suburbs to buy a cup, lol. That's where sports started in our end of town, at Reddish's. The coaches are gone as well and as you said, baseball is a skill game.

Last edited by eastisbest; 06-25-17 at 12:50 PM.
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  #86  
Old 06-26-17, 08:45 AM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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ALL

eliminate all-star games across the board

MLB

no DH

shorter season. still start april 1, but have the regular season over by august 1st.

just play games on the weekends, say thurs through sunday with maybe a series or 2 a week played friday through monday fro some national games. If you schedule in a doubleheader on sunday, go for it.

get rid of interleague play all together.

more playoff teams

even then, i'm not sure the interest level of me or my kids increases. My kids don't care about it one bit.

NBA

same thing, less games

bring in the penalty box

let HS kids back in, the one and done thing is silly

move the 3 point line back to 25.5 feet

NHL

no more shootouts

bring back the old divisions.... actually just make it the way it was in 1986. that's fine.

NFL

I really don't care.... I'm not sitting for 4 hours more than once a year anyways

COLLEGE SPORTS

eliminate them across the board for the big sports and have all major franchises start sports academies, like the rest of the world, so these talented kids can make money instead of getting used
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  #87  
Old 06-27-17, 02:34 AM
thavoice thavoice is offline
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Originally Posted by EastYoungstown View Post
ALL

eliminate all-star games across the board

MLB

no DH

shorter season. still start april 1, but have the regular season over by august 1st.

just play games on the weekends, say thurs through sunday with maybe a series or 2 a week played friday through monday fro some national games. If you schedule in a doubleheader on sunday, go for it.

get rid of interleague play all together.

more playoff teams

even then, i'm not sure the interest level of me or my kids increases. My kids don't care about it one bit.

NBA

same thing, less games

bring in the penalty box

let HS kids back in, the one and done thing is silly

move the 3 point line back to 25.5 feet

NHL

no more shootouts

bring back the old divisions.... actually just make it the way it was in 1986. that's fine.

NFL

I really don't care.... I'm not sitting for 4 hours more than once a year anyways

COLLEGE SPORTS

eliminate them across the board for the big sports and have all major franchises start sports academies, like the rest of the world, so these talented kids can make money instead of getting used
??? NFL games don't come anywhere near 4 hours. 2017 it was an avg of 3 hours and 9 minutes.

Super BOwl..yeah it is much longer with the halftime and longer breaks but for the most part it is no where near 4 hours.

College football at times can have some very long games with the timing rules, constant passing and stopping the clock at all first downs.
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  #88  
Old 06-27-17, 08:33 AM
EastYoungstown EastYoungstown is offline
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??? NFL games don't come anywhere near 4 hours. 2017 it was an avg of 3 hours and 9 minutes.

Super BOwl..yeah it is much longer with the halftime and longer breaks but for the most part it is no where near 4 hours.

College football at times can have some very long games with the timing rules, constant passing and stopping the clock at all first downs.
It sure feels that way.

Maybe it's just boring and I'm over watching the poor product.
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  #89  
Old 06-27-17, 09:08 AM
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Auggie Auggie is offline
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And as for backyard baseball, we played one-on-one homerun derby with a tennis ball on a tennis court or in someone's backyard. We played it for hours until our arms were too sore to pitch anymore. Had an automatic strike if it hit the box on the wall behind the batter. Plenty of chances to play baseball if you want as long as there is at least one other person that wants to play.
One on one whiffle ball was my summer past time in grade school>



While the video is cheesy it is the basic feel for how our game was played in an inner ring suburb with a small back yard. Our ground rule was any ball that hit the basketball hoop in the middle of the field was a double Also, we had the rectangle on the side of the house for balls and strikes, no fancy back stop. My house was the official park because the cyclone fence was just the right distance for HRs; some of our HR trots were legendary.
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