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  #31  
Old 11-04-17, 07:15 PM
James x2 James x2 is offline
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Euclid is so rich in talent all it needed was some motivation and organization by the football program.Many winning seasons but no history in the playoffs.Untill now.This is becoming interesting.Their is no reason for Rotsky to move on. With a gem of a new stadium,lots of available talent, and kids from neighboring cities( with Aunts and Grandparents living in Euclid) he is set up! Bring in the choice recruit or three and you have a powerhouse! If Hoban,Massillon,Wayne and others can do it(just what is reported here on yappi-not my take) than when in Rome ...do as the romans do.
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  #32  
Old 11-04-17, 07:17 PM
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Let us discuss Jeff Rotsky...

I love when private school guys say oh yeah publics can be open enrollment and be the same way.

No

If a public school is open enrollment they have to take ANYONE who wants to come to the school. They cant pick and choose their student body from here or there.

It's a huge difference Our schools can't hold any kid from many counties. Would be able to hold a handful of kids here or there who are good at sports though ..

Sure Rotsky poaches schools and is dirty. He just does it's a few years later than Eds for instance poaching and recruiting youth and middle school programs many counties wide


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  #33  
Old 11-04-17, 07:20 PM
lc5397 lc5397 is offline
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I don't disagree. The reality is the successful privates (and even the successful suburban publics) win with demographics and numbers. The culture and home life is already stable and an advantage and they have 30-40 kids like that every class. More often than not with a well run program, you're going to find enough athletes to win. At the other end is Glenville and Rotsky, who are able to consolidate some key talent (often as juniors or seniors) but the demographics and depth will always been an issue. For the better part of a decade, Glenville pretty much unquestionably had the most D1 talent in the state. They were sending 10-20 guys every year to D1 schools. Iggy and Eds certainly have D1 talent, but maybe only 3-5 guys per year. Even this year in a down year, Cleveland Heights will probably send more kids to D1 schools than Eds or Iggy.

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Originally Posted by Bennies'01 View Post
As a thought exercise, if you're a talented coach, where do you think you have a better chance of being successful: A large, stable all-boys high school, or an inner-ring suburban high school? I think Rotsky has a fantastic track record considering what he's had to work with. Even Chanel was a complete dumpster fire before he got there.
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  #34  
Old 11-04-17, 07:25 PM
hsfan60 hsfan60 is offline
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Plus extra transfers!

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Originally Posted by James x2 View Post
Euclid is so rich in talent all it needed was some motivation and organization by the football program.Many winning seasons but no history in the playoffs.Untill now.This is becoming interesting.Their is no reason for Rotsky to move on. With a gem of a new stadium,lots of available talent, and kids from neighboring cities( with Aunts and Grandparents living in Euclid) he is set up! Bring in the choice recruit or three and you have a powerhouse! If Hoban,Massillon,Wayne and others can do it(just what is reported here on yappi-not my take) than when in Rome ...do as the romans do.
Not all home town talent, fact!
Would be interested to see what it would be with no jump starts, that would be a better result to measure against, fact!
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  #35  
Old 11-04-17, 07:27 PM
Lep2002 Lep2002 is offline
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Originally Posted by Bennies'01 View Post
This is only part of it, and actually only a small part of it. The other part is having access to a large student body of well-resourced, well-supported students who can be developed into football players. In fairness, Kyle single-handedly changed the football culture at Ignatius, so he gets all of the credit for that, but it's extremely unlikely that what he created would be possible at 95% of the other schools in Ohio.
Oh I know that. Being able to pluck kids in communities like Bay, Rocky River, Westlake, etc makes life much easier.
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  #36  
Old 11-04-17, 07:32 PM
lc5397 lc5397 is offline
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The vast majority of which are already in the Catholic school system at St.
Raphel, St. Bernadette and St. Christopher. Not exactly plucking. The advantage is more in the demographics and the fact that Catholic culture has long placed an emphasis on sports participation.

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Oh I know that. Being able to pluck kids in communities like Bay, Rocky River, Westlake, etc makes life much easier.
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  #37  
Old 11-04-17, 07:32 PM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Originally Posted by arizonawildcat View Post
An all-star eighth-grader?
They aren't tough to spot under the right circumstances. Not limited to CYO players by any means, either.....

"Welcome to our camp, kiddies."

I'd guess that a well-heeled old alum like yourself might have received a "Gee Mr, your old high school sure looks swell. Too bad it costs so much" letter or two over the years. Any thoughts ?
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  #38  
Old 11-04-17, 07:35 PM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Why is it that the parochial boosters always seem to be those most provoked by this Rotsky ?
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  #39  
Old 11-04-17, 07:38 PM
lc5397 lc5397 is offline
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Maybe because he's a scumbag? Those same people have nothing but amazing things to say about Ginn and Glenville.

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Why is it that the parochial boosters always seem to be those most provoked by this Rotsky ?
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  #40  
Old 11-04-17, 07:42 PM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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Maybe because he's a scumbag? Those same people have nothing but amazing things to say about Ginn and Glenville.
Have you met the guy ? Or are you just a parrot ?
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  #41  
Old 11-04-17, 07:45 PM
lc5397 lc5397 is offline
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More times than I care to admit.

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Have you met the guy ? Or are you just a parrot ?
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  #42  
Old 11-04-17, 07:55 PM
DB 04 DB 04 is offline
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Originally Posted by James x2 View Post
Lee was at Euclid before transferring to Heights and back to Euclid.There are Cleveland kids who have relatives in Euclid .They use their address and get into Euclid so there should be plenty of talent without him doing much recruiting.Ed's and Iggy have gotten talent from this area.There is a lot of potential there.Euclid has always had athletes,just not the motivation and a coach who could produce.Seymore,Banc,andGibbons ring a bell? Sounds like the witchhunt has begun.If Euclid beats Iggy (which would be an eye opener) will Rotsky get the credit he deserves?He recruites the hallways,and works the youth football in Euclid I'm told.The guy helps kids get to college.Talked to his father- in- law at a game and love him or hate him the guy cares about the kids and that's the most important thing.
Hes not going to beat Iggy.
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  #43  
Old 11-04-17, 08:07 PM
Bennies'01 Bennies'01 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lc5397 View Post
I don't disagree. The reality is the successful privates (and even the successful suburban publics) win with demographics and numbers. The culture and home life is already stable and an advantage and they have 30-40 kids like that every class. More often than not with a well run program, you're going to find enough athletes to win. At the other end is Glenville and Rotsky, who are able to consolidate some key talent (often as juniors or seniors) but the demographics and depth will always been an issue. For the better part of a decade, Glenville pretty much unquestionably had the most D1 talent in the state. They were sending 10-20 guys every year to D1 schools. Iggy and Eds certainly have D1 talent, but maybe only 3-5 guys per year. Even this year in a down year, Cleveland Heights will probably send more kids to D1 schools than Eds or Iggy.
Agreed. So what are the implications of this reality? Should other schools/coaches be punished for trying to find creative ways to close the gap with schools that have structural advantages?

It bears repeating that Rotsky has had a positive impact on hundreds of young men. Who has he harmed in the process? Have his actions shattered the sanctity of high school athletics? What's the issue here?
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  #44  
Old 11-04-17, 08:10 PM
Bennies'01 Bennies'01 is offline
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Originally Posted by Lep2002 View Post
Oh I know that. Being able to pluck kids in communities like Bay, Rocky River, Westlake, etc makes life much easier.
Iggy's success isn't about "plucking" at all. It's more than individual talent. It's about numbers, demographics, and resources. It's about having an innovative mind with the vision to combine those ingredients in a manner that has lead to more than three decades of dominance.
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  #45  
Old 11-04-17, 08:16 PM
panther76 panther76 is offline
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Thanks James

Quote:
Originally Posted by James x2 View Post
Lee was at Euclid before transferring to Heights and back to Euclid.There are Cleveland kids who have relatives in Euclid .They use their address and get into Euclid so there should be plenty of talent without him doing much recruiting.Ed's and Iggy have gotten talent from this area.There is a lot of potential there.Euclid has always had athletes,just not the motivation and a coach who could produce.Seymore,Banc,andGibbons ring a bell? Sounds like the witchhunt has begun.If Euclid beats Iggy (which would be an eye opener) will Rotsky get the credit he deserves?He recruites the hallways,and works the youth football in Euclid I'm told.The guy helps kids get to college.Talked to his father- in- law at a game and love him or hate him the guy cares about the kids and that's the most important thing.
Couldn't of said better myself
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  #46  
Old 11-04-17, 09:26 PM
Wildcat97 Wildcat97 is offline
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Originally Posted by Bennies'01 View Post
Iggy's success isn't about "plucking" at all. It's more than individual talent. It's about numbers, demographics, and resources. It's about having an innovative mind with the vision to combine those ingredients in a manner that has lead to more than three decades of dominance.
Very well said. Chuck Kyle has been the reason, and doesn't show any signs of slowing down.

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  #47  
Old 11-04-17, 09:30 PM
Wildcat97 Wildcat97 is offline
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I have no way of knowing if this is true. Furthermore, I think that stance is very easy to take for a school that is able to go all the way down to Summit County and grab an all star while simultaneously being able to go out to Lorain County to grab an all star.
It is a fact, whether you decide to believe facts or narratives instead is up to you I suppose. Maybe you can enlighten us with your knowledge of transfers at both. I k ow of a couple over all the years. On the other side, I know of plenty that couldn't cut it academically or otherwise and transferrd to a public school. A pretty good example is a heisman t roohy winner, that transferred to a public, so care to show us your facts that for the basis of your narrative?

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  #48  
Old 11-04-17, 09:36 PM
Wildcat97 Wildcat97 is offline
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Originally Posted by MentorGrad2002 View Post
I love when private school guys say oh yeah publics can be open enrollment and be the same way.

No

If a public school is open enrollment they have to take ANYONE who wants to come to the school. They cant pick and choose their student body from here or there.

It's a huge difference Our schools can't hold any kid from many counties. Would be able to hold a handful of kids here or there who are good at sports though ..

Sure Rotsky poaches schools and is dirty. He just does it's a few years later than Eds for instance poaching and recruiting youth and middle school programs many counties wide


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Again, parents can send their kids to wherever they want and pay the tuition align with still paying for their child to go to the district they live in even though the expense to educate them is not being spent by said district. Paying double and then some, so pretty sure I don't want to hear it. Would also help the public schools if they focused more on education and not teaching to tests as well as teaching with a political agenda. There are multiple factors for parents not wanting to send their kids to a public, and it is their right

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  #49  
Old 11-04-17, 10:08 PM
Lep2002 Lep2002 is offline
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Originally Posted by Wildcat97 View Post
It is a fact, whether you decide to believe facts or narratives instead is up to you I suppose. Maybe you can enlighten us with your knowledge of transfers at both. I k ow of a couple over all the years. On the other side, I know of plenty that couldn't cut it academically or otherwise and transferrd to a public school. A pretty good example is a heisman t roohy winner, that transferred to a public, so care to show us your facts that for the basis of your narrative?

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I am not saying that Ed's or Iggy don't have kids that leave their program. What I am saying is that they can easily sustain success because of all the other advantages that they have. Ed's can go out and land Shaun Crawford from Summit County and Andrew Dowell from Lorain county at the same time they draw a large amount of talent from their home county of Cuyahoga. I just find it hypocritical that any fan of those schools would have an issue with kids transferring from Cleveland Heights to Euclid.
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  #50  
Old 11-04-17, 11:04 PM
Curious One Curious One is offline
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Rotsky is a "Saint" with the financial resources to bring players from anywhere. He is VERY loyal to his kids, but is a lunatic on the sideline. His antics eventually cause the home grown families to as their kids lose playing time to Rotsky-ites from anywhere.

A humorous story when he left Maple for Cleveland Heights, the ADs in the LEL met and several were complaining about losing kids to CHHS. The AD at Maple, who had benefitted from Rotsky for a few years even complained. The response from the CHHS AD? Those were just the CHHS kids he recruited to Maple that he had recruited back to Cleveland Heights! As long as there are no rules, and there aren't, there will always be someone willing to allow the Rotskys of the world to operate!
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  #51  
Old 11-05-17, 04:59 AM
IgnatianAMDG IgnatianAMDG is offline
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Originally Posted by Lep2002 View Post
I have no way of knowing if this is true. Furthermore, I think that stance is very easy to take for a school that is able to go all the way down to Summit County and grab an all star while simultaneously being able to go out to Lorain County to grab an all star.
Ignatius does not accept transfers past sophomore year, unless the student is coming from another Jesuit high school. This is a long-standing policy.
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  #52  
Old 11-05-17, 06:16 AM
DB 04 DB 04 is offline
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https://m.clevescene.com/cleveland/m...nt?oid=1496398

After you read this article, you will realize hes a lunatic!

He only wins on talent he recruits.
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  #53  
Old 11-05-17, 06:34 AM
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I don't understand the term "poaching". The districts that students happen to live in have no "rights" to any student/athlete. 8th graders and their parents certainly have the right to choose a high school and the district they live in just happens top be one choice, so any alternative choice is not a loss for that home district.

All that said, private schools certainly have a better opportunity to attract student athletes from a larger geography.
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  #54  
Old 11-05-17, 08:01 AM
eastisbest eastisbest is offline
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I don't understand the term "poaching". The districts that students happen to live in have no "rights" to any student/athlete. 8th graders and their parents certainly have the right to choose a high school and the district they live in just happens top be one choice, so any alternative choice is not a loss for that home district.

All that said, private schools certainly have a better opportunity to attract student athletes from a larger geography.
A carpetbagger is still called a "carpetbagger" regardless they have a "right." "Poaching," just a term to reflect the reality. Recruit, lure, attract, advertise, buy mommy/daddy a car... um okay, maybe not the last one.
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  #55  
Old 11-05-17, 08:11 AM
eastisbest eastisbest is offline
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Originally Posted by DB 04 View Post
https://m.clevescene.com/cleveland/m...nt?oid=1496398

After you read this article, you will realize he’s a lunatic!

He only wins on talent he recruits.
Convincing a kid there are better options than the present situation? Showing the kid the way isn't as hard and unclimbable as he has been led to believe? This is "lunatic" to you?

Being facetious?

Obsessed? Yeah. The kind of guy that sees time running out? Yeah. Selfish? No.

Only wins on talent he recruits? Don't know, it's kind of beside the point. Doesn't seem to be his overall driving motivation.

Read to me like a man who "get's it," even more impressive given he never lived it. His words didn't come to me as someone whose goal was to win at any cost. Read to me like a guy who was sacrificing to teach young people who'd never directly viewed outside world success, how it can be achieved.

When you grow up "in" the neighborhood, where there is little success, it's easy to think people like him, people from "Gates Mills" have it handed to them. To a point, there's no denying the advantage and there's a certain amount of made luck starting ahead but that can translate to anyone from anywhere, if they're shown the possibility. We have these debates all the time, those that think it is "easy" to succeed." It's impossible if you're not shown a way. If the parents have never seen it, don't know how to teach it, doesn't mean they don't love, sacrifice and care for their children. It just means they don't have the experience and a skill to help their child move up. A man like this comes in and helps them is lunatic?

It's terrific that a man like this would come in where he's out of place, not of the culture or the neighborhood or the educational environment and put it on the line to at least try. This is what a "coach" does. No one puts in more time for less money than the coaching staff at a high school. If that's "lunatic," then so be it.
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  #56  
Old 11-05-17, 08:28 AM
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In terms of actual students, Rotsky is probably drawing from a larger pool.

There's a finite number of families interested in a Catholic education that comes with a significant price tag. Rotsky basically has been pulling from Cleveland and the entire eastside of Cuyahoga County for decades.
Do you think the number of families willing to pull up stakes and move is infinite ?

The existence of vouchers renders your point^ hollow. The stretch vans I see full of private school students running around in the morning like Yoder-toters carting in carpenters from Middlefield further assails your argument. Be real here.
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  #57  
Old 11-05-17, 08:29 AM
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Of course. Allow me to grab the best 8th graders from multiple counties every year and watch how good my team turns out. When I go all the way down to Twinsburg and poach Shaun Crawford, I don't know how good he will be...but I know he has the potential to be great. The point is the opportunity. Maybe my next Twinsburg athlete isn't Crawford but he could be a solid starter.
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Old 11-05-17, 08:29 AM
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A carpetbagger is still called a "carpetbagger" regardless they have a "right." "Poaching," just a term to reflect the reality. Recruit, lure, attract, advertise, buy mommy/daddy a car... um okay, maybe not the last one.
The word does not reflect reality. The home school district expectation is unreasonable
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  #59  
Old 11-05-17, 08:32 AM
cabezadecaballo cabezadecaballo is offline
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More times than I care to admit.
Why is he a scumbag, in your studied assessment ? Make your case. Do you have one ?

Is the Hoban coach a scumbag ? Ever meet him ?

Rotsky obviously isn't doing anything as egregious as Howard Ferguson did in wrestling. Do you know if there are Howie pics on the walls of St Edward ?
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  #60  
Old 11-05-17, 08:40 AM
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Rotsky obviously isn't doing anything as egregious as Howard Ferguson did in wrestling. Do you know if there are Howie pics on the walls of St Edward ?
What do you think you know?
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