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  #61  
Old 03-27-17, 08:35 AM
Tesoro Tesoro is offline
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Originally Posted by rjewards View Post
beat the best to be the best, line em all up...
Or if you can't do that...cheat and hunt up some transfers so you can.
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  #62  
Old 03-27-17, 08:41 AM
Tesoro Tesoro is offline
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Originally Posted by sprtsfan247 View Post
I second the notion that transfers are ruining HS sports. He isn't referencing or criticizing the kids. He is criticizing the notion of kids transferring to making a high school team essentially an AAU team.

People question why the crowds are much smaller than they have been at the State Tournament. There are several reasons why they are smaller. The games being on TV, the prices being higher, competing against the NCAA. However, one thing that is definitely a factor is the fact that some of these private schools have "transfers" and there is no connection to these kids. The school can't rally around the kids who have grown up or have been in a feeder school.

Transfers also create the "have" and "have-nots" in HS. It takes the parity out of high school sports. When you have 10,12, 14 teams that have one or two really good players the supporting cast comes into play, and you end up with great games and you end up with teams that have a chance. However, with all these transfers you are putting teams together that have 4 or 5 or 6 really good players (aka an AAU team) and when you play a team that has a "normal" roster (non-AAU team) you end up with games that are extremely lopsided and not very entertaining.

The only defense I will give this "movement" so to speak, is this seems to be the norm. Change sometimes is great and sometimes it sucks. The change that is taking place or has already happened is going to be a good thing or a bad thing. I believe it just depends on who is talking about it. To me, I am a traditionalist. I like teams that grow up together, I like teams that work together, I don't like the AAU teams that are being created. However, it is what it is, and we have to deal with it, like or hate it.
Another reason that AAU sucks.
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  #63  
Old 03-27-17, 10:55 AM
22 Acacia Ave 22 Acacia Ave is offline
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Originally Posted by Tesoro View Post
Or if you can't do that...cheat and hunt up some transfers so you can.
This!
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  #64  
Old 03-27-17, 12:26 PM
sportsauthority101 sportsauthority101 is offline
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Originally Posted by El Indio View Post
If you think they pay, I have some swamp land in Florida I can sell you. Really! You are that dumb? I speak of experience. My niece not only had her tuition paid by a donor, her little brother's tuition was also paid by a donor and he didn't play no sports. Now that's how you get talent to come to your school!
I love clowns like you that speak like you know what every kid at every private school pays because you know a friend of a friend of your Aunt's neighbor. I wrote checks to private schools you moron and my kids started and I paid full boat. IF a kid whose family made $30K/year paid less, it wouldn't of bothered me in the least bit. It just meant my kid had to be good enough or get better.

Private schools don't receive local school taxes but all those parents pay their share of taxes to their local public schools anyways - thus subsidizing your kids tuition! Not to mention their own kids Tuition. So all you public baby's kids go to school for free while private kids pay your school taxes - so what the he@% is your point about free tuition?

Yes private schools get better overall players but Bottom line is private schools have BETTER basketball coaches and thus better programs. If you get your butt's kicked by a private school, then make your kid a better basketball player or get a better Coach! It's the same crap every year with you whiners! Quit putting your kids on sorry aau teams playing slow average competition and maybe they'll get used to the speed of the game played at the highest level!
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  #65  
Old 03-27-17, 12:36 PM
22 Acacia Ave 22 Acacia Ave is offline
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Originally Posted by sportsauthority101 View Post

Yes private schools get better overall players but Bottom line is private schools have BETTER basketball coaches and thus better programs. If you get your butt's kicked by a private school, then make your kid a better basketball player or get a better Coach!
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  #66  
Old 03-27-17, 12:55 PM
El Indio El Indio is offline
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Originally Posted by sportsauthority101 View Post
I love clowns like you that speak like you know what every kid at every private school pays because you know a friend of a friend of your Aunt's neighbor. I wrote checks to private schools you moron and my kids started and I paid full boat. IF a kid whose family made $30K/year paid less, it wouldn't of bothered me in the least bit. It just meant my kid had to be good enough or get better.

Private schools don't receive local school taxes but all those parents pay their share of taxes to their local public schools anyways - thus subsidizing your kids tuition! Not to mention their own kids Tuition. So all you public baby's kids go to school for free while private kids pay your school taxes - so what the he@% is your point about free tuition?

Yes private schools get better overall players but Bottom line is private schools have BETTER basketball coaches and thus better programs. If you get your butt's kicked by a private school, then make your kid a better basketball player or get a better Coach! It's the same crap every year with you whiners! Quit putting your kids on sorry aau teams playing slow average competition and maybe they'll get used to the speed of the game played at the highest level!
Wow! You only can't read, but you also called me a moron! Please go back an read my post. I said niece. Not a rumor, fact!
I wonder how many public schools have fish fry's and all the beer you can drink?
That is just one instance. So please don't come on here and flap your jaws. I know more than you think I know and you are just making an arse of yourself.

Plain and simple, all private schools should compete at least one higher than their division. Period. They draw from the whole county and surrounding counties. Fact!
Just because you might be well off and had a kid who could start (probably his senior year) and you wrote your checks, doesn't mean much.
They have donors for a reason. How many of the starters had donors? Now that is the question to ask.
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  #67  
Old 03-27-17, 01:13 PM
22 Acacia Ave 22 Acacia Ave is offline
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Originally Posted by El Indio View Post
How many of the starters had donors? Now that is the question to ask.
Im sure the starters all paid full tuition.
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  #68  
Old 03-27-17, 01:29 PM
eastisbest eastisbest is offline
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Originally Posted by sportsauthority101 View Post
Private schools don't receive local school taxes....
yeah they do. and of different amounts. depends upon the school. and they're politicing for more so it's not an argument on strong legs.
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  #69  
Old 03-27-17, 02:29 PM
sportsauthority101 sportsauthority101 is offline
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Show quote wear I stated Jackson Coach wasn't a good coach? He won State Final - that's good in anyone's book. Yeah we get the homegrown....since you and the coach like to brag it about it so much! Lets see if Jackson can somehow come up with that kind of length & talent again in next 6-10 years and match that starting 5 again - not likely! But if it's his development of players then we expect to see you in Cbus again in the near future.

Privates don't come close to funds received through taxes and Dept of Ed. - now i really have some Swamp Land to sell you
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  #70  
Old 03-27-17, 03:46 PM
eastisbest eastisbest is offline
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Originally Posted by sportsauthority101 View Post

Privates don't come close to funds received through taxes and Dept of Ed. - now i really have some Swamp Land to sell you
clearly you're trying to sell something that smells since when confronted with facts that meandar your bs to its simplistic means, you create a new one. You went from private schools getting "no" to "don't come close."

Care to be specific about "close?" Takes an effort but a good swamp seller would look them up in order to have a good spin prepared and you might want to wipe that drivel and drool off your chin, come off a bit more intelligent and prepared. There's people here both sides been at this debate a long time, having their facts and mutual respect in hand. We're ten steps ahead of those looking to put their foot into it.
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  #71  
Old 03-27-17, 04:00 PM
22 Acacia Ave 22 Acacia Ave is offline
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Originally Posted by sportsauthority101 View Post
Lets see if Jackson can somehow come up with that kind of length & talent again in next 6-10 years and match that starting 5 again - not likely!
They won the D1 championship twice in 7 years. Yeah, lucky!
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  #72  
Old 03-27-17, 04:13 PM
sportsauthority101 sportsauthority101 is offline
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If you need proof that private schools are subsidized drastically less than public, knock yourself out trying to win the semantics war with your research.

The tuition & transfer thing is an old crutch every tournament time. Their are dozens of public school transfers in Ohio each year. DSJ was not a State Championship quality team - they couldn't get ball over half court before being turned 4 times. Wauseon tried to break St. V press with 5 guys in backcourt and no one up the sidelines - that's not a transfer problem, that's a Coaching problem!

To hear Jackson Coach voluntarily bragging about homegrown is also hilarious - like those facilities and quality of community aren't pulling in sports families at a much higher rate than say Green, Perry, etc. Sure they have solid programs, they also have most to offer in Akron/Canton/Massillon area. Just as Mentor does in Eastern Cleveland area.

To head off the future posts, I'm not jealous of ppl living in Jackson - but fed up with the same ole same ole after tournament time.

Last edited by sportsauthority101; 03-27-17 at 04:24 PM. Reason: Edit
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  #73  
Old 03-27-17, 04:21 PM
22 Acacia Ave 22 Acacia Ave is offline
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Originally Posted by sportsauthority101 View Post
If you need proof that private schools are subsidized drastically less than public, knock yourself out trying to win the semantics war with your research.

The tuition & transfer thing is an old crutch every tournament time. Their are dozens of public school transfers in Ohio each year. DSJ was not a State Championship quality team - they couldn't get ball over half court before being turned 4 times. Wauseon tried to break St. V press with 5 guys in backcourt and no one up the sidelines - that's not a transfer problem, that's a Coaching problem!

To hear Jackson Coach voluntarily bragging about homegrown is also hilarious - like those facilities and quality of community are pulling in sports families at a much higher rate than say Green, Perry, etc. Sure they have solid programs, they have most to offer in Akron/Canton/Massillon area. Just as Mentor does in Eastern Cleveland area.

To head off the future posts, I'm not jealous of ppl living in Jackson - but fed up with the same ole same ole after tournament time.
The coach is exactly right. It's definitely a far better accomplishment for a public school to win a championship. Especially a public that does not accept open enrollment. Far better accomplishment. Not even a question! Way to go jackson!
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  #74  
Old 03-27-17, 05:39 PM
buckeye53 buckeye53 is offline
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I really don't see that LE's transfers tore up the nets, in the title game. Both teams shot 34% on 2 point shots, and LE shot 20% from 3 point range. The difference was Wellington went 1-11 9% on 3's. All in all a very even game. Jackson and Moeller both shot in the low 30%, game could have gone either way. Free throws made a difference in almost every game.
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  #75  
Old 03-27-17, 05:42 PM
playboi12 playboi12 is offline
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I keep seeing and hearing school x draw from x counties or x metro area, but some of you really don't take into account other factors that affect the school. Like price for tuition, religious affiliation, transportation, other competing schools(public and private)and number of school aged kids in the area. When you factor all that in, they really don't have this ginormous pool they can just pluck people out of. Heck, tuition and transportation are deal breakers to a lot of families. If you limit these schools to just a few zip codes, some will have to choose between closing their doors or leaving OHSAA. And you can guess which one they are going to choose.
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  #76  
Old 03-27-17, 05:58 PM
22 Acacia Ave 22 Acacia Ave is offline
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Originally Posted by playboi12 View Post
I keep seeing and hearing school x draw from x counties or x metro area, but some of you really don't take into account other factors that affect the school. Like price for tuition, religious affiliation, transportation, other competing schools(public and private)and number of school aged kids in the area. When you factor all that in, they really don't have this ginormous pool they can just pluck people out of. Heck, tuition and transportation are deal breakers to a lot of families. If you limit these schools to just a few zip codes, some will have to choose between closing their doors or leaving OHSAA. And you can guess which one they are going to choose.
A group of stud AAU players can't just decide to attend a closed public school together and create an all-star team, unless they move into the district. Much harder to win when you have specific boundaries without open enrollment. Apples to oranges.
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  #77  
Old 03-27-17, 06:20 PM
EdzSportsFan EdzSportsFan is offline
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Originally Posted by 22 Acacia Ave View Post
Im sure the starters all paid full tuition.
Lol, you sound like a whiney jealous little girl! Speculating and so sure of yourself (with zero knowledge) of how much families pay to attend private schools. It's significantly more than you pay for your kids to go to a public school at $0 - that I can assure you of.

Stop with your insanity - If private schools have a leg up on Jackson, Wauseon, or DSJ, then Jackson has an equal leg up on Green, Perry, Barberton, Mogagore, and even Medina, Brunswick and Copley. Lorain used to be 4 high schools. Hoover used to be 2. NO ONE recruited more than McKinley or Massillon. It's all relative.

Families pay for what they value in a Catholic School, get over it and take it up with the ohsaa.
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  #78  
Old 03-27-17, 06:28 PM
wildcat71 wildcat71 is online now
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Funny how Lutheran East only gets basketball players isn't it. Their football team is terrible. If you are a "Lutheran " and want to play football you head to Lutheran West I guess....
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  #79  
Old 03-27-17, 09:13 PM
FootsWalker FootsWalker is offline
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Originally Posted by sportsauthority101 View Post
Show quote wear I stated Jackson Coach wasn't a good coach? He won State Final - that's good in anyone's book. Yeah we get the homegrown....since you and the coach like to brag it about it so much! Lets see if Jackson can somehow come up with that kind of length & talent again in next 6-10 years and match that starting 5 again - not likely! But if it's his development of players then we expect to see you in Cbus again in the near future.

Privates don't come close to funds received through taxes and Dept of Ed. - now i really have some Swamp Land to sell you
First of all, I'm not from Jackson. You didn't say he wasn't a good coach but did refer to him as a "knucklehead" for his" homegrown" comment, hardly flattering prose. As for the whole homegrown idea, your 6-10 year comment actually kinda makes the point for the guy you were jousting with, because with "homegrown" players, it often takes a while to fall upon "that special class". Jackson went to state in 2001, lost in the semis to St Ignatius. Took them 9 years but they got back to Cbus in 2010 and beat Moeller to win it. Took them another 7 years to get back to beat Moeller in 2017 to win it again. Point is, they have a great youth program, have for years, and lose very precious few kids to private schools, and yet even with all that and being a big school system with great facilities and strong academics, they still are somewhat at the whim and will of the talent level that lives there and goes to school there. Certainly talent is developed, but 6'7" & 6'6" athletes only come along so often to be developed. I'm sure they'll be back but it won't be right away, as they are closed enrollment and are obviously losing a lot of immediately irreplaceable talent. Your later comments about people moving there because of their strong schools and nice facilities, I mean isn't that kinda the point? People move there to raise their families there to go to school there and play sports there. Buying a house and raising your family so that they eventually go to HS there is a little bit more of a commitment than just transferring in your Senior year just to try and win a championship, don't you think?
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  #80  
Old 03-27-17, 09:25 PM
EdzSportsFan EdzSportsFan is offline
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Originally Posted by DB 04 View Post
That Knucklehead is a pretty good coach. Ever hear the phrase "You never open your mouth until you hear what the shot is?" This guy proved he's one of the best coaches if not THE BEST coach in the state of Ohio winning a title with homegrown talent and beating the GCL in basketball. He doesn't need transfers, he doesn't need AAU mercenaries, and he doesn't need "the calls" to back up his mouth. He's probably getting paid more as a public school than some of the private school coaches also.

Once this competitive balance hits, some of these (maybe all) of the private school state champs are moving up a division.

OHSAA needs have a policy where they can enter a school and randomly audit a private school to make sure the private schools aren't buying kids.
If you live in a Jackson or Mentor you have a rare opportunity to play with coaches that know the game and have good programs. If a talented kid lives in a crappy basketball town - he deserves the opportunity to play for a good coach/program just the same. To think otherwise is a bit sanctimonious! But then again, that's what "Bike Shorts" Wearing Public School Boosters are!

Best Coach in Ohio? Dude had a 6'7" Sr. Butler recruit who is best player in Ohio, a 6'6" Sr. Center with a 35" Vertical, and 3 6'3" guards. Eds had 2 5'10"(?) guards, 2 Freshman starting with one in a knee brace, and a 6'6 Center not in Hill's league in the slightest and Flannery got them to the Final Four.

Ever hear the phrase "You never open your mouth until you hear what the shot is?"
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  #81  
Old 03-27-17, 09:49 PM
sportsauthority101 sportsauthority101 is offline
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Originally Posted by FootsWalker View Post
First of all, I'm not from Jackson. You didn't say he wasn't a good coach but did refer to him as a "knucklehead" for his" homegrown" comment, hardly flattering prose. As for the whole homegrown idea, your 6-10 year comment actually kinda makes the point for the guy you were jousting with, because with "homegrown" players, it often takes a while to fall upon "that special class". Jackson went to state in 2001, lost in the semis to St Ignatius. Took them 9 years but they got back to Cbus in 2010 and beat Moeller to win it. Took them another 7 years to get back to beat Moeller in 2017 to win it again. Point is, they have a great youth program, have for years, and lose very precious few kids to private schools, and yet even with all that and being a big school system with great facilities and strong academics, they still are somewhat at the whim and will of the talent level that lives there and goes to school there. Certainly talent is developed, but 6'7" & 6'6" athletes only come along so often to be developed. I'm sure they'll be back but it won't be right away, as they are closed enrollment and are obviously losing a lot of immediately irreplaceable talent. Your later comments about people moving there because of their strong schools and nice facilities, I mean isn't that kinda the point? People move there to raise their families there to go to school there and play sports there. Buying a house and raising your family so that they eventually go to HS there is a little bit more of a commitment than just transferring in your Senior year just to try and win a championship, don't you think?
Exactly, because he's a knucklehead for starting the public private argument immediately after the win doesn't translate into me implying he's not a good basketball coach. I used the 6-10 years as that is the last time they won one - many feel they choked last year?

Yes the 2 Bigs he had this year won't be repeated anytime soon and maybe never. Someone who moves into a new house in Jackson to play in their sports programs is somehow more enviable than a kid transferring to LE to play in their sports program and whose parent(s) can't afford to move to Jackson? I bet you the house if Seth Wilson transferred into Jackson next year to play basketball, they wouldn't say "sorry, we don't take transfers who don't move here as a 2 year old"!

Last edited by sportsauthority101; 03-27-17 at 09:51 PM. Reason: because
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  #82  
Old 03-27-17, 10:26 PM
FootsWalker FootsWalker is offline
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Originally Posted by sportsauthority101 View Post
Exactly, because he's a knucklehead for starting the public private argument immediately after the win doesn't translate into me implying he's not a good basketball coach. I used the 6-10 years as that is the last time they won one - many feel they choked last year?

Yes the 2 Bigs he had this year won't be repeated anytime soon and maybe never. Someone who moves into a new house in Jackson to play in their sports programs is somehow more enviable than a kid transferring to LE to play in their sports program and whose parent(s) can't afford to move to Jackson? I bet you the house if Seth Wilson transferred into Jackson next year to play basketball, they wouldn't say "sorry, we don't take transfers who don't move here as a 2 year old"!
If you want to think that he was trying to start an argument with that comment that's your prerogative, but I read it that he was grateful and proud to have watched these kids grow up together and accomplish this, period. He made no mention of anyone other than his team. Not sure where your "more enviable" comment is coming from, as I never stated anything of the sort, just made the comment that doing so was a bit more of a commitment than a Sr move-in that's all. By the way, I don't hold anything against those kids/families that cumulatively made this choice to switch schools to LE to try to win a championship, as they did what they did within the rules. I have a problem with the rules that allow for it yes, as it seems to fly in the face of the spirit of HS sports in my opinion. I think the school and the coach that apparently encouraged/allowed the whole process to take place need to be able to look themselves in the mirror as well. Ultimately everyone involved got what they wanted, so congrats to all. Maybe they can become the Kentucky of Ohio HS D4 and do it again....
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  #83  
Old 03-28-17, 07:41 AM
tmajic tmajic is offline
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Private schools have the best coaches? Come on. Coaches win with talent. They can develop players to only a certain level. If they don't have the talent, then they are not going to win many championships. I don't care how great the coach is. So, please don't say that a lot of the private schools have superior talent or that they develop it. The kids that transfered into LE for example certainly weren't "developed" by the LE coach, so you would have to give the credit to their public school coach? Not really, they are talented players.
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  #84  
Old 03-28-17, 10:36 AM
22 Acacia Ave 22 Acacia Ave is offline
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I'm a public and private school supporter, but we are having enough of the team hopping in HS sports. There should be a separation of public and private if this continues.
Amen. This sums it up.

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  #85  
Old 03-28-17, 07:03 PM
Blue Jay Fan Blue Jay Fan is offline
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Originally Posted by DB 04 View Post
I'm a public and private school supporter, but we are having enough of the team hopping in HS sports. There should be a separation of public and private if this continues.
Do you really believe that ONLY happens in private schools? DSJ is a Catholic school where all our players grew up together and played together at this school. We played a team that brought in five new players. Do you see these two schools as equals?
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  #86  
Old 03-28-17, 10:16 PM
jackson03 jackson03 is offline
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Originally Posted by sportsauthority101 View Post
Show quote wear I stated Jackson Coach wasn't a good coach? He won State Final - that's good in anyone's book. Yeah we get the homegrown....since you and the coach like to brag it about it so much! Lets see if Jackson can somehow come up with that kind of length & talent again in next 6-10 years and match that starting 5 again - not likely! But if it's his development of players then we expect to see you in Cbus again in the near future.

Privates don't come close to funds received through taxes and Dept of Ed. - now i really have some Swamp Land to sell you
Jackson went to Columbus in 1994, 2001, 2010, and 2017. They've been doing it for a quarter of a century and a betting man would likely err on the side of them doing it again. Seems like a lot of people are desperate to describe Jackson's success as a fluke for some reason.

The collective freak out among some private school fans in here is really amusing. Really scraping the bottom of the barrel if you think paying tuition has anything to do with fairness in athletics. If you think it's cheap to live in Jackson Local, be my guest. The state isn't showering the district with money. Though a better question might be why you're spending $15k a year on tuition when the Vatican is one of the richest entities on planet Earth.
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  #87  
Old 03-28-17, 10:50 PM
Bball216 Bball216 is offline
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Jackson is a public school that has actually built a program. I have no doubt they will return to Columbus at some point. D1 is brutal but Jackson has as good a public program as there is currently out there. There is no fluke with their success.
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  #88  
Old 03-29-17, 07:14 PM
sportsauthority101 sportsauthority101 is offline
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Originally Posted by jackson03 View Post
Jackson went to Columbus in 1994, 2001, 2010, and 2017. They've been doing it for a quarter of a century and a betting man would likely err on the side of them doing it again. Seems like a lot of people are desperate to describe Jackson's success as a fluke for some reason.

The collective freak out among some private school fans in here is really amusing. Really scraping the bottom of the barrel if you think paying tuition has anything to do with fairness in athletics. If you think it's cheap to live in Jackson Local, be my guest. The state isn't showering the district with money. Though a better question might be why you're spending $15k a year on tuition when the Vatican is one of the richest entities on planet Earth.
1. To Avoid Basketball NOVICES like you
2. Because I can

ANY MORE QUESTIONS?
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  #89  
Old 03-29-17, 07:40 PM
neohiohoops neohiohoops is offline
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Originally Posted by tmajic View Post
Private schools have the best coaches? Come on. Coaches win with talent. They can develop players to only a certain level. If they don't have the talent, then they are not going to win many championships. I don't care how great the coach is. So, please don't say that a lot of the private schools have superior talent or that they develop it. The kids that transfered into LE for example certainly weren't "developed" by the LE coach, so you would have to give the credit to their public school coach? Not really, they are talented players.
You know "NOTHING" about basketball!!

You don't win HS basketball games by rolling out the ball.

If you don't have spacing (harder than said), a press breaker, ways to create TO's, team D playing on a string, shut down leading scorers, force players 3-5 to beat you, team discipline.....doesn't matter how much talent you have. ie. Lorain 2015, Cleveland Hts. 2016-2017

Go act like you know a lot about basketball at your suburban league game
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  #90  
Old 03-29-17, 07:52 PM
neohiohoops neohiohoops is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jackson03 View Post
Jackson went to Columbus in 1994, 2001, 2010, and 2017. They've been doing it for a quarter of a century and a betting man would likely err on the side of them doing it again. Seems like a lot of people are desperate to describe Jackson's success as a fluke for some reason.

The collective freak out among some private school fans in here is really amusing. Really scraping the bottom of the barrel if you think paying tuition has anything to do with fairness in athletics. If you think it's cheap to live in Jackson Local, be my guest. The state isn't showering the district with money. Though a better question might be why you're spending $15k a year on tuition when the Vatican is one of the richest entities on planet Earth.
You public people are funny and remind me of the DNC as you conveniently leave out facts for your benefit. I don't know much about Jackson but I do know they have a college campus more or less. Offer a great place to raise a family. Great youth programs. Competitive HS teams. FEW towns in that area (if any) can match what they offer. So if I'm a young family with young kids and I'm buying a new house...where am I moving too? I have news for you, a Coach doesn't develop a player! It's the player who is driven to relentlessly get better and more than likely, his Dad knew what it took to make him a player. It's almost NEVER the HS coach!

Ignatius, Eds, St. V, VASJ...they can't offer this even if they were public. Cloverleaf, Barberton, Brunswick, Berea, Amherst, Lorain, doesn't offer this. Who else has been to CBUS 4 times in the last 20 years from NE Ohio? Mentor comes 2nd closest is my guess.

Jackson and Mentor are at top of enrollment list in NE Ohio. Jackson has ALL the advantages over any other school from PA. to Indiana and Ashtabula to Kings Island. Gimme a break about "homegrown" - go ahead and pee in our faces and tell us it's raining!

No doubt you Voted Democrat!!
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