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  #1  
Old 12-18-18, 12:09 PM
ccrunner609 ccrunner609 is offline
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Out of season coaching?

As we evolve our sport......out of season coaching and all year around event practice is now a thing in track.

What is everyone's idea on how to handle this?


The premise behind this is that there are lots of influence from other coaches leaking into other coaches programs. For instance a throws, jumps, PV kid is going to facilities 9 months out of the year to work out and then when the season starts these "non" school hired coaches are showing up at meets and want to coach during track season.

I have had words with these people that when my athlete is in season that you are not to work with them or coach them at meets or practices. They act like they are offended by this. Its ridiculous. Could you imagine a guy showing up at a basketball game and coach a kid from the stands?

They argue that "I work with this kid for 9 months and you expect to take them from me for the season?" Unreal.
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  #2  
Old 12-18-18, 12:32 PM
RunnerAdespota RunnerAdespota is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccrunner609 View Post
As we evolve our sport......out of season coaching and all year around event practice is now a thing in track.

What is everyone's idea on how to handle this?


The premise behind this is that there are lots of influence from other coaches leaking into other coaches programs. For instance a throws, jumps, PV kid is going to facilities 9 months out of the year to work out and then when the season starts these "non" school hired coaches are showing up at meets and want to coach during track season.

I have had words with these people that when my athlete is in season that you are not to work with them or coach them at meets or practices. They act like they are offended by this. Its ridiculous. Could you imagine a guy showing up at a basketball game and coach a kid from the stands?

They argue that "I work with this kid for 9 months and you expect to take them from me for the season?" Unreal.
I'm sorry. That's unfortunate.

I haven't had to deal with private coaches hardly at all, but that's probably because I'm at a smaller sized school in a working class district.

The few times I had to deal with private running or specialty coaches I was able to strike up a meaningful relationship with them, but this is probably not possible most of the time.

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  #3  
Old 12-18-18, 04:01 PM
EuclidandViren EuclidandViren is offline
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Went to my AD about this a few years back. And it wasn't an outside coach but parents.

In that situation the AD said the parents or the people trying to coach were not allowed down on the track even if they were parents because OHSAA has strict laws about coaching must come from board approved coaches. It was resolved. But outside of meets and practice I was not coaching and it was not fun for me.

The AD said it was worse in swimming. Imagine the current swimming laws applied to other sports? Currently OHSAA says that swimmers only have to attend 1 high school swim practice a week. The other days and practices are with the club. That would be terrible for team chemistry and trying to do relay teams.

The AD also said it is obviously bad in soccer, basketball and volleyball, but they have strict laws prohibiting contact with the club coaches during season.

But imagine sports like golf coaches and tennis coaches. Where every kid has their own professional swing coach. Or baseball where kids have their own pitching coach and hitting coaches. My AD said you are lucky in xc an track because the CLUB and country club aspect has not taken over your sport.


I would not enjoy my job if I had to deal with what these other sports have to deal with especially swimming.

But at this point the only glory hungry people in our sport are the pole vaulters. The pole vaulting community is amazing and at the same time a little crazy. Whack jobs all trying to help people out in their sandals, Birkenstocks, and fanny packs. Don't get me wrong I have 2 pole vault coaches on staff. These are great people. But at the same time they all help each other out and cheer for each other. Great comradery. Except when you are trying to win meets and every point counts and your paid coach is helping the other team to beat your girl/boy. I have a love/hate relationship with this community.
  #4  
Old 12-18-18, 09:40 PM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EuclidandViren View Post
Went to my AD about this a few years back. And it wasn't an outside coach but parents.

In that situation the AD said the parents or the people trying to coach were not allowed down on the track even if they were parents because OHSAA has strict laws about coaching must come from board approved coaches. It was resolved. But outside of meets and practice I was not coaching and it was not fun for me.

The AD said it was worse in swimming. Imagine the current swimming laws applied to other sports? Currently OHSAA says that swimmers only have to attend 1 high school swim practice a week. The other days and practices are with the club. That would be terrible for team chemistry and trying to do relay teams.

The AD also said it is obviously bad in soccer, basketball and volleyball, but they have strict laws prohibiting contact with the club coaches during season.

But imagine sports like golf coaches and tennis coaches. Where every kid has their own professional swing coach. Or baseball where kids have their own pitching coach and hitting coaches. My AD said you are lucky in xc an track because the CLUB and country club aspect has not taken over your sport.


I would not enjoy my job if I had to deal with what these other sports have to deal with especially swimming.

But at this point the only glory hungry people in our sport are the pole vaulters. The pole vaulting community is amazing and at the same time a little crazy. Whack jobs all trying to help people out in their sandals, Birkenstocks, and fanny packs. Don't get me wrong I have 2 pole vault coaches on staff. These are great people. But at the same time they all help each other out and cheer for each other. Great comradery. Except when you are trying to win meets and every point counts and your paid coach is helping the other team to beat your girl/boy. I have a love/hate relationship with this community.
Smart head coaches would not seek a confrontation with out-of-season coaches. Instead, seek to work with them and gain insights that you may not have. The days of a "board-approved" coach being the be-all, say-all god-like figure in a serious HS athlete's life are GONE. Kaput. If you take that attitude, they (the athletes) just might call your bluff and tell you what you can do with your coaching. Better to gain their insights and work that into your system. Get the athlete and his private coach on board with your program. Don't take it personally that they might have a different viewpoint. Views are like .... - everyone's got one.

I guess I never felt threatened by outside influences as the coaches I was around were all former serious athletes themselves, many of them having competed at the collegiate level like myself. I'd also done some post-graduate studies in bio-mechanics and studied the dickens out of my areas of expertise. I continued to learn from others. Never took any of it personally if someone had a difference of opinion.

Hope this is of some help.

P.S. - Having been a former vaulter in another lifetime, yes, they are different. There are also very FEW GOOD vault coaches out there, so best not to piss them off. Else, you might not have any vaulters at all.
  #5  
Old 12-19-18, 06:39 AM
ccrunner609 ccrunner609 is offline
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Would agree......the situation that started this was with mainly PV. I know that you cant police kids when they are on their own time and are vaulting on weekends and after practice at other schools in the evenings.

The big problem is trying to coach them at meets. Some of the outside influences are actually at meets with their teams and still videoing my kids and trying to help them when the "board approved" hired coach is their.

I had a very good PVer last year that by the time outdoor started was so screwed up from overcoaching that the 11'6" girl couldnt get 9'6" at indoor state. Her actual school coach had to start her over again.

Then I find out that she had a concussion from vaulting and the out of season coach failed to inform us or her parents.
  #6  
Old 12-19-18, 07:07 AM
JAVMAN83 JAVMAN83 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccrunner609 View Post
Would agree......the situation that started this was with mainly PV. I know that you cant police kids when they are on their own time and are vaulting on weekends and after practice at other schools in the evenings.

The big problem is trying to coach them at meets. Some of the outside influences are actually at meets with their teams and still videoing my kids and trying to help them when the "board approved" hired coach is their.

I had a very good PVer last year that by the time outdoor started was so screwed up from overcoaching that the 11'6" girl couldnt get 9'6" at indoor state. Her actual school coach had to start her over again.

Then I find out that she had a concussion from vaulting and the out of season coach failed to inform us or her parents.
Wow...the out-of-season coach failed to inform of a concussion? Seriously? That should be grounds by the parents for never working with that person again...at the least!
  #7  
Old 12-19-18, 01:49 PM
psycho_dad psycho_dad is offline
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That's on the parents. Their responsibility to inform coaches of such things.

I've already gone on my 5 PV rants. We go to one meet where it is just a miserable experience. It might very well be a miserable experience at the two large invites we hold at the end of the season too, but ours is miserable because we are trying to give every kid a fair opportunity to hit season bests and propel themselves into the championship part of the season. The other meet is miserable because it's taken over by private coaches / school coaches that also coach multiple vaulters from other schools. So, it is all set up for the top 2 or 3 vaulters and everyone else gets screwed.

The thing is that if you have a kid that is getting outside coaching, you need to do as much as you can to coordinate what is taking place. If you can't do that, or the parents, athlete or outside coach is not willing to work a plan, then tell them to go have fun, but you will have to go the season without them.
 

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