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  #391  
Old 02-22-17, 07:20 AM
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cardzfan1234 cardzfan1234 is offline
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Player is dribbling, player slips and knee hits ground. Player keeps his dribble before the slip, during the slip, and after the slip. As he gets himself up (while dribbling), a travel violation is called. Is this right?
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  #392  
Old 02-22-17, 09:11 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardzfan1234 View Post
Player is dribbling, player slips and knee hits ground. Player keeps his dribble before the slip, during the slip, and after the slip. As he gets himself up (while dribbling), a travel violation is called. Is this right?
What you described is not a violation.
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  #393  
Old 02-23-17, 01:11 AM
Philly_Cat Philly_Cat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cardzfan1234 View Post
Player is dribbling, player slips and knee hits ground. Player keeps his dribble before the slip, during the slip, and after the slip. As he gets himself up (while dribbling), a travel violation is called. Is this right?
Had this happen in my son's game over the weekend. Ref blew the whistle for a travel. The other ref came over to talk with him. After talking they riled that it wasn't travel and the team retained possession and inbounded the ball from the spot where play was stopped.
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  #394  
Old 02-23-17, 01:33 AM
Look Ma No Hands Look Ma No Hands is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philly_Cat View Post
Had this happen in my son's game over the weekend. Ref blew the whistle for a travel. The other ref came over to talk with him. After talking they riled that it wasn't travel and the team retained possession and inbounded the ball from the spot where play was stopped.
Correctable error?

Last edited by AllSports12; 02-23-17 at 07:07 AM.
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  #395  
Old 02-23-17, 07:07 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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This does not fall into the correctable error category.
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  #396  
Old 02-23-17, 10:09 AM
Look Ma No Hands Look Ma No Hands is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
This does not fall into the correctable error category.
So in Philly Cat's scenario, there were two mistakes.
1) The call should not have been made (the travel call), and
2) It should not have been corrected.
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  #397  
Old 02-23-17, 10:25 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Look Ma No Hands View Post
So in Philly Cat's scenario, there were two mistakes.
1) The call should not have been made (the travel call), and
2) It should not have been corrected.

Correct.......
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  #398  
Old 02-23-17, 10:33 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Look Ma No Hands View Post
Correctable error?
Correctable Errors involve one of the following.....

- Failure award merited Free Throw
- Awarding unmerited Free Throw
- Free Throw attempted by the wrong player
- Free Throw attempted at the wrong basket
- Erroneously counting or cancelling a score
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  #399  
Old 02-23-17, 02:29 PM
Teddy_Westside Teddy_Westside is offline
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You could rule it an inadvertant whistle. That way the correctbale error rule does not come into play. Referee blew the whistle when he should not have. I know that could open a can of worms, but that is clearly not a violation.
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  #400  
Old 02-23-17, 02:31 PM
Talk some sense Talk some sense is offline
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Wrong shooter on free throws

Saw this recently. Player 1 from team A gets fouled in bonus situation. Player on team B gets a technical foul for reacting. Player 2 from team A steps up to line to shoot free throws and makes two in a row. Then Player 2 proceeds to shoot two more free throws and makes both of those. Coach of team B protests that wrong player was shooting. Coach of team A shrugs and grins. Refs rule that all 4 shots count as it is non-correctable since shots already taken.

What is proper correction - especially if first two free throws should have been taken by Player 1?
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  #401  
Old 02-23-17, 03:30 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Teddy_Westside View Post
You could rule it an inadvertant whistle. That way the correctbale error rule does not come into play. Referee blew the whistle when he should not have. I know that could open a can of worms, but that is clearly not a violation.
An IW is one blown for no reason. If an official tries to get out of a kicked call by claiming an IW, then he's going to get zero respect from his partners and coaches and is not going to be around long.
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  #402  
Old 02-23-17, 03:33 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Talk some sense View Post
Saw this recently. Player 1 from team A gets fouled in bonus situation. Player on team B gets a technical foul for reacting. Player 2 from team A steps up to line to shoot free throws and makes two in a row. Then Player 2 proceeds to shoot two more free throws and makes both of those. Coach of team B protests that wrong player was shooting. Coach of team A shrugs and grins. Refs rule that all 4 shots count as it is non-correctable since shots already taken.

What is proper correction - especially if first two free throws should have been taken by Player 1?
If the error was realized before the first dead ball after the ball be came live after the error, then the two throws made incorrectly by Player 2 would be wiped out and Player 1 would shoot the Bonus. Team A then would get the ball at the division line for a throw-in
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  #403  
Old 02-23-17, 04:46 PM
Talk some sense Talk some sense is offline
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Wrong shooter

That's what Coach B tried to get done but refs weren't having any of it. Turned out OK as Team B won on last second shot.
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  #404  
Old 02-23-17, 05:56 PM
Philly_Cat Philly_Cat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
Correctable Errors involve one of the following.....

- Failure award merited Free Throw
- Awarding unmerited Free Throw
- Free Throw attempted by the wrong player
- Free Throw attempted at the wrong basket
- Erroneously counting or cancelling a score
Full disclosure, this was a 6th grade game. Not that I condone it, because I would prefer games are called the same regardless of level, but you do tend to give some leeway in general to referees at the youth level, especially when it comes to getting things right in the end.

Knowing what I known now, and that the call shouldn't have been changed, I would have preferred it to have been done correctly. Now whether that was known by those refs , I don't know. Ultimately I'm fine with what they did, but it is a fine line at the youth level.
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  #405  
Old 02-27-17, 12:45 PM
Dad Of HDvHS Fan Dad Of HDvHS Fan is offline
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Player A1 commits a personal foul [his 4th]. B1 reacts and is assessed a T. A1 then reacts and is also assessed a T [his 5th]. A1 was allowed to shoot the T free throws before being replaced for his 5th foul. Correct ???
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  #406  
Old 02-27-17, 09:09 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dad Of HDvHS Fan View Post
Player A1 commits a personal foul [his 4th]. B1 reacts and is assessed a T. A1 then reacts and is also assessed a T [his 5th]. A1 was allowed to shoot the T free throws before being replaced for his 5th foul. Correct ???
No

A1 disqualified himself from the contest when he received his 5th foul via the technical foul. The officials should have required Team A's Head Coach to pick a substitute for A1.
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  #407  
Old 02-28-17, 01:51 AM
Look Ma No Hands Look Ma No Hands is offline
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I haven't seen this, but was wondering... on a side out of bounds play a team throws a lob play towards the rim and the ball goes through the hoop without touching someone. I know the basket doesn't count, but is the ball still live after it goes through the hoop? The hoop is considered in bounds. Or is it a violation?
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  #408  
Old 02-28-17, 08:34 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Look Ma No Hands View Post
I haven't seen this, but was wondering... on a side out of bounds play a team throws a lob play towards the rim and the ball goes through the hoop without touching someone. I know the basket doesn't count, but is the ball still live after it goes through the hoop? The hoop is considered in bounds. Or is it a violation?
It is a violation to throw the ball into the basket directly from OOB. The opponent will be awarded a designated spot throw-in from the same spot the prior throw-in occurred.
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  #409  
Old 03-01-17, 08:34 PM
Philly_Cat Philly_Cat is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
It is a violation to throw the ball into the basket directly from OOB. The opponent will be awarded a designated spot throw-in from the same spot the prior throw-in occurred.
Is the ball still live if it touches the rim first before any player?
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  #410  
Old 03-01-17, 09:59 PM
Blue Jay Fan Blue Jay Fan is offline
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is there still a rule that prohibits a player from running out of bounds on the baseline? I know a rule was instituted a few years ago and saw it called once, maybe twice that year but not since. I saw it called two weeks ago.
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  #411  
Old 03-01-17, 11:40 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Philly_Cat View Post
Is the ball still live if it touches the rim first before any player?
Yes

It's only a violation if it passes through the basket
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  #412  
Old 03-01-17, 11:45 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Jay Fan View Post
is there still a rule that prohibits a player from running out of bounds on the baseline? I know a rule was instituted a few years ago and saw it called once, maybe twice that year but not since. I saw it called two weeks ago.
It is a violation for a player to go out of bounds for the purpose of attaining an advantage. (It is a technical foul for a player to be legally out of bounds and delay his/her return inbounds in order to gain an advantage)

Example >>>> A13 runs out of bounds at the point where A45 and A44 are setting a double screen along the end line. A13 clears the screen, which effectively prevents B22 from defending the play.

The ball is dead immediately when A13 runs out of bounds.

Last edited by AllSports12; 03-03-17 at 07:21 AM.
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  #413  
Old 03-02-17, 10:14 AM
JElder JElder is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
It is a violation for a player to go out of bounds for the purpose of attaining an advantage. (It is a technical foul for a player to be legally out of bounds and delay his/her return inbounds in order to gain an advantage)

Example >>>> A13 runs out of bounds at the point where A45 and A44 are setting a double screen along the end line. A13 clears the screen, which effectively prevents B22 from defending the play.

The ball is dead immediately when A13 runs out of bounds.
I've seen it called once in 14 years of officiating. Not that it makes it right, but good luck explaining that to the coach until it becomes a point of emphasis.

Last edited by AllSports12; 03-03-17 at 07:22 AM.
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  #414  
Old 03-02-17, 01:16 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JElder View Post
I've seen it called once in 14 years of officiating. Not that it makes it right, but good luck explaining that to the coach until it becomes a point of emphasis.
It was a point of emphasis in 2004-2005. Those POE's remain in effect until otherwise specifically changed.

The penalty for this infraction was changed from a technical foul to a violation prior to the 2005-2006 season. (reason -- officials weren't calling it and both coaches and officials agreed that the penalty was too severe)

It's easy to call, when they go OOB to gain an advantage, you blow the whistle and award the ball to the opponent, just like you do when they travel, double dribble, commit offensive basket interference...etc.

Had three of them this year alone in games I worked.

Last edited by AllSports12; 03-03-17 at 07:19 AM.
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  #415  
Old 03-02-17, 01:30 PM
blue60 blue60 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
It was a point of emphasis in 2004-2005. Those point remain in effect until otherwise specifically changed.

The penalty for this infraction was changed from a technical foul to a violation prior to the 2005-2006 season. (reason -- officials weren't calling it and both coaches and officials agreed that the penalty was too severe)

It's easy to call, when they go or stay OOB to gain an advantage, you blow the whistle and award the ball to the opponent, just like you do when they travel, double dribble, commit offensive basket interference...etc.

Had three of them this year alone in games I worked.
Seen this called a couple of times this year. What happens when the player is clearly pushed out of bounds by defender?
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  #416  
Old 03-02-17, 05:09 PM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by blue60 View Post
Seen this called a couple of times this year. What happens when the player is clearly pushed out of bounds by defender?
Foul on the defender

In all seriousness..... He didn't go out of bounds on his own to gain an advantage, so there is no violation. However, if he delays his return to the court for the purpose of gaining an advantage (the defenders forget about him), then the penalty is a technical foul.

The game is meant to be played inside the boundary lines.

Last edited by AllSports12; 03-03-17 at 07:19 AM.
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  #417  
Old 03-02-17, 11:43 PM
zebrastripes zebrastripes is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
It is a violation for a player to go out of bounds for the purpose of attaining an advantage. (It is also a violation for a player to be legally out of bounds and delay his/her return inbounds in order to gain an advantage)
AllSports, what you described in parentheses is not a violation; it's a technical foul.
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  #418  
Old 03-03-17, 07:17 AM
AllSports12 AllSports12 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zebrastripes View Post
AllSports, what you described in parentheses is not a violation; it's a technical foul.
Holy crap....... that will teach me to try to place two or three thoughts into one response..... Thanks, Good Catch!


*** Edited those responses to correctly indicate that delaying the return after being legally out of bounds is penalized with a technical foul ***

Last edited by AllSports12; 03-03-17 at 02:10 PM.
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  #419  
Old 03-04-17, 10:34 AM
Andy27 Andy27 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AllSports12 View Post
Holy crap....... that will teach me to try to place two or three thoughts into one response..... Thanks, Good Catch!


*** Edited those responses to correctly indicate that delaying the return after being legally out of bounds is penalized with a technical foul ***
I saw this called in the Akron/Miami game on Tuesday night. Kid for Akron got his 4th foul and walked off onto the sideline and got hit with a technical and fouled out.
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  #420  
Old 03-08-17, 08:07 PM
kingpin2010 kingpin2010 is offline
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What about if the player is on defense? Most famous of this was the lakers guard last year hiding behind the coach then coming from behind to make a steal.

Also, I may have got this misconstrued. Last week in our tournament game, one of our players got T'd up for dunking pre-game. So he starts with a foul, the opponent shoots 2 and gets the ball to start. But the coach also was forced to sit on the bench while the ball was live? Overall it seems like an incredibly harsh punishment.
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