Centerville vs. St.X

[ElksSWIM2010]

The rivalry continues and i believe that this year CVILLE will have a close competition with St.X. Centerville has many fast underclassmen and some fast freshmen coming in. Swimmers from Centerville performed very well this LCM summer and i think they have a great chance of an upset.

[ImPartial]

Does StX consider this a rivalry, or is that just in Cville's mind? How about providing some stats to support Centerville's chances?

At district, here is how I see the comparison:

distance: StX: Columbus, Lawley, Miller greatly outscore Perkins
IM & breast: Lipari & Schwartz outscore Litvinov & Glaser-Garbrick

backstroke & fly: goes to Centerville
50/100: StX Schoenling is the only returning sprinter at district for either team

relays: is there any reason to think Centerville will win 2 or more relays? Until Centerville beats StX at a meet, I would give the advantage to StX.

diving: StX, Meier & Resendes way ahead of Fowler

On paper right now, Centerville is ahead in two out of twelve events, StX has a clear lead in at least six events and probably two relays. Share some of those LCM performances that indicate even a glimmer of a teeny chance of an upset.

[ElksSWIM2010]

Centerville has two new freshmen coming in Sam Mitchell and Brian Clark who are both 22 lows and 49s in freestyle and they will be even better when they train with the high school group...this summer both easily made top8 at JOs and
mitchell went a(LCM)
1:02.00 100back
56.2 100free
25 50free
2:12 200back

Brian Clark went 26low and 57 low(LCM) in his sprinting events...

Also you forgot to mention travis schieman who is a young JRNA qualifier whos 100breast is 1:07mid LCM and 200breast is 2:33 which beats lipari and schwartz. his 100fly is a 58(LCM) which is very good as well. and he is a excellent free sprinter

Ty perkins truly will be alone against lawly and columbus...at Y nationals ty went a 4:08 in his 400free(LCM) which is not bad he has gone a 22low 50free and a 47 100free which is good for relays dont know his 200free time..

Dan Glaser-Garbrick is more of a distance IMer at a 4:48(LCM) but his 200IM 2:18 is not bad lipari and schwartz should beat him and litvinov easily dan went a 58.8 in his 100fly(LCM) which is an awesome swim and a 2:11 in his 200fly both every close to NCSA cuts

Mark gammell went a 1:02.02 and a 2:10.4 in his backstroke events this summer(LCM) and has gone a 56 in his 100free and a 2:20 in his 200IM(LCM) adding to the backstroke depth

Also backstrokers tyler roberts and mason davis went a 1:04 this summer adding more backstrokers and tyler roberts went a 1:01 in his 100fly not spectacular but its something

Max litvinov went a 2:31 and a 1:10 in his breastroke events(LCM) and his IM is mediocre with a 2:20(LCM) also nathan falknor is a 1:01low 100breast (SCY) and a 22 50free

Also more notables are austin gregory who went a 57(LCM) 100free and a 2:03(200free) nathan spruill, clay johnson, also new sprinter tyler mcdaniel 22(SCY) 50free are some other swimmers.

diving...centerville diving is pretty bad yeah:(

relays...the medley should get close dont know bout the other relays...

just saying...it could be kinda close centerville swimmers showed improvements over the summer

[SwimFan23]

I have been following swimming and the history of swimmers in the olympics for a good many minutes now. I can safely say that (and the past has shown us) the outcome of races is based only MINIMALLY on previous performance as numerous factors go into whether or not a particular swimmer achieves success in his/her aquatic ventures. I provide one particular example:

Kipta, Babba of Finland's north-indian streamed region was estimated to have succeeded his previous teammate's records in the individual swimming racing times in the watery lanes (bordered by the floating circles). It was looked forward to, discussed throughout his home-land, and his name had be so hailed that a fan-base developed, and the hype had grown so great concerning his race that particular sunny/cloudy day that a flock of rabid african water-pigs lay neath his windowsill. The thunder rolled, the hummingbirds farted, and the milkmen trembled in their dairy-like tubs. As Kipta warmed his swimmery muscles the Gods seemed to have smiled behind their bushy mustachii as they yearned to see the results from his first race in his swimmery lane with his swimmery circles. His swimmery suit was pink, by the way. Long-story short, Kipta never won that day.

So you see, things don't always turn out as they are expected. So i end now by saying...ImPartial doesn't know anything about swimming...take it from me...

[ImPartial]

There were three big meets recently where you can verify results:

1 Speedo sectional: http://iu.iuhoosiers.com/swimmeet/speedo08/

2 YMCA national: http://www.ymcaswimminganddiving.org/2008LC/Results/Realtime/index.htm

3 Ohio JO: http://www.swim-makos.com/realtime/index.htm

I'm not associated with Centerville nor StX, so I don't know all the team members for next year. I looked up results at those three meets and put together these times for similar high school events:

50 free
24.55 lawley 1
25.44 schoenling 1
25.97 louis, kevin 1
26.24 mitchell 3
26.62 clark 3
27.21 falknor 1

100 free
54.69 lawley 1
55.41 louis 1
56.30 mitchell 3
56.87 schoenling 1
57.58 clark 3

200 free
1:55.53 lawley 1
1:55.82 columbus 1

500 free (400 free lcm)
4:06.04 columbus 1
4:08.26 lawley 1
4:09.36 perkins 2
4:13.27 miller 1
4:26.40 lawley, robert 2

breast
1:08.60 lipari 1
1:09.02 schwartz 1
1:09.88 schieman 1
1:10.64 litvinov 1
1:12.32 baumgartner 3
1:14.44 falknor 1

back
1:02.00 mitchell 3
1:02.22 gammel 1
1:04.20 roberts 1
1:06.19 davis 1

fly
58.80 glaser 1
59.81 schieman 1
60.60 louis 1 (will he swim this or 50 free??)
61.59 roberts 1

im
2:14.13 schwartz 1
2:15.50 lipari 1
2:18.31 glaser 1
2:20.08 gammell 1
2:20.25 litvinov 1

Remember, you can only swim two individual events at district and there are no 200 back/fly/breast. I added Lawley's times in the sprints for reference, since he will be significant in the relays. Based on that, I still see StX scoring more points in the 4 freestyle events, the breaststroke and IM. Centerville scores more points in the back and fly.

[ElksSWIM2010]

First things first...swimming is put into two divisions meaning the better people from both teams may move higher depending on who is in DIV-I such as maybe pat mchugh or bryan bedacht could be in DIV-II...

This meaning that CVILLES flyers and backstrokers would maybe move up even higher while st.x doesnt have too many.
Also at senior championships mason davis went a 1:04 in a swim-off...
http://www.daytonraiders.com/meets_lc2008/seniors_complete_results.htm

Travis Schieman went a 1:07 100BREAST at speedo sectional champs in march 27-30 in indy
http://www.daytonraiders.com/meets_sc_2008/sectionals_complete_results.htm
NOTE...
Based on the long course performences of travis schieman(1:07) that makes him better than joe albers and taking away seniors from last district the projected top5 are
albers,schieman,schwartz,lipari,litvinov

and based on LCM season travis is the fastest and if we base it on best times districts would be
1.travis schieman(C)
2.joe albers
3.sam lipari(X)
4.evan schwartz(X)
5.max litvinov(C)
AND points wise making centervilles breastrokers better than st. xs


Also i am pretty sure lawly will not do either the 100free or the 500free but will do the 200free

Centervilles has a strong medley relay i dont know its lineup for sure but at state last year on splits for the relay travis schieman went a 22.9 and with seniors alex shaffer and ---- gone that makes him the fastest or 2nd fastest 50flyer in ohio next year and mark gammell went a 25.6...on his 200back at finals for sectionals he took it out in a 29.7(LCM) ty perkins could be the freestyler at districts last year ty went a 22.1 on the 2free relay and a 47 on the 400free relay. Breastroker max litvinov best time was at mako holiday classic december of last year with a 27.6 and he took his 100breast out in a 32.1(LCM) at sectionals this july... this could win districts

the free relays could be rough for centerville here is a list of people could would or could be on them
-mark gammell
-dan glaser-garbrick
-sam mitchell
-ty perkins
-brian clark
-tyler mcdaniel
-travis schieman

400free looking to be better than the 200free relay

[ImPartial]

District results from last season for underclassmen that are most likely Division I schools:

4 Joe Albers Jr Cincinnati Moeller :58.75
5 Travis Schieman So Centerville :59.06
6 Evan Schwartz Jr Cincinnati St. Xavier :59.51
7 Sam Lipari So Cincinnati St. Xavier :59.91
11 Maxim Litvinov So Centerville 1:00.87
14 Andrew Keriazes Jr Springfield North 1:01.49
16 Gabriel Baumgartner Fr Cincinnati St. Xavier 1:01.73
18 Blaine Kincaid Jr Springboro 1:01.91
19 Brandon Williams So Loveland 1:01.98
20 Nate Falknor Jr Centerville 1:02.03

LCM results from Speedo sectional:


22 Albers, Joe C 17 Cincinnati Marli 1:07.87
23 Lipari, Sam J 16 Cincinnati Marli 1:08.60
27 Schwartz, Evan 17 Cincinnati Marli 1:09.02
37 Schieman, Travi 16 Washington Towns 1:09.88
38 Kincaid, Blaine 17 Washington Towns 1:10.60
39 Litvinov, Maxim 17 Washington Towns 1:10.64
47 Williams, Brand 16 Mason Manta Rays 1:11.51
2 Baumgartner, Ga 14 Marlins-OH 1:12.32 **
4 Keriazes, Drew G 17 SPY 1:12.72 **
74 Falknor, Nate K 17 Washington Towns 1:14.44


The high school district meet is scored by head-to-head finish at the same pool on the same day, not based on season best time. The speedo sectional had eight of the top ten breaststroke finishers in the same pool same day (except Baumgartner and Keriazes). What is nice about that is you don't have to listen to excuses about how someone "could of" or "would of" swam better under different conditions.

District is scored as:
20-17-16-15-14-13-12-11 9-7-6-5-4-3-2-1

If the order of finish stayed the same as last year:
StX: 16+15+12=43
Centerville: 17+14+7=38

If the order of finish is the same as at the speedo sectional:
StX: 17+16+11 = 44
Centerville: 15+13+7 = 37

For the next actual head-head race by these ten guys, we will have to wait for the high school district race. Even if you want to assume Schieman finishes first and bumps the next three down a spot, you get:

StX: 16+15+11 = 42
Centerville: 20+13+7 = 40


Overall, I don't think a five point swing in breaststroke will make much of a difference in the total team score. StX will still probably score in the 350+ range while Centerville, Mason, and Moeller will fight for second place scoring in the 230-270 range. It will be fun to see those three compete at the Larry Lyons meet this year.

[ElksSWIM2010]

Mason Lost...
Brandon Evans(12th 200free)(7th 500free)
Spencer Hewes(2nd 100breast)(6th 200IM)
Brad Langford(4th 200free)(6th 100fly)
Nick Steege(10th 100back)
Jonathan Joyce(15th 50 free)(10th 100free)
Jacob Lindley(17th 100breast)(25th 100fly)
Drew McKee(22nd 100fly)
all stats from districts...

Moeller Lost...
Brian Howell(1st 200IM)(2nd 500free)
Peter Schildknecht(10th 100breast)

Centerville Lost...
Brian Brasser(3rd 100breast)
Brad Chambers(2nd 200Free)(5th 100free)
Ryan Bender(12th 200IM)

Besides an occasional sprinter mason doesnt have close to the depth of centerville and a lot of those guys they lost were on relays mason has no backstroker, flyer, or breastroker that comes remotely close to gammell/mitchell/roberts, litvinov, or schieman/glaser-garbrick let alone the top16, they do have Jared Kolwyck and Zach Rice for distance but ty is faster, Tyler Torbet is a decent IMer but against two guys from cville, Andy Supronas and Keaton Freds are decent sprinters but not enough people for relays...

Moeller could be very good...Kevin Koenig, David Sanders, Kevin Schwab, and michael krone are and excellent group of freestylers and sanders for fly. Joe albers is an excellent breast and IMer. But are these enough people to go against centerville. Brian Howell leaving meaning there are ZERO 500swimmers coming back and his 200IM was...you know...kinda good. Also howell just happened to swim backstroke on the medley and anchor the 4free relay... Joe albers was not on the medley but if he gets put on it that would mean he could not swim one of the other relays. Same with Kevin Koenig

Centerville has too much depth at backstroke and fly for moeller...
-gammell ,roberts ,mitchell(FR) ,davis vs Kevin Koenig(19th last year)
-Schieman, Glaser-Garbrick and Roberts vs sanders

Centervilles BRers will outscore albers because he is only one man...
-Schieman, Litvinov vs joe albers

Ty Will outscore everyone in the 500free(moeller 0 returning swimmers from that position) but will have trouble with michael krone on the 200free.

200IM
-Albers vs Litvinov and Glaser-Garbrick this could be bad for cville

in the 50 and 100free moeller will do well in with...
Kevin Koenig and Kevin Schwab in the 50
michael krone and kevin Schwab in the 100
New freshmen sam mitchell and brian clark will ad to the sprinting depth for centerville...

200medley...moeller does not have brian howell and the next person to swim back on the relay is kevin Koenig meaning he would not swim free and he is there fastest 50freestyler and this takes him off one of the free relays...even if he swims back gammell is much faster as he has proved this LCM season... putting albers on the medley takes him off one of the other relays, but even if that happens centerville will have a major advantage on back,fly and maybe free because koenig swims back, and albers will have an advantage on litvinov...

so...Kevin Koenig, Kevin Schwab, David Sanders, Michael Krone, and Joe Albers would be cycled on three relays ?could that work with only two maximum relays per person?

so main reason for centerville beating moeller...no brian howell

LARRY LYONS...haha howell was not there last time and centerville beat moeller

[ImPartial]

Mason Lost...

Moeller Lost...
Brian Howell(1st 200IM)(2nd 500free)
Peter Schildknecht(10th 100breast)

Centerville Lost...
Brian Brasser(3rd 100breast)
Brad Chambers(2nd 200Free)(5th 100free)
Ryan Bender(12th 200IM)


so main reason for centerville beating moeller...no brian howell

LARRY LYONS...haha howell was not there last time and centerville beat moeller

Mason lost the most. Here are the Lyons scores from last season:

1. Mason.High.School. 321
2. Centerville.High.School 315
3. Moeller.High.School 259

But Howell was not there, so from the Lyons meet, they will only be missing Schildknecht (6 pts) while Centerville will be missing Brasser, Bender, Chambers...57 individual points.

Lyons is five months away, but just for fun... I took the top two from sectionals last year and compared for Lyons. First, you are only allowed two per event at Lyons and nobody is tapered for Lyons. So sectional times are are a reasonable point of comparison. Lyons is scored
16-13-12-11-10-9 7-5-4-3-2-1



50.free
Supronas,.Andy.......JR.Mason..................22. 23......22.04...16
Sanders,.David.V.....JR.Moeller................22. 16......22.14...13..
Koenig,.Kevin.W......JR.Moeller................21. 90......22.27...12
Hancher,.Jonathon.A..JR.Sycamore...............23. 00......22.57...11
Freds,.Keaton.S......JR.Mason..................23. 30......23.00...10
Nate.Falknor.........Jr.Centerville............... ........23.75....9
Mike.Hartman.........So.Centerville............... ........24.99....7

Schwab,.Kevin.P......FR.Moeller................23. 51......22.90....


100.free
Supronas,.Andy.......JR.Mason..................49. 52......48.30...16..
Krone,.Michael.F.....JR.Moeller................47. 83......48.37...13..
Schwab,.Kevin.P......FR.Moeller................51. 34......49.95...12
Freds,.Keaton.S......JR.Mason..................51. 70......50.73...11..
Winkler,.Steven.A....FR.Sycamore...............52. 21......51.87...10..
Mark.Gammell.........Jr.Centerville............... ........52.13....9
Spooner,.David.......JR.Mariemont..............51. 99......52.16....7..
Tyler.Roberts........So.Centerville............... ........52.89....5

Hammerstein,.Logan...SO.Moeller................52. 64......51.71.....

200.free
Ty.Perkins...........So.Centerville............... ......1:45.70...16
Vigar,.John.J........SO.Anderson.............1:44. 65....1:46.03...13..
Krone,.Michael.F.....JR.Moeller..............1:45. 52....1:46.34...12..
Rice,.Zach.J.........JR.Mason................1:48. 16....1:47.84...11..
Kolwyck,.Jared.M.....JR.Mason................1:48. 95....1:49.23...10..
Austin.Gregory.......Fr.Centerville............... ......1:50.82....9
Carrigan,.Michael....SO.Mariemont............1:55. 70....1:51.81....7
Gutierrez,.Manuel.M..FR.Sycamore.............1:51. 58....1:53.15....5

500.free
Ty.Perkins...........So.Centerville............... ......4:40.26...16
Vigar,.John.J........SO.Anderson.............4:44. 58....4:43.82...13..
Kolwyck,.Jared.M.....JR.Mason................4:48. 76....4:48.37...12..
Snook,.Andy..........JR.Turpin...............4:57. 63....4:52.61...11..
Rice,.Zach.J.........JR.Mason................4:56. 12....4:53.79...10..
Dulle,.Brogan........FR.Turpin...............5:08. 09....4:56.46....9..
Gorman,.Andy.........FR.Mariemont............5:08. 36....4:59.52....7..
Clay.Johnson.........Jr.Centerville............... ......5:04.43....5
Gutierrez,.Manuel.M..FR.Sycamore.............5:01. 34....5:06.50....4
Krehbiel,.Paul.R.....SO.Moeller..............5:31. 43....5:23.79....3
.
100.back
Mark.Gammell.........Jr.Centerville............... ........55.31...16
Koenig,.Kevin.W......JR.Moeller................55. 72......55.78...13.
Tyler.Roberts........So.Centerville............... ........57.78...12
Romanchek,.Christian.SO.Mason..................59. 69......59.23...11..
Albers,.Dieter.F.....JR.Moeller................59. 66......59.53...10..
Cerda,.Jose.R........FR.Sycamore.............1:00. 55....1:00.25....9..
Winkler,.Steven.A....FR.Sycamore.............1:01. 26....1:01.17....7..
Steele,.Sean.M.......JR.Mason................1:01. 02....1:02.07....5

Hammerstein,.Logan...SO.Moeller..............1:00. 45....1:00.95......

100.breast
Albers,.Joe.C........JR.Moeller..............1:00. 81....1:00.85...16..
Travis.Schieman......So.Centerville............... ......1:01.50...13
Maxim.Litvinov.......So.Centerville............... ......1:02.69...12
Hanson,.Andy.M.......JR.Mason................1:04. 47....1:03.88...11..
Foos,.Patrick.R......SO.Moeller..............1:04. 05....1:04.02...10..
Torbet,.Tyler.S......JR.Mason................1:05. 60....1:04.94....9..
Jackson,.Kyle........FR.Turpin...............1:06. 31....1:06.56....7..

Reynaert,.Greg.......FR.Moeller..............1:07. 62....1:07.15......

100.fly
Travis.Schieman......So.Centerville............... ........53.26...16
Sanders,.David.V.....JR.Moeller................53. 73......53.39...13..
Dan.Glaser-Garbrick..Jr.Centerville.......................53. 81...12
Keefe,.Ben.J.........SO.Sycamore...............55. 70......55.35...11..
Snook,.Andy..........JR.Turpin.................57. 95......55.72...10..
Carrigan,.Michael....SO.Mariemont..............58. 04......56.66....9
Griffiths,.Chad......JR.Mason..................57. 38......57.12....7..
Albers,.Dieter.F.....JR.Moeller................57. 78......57.25....5..
Dulle,.Brogan........FR.Turpin.................58. 86......57.55....4.
.
Glaser,.Mike.D.......JR.Moeller................59. 16......57.89......

200.IM
Albers,.Joe.C........JR.Moeller..............1:57. 17....1:57.22...16..
Dan.Glaser-Garbrick..Jr.Centerville.....................2:02. 54...13
Maxim.Litvinov.......So.Centerville............... ......2:03.83...12
Torbet,.Tyler.S......JR.Mason................2:05. 56....2:04.36...11..
Foos,.Patrick.R......SO.Moeller..............2:07. 16....2:07.09...10..
Monahan,.Sean........FR.Turpin...............2:11. 10....2:07.23....9..
Hanson,.Andy.M.......JR.Mason................2:10. 59....2:08.09....7..
Gorman,.Andy.........FR.Mariemont............2:10. 70....2:09.54....5


Summing points for individual swims:

182 Centerville
158 Moeller
157 Mason

There are too many variables to bother with relays. Last year, the lowest place by a B relay for these three schools was eight place with these totals for A&B relays:

136 Mason
126 Moeller
120 Centerville

So add 120-140 to all the individual scoring, plus diving, plus add in any super freshmen, minus anyone that is on a college trip or has the flu or broke his arm skiing, etc. On paper, it looks like Centerville has the lead. But I think that was the same story last year when Mason beat Centerville.

[ElksSWIM2010]

Centerville lost by 5-10 points last year to mason and there 200free A relay got DQed for a false start

[ImPartial]

Centerville lost by 5-10 points last year to mason and there 200free A relay got DQed for a false start

It is true that you score less points if DQ'd. For example, this 400 relay at Speedo Sectional scored zero points:

http://iu.iuhoosiers.com/swimmeet/speedo08/080716F034.htm

-- Washington Towns-OH 'A' 3:46.34 DQ
1) Kincaid, Blaine J 17 2) Glaser-Garbrick, Dan R 17
3) Schieman, Travis C 16 4) Gammell, Mark J 17

[ElksSWIM2010]

Centerville is not going to lose the LARRY LYONS meet again because of a cheap call by an official

[SwimFan23]

the fact of the matter is...whoever swims faster will end faster, and THEY will win the race...contrary to popular belief.

let me introduce myself...i am the much hailed hermerker, homolka hermerker...

i am here to travel the world...evaluate swimming events...and DO GOOD! MAY THE WORLD WITNESS MY GREATNESS! MAY THE WATER CRASH BENEATH MY FLATULANCE! AND MAY...THE ELKS OF CENTERVILLENESS FOREVER REIGN UPON THE WATERY DEPTHS OF SYCAMORE LARRYNESS INVITATIONS TO LIONS! ALLOW THE SANDS UPON THE DUNES OF LARRY, TO BREATHE HEAVILY AND BLIND THE SWORN ENEMIES OF THE ELKS! BY GOD ALLOW THE LANDS OF ETERNAL TIME TO RAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAIIIIIIN DOOWNNN UPON THE LANES!

-Hermerker


http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/cinema/2636/congo1.jpg

[ElksSWIM2010]

To add more best times from CVILLE people at the zone meet...

Maxim Litvinov
1:08.94 100Breast
2:30.22 200Breast

Tyler Roberts
1:03.92 100Back
1:00.50 100Fly

Mark Gammell
1:01.50 100Back

Dan Glaser-Garbrick
58.71 100fly
2:10.69 200 Fly