View Full Version : Ultimate Showdown...Club or H/s.
Which is more beneficial in terms of the college recruiting game, and which showcases more skill.
My op. Club..
TallmagefanGK
12-04-07, 11:23 PM
definitely club
Soccerfans
12-05-07, 08:19 AM
This is like asking which has better soccer....EPL or MLS? No brainer....club
This is like asking which has better soccer....EPL or MLS? No brainer....club
Then why do so many define how some one is good based on h/s play.
goggles10
12-05-07, 04:41 PM
Then why do so many define how some one is good based on h/s play.
In highschool all you have to have to be good is speed. In club you have to be good all around with skill, vision, and speed. If you just have speed you will get shut down in club play rather in highschool play where youll be good.
FUTBOOOL
12-05-07, 07:50 PM
it's club, no more need to discuss this.
In highschool all you have to have to be good is speed. In club you have to be good all around with skill, vision, and speed. If you just have speed you will get shut down in club play rather in highschool play where youll be good.
but you do agree there are exceptions right and lots of them.
Offsides
12-06-07, 09:45 AM
Why then doesn't everyone play club in the fall and forget HS? I enjoy playing under the lights and the community involvement. Plus, you get to train everyday. I think they compliment each other very well, but you can quit HS if you want.
envelope
12-06-07, 10:34 AM
it's club, no more need to discuss this.
This thread is a waste of time. Who ever started it had to much time on their hands, everyone knows Club teams are better. Pay attention, I'm drawing a line, don't thread past the line, just stop.
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floridafutboler08
12-06-07, 11:50 AM
you left a hole in you line...so i snuck through
you left a hole in you line...so i snuck through
haha
cincysoccer2006
12-07-07, 08:47 PM
i liked hs so much more than club and developed more, but that was because my hs coach was insanely good. overall better competition is in club USUALLY, but if hs went all year id pick that any day. just so much more exciting and fun
This thread is a waste of time. Who ever started it had to much time on their hands, everyone knows Club teams are better. Pay attention, I'm drawing a line, don't thread past the line, just stop.
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Really now! There seems a certain snobby attitude about Club versus High School soccer. As to what is better for getting a kid noticed for college or developing a player's skills, I'll leave it up to the experts to decide.
I can only go by what I've observed and this is that HS soccer is a lot more fun to watch and that the best HS teams would beat the best club teams.
My kid played both HS and club and I'll readily admit that club soccer is prettier! But if this years D1 champ was matched up against the best club in Ohio, I would put my money on the HS team. Why? Because they would be in better shape, play as a team and be much more physical.
How many club programs practice almost every day? How many club programs go through the type of conditioning that HS teams do? The best HS teams are built to win leagues and go deep into the playoffs. I think a lot of the "club is better then HS" comes from the fact that by definition your "average" club team is better then your "average" high school team. That's because less kids play club at the HS age then play HS soccer. So the soccer talent is deeper accross all the club programs. But when you get to the best of the best in a state, I would go with HS.
More importantly, HS soccer actually means something! The games are played under the lights in front of a couple of hundred people. In the playoffs the atmosphere resembles football with huge student cheering sections and even bigger crowds. The games are covered in the newspapers and on the sports shows. Heck, HS soccer is talked about on Yappi a whole lot more then club soccer. In comparison, even the best club soccer is played on some field with the parents either sitting in yard chairs or pacing back and forth screaming at the refs! Maybe 25 people are watching and nobody cares about who wins or loses accept a couple of purists.
In my humble opinion, there is NO comparison between high school soccer and Club. High School wins hands down every time!
floridafutboler08
12-08-07, 12:55 PM
I can only go by what I've observed and this is that HS soccer is a lot more fun to watch and that the best HS teams would beat the best club teams.
My kid played both HS and club and I'll readily admit that club soccer is prettier! But if this years D1 champ was matched up against the best club in Ohio, I would put my money on the HS team. Why? Because they would be in better shape, play as a team and be much more physical.
that is so wrong i'm not sure where to start
that is so wrong i'm not sure where to start
What is so wrong? That a top level high school team would beat a top in state club team or that high school soccer is a much better overall experience for fans/players?
Well for the first question, we'll never know because they won't play so we can argue to the cows come home.
However, for the second one it's a no brain-er, HS soccer is more exciting, more intense and easily wins the battle of the intangibles with club soccer. I don't know how they do it in Florida, but here in Ohio when teams make deep runs into the HS playoffs, the intensity level explodes. Big stadiums, big crowds, soccer played at a feverish pitch and prime time attention. Club can't even begin to compare.
What is so wrong? That a top level high school team would beat a top in state club team or that high school soccer is a much better overall experience for fans/players?
Well for the first question, we'll never know because they won't play so we can argue to the cows come home.
However, for the second one it's a no brain-er, HS soccer is more exciting, more intense and easily wins the battle of the intangibles with club soccer. I don't know how they do it in Florida, but here in Ohio when teams make deep runs into the HS playoffs, the intensity level explodes. Big stadiums, big crowds, soccer played at a feverish pitch and prime time attention. Club can't even begin to compare.
I do agree with you when it comes to h/s that the lights, crowd , the stadiums are perks but in terms of college, a player seeking to play in college will get more praise playing for his/her club and the accomplishments
that come with club then that of the h/s team and the accomplishments with the team..
goggles10
12-08-07, 06:11 PM
Really now! There seems a certain snobby attitude about Club versus High School soccer. As to what is better for getting a kid noticed for college or developing a player's skills, I'll leave it up to the experts to decide.
I can only go by what I've observed and this is that HS soccer is a lot more fun to watch and that the best HS teams would beat the best club teams.
My kid played both HS and club and I'll readily admit that club soccer is prettier! But if this years D1 champ was matched up against the best club in Ohio, I would put my money on the HS team. Why? Because they would be in better shape, play as a team and be much more physical.
How many club programs practice almost every day? How many club programs go through the type of conditioning that HS teams do? The best HS teams are built to win leagues and go deep into the playoffs. I think a lot of the "club is better then HS" comes from the fact that by definition your "average" club team is better then your "average" high school team. That's because less kids play club at the HS age then play HS soccer. So the soccer talent is deeper accross all the club programs. But when you get to the best of the best in a state, I would go with HS.
More importantly, HS soccer actually means something! The games are played under the lights in front of a couple of hundred people. In the playoffs the atmosphere resembles football with huge student cheering sections and even bigger crowds. The games are covered in the newspapers and on the sports shows. Heck, HS soccer is talked about on Yappi a whole lot more then club soccer. In comparison, even the best club soccer is played on some field with the parents either sitting in yard chairs or pacing back and forth screaming at the refs! Maybe 25 people are watching and nobody cares about who wins or loses accept a couple of purists.
In my humble opinion, there is NO comparison between high school soccer and Club. High School wins hands down every time!
Personally i beleive club is better then highschool because of the competition.
You play much better competition and for me atleast highschool was easy. You rarely played someone with skill which is a dissapointment for me. I love a challenge and highschool soccer just wasnt. In your case your songs club team probly was bad and his highschool was atleast decent. When you watched your sons club games they were boring and pointless. His highschool games were more exciting so you like it more. Come out to some big time club games and im sure youll change your opinion
cincysoccer2006
12-09-07, 02:02 PM
^^^no. just no.
high school games are no doubt more exciting than club games because when you play for your hs you represent something. when you play for your club you feel no great devotion to your club, it is an avenue for you to play college soccer. when you play hs you're wearing your school on your shirt and that means something and you usually have a history with the team you're playing. i would watch a madeira IH or summit seven hills game any day over say chicago magic vs. scott gallagher (when i watched the latter teams play they were 1 and 2 in the region. game was a great game to watch but hs games are much more exciting)
Statechamps02
12-09-07, 07:36 PM
I think it determines which club you play for. Personally, playing in regionals, jefferson cup, tampa bay sun bowl, disney showcase...those were far more exciting than high school. You're playing against the top teams in the nation. Playing teams that have ESPN's top 50 players on it. It's weird to watch players that I used to play against in those tournaments on TV. Those games show wayyyy more creativity and development for a soccer minded person, not just any spectator. Those games are not sloppy.
I think it determines which club you play for. Personally, playing in regionals, jefferson cup, tampa bay sun bowl, disney showcase...those were far more exciting than high school. You're playing against the top teams in the nation. Playing teams that have ESPN's top 50 players on it. It's weird to watch players that I used to play against in those tournaments on TV. Those games show wayyyy more creativity and development for a soccer minded person, not just any spectator. Those games are not sloppy.
I feel the same about my club exp's, club opens the door to more creativity. Especially if u have a coach that is focused only on the basics.
My overall feeling about club and its rtealtion to h.s is that Club soccer you could say serves as street cred for h/s.
FUTBOOOL
12-10-07, 11:14 PM
this is ridiculous, if you play on a solid club team there is so much more development. sorry lotr i love your enthusiasm but there's no comparison. if you threw out the best 17 (probably OE) and the best 18 (old eagles team) they would beat hilliard davidson by a solid 4 goals. HS soccer gets you basically NO college exposure. 95% of it goes through club.
I understand why people love hs soccer, i love parts of it too including playing for your school, playing in front of your community and peers, and playing a tough physical game. but jogas question Which is more beneficial in terms of the college recruiting game, and which showcases more skill, club wins this 100 percently (if thats a word) in my head. If it was a different question like what's more fun or what's funner to watch, i could see some different answers.
this is ridiculous, if you play on a solid club team there is so much more development. sorry lotr i love your enthusiasm but there's no comparison. if you threw out the best 17 (probably OE) and the best 18 (old eagles team) they would beat hilliard davidson by a solid 4 goals. HS soccer gets you basically NO college exposure. 95% of it goes through club.
I understand why people love hs soccer, i love parts of it too including playing for your school, playing in front of your community and peers, and playing a tough physical game. but jogas question Which is more beneficial in terms of the college recruiting game, and which showcases more skill, club wins this 100 percently (if thats a word) in my head. If it was a different question like what's more fun or what's funner to watch, i could see some different answers.
Makes sense that club would be better for college recruiting since the college season is in the fall.
As to match-ups, we'll never know but I doubt the top U17 or U18 Ohio Club team would beat the final 4 D1 HS teams by 4 goals. I suspect if you took the top 2 U17, top 2 U18 clubs and put them in a tournament with the state final 4 D1 teams, you might be surprised how competitive the games would be. I admit the best U18 club would be the favorite to win it, but there are years when the state HS champions are formidable teams.
For example, there is no way the any of the best Ohio Club teams would have scored 4 goals on last years Fairfield team. Don't see it happening.
By the way, my kid played for an okay club team and we went to tons of tournaments (it was a lot of fun even though we missed some holidays). Best his team ever did was as U16 runner-up at the Bush tournament in St. Louis. Now this was a while ago (early/mid 90's) but we would stay and watch the championship games between top clubs and while the soccer was terrific it wasn't a whole lot better then what you see deep in the Ohio HS playoffs.
I would be curious to get other perspectives on this. Again, I just don't see the top Club team in Ohio scoring 4 goals on last years FF team.
One thing I think most of us can agree on is that during the last few years the HS soccer playoffs have become big time with respect to excitement, crowds and intensity. In the 90's you didn't have the crowds that have become routine the last couple of years. Heck, there are now huge student cheering sections at these games. We can all agree that's progress!
Statechamps02
12-11-07, 10:42 PM
Lotr, I definitely see your reasoning...but if your referring club teams from the early/mid 90's, then you're missing out on some of the best soccer ever played. The amount of kids (not necessarily OH) that are now being recruited by MLS and EPL teams from American club soccer is unbelievable. I played against Spector, from Chicago Magic, who was drafted by Man U at the age of 17 and now plays for our national team. The level of talent from the early/mid 90's to now has probably multiplied by 300-400%. Although I agree with you that Fairfield had a great team last year, their D would get destroyed by the state champion u-17 team in ohio south (unless all 4 defenders played on a highly competitive club team). Now, the high school teams may not get outworked...but the club teams will have far better ball possession/control/skill-you name it. High school teams can be a 3/4 man show that will take their team to state. To win state in club takes 8/9 players.
This is comparing Apples to Oranges. There is a huge difference between the two. High school games can be won with speed alone. This won't happen in a high quality club game. You say the championship games you stayed and watched weren't that impressive liek HS....Well you have two great teams with 8/9 great players on them playing against each other. That's like putting two of the best high school teams against each other. Same thing is going to happen...play is going to be disrupted alot.
kbot513
12-12-07, 04:44 PM
What is so wrong? That a top level high school team would beat a top in state club team or that high school soccer is a much better overall experience for fans/players?
Well for the first question, we'll never know because they won't play so we can argue to the cows come home.
However, for the second one it's a no brain-er, HS soccer is more exciting, more intense and easily wins the battle of the intangibles with club soccer. I don't know how they do it in Florida, but here in Ohio when teams make deep runs into the HS playoffs, the intensity level explodes. Big stadiums, big crowds, soccer played at a feverish pitch and prime time attention. Club can't even begin to compare.
i highly doubt a top ranked hs team would have a chance against the best club team. i see where you are coming from but honestly, club teams are basically best players around on the best teams. Basically the best players from the hs teams play all for the same club team to make amazing teams, and i just think that level is such much different than luck of where you live and going to the same school.
dessfan
12-13-07, 07:26 AM
The original question was - who gets more college exposure? I know of a D1 all state, all region player that has not yet been able to secure a good D1 commitment from a college. On the flip side, I hear of more marginal club players who have college arrrangements. Hands down college opportunties come from club.
Now if you want to talk about spectator involvement, atmosphere or fun, I'm going with HS. Kinda like Major league baseball (boring - unquestioned great talent) vs. minor league (exciting, packed local parks all over the country, obviously not the same talent pool...)
pate23516
01-04-08, 02:03 PM
I got halfway through this thread and had to stop on account of lotr10
but first cincysoccer06...you should develop in high school soccer b.c there is not nearly enough talent for you to work with as a team so u need to be focusing on ur individual skills....but more exciting? no way man, u just need to get on a decent club team if you think that
and now, lotr10...you must be outside your mind when saying the best high school team could beat the best club team, there is absolutly no way
(you're sit there talking an about why club teams dont practice everyday? its because its unhealthy for the players...just a little fact i thought id throw your ignorant way)
and the newspapers pick the best players from ALL the high schools...most of those kids who were picked from cincinnati play on the same team...so that must mean that the best high school players are not on the same high school but on the same club team, what do u make of that?
the only correct thing you said in your whole post was that high school soccer is more physical
main point though....club is better than high school and gets more exposure
08soccer
01-04-08, 07:30 PM
Club definitely leads to more college opportunities, but nothing can compare to the excitement and fun of high school soccer. Totally agree with cincysoccer2006 on this one
I got halfway through this thread and had to stop on account of lotr10
but first cincysoccer06...you should develop in high school soccer b.c there is not nearly enough talent for you to work with as a team so u need to be focusing on ur individual skills....but more exciting? no way man, u just need to get on a decent club team if you think that
and now, lotr10...you must be outside your mind when saying the best high school team could beat the best club team, there is absolutly no way
(you're sit there talking an about why club teams dont practice everyday? its because its unhealthy for the players...just a little fact i thought id throw your ignorant way)
and the newspapers pick the best players from ALL the high schools...most of those kids who were picked from cincinnati play on the same team...so that must mean that the best high school players are not on the same high school but on the same club team, what do u make of that?
the only correct thing you said in your whole post was that high school soccer is more physical
main point though....club is better than high school and gets more exposure
Everyone is entitled to their opinion. I'll take the high energy, intense HS game over club any day. And for the record I'v seen some very good club championship games from around the country. The crowd usually consists of the parents a few scouts and a couple people (like me) who watch out of curiosity. Compare that to late round HS soccer playoff games. Huge corwds and the game means something.
Oh and guess what, all star teams are boring to watch.
One last thing, this is a message board and you need to be able to handle different opinions a little better.
One final thought as this thread has been resurrected. Why do all you club guys think that the best players are being chosen for their club teams. What, no politics, poor talent assessment, and a sport in which talent evaluation is almost entirely subjective!
Some of the FF posters can correct me if I’m wrong (Kbot are you out their) but did the Bauer kid from 2006’s runner up team even play high level club soccer? My understanding is he played baseball. Now that kid was an outstanding defensive player. In my opinion he was one of the best in Ohio but wasn’t recognized in the all star voting because he didn’t play club. I would have felt comfortable with him marking the best forward in Ohio that year. In fact I think he did (the Fairmont kid) and shut him down.
Now I may be wrong here but that’s how I understood it to be.
Crusaders
01-17-08, 01:26 AM
The US will never be truely good at soccer until the only youth soccer that matters is the youth clubs for MLS teams. Basically, the full adoption of the worldwide method of youth develpment is the best way to go. HS and college do not develop players well enough. It's a nice way to pay for college, but our professionals should not be being introduced to the starting XI at 21 or 22, they should be entering their primes!
moellerspiker11
01-18-08, 12:24 AM
i gotta say club by far
The US will never be truely good at soccer until the only youth soccer that matters is the youth clubs for MLS teams. Basically, the full adoption of the worldwide method of youth develpment is the best way to go. HS and college do not develop players well enough. It's a nice way to pay for college, but our professionals should not be being introduced to the starting XI at 21 or 22, they should be entering their primes!
the mls is a monopoly, i dislike it, my op.
Crusaders
01-18-08, 03:48 PM
Lol, a monopoly of what? C-rate football?
well, the mls is ran by pretty much ran by a select few, and these few control every aspect of the mls, from sponsorships to player contracts. Do you know how big the contract of 1st round mls draftee will recieve>?About 40k-50k. Only a about 4-7 guys will get money over that. The mls, dont get me wrong has great talent, just players are getting f'ed.
Crusaders
01-19-08, 02:59 AM
What professional league in the world isn't controlled by a select few? There are no leagues that the fans run.
MLS is the biggest professional soccer league the US has right now. Even at that, it's barely making a profit. They are working all the time to raise the salary cap (which one could argue shouldn't even exist if they want to compete on a global scale for players) so that you don't have guys like Landon Donovan making 250k a year while some other guy is making 12k.
Besides that, I disagree, MLS players do not have great talent for professionals. Most of these guys would be lucky to play in the Coca Cola Championship in England, and that is a major stretch.
The problem with MLS is it's trying to promote 3rd rate soccer as 1st rate and not too many are buying into it.
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