Toledo City League

Smalls

Active member
I have not had a chance to watch the 2nd Rogers/Start game yet, but is there a more improved player in the area than Curtis Jackson? His confidence and effort took a total 180. Last year we saw glimpses of what he could do, but I kept wanting to see more from him. This year he is showing me more.
 
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Smalls

Active member
Looking forward to the result of Saturday's Rogers/St. Xavier game. Xavier beat Central by 20+. Should be a good measuring stick for where Rogers is at.
 

Maple_City_Fan

Well-known member
I'm looking forward to Rogers-Sandusky in a few weeks. It should give me a better feel how good the Blue Streaks are and the Staveski kid.
 

MacMen22

Member
Nice crowd for the Rogers @ Rossford game. Rossford able to hang around a bit before the Rams pulled away late 3rd Q. Good experience for the young Bulldogs playing a veteran team. Rogers can clamp down on defense when focused. 62-46 Rams.
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
The night before, Rossford played a competitive Eastwood team. Rogers let a Bowsher team hang around that shouldn't have even been in the game on a playground. I'm not thinking the issue is focus.
 

MacMen22

Member
The night before, Rossford played a competitive Eastwood team. Rogers let a Bowsher team hang around that shouldn't have even been in the game on a playground. I'm not thinking the issue is focus.
Did you attend that Bowsher game? Absolutely it’s being focused. Didn’t you see the effort defensively? Sorry but sometimes city teams play down to the Bowsher level because of lack of focus. Come to a game and find out.
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
Did you attend that Bowsher game? Absolutely it’s being focused. Didn’t you see the effort defensively? Sorry but sometimes city teams play down to the Bowsher level because of lack of focus. Come to a game and find out.
Focus and effort are different things with different possible solutions.

There's not keeping attention (lack of focus), there's not knowing what to do (lack of putting teaching to use), there's not being interested in doing it. To each their own opinion. I don't think the team has gelled and I don't think it has to do with lack of focus or lack of effort. I'm not on the practice floor so only getting one side of the issue. If you are, then more power to your opinion.
 
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MacMen22

Member
Focus and effort are different things with different possible solutions.

There's not keeping attention (lack of focus), there's not knowing what to do (lack of putting teaching to use), there's not being interested in doing it. To each their own opinion. I don't think the team has gelled and I don't think it has to do with lack of focus or lack of effort. I'm not on the practice floor so only getting one side of the issue. If you are, then more power to your opinion.
When Rogers is locked in defensively, and hustling their butts off they’re tough to beat in division 2. Last night was a great atmosphere and I shared the experience, but you always jump with some negative point of view. Sometimes we just get too critical of kids especially from the city. Rogers has lapses with inferior teams and that’s no secret, but when they’re playing team ball and rotating on defense like last night....watch out. You should probably check out Rogers at Sandusky next Sat instead of judging how they do with Scott on Tuesday. You might see some gelling.
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
When Rogers is locked in defensively, and hustling their butts off they’re tough to beat in division 2. Last night was a great atmosphere and I shared the experience, but you always jump with some negative point of view. Sometimes we just get too critical of kids especially from the city. Rogers has lapses with inferior teams and that’s no secret, but when they’re playing team ball and rotating on defense like last night....watch out. You should probably check out Rogers at Sandusky next Sat instead of judging how they do with Scott on Tuesday. You might see some gelling.
Well, anyone gets a vote but I'm pretty sure YOU are the one that said the "kids" sufferstaying focused. Kind of repeated it here. lol

If you don't want to talk, doors and butts you know. If you're looking for a "yes-man," yep you got the wrong guy. I don't see a point in trying to fix things that aren't broken so find discussing things that aren't working to be more interesting. And as far as I'm concerned, you can cut the "pity my poor "city" a$$" routine. It holds no water. EVERYONE on here, small poor town to Bexley is here to analyze and discuss their local teams. They are here to occasionally "critique."

FWIW: glad you posted. I'd heard about a local b-ball coach just passed, Macomber grad and you hadn't posted for awhile..
 
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MacMen22

Member
It’s only Tuesday and I’m already thinking about Rogers @ Sandusky & Perrysburg @ Start this weekend. Can’t wait!
 

Smalls

Active member
It’s only Tuesday and I’m already thinking about Rogers @ Sandusky & Perrysburg @ Start this weekend. Can’t wait!

When I watched Sandusky they didn't look overly big or quick outside of Staveskie. Their loss to Norwalk who is a little down tells me they could struggle to hang around by the 4th quarter. Rogers by 10-12.

Perrysburg vs Start should be a tight game. Start will have the quickness advantage, but will need to keep Pburg off the glass. Sizemore, Hosler and Kilbride give Pburg 3 big, strong, athletic guys who can play above the rim. It was a 2 point Start victory last year. Perrysburg has everyone back while Start lost a lot from last year. Start has the better wins this year, but I'll still take Perrysburg by 4-5.
 
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MacMen22

Member
When I watched Sandusky they didn't look overly big or quick outside of Staveskie. Their loss to Norwalk who is a little down tells me they could struggle to hang around by the 4th quarter. Rogers by 10-12.

Perrysburg vs Start should be a tight game. Start will have the quickness advantage, but will need to keep Pburg off the glass. Sizemore, Hosler and Kilbride give Pburg 3 big, strong, athletic guys who can play above the rim. It was a 2 point Start victory last year. Perrysburg has everyone back while Start lost a lot from last year. Start has the better wins this year, but I'll still take Perrysburg by 4-5.
Thank you Smalls. Solids picks. Sandusky’s the one team I haven’t checked out yet so thanks for the info.
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
The Truckers controlled the third the same way they control most of their wins. They took their time on offense and they controlled the paint.
On size alone, Rogers shouldn't have trouble controlling the basket. Patience (improving the shot) on offense might be a new consistent.

Something I noted on one of these threads earlier, the Roger's players weren't squaring up, often. First opening (sometimes) they seemed to fling it. Legs splayed, arms splayed. Sideways, angled... With the experience of player they bring, I was surprised by that. I'm thinking it was the Lima game. I can't find it on this thread, maybe the TRAC thread.

I don't think they need exceptional PG to handle Sandusky or even Shawnee. They don't need to approach the basket on the dribble. They have to get it past mid, set up the offense and look for the passing lane. Height will take care of the rest.
 

Maple_City_Fan

Well-known member
In fairness to Norwalk, Truckers are finally playing some solid ball. It would not surprise me if they win Madison District which I would have said an emphatic no beginning of year.
 
On size alone, Rogers shouldn't have trouble controlling the basket. Patience (improving the shot) on offense might be a new consistent.

Something I noted on one of these threads earlier, the Roger's players weren't squaring up, often. First opening (sometimes) they seemed to fling it. Legs splayed, arms splayed. Sideways, angled... With the experience of player they bring, I was surprised by that. I'm thinking it was the Lima game. I can't find it on this thread, maybe the TRAC thread.

I don't think they need exceptional PG to handle Sandusky or even Shawnee. They don't need to approach the basket on the dribble. They have to get it past mid, set up the offense and look for the passing lane. Height will take care of the rest.
EIB, I agree. Here is what I don't understand about Rogers: Jackson and Nelson are tremendous threats inside, and Nelson alone is one of the most athletic bigs I've seen in a long time. But they are on the floor with three guys who can all create their own opportunities (Neal,Wyatt, Coleman)and no one seems to want to make getting the ball to these two a priority. I'm gobsmacked. I would flash one or both to the elbow with some simple high/low stuff and force teams to stop it before trying anything else.

I've seen them a handful of times this year and I am baffled by how they go long stretches of time and Nelson just doesn't touch the ball. That can't happen if they are going to compete. High percentage shots. And not just off the press, but in the half court set. I want to see these kids maximize their potential, but they are running out of time...
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
Careful, you don't want to get "critical" in this thread. Apparently "city kids" are too sensitive. I know I didn't ask for any posts to be deleted.

I see few of the pgs actually running an offense, making decisions. Start an exception. Am I mistaken?

For all the genetics, skill and effort I see from the Roger's team, how is their coach supposed to run an offense without a PG? At the risk of getting anyone riled up because I disagree with their assessment, I do not think paying attention is Roger's issue. I think it's still what I posted early in season; they do not have a true PG. A kid that can break the press and make decisions and pass reliably with the best of their competition. And they've not had the schedule that would allow them to develop that player, presuming they see that weakness.
 
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irish_buffalo

Well-known member
Rogers comeback falls short at Sandusky, 76-70. Streaks were up 19 with 5 minutes left.
Wow. Probably had nothing to do with coaching.

I poke fun but in all honesty, it is incredibly tough to coach an All-Star team of kids. One ball, too many kids that gots to get theirs. Down 19 at one point? Sandusky is good, they are not 19 points better than the Rams at any point. But they were.

Cardinal Stritch had TCC on the ropes until what? 2nd OT? The Irish seem to play to their competition.

And finally Start beats the NLL Champs by 20. In all honesty Start is the only big boy team in the area that resembles a TCL team from yesteryears. Sound on offense and play suffocating D. No real star either just a tough hard nosed brand brought to them by their coach.

By far the weakest I have EVER seen Toledo area basketball (especially DI/DII). By far.
 

Fayette79

Member
Wow. Probably had nothing to do with coaching.

I poke fun but in all honesty, it is incredibly tough to coach an All-Star team of kids. One ball, too many kids that gots to get theirs. Down 19 at one point? Sandusky is good, they are not 19 points better than the Rams at any point. But they were.

Cardinal Stritch had TCC on the ropes until what? 2nd OT? The Irish seem to play to their competition.

And finally Start beats the NLL Champs by 20. In all honesty Start is the only big boy team in the area that resembles a TCL team from yesteryears. Sound on offense and play suffocating D. No real star either just a tough hard nosed brand brought to them by their coach.

By far the weakest I have EVER seen Toledo area basketball (especially DI/DII). By far.
IB,

I agree 100%. City League used to have some great teams and great rivalries...now it seems they don't have the kids out anymore or they are headed to the private schools.

And yes D1 and D2 are HORRIBLE in NW Ohio this year.
 

D1nwobb

Member
Rogers without Ketaan Wyatt. Out for the season after injury at Rossford.

Central and Stritch went only one overtime. Stritch played a lot of zone and Central settled for a bunch of 3's in the first half. Down 13 at halftime. Central much more patient in the second half and got the ball inside. Back in the game midway through the third. Second shots also hurt Stritch. Central down three late with the ball, and Stritch didn't choose to foul Norrils late with Central still in the 1 & 1. After a late Central timeout, Stritch came out in a man (not sure why but easy to second guess now) and Hunt got a good look on a 3 which he drilled. Marshall hit a 3 in the overtime with Central down 1 and things snowballed from there. Holifield and Wilson had big games and no temper tantrums. Very physical game. Both teams were money from the foul line. Certainly worth the price of admission.
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
Wow. Probably had nothing to do with coaching.

I poke fun but in all honesty, it is incredibly tough to coach an All-Star team of kids. One ball, too many kids that gots to get theirs. Down 19 at one point? Sandusky is good, they are not 19 points better than the Rams at any point. But they were.

Cardinal Stritch had TCC on the ropes until what? 2nd OT? The Irish seem to play to their competition.

And finally Start beats the NLL Champs by 20. In all honesty Start is the only big boy team in the area that resembles a TCL team from yesteryears. Sound on offense and play suffocating D. No real star either just a tough hard nosed brand brought to them by their coach.

By far the weakest I have EVER seen Toledo area basketball (especially DI/DII). By far.
IB,

I don't agree 100% :D

Start: it's the coach. He'd do that at any team in the league. It's not just rah-rah motivation. He knows the game, he can explain it, teach it and his kids want to do it. I don't know his entire history but do know at least in high school his coaches, were not all ball players. Those he assisted with when young were not all ball-players. Certainly not high level. He was a role player himself. Sometimes, it's the brains.

Rogers: I think what you wrote can come off like you're calling them selfish (All-Star) so I think it important to elaborate.

Firstly, I've not seen a lick of selfish. I imagine what you're sayin is that they are each used to having the role of the go-to when times get tough. None of them that I can see are used to being the one designated to run the show. They do not know how to work together. Thats a different thing. All-Stars can work together. These guys? They're tall.

Am I wrong, their individual mechanics are way off? Leaning, legs splayed jump shots. The back-step when they want to move forward. They're slow as 6'5"-6'7" kids tend to be when they're playing four inches taller than the other team. They have no PG. They spread the defense by standing around on their cell phones while one guy with the ball dribble-drives and on D they cannot follow a team that has as many ball handlers as Sandusky. Youve brought up this point, you'd like to see them attack more. When they do, it's invarialby from the top of the key with everyone else standing around.

Compare Sandusky. Every direction with at least one other player making the cut for the potential pass. Their big guy in the middle is a smooth dancing bear. We've had a few of those in the TCL. They're a blast to watch. Sandusky is not all about their star. Those kids know the game as Seniors should. And then, there's the Freshman. He's going to be a talent.

I did not see any loss of focus on that part of the Rogers players. I'm not sure they know consistently, what to focus on.

I said early in the year they may make it to states but it won't be because they out basketball anyone. They're not gelling. They didn't gell. You can't, not without a PG. I was waiting to see if they bit the bullet early and developed the PGs on the bench at the risk of losing some games. They didn't.

I think we might see more out of them come play-offs. At least on effort and a good shooting night they have a shot. But their mechanics, that you don't fake.
 
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irish_buffalo

Well-known member
We are in agreement.

Spot on when it comes to Start.

Spot on with Rogers. It is tough to bring a bunch of talent together and win. On the outside it looks easy. Accomplishing this is another thing. We've seen it before even with HOF coaches. The best thing you said was "gel." It is tough to find that cohesiveness. Good teams who have played with each other for substantial time know the intricacies of their teammates. They know when they are about to set up a move, when they will break and slash, how they roll off of a screen, etc. Then there is the fact that you are dealing with 15-16-17 year old kids who watch ESPN. Not an easy task.
 

eastisbest

Well-known member
For all his gathering of talent, it does give an appreciation for Coach Bates. His teams could break down on defense sure but for the most part, they worked together, they were machines on offense. Wasn't a person on that team couldn't be high scorer on some other team but they played their roles well. Particularly Wells.
 

scbuckeye99

Active member
For all his gathering of talent, it does give an appreciation for Coach Bates. His teams could break down on defense sure but for the most part, they worked together, they were machines on offense. Wasn't a person on that team couldn't be high scorer on some other team but they played their roles well. Particularly Wells.
I miss ole Leroy and his Western Avenue Cowboys. Especially back in the late 90s / early 00's. Those were fun teams to watch.
 
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