Solon vs Kirtland on Sept. 25th

Kirtland4580 said:
It would be interesting to see Kirtland in Division IV, but I doubt it will happen anytime soon. In fact, if anything, Kirtland could even drop a division as they’re one of the smallest schools in Division V.

As far as competitive balance goes, here’s my understanding of how CB #’s are determined, someone can correct me if I’m wrong:

1.) If you’re a public school your CB # goes up 1 for each student that doesn’t have a parent residing in the school district area/attendance zone.
2.) If you’re a private/non-public school your CB # goes up 2 for each student that didn’t attend private school since 7th grade & 1 if they didn’t come from a feeder school.

Kirtland’s CB # is 0 since they’re a public closed enrollment school, so there’s essentially no chance they get to Division IV.

Shaker Heights had some talent out there. Their QB threw a good ball & they had some athletic linebackers & receivers. I expect a lot of the same from Solon, but perhaps some better talent.

In terms of Cuyahoga Heights, I had heard from fans in recent years saying their down year was coming, but didn’t know when. They’ll come back to relevance very soon as long as Coach Martin is there.
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Yeah Kirtland and Mentor do it the right way. 0 competitive balance number. Kirtland won't move up a division just because they are killing teams doing it the right way
 
EaglePride01 said:
In response to your PS after you stewed over this some more, I never claimed St. V was down. I know nothing about them this year. I said they are a D3 school that has played second fiddle in recent years to their rival Hoban. That's a fact. I don't think Solon likes to challenge themselves much out of conference. This year presents a perfect opportunity to "schedule up" without repercussion. There was an opportunity for them in week 5 to do just that against a St. Ed's team that is behind where they've been in recent years. Instead they work something out with a D5 school who is looking to challenge themselves, and screw Beachwood out of a game in the process. Whether Solon is on our schedule or not, I could care less. Just calling out what I think was a missed opportunity.
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Lol at stewing. I edited in portions of that 20 minutes after my post. Don't really care if you agree or not. But don't group Mentor and Eds. The only way we are like eds is being a contender lately. Otherwise completely different in how we do things
 
MentorGrad2002 said:
They have started a few kids who didn't make our two deep in recent years. So I'd say no. Maybe they could steal 1 out of 10 if they had a great team vs one of our no playoff down ones.
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So these kids once played at Mentor but then played at Kirtland? Am I reading that right?
 
MentorGrad2002 said:
Theyve had a couple kids who were at Mentor part ways through and then went to Kirtland. People do move. Mentor and Kirtland border each other
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Correct. I believe there was 1 or 2 players that came from Mentor a few years back. Other than that, nobody else from Mentor comes to mind.
 
YTOWN said:
One other play I remember was the hit Mr. Zordich put on that Popelas (spelling) kid on what I remember as a WR screen pass. I only remember the kid's name because he took one of the hardest hits I have ever seen at the HS level. I want to say that was right before Mr. Harper's 58-yard FG but I'm not sure of that. IIRC Mr. Harper broke the state record with a 61-yarder a week or two later.
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First play in the film.

 
Always loved the kirtland fan base so respectfull was a garaway fan sometimes I wish we would stay div 6 because kirtland is on a different level in div 5
 
Kirtland is a great program w/ consistently great teams. Mentor would rail them. Kirtland consistently bludgeons D5 teams at the LoS. That's just not going to happen against Mentor or other topshelf D1 teams. I would think Kirtland is state championship caliber up to and including D3. I think games against Chardon (D2) or Canfield (D3) would be very good. But, they're not hanging with Mentor (or, say, Pick Central) or other top 10-type D1 teams.

They're going to steamroll D5 again, though, and would likely steamroll D4.
 
iam416 said:
Kirtland is a great program w/ consistently great teams. Mentor would rail them. Kirtland consistently bludgeons D5 teams at the LoS. That's just not going to happen against Mentor or other topshelf D1 teams. I would think Kirtland is state championship caliber up to and including D3. I think games against Chardon (D2) or Canfield (D3) would be very good. But, they're not hanging with Mentor (or, say, Pick Central) or other top 10-type D1 teams.

They're going to steamroll D5 again, though, and would likely steamroll D4.
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Not top ranked D1's but let's see more competitive games. As mentioned earlier CCC is D6 and plays D1 Jackson and D2 power Perry and holds their own so I agree why wouldn't Kirtland hold their own? I think it comes down to philosophical strategy. Btw a couple years ago CCC played both teams PLUS Winton Woods and Strongsville. But that is borderline nuts.
 
The Hilltoppers are D-III not D-II. I don't know if Kirtland would win against Chardon or Canfield this year, they both look really good, but I think Kirtland could handle most of D-III except the top 5 or 10 teams. And I think Kirtland in a typical year would be a toss up with Canfield in a typical year, but 2017, 2018 and this year it is highly unlikely they would win barring some sort of miracle. In 2017 Canfield barely lost to SVSM after dominating the whole game pretty much, who ended up runner-up in the state and in 2018 they only lost to the eventual state champion's Kenston, and Canfield probably was the 2nd or 3rd best D-III team both years. In typical years, take Canfield in 2016, I would say the game would be a toss up, if Canfield was having more of a down year like 2014 then I would say Kirtland by two scores.
 
Back on page one of this thread, it was noted that Beachwood picked up Conneaut as a replacement to Kirtland for this coming week, so Kirtland did not leave Beachwood w/o a game.
 
TigerPaw said:
Not top ranked D1's but let's see more competitive games. As mentioned earlier CCC is D6 and plays D1 Jackson and D2 power Perry and holds their own so I agree why wouldn't Kirtland hold their own? I think it comes down to philosophical strategy. Btw a couple years ago CCC played both teams PLUS Winton Woods and Strongsville. But that is borderline nuts.
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Canton Central Catholic is overall the closest we've seen to how a smaller school would stack up by playing bigger schools week in and week out, which is mixed but more along the lines that the better lower division programs won't be embarrassed but probably would get worn down over the long run.

That CCC team not only played the teams you mentioned (was competitive against the neighborhood rivals Perry and Jackson) but were blown out by Strongsville and Winton Woods. But then were competitive in losses to a Bellevue team (D4 that made the regional finals) and a New Philadelphia team that went 9-2.

Though the year before CCC beat both Jackson and Perry (both made the playoffs with Perry making the D2 title game). CCC did lose three close games to teams that all made the regional finals (New Philadelphia, D3; St. Thomas Aquinas, D7; and Notre Dame-Cathedral Latin, D4) before going on to win the D5 state title.

I've definitely come around the past decade or so (used to be in the camp that any above average D1 pastes any public school D5 or smaller). But some of these H2H matchups show that very good to elite D5s or smaller can punch way above their weight class in a single game situation and still be competitive even over 3-4-5 games.

This should be interesting. Solon I think absolutely still has rust to shake off and a very good D4 SVSM team exploited that. It won't get any easier this week.

Solon, you would think, makes a bit of a "Week 1 to Week 2 jump." But will it be enough of one (as talented as Solon potentially is) to overcome what is a machine of a small school program.

I think this is definitely the game of the week in Ohio just because there is so much intrigue surrounding it.
 
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bucksman said:
Back on page one of this thread, it was noted that Beachwood picked up Conneaut as a replacement to Kirtland for this coming week, so Kirtland did not leave Beachwood w/o a game.
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Yes it sounds like Kirtland basked our of the Beachwood game. Beachwood coach wasn’t thrilled about it. But considering Beachwood barely beat Cardinal the other night, they should thank Kirtland for letting them get out of it.
 
Via Cleveland.com:

No. 10 Kirtland (4-0) at No. 17 Solon (0-1)

When: 7 p.m. Friday

Where: Stewart Field at Solon High School

What to know: Kirtland has not lost a football game since the 2017 Division VI state championship against Maria Stein Marion Local. The Hornets bettered Marion Local a year later and have answered every challenge since then, moving up in 2019 to Division V. What about bigger opponents? Division II Riverside was the biggest school willing to tackle the Hornets last year, but with no computer points at stake in 2020, Solon will be their second Division I opponent. Kirtland took down Shaker Heights, 35-10, on the road in Week 2. Solon presents a different challenge as a playoff regular, but one that is still acclimating to this football season. The Comets opened last week with a 28-7 loss at St. Vincent-St. Mary and are about a month behind both with practices and games. This will be the first time Solon meets Kirtland in a football game, and it came together because of a connection between Kirtland coach Tiger LaVerde and Solon assistant Ed Bubonics, who played together at Mount Union. Coincidentally, Kirtland played twice at Solon in 2017 during the Division VI playoffs against Mogadore and Rootstown. Solon’s YouTube channel will have a stream of the game, which can be found here.

cleveland.com pick: Solon
 
SVillegrad said:
Canton Central Catholic is overall the closest we've seen to how a smaller school would stack up by playing bigger schools week in and week out, which is mixed but more along the lines that the better lower division programs won't be embarrassed but probably would get worn down over the long run.

That CCC team not only played the teams you mentioned (was competitive against the neighborhood rivals Perry and Jackson) but were blown out by Strongsville and Winton Woods. But then were competitive in losses to a Bellevue team (D4 that made the regional finals) and a New Philadelphia team that went 9-2.

Though the year before CCC beat both Jackson and Perry (both made the playoffs with Perry making the D2 title game). CCC did lose three close games to teams that all made the regional finals (New Philadelphia, D3; St. Thomas Aquinas, D7; and Notre Dame-Cathedral Latin, D4) before going on to win the D5 state title.

I've definitely come around the past decade or so (used to be in the camp that any above average D1 pastes any public school D5 or smaller). But some of these H2H matchups show that very good to elite D5s or smaller can punch way above their weight class in a single game situation and still be competitive even over 3-4-5 games.

This should be interesting. Solon I think absolutely still has rust to shake off and a very good D4 SVSM team exploited that. It won't get any easier this week.

Solon, you would think, makes a bit of a "Week 1 to Week 2 jump." But will it be enough of one (as talented as Solon potentially is) to overcome what is a machine of a small school program.

I think this is definitely the game of the week in Ohio just because there is so much intrigue surrounding it.
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A lot of that has to do with low participation numbers in football across the board. A lot of average D1 programs these days have roster numbers of what a lower division team would have a decade or more ago. So if you have a lower division school maxing out its roster numbers and/or has a few elite players, it's easy to see how the gap closes against a fair number of big schools.
 
cjb56 said:
A lot of that has to do with low participation numbers in football across the board. A lot of average D1 programs these days have roster numbers of what a lower division team would have a decade or more ago. So if you have a lower division school maxing out its roster numbers and/or has a few elite players, it's easy to see how the gap closes against a fair number of big schools.
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Numbers definitely matter, but let's take it a step further. Another factor is how good of a job is the bigger school doing in retaining its talent? If you're a DII team, and your best couple athletes transfer somewhere else in the offseason, your team can become beatable rather quickly by a smaller school who has kept its roster intact.
 
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Mr. Red Raider said:
The way that Kirtland has been, I can see them moving up to Division IV, at least from a competitive balance standpoint. I'm glad to see they've moved up to the top tier of the CVC, as they've outgrown that conference and then some. And as someone that graduated from Shaker, it was really cool to see them play against my alma mater.

Not to derail the thread too much, but what happened to Cuyahoga Heights? They're usually pretty decent year in and year out. But they've been blown out in each of their losses.
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Not happening unless Kirtland gets an economic boom of new housing real fast. They’re one of the smallest D5 schools with no open enrollment.
 
Not exactly related to tomorrow's game, but Drew Pastaur and a few other sites had projected winner and by how much. He's not up this year. Does anyone know of another site that has the projected winner/line?

I'm guessing Solon is favored by 3-5 points.
 
Unfortunately I can’t help you there kirt88...I have not seen Solon play before. Have seen Kirtland play probably 30 times in the past 5 years. I’m sure most will think I’m crazy but I say Kirtland by 2-3 TDs
 
Kirtland4580 said:
Via Cleveland.com:

No. 10 Kirtland (4-0) at No. 17 Solon (0-1)

When: 7 p.m. Friday

Where: Stewart Field at Solon High School

What to know: Kirtland has not lost a football game since the 2017 Division VI state championship against Maria Stein Marion Local. The Hornets bettered Marion Local a year later and have answered every challenge since then, moving up in 2019 to Division V. What about bigger opponents? Division II Riverside was the biggest school willing to tackle the Hornets last year, but with no computer points at stake in 2020, Solon will be their second Division I opponent. Kirtland took down Shaker Heights, 35-10, on the road in Week 2. Solon presents a different challenge as a playoff regular, but one that is still acclimating to this football season. The Comets opened last week with a 28-7 loss at St. Vincent-St. Mary and are about a month behind both with practices and games. This will be the first time Solon meets Kirtland in a football game, and it came together because of a connection between Kirtland coach Tiger LaVerde and Solon assistant Ed Bubonics, who played together at Mount Union. Coincidentally, Kirtland played twice at Solon in 2017 during the Division VI playoffs against Mogadore and Rootstown. Solon’s YouTube channel will have a stream of the game, which can be found here.

cleveland.com pick: Solon
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I don't like it when people respond with a meaningless stat, but I will. Solon played Kirtland in 1943 and 1944. Solon won both games. I really think Kirtland will have REVENGE on their minds from those games!!!
 
kirt88 said:
Not exactly related to tomorrow's game, but Drew Pastaur and a few other sites had projected winner and by how much. He's not up this year. Does anyone know of another site that has the projected winner/line?

I'm guessing Solon is favored by 3-5 points.
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Cal preps has:

Kirtland 28, Solon 22

calpreps.com

www.calpreps.com
 
kirt88 said:
I don't like it when people respond with a meaningless stat, but I will. Solon played Kirtland in 1943 and 1944. Solon won both games. I really think Kirtland will have REVENGE on their minds from those games!!!
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Now that’s funny!! I sure hope Tiger posts that stat in the locker room to get the Kids fired up. As far as predictions go, I did the calpreps matchup projection and it came up 28-22 Kirtland. For what that’s worth. I am a little surprised there hasn’t been more talk about this game. Anyone who has seen Kirtland play knows they aren’t flashy but will pound on you for the entire game. I can’t ever remember another team wearing Kirtland down, I think conditioning will play a big factor tomorrow night. Along with the relentless stacked I attack. Any other thoughts about what to expect from Solon? I know they have a beast at tight end and tackle and a senior Qb, but that’s about it.
 
Oldhornetguy said:
Now that’s funny!! I sure hope Tiger posts that stat in the locker room to get the Kids fired up. As far as predictions go, I did the calpreps matchup projection and it came up 28-22 Kirtland. For what that’s worth. I am a little surprised there hasn’t been more talk about this game. Anyone who has seen Kirtland play knows they aren’t flashy but will pound on you for the entire game. I can’t ever remember another team wearing Kirtland down, I think conditioning will play a big factor tomorrow night. Along with the relentless stacked I attack. Any other thoughts about what to expect from Solon? I know they have a beast at tight end and tackle and a senior Qb, but that’s about it.
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