RECRUITING!!!!

Soccer Toe said:
We can argue how many, (some will argue even if any), of these kids were recruited. Moeller has a recruiting reputation going back to the 70s with Faust. We've all been around the block and realize that some of the religious schools do not live up to their stated values in terms of playing fairly and by the rules. I know of several instances at the Catholic grade school level.
As for a better education, IMO that is debatable. For students that come from strong families and reasonably good economic environment, their education is much more dependent on the student and the parents. There are pros and cons of going to a parochial school. I say that as a proud GCL alum.
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A lot has changed on the education front. I have kids in both private and public high school. It really is night and day. 5 years ago I would have said that a high achieving kid would do well at either and private school didn’t matter. I don’t feel the same way today. Some of my friends that are public school teachers feel the same way unfortunately including two that send their kids to private schools.
 
Scottyflatstix said:
Kids that play together in club that want to play together in high school isn’t recruiting.

A parent who teaches in a public school system where her son attends. Recognizes he needs to be put in a better situation academically and socially. And decides to not only send him but also his brother to Moe due to the academics isn’t recruiting.

Kids who want to improve their situation academically, athletically or both and decide to attend a private school isn’t recruiting.

An incoming freshman at a public school that is training with the local HS team but transfers to Moeller mid summer because their parents have concerns about the public school’s remote learning plan isn’t recruiting.

A HS coach who decides to coach club soccer to improve his coaching tactics, refine his skills and learn different styles of play and tricks he can apply in HS isn’t recruiting.

A coach who gets the latest and greatest gear for his team (for which families have to pay a participation and uniform fee) isn’t recruiting.

The fact is Moeller sells itself academically and athletically. Many of their athletic programs have had sustained success, including soccer. The coaching staff has built a family culture at Moe. The kids love playing for him and the parents are invested in the program. There’s clear and open communication from the coaching staff to the families, which is consistent throughout the school from the teachers, administrators, counselors and leadership. They have a style of play that is built on 1-2 touch possession-style soccer, which is consistent with top clubs teams across the country. This is a style of play that attracts players from top clubs as it will help further their development. It attracts college coaches to their best players for recruiting purposes. Academically the school fosters inclusion and brotherhood through their house system, mentor group and many other programs. Proven by the fact that the athletic administration and coaching staff made a joint decision to not cut anyone from the program.

Certainly Moe isn’t for everyone. They’ve had students and athletes transfer out just as they’ve transferred in. That’s what makes America great. The freedom to make a choice that is in the best interest of my family and my son. This freedom should be celebrated, rather than slandered with false accusations and hearsay behind pen names on a blog. Why not write about how great some of the transfers are doing academically, athletically and socially. Or how the Moe soccer family has welcomed them into the family. Or how much the kids respect them ... so much so that the team, not the coaching staff, voted 2 of them to be captains.

Perhaps if the academic and athletic programs were just better at all these schools, kids wouldn’t transfer. I guess it’s a lot easier to throw stones rather than put in the work to just be better.
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Would you stop it!!!!!! Enough with the mission statement. Focus. 6 very good players over 2 years. Doesn’t happen. Don’t focus on boys. Not their fault. The fault lies with the adult skirting the rules. And I don’t know what others on here have said but I certainly didn’t say it’s not a good school academically. Plus you lose credibility when you tell me I’m hiding behind a pen name. My name is David????? My last name begins with H. I guess your name is ScottyFlatStiks? practice what you preach. Listen. We won’t agree. That’s fine. Let’s just compare first 8 to last 8. Topic kind of boring now. Said all that needs to be said but if I think about it I’ll check in toward end of season. Okay, have a good day.
 
Droopy said:
My point was that you indicated that 6 starters were “recruited from other schools”. That is factually wrong. There are 4 starters who weren’t at Moeller as freshmen. I won’t argue with you about how or why they ended up at Moeller, since that is open to interpretation, but the numbers are the numbers. It sounds like you might have an inside track with the Moeller AD, so maybe you can enlighten us more on what is really going on there.
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Doesn’t matter. We don’t agree. Nothing wrong with that. In looking what I wrote I was too harsh in my previous response to you and I feel bad about that. I’ve never posted on here until recently but I actually don’t have time or energy for it. But wanted to make sure I apologized to you. So this is long way of saying I’m sorry. Okay, have a good day.
 
had sort of lost interest in the topic and just checked the GCL records and rosters; MW's confusion of great coaching vs great players has come home to roost. Stuffing the roster with undersized underclassmen isn't paying off. Just because JR, PG or KT were on varsity as freshman doesn't make it the secret formula for developing talent and elevating the program down the road.
 
EvilReklew said:
had sort of lost interest in the topic and just checked the GCL records and rosters; MW's confusion of great coaching vs great players has come home to roost. Stuffing the roster with undersized underclassmen isn't paying off. Just because JR, PG or KT were on varsity as freshman doesn't make it the secret formula for developing talent and elevating the program down the road.
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I feel bad for the players there. They all deserve to have a great High School soccer experience. There are some great kids there. Between COVID, tragic student death that impacted the whole community, and some very questionable coaching moves it has to be hard for them right now. Hopefully they have some students step up and lead them through it.
 
EvilReklew said:
had sort of lost interest in the topic and just checked the GCL records and rosters; MW's confusion of great coaching vs great players has come home to roost. Stuffing the roster with undersized underclassmen isn't paying off. Just because JR, PG or KT were on varsity as freshman doesn't make it the secret formula for developing talent and elevating the program down the road.
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The lack of results just highlights what everyone already knew and what they were trying to hide by getting transfers. Acquiring talent and just throwing out the ball isn’t coaching.
 
So what's the story with the season-- injuries, young player getting the minutes, has there been an exodus of any talent because they thought it was their time only to have that opportunity given to the next player who was brought in?

The results have been shocking...continuing with a 5-3 loss to Winton Woods (whoa?!?)
 
I don’t know what happened at Winton Woods, but I can tell you that against St. X they played their hearts out. They had a great game plan moving a forward into their back line, and then pressing all over the field. They never threatened offensively and I am not sure they even had a shot on goal. They also shortened the game quite a bit by subbing VERY often to keep fresh legs on the field. St. X had probably 75% possession, but looked out of sorts, missing easy passes due to the press. St. X also had at least 10 corners that were well taken but no one even threatened to get on the end of them. So, to turn around and have to play again the next day after that kind of emotional, and physical battle is really difficult to do. So, again I feel bad for the kids. Run their legs out against St. X and then lose to a team that they don’t lose to on any other night.
 
I know the back story. Nothing first hand. But I agree with whoever said where there is smoke there is fire. Plus, enough people posting on here. Somethings not right. Question is why don’t other schools do something? Namely GCL schools or schools that kids are being taken from. Why does this even go on in HS??? Just coach kids you have to work with.
 
Kellog said:
I know the back story. Nothing first hand. But I agree with whoever said where there is smoke there is fire. Plus, enough people posting on here. Somethings not right. Question is why don’t other schools do something? Namely GCL schools or schools that kids are being taken from. Why does this even go on in HS??? Just coach kids you have to work with.
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Because winning at Moeller is very, very important. It is their lifeblood...literally. When your tuition is just several hundred dollars less than X's, you have to have something that makes that a value proposition and Athletics is that value proposition. Second to none in Basketball, typically one of the best in SWO in Soccer, Unbelievable talent in Baseball, until recently: fantastic football program, a few years ago, Moeller came in second in Swimming in the State. One could go on and on. Moeller has been trying to position itself for years to be to Athletics what X has a had reputation for in Academics. Winning solidifies that reputation and by extension, justifies that tuition.
 
BASESWIMPARENT said:
Because winning at Moeller is very, very important. It is their lifeblood...literally. When your tuition is just several hundred dollars less than X's, you have to have something that makes that a value proposition and Athletics is that value proposition. Second to none in Basketball, typically one of the best in SWO in Soccer, Unbelievable talent in Baseball, until recently: fantastic football program, a few years ago, Moeller came in second in Swimming in the State. One could go on and on. Moeller has been trying to position itself for years to be to Athletics what X has a had reputation for in Academics. Winning solidifies that reputation and by extension, justifies that tuition.
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If that’s the case that’s sad. You know who loses in the end? The kids. Especially the ones on the cusp only to be replaced by the kids the coach recruits or whatever. What a blow to their ego. Confidence. Whatever you want to call it. These kids need education. All the parents out there who think their kids are going to be the next great professional. In any sport, are guiding their kids in wrong direction. I may be misinterpreting your comment but you seem to be justifying athletic department being unscrupulous for the sake of money. Please correct me if I’m wrong. Either way. That’s not sustainable. Building these kids up. Correcting when wrong. Making them believe is what’s important. Not cutting corners and breaking rules to win a game. Kids are smart. They see through a lot of BS. I would think bringing kids in, whatever the numbers are, 6 kids plucked from other schools to try and win more games would build a horrid culture. And not just in sports. But the school in general. If that goes on in all sports there I don’t think enrollment will be very good in future. Is this CAPE part two? The world is changing. I don’t think kids sports will hold the weight maybe they did in past.
 
Kellog said:
If that’s the case that’s sad. You know who loses in the end? The kids. Especially the ones on the cusp only to be replaced by the kids the coach recruits or whatever. What a blow to their ego. Confidence. Whatever you want to call it. These kids need education. All the parents out there who think their kids are going to be the next great professional. In any sport, are guiding their kids in wrong direction. I may be misinterpreting your comment but you seem to be justifying athletic department being unscrupulous for the sake of money. Please correct me if I’m wrong. Either way. That’s not sustainable. Building these kids up. Correcting when wrong. Making them believe is what’s important. Not cutting corners and breaking rules to win a game. Kids are smart. They see through a lot of BS. I would think bringing kids in, whatever the numbers are, 6 kids plucked from other schools to try and win more games would build a horrid culture. And not just in sports. But the school in general. If that goes on in all sports there I don’t think enrollment will be very good in future. Is this CAPE part two? The world is changing. I don’t think kids sports will hold the weight maybe they did in past.
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I am just pointing out a fiscal reality. There are many once large, proud Catholic private schools that are shrinking, merging, fading away. You are talking about a 16k a year tuition. There has to be some reason for it. The coaches are generally very well respected. Kids go there to develop and win. I think that the mistake is ours. We look at it as part of adjunct to the educational experience. Others look at as a steeping stone to a prosperous future. And unlike CAPE, i don't think any academic standards are being compromised.
 
I understand what your saying. Makes sense. As a side note it’s the families business and no one else’s if they want to pay thousands for high school tuition but you do wonder if the private schools are pricing themselves out of the market.
 
Kellog said:
I understand what your saying. Makes sense. As a side note it’s the families business and no one else’s if they want to pay thousands for high school tuition but you do wonder if the private schools are pricing themselves out of the market.
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I am an X grad and my kid was interested in Moeller, but I have 2 daughters that are were/are going to college and I could not swing another college level tuition. The high tuition at the time took my breath away.
 
EvilReklew said:
had sort of lost interest in the topic and just checked the GCL records and rosters; MW's confusion of great coaching vs great players has come home to roost. Stuffing the roster with undersized underclassmen isn't paying off. Just because JR, PG or KT were on varsity as freshman doesn't make it the secret formula for developing talent and elevating the program down the road.
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Me as well but I checked stats after you mentioned. The way I see it if it wasn’t for transfers they would of maybe won two and lost more games. I echo Kellog that it’s a shame this garbage occurs in HS. With the last two years transfers and who knows how many more next year I don’t know how they can feel good winning games next season either.
 
BASESWIMPARENT said:
I am an X grad and my kid was interested in Moeller, but I have 2 daughters that are were/are going to college and I could not swing another college level tuition. The high tuition at the time took my breath away.
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Yikes! I’m just around the corner with those payment. Not looking forward to it.
 
Moe football got popped by state for recruiting. Soccer shouldn’t be too far behind. The crap that goes on there with sports is ridiculous.
 
Football, basketball, baseball, soccer, doesn’t matter the sport, they all believe the rules don’t apply to them. Entitlement. Entitlement. Entitlement. A word that describes everyone involved.

I’m sure we will hear about the next great recruitment class soon. Eventually this type of behavior does catch up with individuals.
 
If you read what they did, it is pretty innocuous as they were soliciting information from private, catholic elementary schools. You know: what used to be what was once called feeder schools. A big difference from recruiting kids from a private club team that a coach is affiliated with. Why the coach had to do this and does not have a relationship with the coaches already does not make sense.
 
Now that it’s 2021 how many transfers will we see magically appear on a certain GCL roster this Fall? Over/under 5.5? I’m hearing whispers it’s allll happening again!!!
 
Whistleblower2020 said:
Seen it wreck basketball in our city and now it’s happening in soccer. Coaches talking to kids that are in one high school trying to get them to transfer. One school in particular. Started last year and happening again this year!!!!!! SNAKES!!!!!
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For Public Schools:

Those who are injured: suffer a loss, should have the intestinal fortitude to speak up. That is, the taxpayers of that school district, and the parents of the players who are displaced, whose parents have been paying taxes in that school district since the kid entered kindergarten are the aggrieved parties..

Otherwise, whose business is it?

The motive for recruiting in interscholastic athletics are selfish: a guy wants to promote his own career, and nothing else. The last time I looked there is no cash prize for winning any interscholastic contest.

Is it more fun to win than to lose a game? of course, but if the object of the extracurricular is education: quite often the lesson(s) taught by losing a game are more valuable than winning it.. If enduring or overcoming adversity is more important than easily beating a weaker team, the answer is obvious. Interscholastic athletics are a zero sum game. For each winning team there is a losing team.

"It's not how many times you get knocked down that counts, it's how many times you get back up."

if that is true, then losing is just as valuable as winning.

Private schools are a completely different animal of course: ALL students are essentially "recruited"
 
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If you read one of my previous posts, you will understand that 2 boys Private Catholic schools in Cincinnati are very expensive. One is known primarily for Academic rigor (although it admittedly has at least 1 nationally ranked athletic program and it has the best Theatre program in the city), the other is known for Athletics. For those schools to justify (for this area) the incredibly high tuition, they must have success in those areas. Success academically might include political, business, and professional success to include entrance into the most prestigious universities in the nation. (That last part is not happening like it once did but that is for another post). Athletic success is simple: WIN. Getting their students meaningful athletic scholarships and developing professional athletes follows. So quite simply, the financial success of these institutions means meeting these objectives. So it is imperative that these institutions recruit/market to meet their goals. If you look at things this way, you will understand their motivations.
 
BASESWIMPARENT said:
If you read one of my previous posts, you will understand that 2 boys Private Catholic schools in Cincinnati are very expensive. One is known primarily for Academic rigor (although it admittedly has at least 1 nationally ranked athletic program and it has the best Theatre program in the city), the other is known for Athletics. For those schools to justify (for this area) the incredibly high tuition, they must have success in those areas. Success academically might include political, business, and professional success to include entrance into the most prestigious universities in the nation. (That last part is not happening like it once did but that is for another post). Athletic success is simple: WIN. Getting their students meaningful athletic scholarships and developing professional athletes follows. So quite simply, the financial success of these institutions means meeting these objectives. So it is imperative that these institutions recruit/market to meet their goals. If you look at things this way, you will understand their motivations.
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Um why is the tuition so high?

Have you ever analyzed it? Do they pay their teachers more/recruit more highly degreed instructors? Do they have high debt obligations? What's the deal?
 
HippyDippy said:
Um why is the tuition so high?

Have you ever analyzed it? Do they pay their teachers more/recruit more highly degreed instructors? Do they have high debt obligations? What's the deal?
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I can't speak for the Athletic school but for the Academic school, the credentials of their instructors would put a small College to shame. When I went there, there was one teacher with a doctorate in Chemistry and she was an incredible instructor. There was another Physics teacher that had close to a doctorate and he was incredible too. Today they must have a dozen teachers with doctorates and most have Masters degrees in particular disciplines. Having said all that, I would say that their compensation is commensurate to that of of some of the highest ranked public high schools in SWO (e.g. Lakota, Sycamore and Mason). Also, the facilities are pretty strong too but could be better. A recently rebuilt public high school is much nicer.
 
BASESWIMPARENT said:
I can't speak for the Athletic school but for the Academic school, the credentials of their instructors would put a small College to shame. When I went there, there was one teacher with a doctorate in Chemistry and she was an incredible instructor. There was another Physics teacher that had close to a doctorate and he was incredible too. Today they must have a dozen teachers with doctorates and most have Masters degrees in particular disciplines. Having said all that, I would say that their compensation is commensurate to that of of some of the highest ranked public high schools in SWO (e.g. Lakota, Sycamore and Mason). Also, the facilities are pretty strong too but could be better. A recently rebuilt public high school is much nicer.
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I'm all for touting things, but let's not go to extremes here.

I've worked at numerous "small colleges" and every single instructor had doctorates and were published. Every single one. I've also taught at a private high school where their AP Physics teacher had an English degree.
 
You are right. It is an exaggeration to make a point. How many high schools public or private have teachers that that have doctorates in an academic field (meaning to education or education administration)? Not too many I would guess. And if so, maybe 1 or 2. This school has many more than that.

Bill
 
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