Northwest Ohio Realignment

Haha right? This isn’t college football where we’re putting West Virginia in the Big 12. Findlay is far as hell from Sylvania. Why do that if you don’t have to?

Also what’s all this nonsense about Genoa and Lake being in the same league as Southview. Lol that’s insane
Is there a law where you can't travel outside of the Toledo metro area for sports??
 

dhsdog06

Well-known member
Maybe, but why announce you are looking after you're done looking?

Why not just announce that they have a new 16 team conference?

Who would they be trying to fool, and why?
Because in the scenario I've seen where they've talked to everyone and everyone is on board, they're at 15. Still need 1 more, preferably a small school.
 

dhsdog06

Well-known member
Haha right? This isn’t college football where we’re putting West Virginia in the Big 12. Findlay is far as hell from Sylvania. Why do that if you don’t have to?

Also what’s all this nonsense about Genoa and Lake being in the same league as Southview. Lol that’s insane
Don't be ridiculous.

Hell is 67 miles from Sylvania!
 

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chs1971

Well-known member
If fit were all about numbers then I would agree with the sentiment of your post. Culturally, demographically, etc. Gunplay is absolutely more of an NLL school than Clay and there's really not a discussion about it.
So you think that Napoleon and Perrysburg are culturally, demographically, etc identical?

Or that Springfield and AW are culturally, demographically, etc identical?

Or that BG and Maumee are culturally, demographically, etc identical?

Or that Northview and Southview are culturally, demographically, etc identical?

Then you really don't know much about those schools or communities and there's really no discussion about it. Except that, since I do know about these schools and communities, culturally, demographically, etc Clay fits as well as Findlay.
 
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chs1971

Well-known member
I wonder if they only find six teams if would go with 2 7 teams divisions and for football play 3 non-conference games and 1 cross over game (biggest team in each division play, 2nd biggest play and so on) that doesn't count in conference standings. Not ideal but I think it could work.
Anything could work, but why do any of that? If the NLL loses one school pick up Clay. If they lose another, well then the league is driving to Fremont or Findlay instead of Napoleon. Still a fairly compact eight team league easy to schedule.

Now if they can figure out two eight school divisions all the better, but I don't think the NLL will vote to expand to 12, 14, or 15.

I could be very wrong though.
 

chs1971

Well-known member
Doesn't anyone get it, Nobody in the NBC wants Maumee in the league. They're to much bigger and bring nothing to the NBC.
And the problem with Northwood they're rebels with move ins living with the coach.
Actually Maumee would bring a lot to the league, but I agree they are too big.

The question though is, if you lose Elmwood and Woodmore what are you going to do? You have to play somebody, and an eight team league is much easier to schedule than a six team league.

So what do you do?
 

chs1971

Well-known member
Because in the scenario I've seen where they've talked to everyone and everyone is on board, they're at 15. Still need 1 more, preferably a small school.
Which was my point. They don't have their 16 yet.

So you've seen 15. 8 NLL, 4 TRAC, your Defiance? Who are the other two?
 

NLLBEST

Active member
Doesn't anyone get it, Nobody in the NBC wants Maumee in the league. They're to much bigger and bring nothing to the NBC.
And the problem with Northwood they're rebels with move ins living with the coach.
They don’t get it or don’t want to.
 

bmss17

Active member
As an outsider, this is pretty fascinating. I’m pretty tuned in to NEO sports and their different conferences being from there. However I started really following NWO when I married my wife, who’s a Clay grad. It never made sense why Clay was never in the NLL, especially after hearing her talk about her days as a senior driving to Lorain for league games!

To me, it seems strange that the NLL seems to be the one struggling with its membership, but they will clearly be fine because they can replace. Many on here are claiming that this is TRAC public driven, but there’s no way that’s the case...if the NLL was in a good place, these conversations wouldn’t be happening; it’s clear the disparity between the top and bottom of the NLL has become too great.

IMO, I think the NLL is missing the boat here, because unlike many conferences, if Maumee or Napoleon decide to leave, they can fill those spots in 30 seconds no problem. By expanding, it’s clear they are trying to appeal to all 8 current members. And it’s clear the ripple effect it will have on the rest of the area.

The one thing where I think the NLL is doing right is reaching for 16 schools. It seems like 12 might be the ideal number, but based on what I’ve seen, the number one thing that blows up multi division conferences more than anything is mandated crossovers. I know on the surface 16 is strange (why not just have two conferences), but there are benefits to it. I don’t think there’s a magic number to teams, as long as crossovers are not mandated.

Before, conferences used to either have 8 or 10 members...what we’re seeing in NEO, and I’m wondering if NWO isn’t far off, is so many conferences have an odd number of teams, getting late season games really is not a problem at all.

If the NLL was smart, they would pick up the phone and call the commissioner of the Suburban League in the Akron area. They went through almost the exact same thing: an 8 team league that expanded to 16...the 16 teams lasted about a month before one of the teams bolted, and it went to 15. And something happened that not a lot of people predicted: it has become an extremely stable 15 team league. They’ve talked about expansion many times, and have had many teams apply. However, they were not in a rush to get to 16, and they still remain at 15, with an 8 team division and a 7 team division. What they have going for them are the following:

- a fantastic commissioner with ties to the league
- like minded schools
- pretty tight geographically

It’s clear whatever the NLL decides to do is going to have a huge ripple effect on the rest of NWO. If I’m them, I’m sitting patiently and waiting until Napoleon and/or Maumee make a move then backfill from there. But if they make the move to expand, I hope they don’t get caught up on a magic number, but rather find a group of teams that truly fits, and make it work with that group.
 

chs1971

Well-known member
As an outsider, this is pretty fascinating. I’m pretty tuned in to NEO sports and their different conferences being from there. However I started really following NWO when I married my wife, who’s a Clay grad. It never made sense why Clay was never in the NLL, especially after hearing her talk about her days as a senior driving to Lorain for league games!

To me, it seems strange that the NLL seems to be the one struggling with its membership, but they will clearly be fine because they can replace. Many on here are claiming that this is TRAC public driven, but there’s no way that’s the case...if the NLL was in a good place, these conversations wouldn’t be happening; it’s clear the disparity between the top and bottom of the NLL has become too great.

IMO, I think the NLL is missing the boat here, because unlike many conferences, if Maumee or Napoleon decide to leave, they can fill those spots in 30 seconds no problem. By expanding, it’s clear they are trying to appeal to all 8 current members. And it’s clear the ripple effect it will have on the rest of the area.

The one thing where I think the NLL is doing right is reaching for 16 schools. It seems like 12 might be the ideal number, but based on what I’ve seen, the number one thing that blows up multi division conferences more than anything is mandated crossovers. I know on the surface 16 is strange (why not just have two conferences), but there are benefits to it. I don’t think there’s a magic number to teams, as long as crossovers are not mandated.

Before, conferences used to either have 8 or 10 members...what we’re seeing in NEO, and I’m wondering if NWO isn’t far off, is so many conferences have an odd number of teams, getting late season games really is not a problem at all.

If the NLL was smart, they would pick up the phone and call the commissioner of the Suburban League in the Akron area. They went through almost the exact same thing: an 8 team league that expanded to 16...the 16 teams lasted about a month before one of the teams bolted, and it went to 15. And something happened that not a lot of people predicted: it has become an extremely stable 15 team league. They’ve talked about expansion many times, and have had many teams apply. However, they were not in a rush to get to 16, and they still remain at 15, with an 8 team division and a 7 team division. What they have going for them are the following:

- a fantastic commissioner with ties to the league
- like minded schools
- pretty tight geographically

It’s clear whatever the NLL decides to do is going to have a huge ripple effect on the rest of NWO. If I’m them, I’m sitting patiently and waiting until Napoleon and/or Maumee make a move then backfill from there. But if they make the move to expand, I hope they don’t get caught up on a magic number, but rather find a group of teams that truly fits, and make it work with that group.
Outstanding.

The two largest schools are now twice the size of the two smallest, and growing rapidly. The three at the bottom are not going to grow.
 

smurfyeah19

Active member
Outstanding.

The two largest schools are now twice the size of the two smallest, and growing rapidly. The three at the bottom are not going to grow.
You do wonder if this at all will reverse. I’ll be honest I’m one of the Perrysburg people (no kids yet though). Grew up in one of the local farming towns (SLL) & went to BGSU. Moved away for first job out of college, moved back because I got an offer with one of the companies I interned with in college. Perrysburg is an awesome town on the river that’s extremely well priced for what you get (prices on par with a cheap Columbus suburb) which is why so many younger professionals are coming here.

My question however is, this city does not have an abundance of white collar jobs & it takes a hot second to get into some of these skilled trades unions. How long will it be before Perrysburg & the Anthony Wayne district get too expensive for the market and folks start turning back to places like Maumee?
 

chs1971

Well-known member
You do wonder if this at all will reverse. I’ll be honest I’m one of the Perrysburg people (no kids yet though). Grew up in one of the local farming towns (SLL) & went to BGSU. Moved away for first job out of college, moved back because I got an offer with one of the companies I interned with in college. Perrysburg is an awesome town on the river that’s extremely well priced for what you get (prices on par with a cheap Columbus suburb) which is why so many younger professionals are coming here.

My question however is, this city does not have an abundance of white collar jobs & it takes a hot second to get into some of these skilled trades unions. How long will it be before Perrysburg & the Anthony Wayne district get too expensive for the market and folks start turning back to places like Maumee?
No place to build new housing in Maumee. Many more new houses new being developed around Perrysburg and in Monclova Twp.
 

ayCC!

Active member
Clay put up a big fight against Northview last night, too. I think their sports might really be on par with what the NLL is looking for in terms of competition.

I was thinking about this a little while ago. Do you think they would have different divisions for different sports? I think in terms of football, the levels of competition really are mismatched (even with a realignment), while in basketball, it could be 5/6 teams that have a shot at winning the championship every year.

My main subject would be Northview, only because their football program usually is at the mid/bottom, and putting them in the top division really does nothing for them. Yet in basketball, they seem poised to make a run nearly every year. It's nearly the same case with Southview, as well. Do you think any of these teams would object to being placed in a "lower" division when they very obviously could be competing with the "higher" schools, just in a different sport. IMO, I think Southview b-ball would probably dominate in basketball, but their football program would be able to compete in this lower division.
 

NLLBEST

Active member
My main subject would be Northview, only because their football program usually is at the mid/bottom, and putting them in the top division really does nothing for them. Yet in basketball, they seem poised to make a run nearly every year. It's nearly the same case with Southview, as well. Do you think any of these teams would object to being placed in a "lower" division when they very obviously could be competing with the "higher" schools, just in a different sport. IMO, I think Southview b-ball would probably dominate in basketball, but their football program would be able to compete in this lower division.
NV wasn’t exactly known for basketball in the NLL until just a few years ago when McDonald took over as coach and a few really talented players came through. Now they consistently have one of the best programs around. I know it’s easier to get good at basketball fast than it is in football but NV has had numbers for years now and you wonder why they haven’t been better outside of the ‘17 season with some D1 talent. Football might be the only sport they’re really underachieving in.
 

dappling

Active member
Anything could work, but why do any of that? If the NLL loses one school pick up Clay. If they lose another, well then the league is driving to Fremont or Findlay instead of Napoleon. Still a fairly compact eight team league easy to schedule.

Now if they can figure out two eight school divisions all the better, but I don't think the NLL will vote to expand to 12, 14, or 15.

I could be very wrong though.
Agreed. As a parent I am with you and would vote against league expansion. The whole thing seems silly and it seems like the nll is trying to solve the trac’s problem.

if the nbc don’t want maumee and Napoleon, there is zero danger of losing either of those schools (as the blade alluded to today) because other than the nbc, they have no where to go.
 
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dappling

Active member
You do wonder if this at all will reverse. I’ll be honest I’m one of the Perrysburg people (no kids yet though). Grew up in one of the local farming towns (SLL) & went to BGSU. Moved away for first job out of college, moved back because I got an offer with one of the companies I interned with in college. Perrysburg is an awesome town on the river that’s extremely well priced for what you get (prices on par with a cheap Columbus suburb) which is why so many younger professionals are coming here.

My question however is, this city does not have an abundance of white collar jobs & it takes a hot second to get into some of these skilled trades unions. How long will it be before Perrysburg & the Anthony Wayne district get too expensive for the market and folks start turning back to places like Maumee?
Houses in maumee get snapped up quickly when they are for sale. Not a lot of turnover and an older housing stock though are the issues.
 

smurfyeah19

Active member
No place to build new housing in Maumee. Many more new houses new being developed around Perrysburg and in Monclova Twp.
I know this, what I’m saying is if the price to build gets too high it’ll be a more attractive option to buy in Maumee and renovate. It’s noticeable how Maumee and Rossford have a much older population than that of Perrysburg
 

dhsdog06

Well-known member
Which was my point. They don't have their 16 yet.

So you've seen 15. 8 NLL, 4 TRAC, your Defiance? Who are the other two?
In the post I saw, Bryan and Wauseon. Which I know isn't for sure yet (neither is Defiance), but it's one scenario out there.
 

ayCC!

Active member
TRAC Commish hasn't heard anything from people wanting to leave, per The Blade: "Three Rivers Athletic Conference commissioner Mike Richards: 'I have not seen any notices from our conference schools as far as what their intentions are. That's how our constitution reads, that they have give something in writing to me. I've heard the same [realignment] rumors and, if the dominoes fall any one way, that could have an impact [the TRAC]. But, right now, those dominoes haven't fallen. The NLL has given a vision, and I think we all have a vision on what might happen. There's nothing wrong with that. But what is needed for that to occur hasn't happened yet.'" Not surprised if schools are trying to figure stuff out internally first.
 

CCHS93

Active member
Is there a law where you can't travel outside of the Toledo metro area for sports??
The NLL is spoiled. They only want to travel to other affluent suburban public schools within 10 miles. So no inner city public, no Catholics, no lower income small city schools like Fremont Ross or Lima Senior. They might 'slum it' with Whitmer and Clay.

Other than Central in football, the NLL is really on par with the TRAC. St. Francis and St. Johns would be competitive but probably wouldnt win the NLL. The NLL is superior to the track in soccer, both boys and girls. Other than NDA in girls basketball, the NLL is better than the TRAC. In boys basketball, the TRAC is probably better with SJJ and Lima.

Overall it would make a lot of sense to merge the two leagues and have divisions based on program strength.

Division A in football: CCHS, Whitmer, SJJ, SFS, Findlay, Perrysburg, Anthony Wayne, Springfield
Division B in football: Clay, Fremont, Lima, Napoleon, Northview, Southview, Maumee, Bowling Green

Division A in girls soccer: Anthony Wayne, Perrysburg, Northview, Southview, Clay, Findlay, NDA, SUA
Division B in girls soccer: CCHS, Springfield, Fremont, Whitmer, Napoleon, Maumee, Bowling Green, Lima

Division A in boys basketball: Lima, SJJ, SFS, Perrysburg, Northview, Southview, Findlay, Whitmer
Division B in boys basketball: CCHS, Anthony Wayne, Springfield, Napoleon, Maumee, Fremont, Bowling Green, Clay

Division A in girls basketball: NDA, Northview, Perrysburg, Napoleon, CCHS, Anthony Wayne, Findlay, Southview
Division B in girls basketball: SUA, Lima, Fremont, Whitmer, Maumee, Bowling Green, Springfield, Clay.

These are just examples. Each year or every two years a review of program strength would be done to see if a team needs to move up or down.

I personally think the City League should be in as well.
 
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