NFHS Released Guidance for State Associations to Consider in Re-opening High School Athletics and Other Activities


As evidence by the data in the article, anyone under the age of 70 has little to no chance of dying from this virus. It shows there have been ZERO deaths in the 0 - 19 age range. Additionally, I saw a report last week that over 60% of the people who've allegedly died from this virus in Ohio were already in nursing homes. Those figures are consistent with what other states are reporting. Isolate and provide the necessary healthcare support to the vulnerable, but don't penalize the other 80+% of the population. I feel sorry for the kids.

Heck in NY, their idiot Governor was sending thousands of people diagnosed with Covid-19 to nursing homes instead of hospitals, who then infected others!!!! No wonder 30% of the Covid-19 deaths in this country were in NY!!! Florida, which has as many or more elderly as any state, has not had the problems. They've had less than 1/10th the deaths as NY. We are all paying the price of mismanaged states like NY, IL and MI which are inordinately skewing the numbers. Michigan (led by another idiot Governor) has over three times as many Covid-19 deaths as Ohio.
 

bucksman

Moderator
We can talk about lawsuits all day, however, I have yet to see a school in Ohio with a plan to get going in three days yet. Anybody see or know any districts that are? Shows the lack of preparation.
School systems are working toward opening their facilities back up, they have to go through the various considerations (policies, liability, etc.). The issue here is Dewine and Quackton have mismanaged this whole thing, and are kind of winging stuff as they go. Decisions are made too close to an effective date, done in seemingly random fashion, regulations are designed to create the appearance of opening up but the reality of it being untenable. If there was any figment of systemic thinking in this going back to early April, things would be preceding much more reasonably.
 

ringer2

Active member
First, there is no right to not get sick.

Second, every school has athletes and parents sign a waiver now.
Yes, and those waivers are essentially worthless as well. I was referring to new Covid waivers. With or without waivers, if a schools acts negligently they can lose a suit. If they do not act negligently, they will win any suit.
 

brianwr112

Well-known member
If kids are working out at the facilities, kids can go back to school this fall.
And that's one of the main things causing holdup. How do they open these things safely without endangering the school year. I really don't understand how people don't think there will be no liability. And waivers are literally ruled against daily in court rooms across America. I'll admit being wrong on the mask rule but my argument stands. And I'm not sure how fast people think these things get through court but at this point any suit would must likely end up with a temporary order allowing the kids to play while the case proceeded. I'd say in most counties you're looking at maybe Sept/Oct at the earliest before anythings heard due to COVID. I guess a judge could move it up on their docket if they found the case important enough. The whole time legal fees are adding up. And you can literally sue for anything....but they aren't just dismissed like people think. That's an argument for a different day.

Passing the buck to different groups has lead to nothing but confusion. I would be upset if I was a parent because the government said schools could open. And we're three days away and nobody knows what's going on. I'm sure coaches are talking to their AD's. What are their ADs saying? That decision's over the Ads pay grade right? Lets take the legal aspect out of it. When there's public outcry, we're very split on this topic as a country, who's willing to stand up and say it was my decision and I stand by it?
 

cknights

Active member
Yes, and those waivers are essentially worthless as well. I was referring to new Covid waivers. With or without waivers, if a schools acts negligently they can lose a suit. If they do not act negligently, they will win any suit.
False. The OHSAA and accompanying school systems have never lost a lawsuit related to HIV, Hepatitis, or any other virus since implementing said waivers. Again.....sports are a privilege that come with risk. If you or anyone doesn’t like a virus that has a .00005% mortality rate outside our long term care facilities, then don’t have your kids or grandkids play ball. Take the privilege away.
 

CC Track Fan

Active member
Additionally, I saw a report last week that over 60% of the people who've allegedly died from this virus in Ohio were already in nursing homes. T
The State revised there count it is now 70% deaths from nursing homes. Residents in nursing homes makes up .8% of Ohio population and in an average year 30% of all nursing home residents die.
 

cknights

Active member
And that's one of the main things causing holdup. How do they open these things safely without endangering the school year. I really don't understand how people don't think there will be no liability. And waivers are literally ruled against daily in court rooms across America. I'll admit being wrong on the mask rule but my argument stands. And I'm not sure how fast people think these things get through court but at this point any suit would must likely end up with a temporary order allowing the kids to play while the case proceeded. I'd say in most counties you're looking at maybe Sept/Oct at the earliest before anythings heard due to COVID. I guess a judge could move it up on their docket if they found the case important enough. The whole time legal fees are adding up. And you can literally sue for anything....but they aren't just dismissed like people think. That's an argument for a different day.

Passing the buck to different groups has lead to nothing but confusion. I would be upset if I was a parent because the government said schools could open. And we're three days away and nobody knows what's going on. I'm sure coaches are talking to their AD's. What are their ADs saying? That decision's over the Ads pay grade right? Lets take the legal aspect out of it. When there's public outcry, we're very split on this topic as a country, who's willing to stand up and say it was my decision and I stand by it?
Name one time an OHSAA waiver has EVER lost in a lawsuit. Ever. Please. This is the most ridiculous argument. “We will cry and sue you if we get a cold”.

If you don’t want your kids in sports or school, then there’s alternatives.
 

bucksman

Moderator
There's distancing requirements (especially inside), I think there are temperature/medical check protocols, there's working through the concerns of parents and stakeholders, and so forth. To make an announcement on Thursday afternoon of a holiday weekend, and expect things ready to go by the Tuesday after a holiday is a little rash. Especially when the "prior state" was that school facilities weren't going to be open for another five-to-six weeks based on the ODH order.

Compliance, satisfying stakeholders, and coming up with a plan that accommodates all the teams takes time. Athletic administrators, building administrators, school system administrators, and other government types (i.e. county board of health) will probably be spending the coming week creating solution(s) that meet the needs of their respective school communities - hopefully for 6/1/2020 rollout.
 

brianwr112

Well-known member
Their insurance company has paid on numerous suits. Not sure if you consider that losing because an agreement was reached. And OHSAA literally lost in court over clearly stated rules just prior to the shut down. It was a complete embarrassment for them and they tucked their tail and walked. No appeal even though the rules were clearly written to prob 95% of us.

I don't know why you think OHSAA (an organization), is any different than public or private companies? The things people "sign-off" on are argued every day in courts. They surely aren't fool proof. Believe what you want though.
 

cknights

Active member
Their insurance company has paid on numerous suits. Not sure if you consider that losing because an agreement was reached. And OHSAA literally lost in court over clearly stated rules just prior to the shut down. It was a complete embarrassment for them and they tucked their tail and walked. No appeal even though the rules were clearly written to prob 95% of us.

I don't know why you think OHSAA (an organization), is any different than public or private companies? The things people "sign-off" on are argued every day in courts. They surely aren't fool proof. Believe what you want though.
Specific examples. Citations and find one about viruses please.
You are arguing just to argue and now using a snowflake excuse of lawsuits. Again. If your child is too endangered to get the privilege of playing sports, then don’t play. It’s that simple. No one is twisting your arm to make them play.
 

brianwr112

Well-known member
I have no clue about ones they've lost/settled due to viruses. On the other hand, I can't name one brought because of transmission of hepatitis. I'm not an expert regarding COVID but I'm pretty sure there's a different form of transmission. Which is why all these additional guidelines are important. And they must ensure they're meeting the highest standards for the safety of their students, staff and public. Can anyone tell me what that is?

OHSAA HAS PRIVATLY SETTLED NUMEROUS SUITS OVER THE YEARS. PARTIES CAN NOT DISCLOSE INFORMATION ABOUT SETTLEMENT. This is how nearly every civil suit ends. Most before the suit is even filed.
 

ringer2

Active member
False. The OHSAA and accompanying school systems have never lost a lawsuit related to HIV, Hepatitis, or any other virus since implementing said waivers. Again.....sports are a privilege that come with risk. If you or anyone doesn’t like a virus that has a .00005% mortality rate outside our long term care facilities, then don’t have your kids or grandkids play ball. Take the privilege away.
False. The OHSAA and accompanying school systems have never lost a lawsuit related to HIV, Hepatitis, or any other virus since implementing said waivers. Again.....sports are a privilege that come with risk. If you or anyone doesn’t like a virus that has a .00005% mortality rate outside our long term care facilities, then don’t have your kids or grandkids play ball. Take the privilege away.
That proves nothing. Have they been negligent in any of those cases?
 

cknights

Active member
I have no clue about ones they've lost/settled due to viruses. On the other hand, I can't name one brought because of transmission of hepatitis. I'm not an expert regarding COVID but I'm pretty sure there's a different form of transmission. Which is why all these additional guidelines are important. And they must ensure they're meeting the highest standards for the safety of their students, staff and public. Can anyone tell me what that is?

OHSAA HAS PRIVATLY SETTLED NUMEROUS SUITS OVER THE YEARS. PARTIES CAN NOT DISCLOSE INFORMATION ABOUT SETTLEMENT. This is how nearly every civil suit ends. Most before the suit is even filed.
So basically now we are on to civil suits that may or may not have been brought against the OHSAA and viruses that are far more likely to kill you and/or have long term effects, we have never heard about when it comes to lawsuits. Furthermore, athletes specifically sign off on a waiver that they are taking the risk. Yet, if said waiver adds Covid, suddenly there will be a switch flipped that will allow mysterious civil suits to come in abundance. Got it. Sounds far fetched but if it fits your narrative, I must be wrong.

Too many people pandering to the news for a virus that has a .00005% chance of major complications/death. The only reason that the OHSAA is being so careful now is because people want that narrative to fit. From my talks with administration, there is a 95-99% chance that schools allowing football will have football in the fall. The OHSAA is a billion dollar industry. It’s going to happen and they will have a lock tight waiver And those scared should not play.
 

ringer2

Active member
Name one time an OHSAA waiver has EVER lost in a lawsuit. Ever. Please. This is the most ridiculous argument. “We will cry and sue you if we get a cold”.

If you don’t want your kids in sports or school, then there’s alternatives.
You’re missing the point and don’t understand law. First of all, I have been around school athletics and the OHSAA a long time and I don’t remember ANY suits related to a virus. Please link us to one if you are aware. Second, it would be the lack of negligence on the OHSAA’s part that won them the lawsuit, not the waiver. If the court had determined negligence, the waiver would be useless. This is well established legal precedent.
 

brianwr112

Well-known member
Cool story. What is the relevance to Ohio?
Not really related to Ohio but when one of the top programs in the country, in one of our top football states get called out and suspended. I hope it keeps those in Ohio from looking for a little advantage. School Districts are not in a potion to allow any variation of whatever rules they come up with. That's the part that effects Ohio
 

brianwr112

Well-known member
You’re missing the point and don’t understand law. First of all, I have been around school athletics and the OHSAA a long time and I don’t remember ANY suits related to a virus. Please link us to one if you are aware. Second, it would be the lack of negligence on the OHSAA’s part that won them the lawsuit, not the waiver. If the court had determined negligence, the waiver would be useless. This is well established legal precedent.
No VIRUS suits I've ever heard of. And it's pretty much always the negligence that makes the waiver useless. Not always intentionally either.

And above all...each example I know of ended up making their sports safer for those that follow.
 

270SC

Member
And that's one of the main things causing holdup. How do they open these things safely without endangering the school year. I really don't understand how people don't think there will be no liability. And waivers are literally ruled against daily in court rooms across America. I'll admit being wrong on the mask rule but my argument stands. And I'm not sure how fast people think these things get through court but at this point any suit would must likely end up with a temporary order allowing the kids to play while the case proceeded. I'd say in most counties you're looking at maybe Sept/Oct at the earliest before anythings heard due to COVID. I guess a judge could move it up on their docket if they found the case important enough. The whole time legal fees are adding up. And you can literally sue for anything....but they aren't just dismissed like people think. That's an argument for a different day.

Passing the buck to different groups has lead to nothing but confusion. I would be upset if I was a parent because the government said schools could open. And we're three days away and nobody knows what's going on. I'm sure coaches are talking to their AD's. What are their ADs saying? That decision's over the Ads pay grade right? Lets take the legal aspect out of it. When there's public outcry, we're very split on this topic as a country, who's willing to stand up and say it was my decision and I stand by it?
I can confirm this is happening pretty much state wide. I have heard from at least three, two very prominent athletic departments that this is the issue, whatever is figured out it conflicts with our government, OHSAA, and or the county health board.
 

cknights

Active member
You’re missing the point and don’t understand law. First of all, I have been around school athletics and the OHSAA a long time and I don’t remember ANY suits related to a virus. Please link us to one if you are aware. Second, it would be the lack of negligence on the OHSAA’s part that won them the lawsuit, not the waiver. If the court had determined negligence, the waiver would be useless. This is well established legal precedent.
Thanks. You proved my point. There has never been a lawsuit about a virus that anyone can point to. Not only is it absurd to think someone would try to sue over a legally binding document, it is also very funny that people are on here making up a potential court case whereas someone miraculously wins against their own signature! Further, it’s a waist of time to pour conjecture into it as no one can point to a single case they know of that speaks about the OHSAA losing a lawsuit. Especially one that includes a specific bylaw whereas you sign a waiver to play, HOLDING THE OHSAA HARMLESS. Please give one specific case, whereas a hold harmless clause did not hold up in the court of law.

I’ll happily wait until someone proves a signature and a hold harmless clause didn’t stand up in the court of law.
 
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cknights

Active member
"The OHSAA is a billion dollar industry. "

If it is, I'm sure it's news to them.
The OHSAA hands out nearly 3 million in ticket reimbursements and scholarships per year out of their general fund. It’s on their website. That’s just money they hand out. The OHSAA is a very wealthy industry. While we have one of the only state sports authorities that doesnt self fund fully from schools, it’s still an extremely wealthy industry.
 
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winbypin

Well-known member
Not really related to Ohio but when one of the top programs in the country, in one of our top football states get called out and suspended. I hope it keeps those in Ohio from looking for a little advantage. School Districts are not in a potion to allow any variation of whatever rules they come up with. That's the part that effects Ohio
Ok...I guess. Yes, schools should follow the rules or face consequences. Is that the point?
 

ringer2

Active member
Thanks. You proved my point. There has never been a lawsuit about a virus that anyone can point to. Not only is it absurd to think someone would try to sue over a legally binding document, it is also very funny that people are on here making up a potential court case whereas someone miraculously wins against their own signature! Further, it’s a waist of time to pour conjecture into it as no one can point to a single case they know of that speaks about the OHSAA losing a lawsuit. Especially one that includes a specific bylaw whereas you sign a waiver to play, HOLDING THE OHSAA HARMLESS. Please give one specific case, whereas a hold harmless clause did not hold up in the court of law.

I’ll happily wait until someone proves a signature and a hold harmless clause didn’t stand up in the court of law.
Well, since you asked.


As I said, it comes down to whether the organization was negligent or not.
 

BIG ED

Well-known member
If Disney is going to make you sign a waiver before you enter their parks that you won’t sue them if you get covid, then what’s to stop Stadiums and arenas from doing so, or school systems. Obviously Disney feels those signatures hold the weight to stop the ambulance chasers or in this case Covid chasers from suing them.
 
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