Gameplanning vs Colerain

[OldSchoolPanther]

So then why hasn't this drop occurred at a majority of the other parochial high schools in Cincinnati?

If it's mostly about less kids in parochial grade schools, why are some parochial high schools growing and some not?

It's because of the things they're doing to make them successful.

 

[Omar]

So then why hasn't this drop occurred at a majority of the other parochial high schools in Cincinnati?

If it's mostly about less kids in parochial grade schools, why are some parochial high schools growing and some not?

It's because of the things they're doing to make them successful.

That’s a difft question. You asked why enrollment declined in the first place, that was why. You’re out of your element here.

 

[OldSchoolPanther]

How is that different?

So, declining enrollment in grade school applies to Elder, but not any other parochial high school in Cincinnati?

Huh?

 

[Omar]

How is that different?

So, declining enrollment in grade school applies to Elder, but not any other parochial high school in Cincinnati?

Huh?

Their feeders have higher enrollment. Dominic used to be the biggest grade school in Cincinnati. Now, it’s nothing.

 

[PURPLE REIGN]

So then why hasn't this drop occurred at a majority of the other parochial high schools in Cincinnati?

If it's mostly about less kids in parochial grade schools, why are some parochial high schools growing and some not?

It's because of the things they're doing to make them successful.

What parochial high schools in Cincinnati are growing?

 

[OldSchoolPanther]

Seton, MND, Ursula, St X, and I believe even Moeller (may not be as drastic).

Everyone says "this is happening everywhere" - actually it's not.

It's another thing Elder fans talk themselves into instead of facing reality.

The facts are that some are growing and some are shrinking. Those that are growing are doing it at the expense of those that are shrinking. Very few are leaving to go to public education. They are picking a different Catholic option.

It's a matter of competing for diverse talent.

 

[Omar]

What parochial high schools in Cincinnati are growing?

He doesn’t know wtf he’s talking about. There’s two difft sides to this:

1) Why enrollment declined in the first place... bc key feeders like Dominic and Victory have shrunk immensely

2) what Elder can do to combat this decline?

His claim enrollment declined bc of the failure of inclusion is incorrect. It’s stagnating bc of that, but it’s not WHY enrollment dropped in the first place.

However, it really doesn’t matter WHY enrollment declined at this point. All that matters is getting it back up and the best way to do that is attract a growing population of non Feeder students. Trends don’t go backwards, Victory and Dominic will never have the #s they once had, it’s not going to happen.

 

[OldSchoolPanther]

Go check the enrollment numbers at X, MND, Seton and St X. And you tell me I don't know what I'm talking about.

Blatantly ignore reality to fit your non-feeder agenda. Elder is not competing for a diverse mix of students. The others are, and it's shows.

You're too dumb to realize that we're saying the same thing.

I have no idea why you think it's realistic that a diverse group of athletes is all of a sudden going to pick Elder when they are the most home-grown, geogrpahically pocketed, same-thinking, non-changing, outside un-friendly group of the bunch. You're living in a dream world.

 

[Omar]

Go check the enrollment numbers at X, MND, Seton and St X. And you tell me I don't know what I'm talking about.

Blatantly ignore reality to fit your non-feeder agenda. Elder is not competing for a diverse mix of students. The others are, and it's shows.

You're too dumb to realize that we're saying the same thing.

I have no idea why you think it's realistic that a diverse group of athletes is all of a sudden going to pick Elder when they are the most home-grown, geogrpahically pocketed, same-thinking, non-changing, outside un-friendly group of the bunch.

It’s honestly hard for me to grasp how dim you are. It’s like talking to someone in Stern’s Wack Pack. Elder wouldn’t have to compete for students if the Feeder enrollment was as massive as it was 30 yrs ago. However, that’s no longer the reality and it will never be that way again. As a result, Elder needs to change their approach to attract non Feeder students. At this point, it’s not realistic to assume a diverse group of students would pick Elder, and that desperately needs to change.

 

[PURPLE REIGN]

Go check the enrollment numbers at X, MND, Seton and St X. And you tell me I don't know what I'm talking about.

.

You said a drop has not occurred at a majority of other parochial high schools in Cincinnati yet you only mentioned 4 schools?

What about these schools who were previously Division One: LaSalle, Mercy, Roger Bacon, Purcell, etc?

Why is Mercy no longer in business and LaSalle is now Division Two?

 

[OldSchoolPanther]

So yes, that perception change has to come first. Now we're getting somewhere.

There's no way the leaders of that school can send out the new Admissions Director and say "you need to find us more diversity" - that's insanity.

The culture of diversity acceptance, progressive thinking, inclusiveness of others not like them, diversifying the staff, etc, etc, all has to happen before you can go out and start selling people on this idea.

That falls directly on the leaders of the school. You can't sell diversity without being diverse.

 

[OldSchoolPanther]

You said a drop has not occurred at a majority of other parochial high schools in Cincinnati yet you only mentioned 4 schools?

What about these schools who were previously Division One: LaSalle, Mercy, Roger Bacon, Purcell, etc?

Why is Mercy no longer in business and LaSalle is now Division Two?

I meant overall. Most of the time, those leaving a parochial school leave for another parochial school. Some those losing become other school's gain. There are some that go the public route, but overall, those are few and far between.

 

[Omar]

I meant overall. Most of the time, those leaving a parochial school leave for another parochial school. Some those losing become other school's gain. There are some that go the public route, but overall, those are few and far between.

Get some stats to back that claim up.

 

[PURPLE REIGN]

Get some stats to back that claim up.

He cant. He wont. Parochial schools are shrinking in Cincinnati and across the country in significant numbers. But it's comical he thinks Elder fans are making this up :Ohno:

Trey- If EVERY catholic school on the west-side of Cincinnati is shrinking (except maybe Ignatius), what other catholic schools are they choosing?

 

[OldSchoolPanther]

You're not following, or maybe I'm not explaining it that well. Obviously, grade school decline at grade schools is impacting enrollment. That's a piece of the decline, no doubt.

But once students get to high school, students in Cincinnati aren't choosing between public and parochial schools. If they have a list, it's either all private or all public (for the most part, obviously there are some exceptions).

Before open borders, this didn't really matter because you went to the school in your border. Now that they're open, it's open season. Those decisions are now greatly influenced by marketing, advertising, diversity, inclusiveness, belonging, and culture. Much the same as the reasons why you'd pick an employer.

Elder doesn't have a great sales pitch for alot of those things, and they're losing out on those students. It's the second layer of competition other than the obvious overall decline of grade school parochial enrollment.

 

[SMARTY22]

The defensive game plan was good. The offensive game plan could have been better - run the football more. If you're looking at 42-0 without watching the game or having some context then sure I guess it looks like a bad game plan.

I wátched the game. Still think the Defensive plan stunk and they were totally unprepared for the Pass. On the Offensive side they never run the ball enough. Just the way it is.

 

[Omar]

I wátched the game. Still think the Defensive plan stunk and they were totally unprepared for the Pass. On the Offensive side they never run the ball enough. Just the way it is.

You have to play the odds against an Offense like Colerain. At the end of the day, you’ve got to trust your Corners in man cvg, and Elder’s got beat.

I’m more confident the weak link on Defense I talked about last week was the reason those Dive plays went for long TDs.

 

[SMARTY22]

The Jr class is weak, but I think the Soph class is pretty strong.

This is a problem also. Elder can not afford to have a “weak” class. Obviously some will turn out better than others but weak just sets them back every time.

 

[PURPLE REIGN]

You're not following, or maybe I'm not explaining it that well. Obviously, grade school decline at grade schools is impacting enrollment. That's a piece of the decline, no doubt.

But once students get to high school, students in Cincinnati aren't choosing between public and parochial schools. If they have a list, it's either all private or all public (for the most part, obviously there are some exceptions).

Disagree. Kids thinking about Elder are also thinking about X and LaSalle. But they, and their parents, also consider Walnut Hills, OH, and Taylor more and more.

In addition, their are significantly less kids to choose from. This is why Mercy is no longer a school and LaSalle is in D II.

Elder loses a handful of kids to X every year, but they have ALWAYS lost a handful of kids to X. In fact, I think they lose less now then they did 20 years ago.

 

[Omar]

This is a problem also. Elder can not afford to have a “weak” class. Obviously some will turn out better than others but weak just sets them back every time.

I was talking about Colerain. Elder’s Jr class is pretty strong. Soph class is kind of meh but has a strong OL and WRs. Frosh aren’t deep but have about 7-8 very good players. 2-3 D1 prospects.

 

[SMARTY22]

I was talking about Colerain. Elder’s Jr class is pretty strong. Soph class is kind of meh but has a strong OL and WRs. Frosh aren’t deep but have about 7-8 very good players. 2-3 D1 prospects.

Colerain will fill the weak class with some sophomores and make them better along with getting playing experience. Elder has had plenty of classes that were down and it sets them back. D1 prospects that are Frosh?

 

[Omar]

Disagree. Kids thinking about Elder are also thinking about X and LaSalle. But they, and their parents, also consider Walnut Hills, OH, and Taylor more and more.

In addition, their are significantly less kids to choose from. This is why Mercy is no longer a school and LaSalle is in D II.

Elder loses a handful of kids to X every year, but they have ALWAYS lost a handful of kids to X. In fact, I think they lose less now then they did 20 years ago.

I honestly have a migraine from the back and forth. He just likes to complain and you can tell by how half azzed his arguments are

 

[Omar]

Colerain will fill the weak class with some sophomores and make them better along with getting playing experience. Elder has had plenty of classes that were down and it sets them back. D1 prospects that are Frosh?

That’s just my opinion. Ramsey and Hambleton should play at the next level. Possibly Niangange (DE from Lawrence) and Thomas. Some other good players like Kirch, Spinney, and Keller.

 

[Omar]

The defensive game plan was good. The offensive game plan could have been better - run the football more. If you're looking at 42-0 without watching the game or having some context then sure I guess it looks like a bad game plan.

I have to revisit this bc the complaint about the game plan bothers me. Respectfully, you’re really missing the point if you think the Defensive Game Plan is at fault.

Watch those plays again, the Elder DB plain got beat. It wasn’t a mix up in assignments or him reading the play wrong, he flat out got beat in Man Cvg. That’s not a coaching issue, that’s a personnel issue.

I get it’s easier to blame coaches bc they’re adults, but you have to look at this logically. It’s all about the talent. There’s no scheme or game plan genius enough to make up that massive gap in talent bw players. Elder had 1, maybe 2 players on Defense that would start for Colerain. Maybe another 2-3 would make the 2 Deep.

 

[gocards]

I have to revisit this bc the complaint about the game plan bothers me. Respectfully, you’re really missing the point if you think the Defensive Game Plan is at fault.

Watch those plays again, the Elder DB plain got beat. It wasn’t a mix up in assignments or him reading the play wrong, he flat out got beat in Man Cvg. That’s not a coaching issue, that’s a personnel issue.

I get it’s easier to blame coaches bc they’re adults, but you have to look at this logically. It’s all about the talent. There’s no scheme or game plan genius enough to make up that massive gap in talent bw players. Elder had 1, maybe 2 players on Defense that would start for Colerain. Maybe another 2-3 would make the 2 Deep.

There is no shame in getting beat by Sincere Jones and JJ Davis in man coverage. Maybe zone coverage would be a better option with less talented players.

 

[Omar]

There is no shame in getting beat by Sincere Jones and JJ Davis in man coverage. Maybe zone coverage would be a better option with less talented players.

There’s no shame in it. And if they played zone, Colerain would’ve just thrown something shorter and picked up a bunch of YAC. I’m just annoyed at the idea the staff wasn’t prepared. It’s shifting focus away from the real issue.

 

[OldSchoolPanther]

Elder fans have a hard time accepting reality. Leave it to them to say 42-0 was "close" or "the game was not indicative of the score." It was 42-0.

Omar is right about the talent disparity, at least in the games that will define success for the program.

 

[SMARTY22]

There’s no shame in it. And if they played zone, Colerain would’ve just thrown something shorter and picked up a bunch of YAC. I’m just annoyed at the idea the staff wasn’t prepared. It’s shifting focus away from the real issue.

Staff wasn’t prepared but game plan on D was Good?

 

[Omar]

Elder fans have a hard time accepting reality. Leave it to them to say 42-0 was "close" or "the game was not indicative of the score." It was 42-0.

Omar is right about the talent disparity, at least in the games that will define success for the program.

I don’t like you, I’m never going to. And I sure as hell don’t respect you as a person or fan. You’re a coward. You hide in the weeds when things are good then come out to attack when things go bad. You’re a terrible person.

 

[OldSchoolPanther]

Staff wasn’t prepared but game plan on D was Good?

I think he's saying he's tired of hearing that the staff didn't have a good defensive plan, and that it was more about the talent disparity than the defensive preparation.

He's probably not wrong.