FCC Announces Academy Teams for 19-20 Season

Philly_Cat

Active member
I won't dispute this and suspect that the variability in High School Soccer coaching is very large. But I'm not saying they should be scouting HS soccer today I'm saying that maybe the powers that be in American soccer should be looking at HS soccer as the place to invest their money and energy so that the coaching & skills training improves.



Think of HS soccer as one of those great old houses they remodel on HGTV. The place needs a lot of work but the bones are solid and the potential end product after the remodeling is spectacular. You even said it yourself Gr8tSOccr that HS soccer was "a blast". That's the environment that can attract kids to play for their high school that can't easily be imitated in club soccer.



The other advantage of using HS soccer as the infrastructure for developing players is that you already have outposts in the urban areas where soccer isn't popular but athletic kids reside in abundance. It's easier to make inroads at inner city high schools then trying to attract kids to "club" by putting in a soccer field at the local park.



And to be clear, HS soccer wouldn't be responsible for the final training of talent. That would be left to elite "clubs" and academy's. It would follow the football situation where HS introduces a highly competitive version of the sport to teenagers. Even though only a very small number of kids will go on from HS to play in the MLS and on the National Team millions more will become lifetime fans for having played HS soccer.
I pretty much completely agree with this 100%. The problem becomes getting the people with money and resources to buy into that vision, knowing there is going to be quite a while of investment with little to no return. Jut I agree, that once that hump is finally gotten over there talent that will begin to flourish in that environment will be bountiful. It can and would start to look very similar to what you get for the next level from high school talent in most of the other sports.

I don't think trying to mold soccer into the European mold of developing talent is the right choice in America. This is one place where our way of cultivating athletic talent probably would be best here in this country.

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Gr8tS0ccr

Member
I pretty much completely agree with this 100%. The problem becomes getting the people with money and resources to buy into that vision, knowing there is going to be quite a while of investment with little to no return. Jut I agree, that once that hump is finally gotten over there talent that will begin to flourish in that environment will be bountiful. It can and would start to look very similar to what you get for the next level from high school talent in most of the other sports.

I don't think trying to mold soccer into the European mold of developing talent is the right choice in America. This is one place where our way of cultivating athletic talent probably would be best here in this country.

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I would be all for it as well except that I do think a short HS season isn’t ideal for training and development. If only they would listen to us little people. :)
 

lotr10

Well-known member
I would be all for it as well except that I do think a short HS season isn’t ideal for training and development. If only they would listen to us little people. :)
I would move the HS soccer season to Spring where it would compete with baseball & not football. This wouldn't help the short season situation you bring up but it could create a Friday night social event similar to what football has in the Fall and Basketball has in the winter.

I also think that you would have kids playing BOTH soccer & football. Now before folks laugh at me about this I remember years ago a National Team level HS soccer player moved to Cincinnati from Arizona and had to decide whether to play soccer or football at Lakota West! He had been an all state safety back in Arizona! He choose soccer and when I saw him play in a game at Fairfield there was no doubt he would have been a stud on the football field to. The kid was BIG & FAST.

BTW, dual soccer & football players would follow the old tradition of dual football & lacrosse players. Where I grew up in Western NY it was common for kids to play both sports. Don't forget that Jim Brown was a great lacrosse player to.

Finally if you want to make inroads into the urban areas this is how you do it - soccer in the spring & summer and football in the fall.
 

lotr10

Well-known member
I pretty much completely agree with this 100%. The problem becomes getting the people with money and resources to buy into that vision, knowing there is going to be quite a while of investment with little to no return. Jut I agree, that once that hump is finally gotten over there talent that will begin to flourish in that environment will be bountiful. It can and would start to look very similar to what you get for the next level from high school talent in most of the other sports.

I don't think trying to mold soccer into the European mold of developing talent is the right choice in America. This is one place where our way of cultivating athletic talent probably would be best here in this country.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk
I agree 100% with this Philly!
 
I would move the HS soccer season to Spring where it would compete with baseball & not football. This wouldn't help the short season situation you bring up but it could create a Friday night social event similar to what football has in the Fall and Basketball has in the winter.

I also think that you would have kids playing BOTH soccer & football. Now before folks laugh at me about this I remember years ago a National Team level HS soccer player moved to Cincinnati from Arizona and had to decide whether to play soccer or football at Lakota West! He had been an all state safety back in Arizona! He choose soccer and when I saw him play in a game at Fairfield there was no doubt he would have been a stud on the football field to. The kid was BIG & FAST.

BTW, dual soccer & football players would follow the old tradition of dual football & lacrosse players. Where I grew up in Western NY it was common for kids to play both sports. Don't forget that Jim Brown was a great lacrosse player to.

Finally if you want to make inroads into the urban areas this is how you do it - soccer in the spring & summer and football in the fall.
Dual sports could happen, if HS administrators would allow it. I've seen it all over the state where a player does football and soccer in the same season. This is strictly a school policy.

HS soccer does have different seasons, depending on where you are in the country. Personally, a spring in Ohio would be miserable, just look at how it was this spring. Kentucky has middle school in the spring, good luck with having a good preseason, then even more luck needed to ensure a good regular season.

Additionally, what just needs to happen is the HS state associations need to quit being restrictive. Oklahoma allows HS and club to co-exist in the same season (spring). Seemed to flow pretty smoothly, in my experience. High schools know how/when to schedule away from club schedules. There's no fighting or territorialism as much as there is when HS associations restrict everything.
 
Now that the FCC Academy teams have been selected and announced does anyone have an idea of how some of the high schools were impacted? For example, did St X lose a bunch of guys, Mason, Summit, etc?
 
So..the FCC "academy" (joke) is going to play a national schedule with lads from a couple clubs in the Cincy area? I only wish there was some way to get in on some betting action on this (stomach hurts from laughing)...I could retire soon...I will say this one more time....Club soccer is a cash cow run by men and women scamming thousands of dollars out of the pockets of middle and upper class folks so they can ride around in their SUV's with stickers that say their kid (s) play for some blah blah blah club...the soccer is awful! I have seen the highest levels...Buckeye, MRL, ODP and it was mostly small, marginally athletic kids playing a very "unphysical" game...The problem remains our most gifted, athletic kids aren't playing soccer yet...and I say this AS MY YOUNGEST IS PLAYING CLUB! ...This model will not change because the people making a living running these clubs aren't giving it up any time soon...it is easy money...it isn't about the number of high school games...it isn't about training....it is about $$$...My only jealousy is I didn't think of it!
 

Rohbino

Well-known member
So..the FCC "academy" (joke) is going to play a national schedule with lads from a couple clubs in the Cincy area? I only wish there was some way to get in on some betting action on this (stomach hurts from laughing)...I could retire soon..
You do realize that MLS clubs are required to have USSDA teams, don't you? FC Cincinnati doesn't have a choice here. It's either support USDDA teams or don't have a MLS franchise. All MLS teams have USSDA teams. Even the Canadian clubs, Montreal, Toronto, and Vancouver, have USSDA teams.

Club soccer is a cash cow run by men and women scamming thousands of dollars out of the pockets of middle and upper class folks
I won't argue that the pay-to-play club structure probably isn't the best, but someone has to pay. The trainers are not going to do what they do for free. Would you work for free? There is a lot of overhead as well - field fees (maintenance fees if the club owns the fields or leasing/rental), administration fees, insurance, referees, etc.... Until someone can come up with a better plan, it's how it is.

On this subject, though, you should research how much the kids playing in the USSDA, which FCC is a part of, btw, are paying. Not all USSDA teams are affiliated with MLS clubs. IN Ohio the Internationals (all age groups) in Akron/Cleveland and CUP (13 & 14) in Cincinnati, are examples of clubs not affiliated with MLS clubs. Those USSDA teams that are affiliated with MLS clubs, in Ohio that would be FCC and the Columbus Crew, are also subsidized by the MLS clubs. You seem to be making a statement that the FCC families will be "on the hook" for a lot of money in order for their kids to play for a DA team. While I'm not saying that there is no cash outlay from the families, it's not what you think it is.


...the soccer is awful! I have seen the highest levels...Buckeye, MRL, ODP and it was mostly small, marginally athletic kids playing a very "unphysical" game...
Buckeye, MRL, and ODP are not what I would consider the "highest levels." For the boys the highest level is undoubtedly the DA and for the girls it is the DA and ECNL. There is a lot of good soccer being played in the leagues at those levels. Go to a game and you might be surprised. That being said, there are still some good players playing in Buckeye and MRL or in the other USYSA regional leagues. You have a lot of anger over the structure of youth soccer and your tunnel vision probably doesn't allow you to see the good players.

I'm not sure where you get your "small" observation from. Kids, and even adults, don't need to be big to play good soccer. Croatia's Luka Modric is probably 5'7" and maybe 140-150 pounds and he is one of the best players in the world. Xavi, the retired Spanish player, is probably even smaller than that. Messi? Neymar? Dani Alves? Franck Ribery? These guys are all small and among the best in the world. There are a lot more than the players I've mentioned. The history of the game is filled with small players that were great.

I'm guessing from your "small, marginally athletic kids playing a very "unphysical" game" comment that you're a parent that thinks the best form of soccer is to have minimal passing in the midfield and have the defenders boot the ball up to the big, "athletic", and fast forward. Am I right? That isn't soccer, pal.
Here we go with this mindset. 🤦‍♂️🤦‍♀️
That mindset isn't altogether wrong, though. It's probably about the only logical thing that Sports Jock wrote. There are some kids that would be good players that don't get the opportunity to play. To the credit of the MLS clubs, though, there are outreach programs that attempt to draw some of those kids in. I'm not sure how successful the programs are and if they're actually more about "appearances" and building goodwill in the community but I believe some efforts are being made.

Many kids, though, have no interest in soccer. If a kid plays football, baseball, basketball, runs track, or whatever, and is enjoying it, it's all good. Anything to keep kids away from drugs or other degenerate street life is good.
 
You do realize that MLS clubs are required to have USSDA teams, don't you? FC Cincinnati doesn't have a choice here. It's either support USDDA teams or don't have a MLS franchise. All MLS teams have USSDA teams. Even the Canadian clubs, Montreal, Toronto, and Vancouver, have USSDA teams.
That requirement has no timeline though. Toronto just got theirs recently. Minnesota too. Others just bought existing clubs. MLS will allow an entity to begin, and the DA would come along...sometime.

That mindset isn't altogether wrong, though. It's probably about the only logical thing that Sports Jock wrote. There are some kids that would be good players that don't get the opportunity to play. To the credit of the MLS clubs, though, there are outreach programs that attempt to draw some of those kids in. I'm not sure how successful the programs are and if they're actually more about "appearances" and building goodwill in the community but I believe some efforts are being made.

Many kids, though, have no interest in soccer. If a kid plays football, baseball, basketball, runs track, or whatever, and is enjoying it, it's all good. Anything to keep kids away from drugs or other degenerate street life is good.
It is wrong. There's only one country that has more people playing soccer than the US, and that's China. It's not a numbers of athletes OR people problem. It's a culture problem.

What is the determination of "best athlete"? I ask that all the time when people bring this statement up. Messi would never be considered "best athlete" in the US, but he's arguably the best player in the world. It's not about being "best athlete." It's about being the "best soccer players."

Ever compare the speed or agility of our USMNT players with NFL combine participants? A lot of those numbers are extremely similar, and many better for the USMNT players. You match our NT up with any other NT, and I would be that the "athletic ability" would be similar to any other country. Compare the technical and tactical ability, that's a different story. Compare the soccer IQ, completely different.
 

Rohbino

Well-known member
What is the determination of "best athlete"? I ask that all the time when people bring this statement up. Messi would never be considered "best athlete" in the US, but he's arguably the best player in the world. It's not about being "best athlete." It's about being the "best soccer players."

Ever compare the speed or agility of our USMNT players with NFL combine participants? A lot of those numbers are extremely similar, and many better for the USMNT players. You match our NT up with any other NT, and I would be that the "athletic ability" would be similar to any other country. Compare the technical and tactical ability, that's a different story. Compare the soccer IQ, completely different.
You make a fair and valid point. It's kind of where I was going with my comments above in regard to "small players." In rereading what I wrote, I didn't finish my thoughts.

I will contend, though, and perhaps it may have been where Sports Jock was going, is that there are probably many kids that would be decent players that miss out on the opportunity because it is too elusive and quality instruction is not attainable.
 

Philly_Cat

Active member
So..the FCC "academy" (joke) is going to play a national schedule with lads from a couple clubs in the Cincy area? I only wish there was some way to get in on some betting action on this (stomach hurts from laughing)...I could retire soon...I will say this one more time....Club soccer is a cash cow run by men and women scamming thousands of dollars out of the pockets of middle and upper class folks so they can ride around in their SUV's with stickers that say their kid (s) play for some blah blah blah club...the soccer is awful! I have seen the highest levels...Buckeye, MRL, ODP and it was mostly small, marginally athletic kids playing a very "unphysical" game...The problem remains our most gifted, athletic kids aren't playing soccer yet...and I say this AS MY YOUNGEST IS PLAYING CLUB! ...This model will not change because the people making a living running these clubs aren't giving it up any time soon...it is easy money...it isn't about the number of high school games...it isn't about training....it is about $$$...My only jealousy is I didn't think of it!
You do realize that the FCC academy teams are fully funded, meaning families pay nothing for their kid to play, right? That includes travel, as the players travel by bus together as a team with the staff. Parents are responsible to getting the kids to training during the week, but even that can be worked around. I know the Crew have sponsored families that kids can live with instead of having to travel back and forth from home. There are kids from. Cincinnati that have done that in the past. With Cincinnati now having a fully funded MLS academy the city should lose less kids to Columbus, but I'm sure there are kids at FCC coming from Louisville and Lexington, so I wouldn't be surprised if they are doing the same for players far away.
 
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Yes...fully funded...for a bunch of mostly rich caucasian kids lol...I HAVE seen 2 DA's play...2 boys and one girl's teams ...was not blown away...the skills were mostly there but once again there was no size or physical play...I would rather watch a good high school game..It is only my opinion but school teams seem more "team like" for lack of a better phrase...they represent their friends, parents and communities...and I do see the better games when I can. I agree high school teams by and large aren't as well-coached but on the better teams I see athletic kids competing...some of these kids don't play club at all because they (gasp) play lacrosse or baseball in the spring...or basketball in the winter. Don't get me wrong...there ARE athletic kids that play club but not as many as the owners who profit off the situation would lead you to believe. As my son plays for a club I am not against it...he loves to play but the whole mentality that this pay to play system is the golden road is ridiculous...so FC had to have a DA team...why not open tryouts spread out over a few weeks? 2 of the best soccer players I have seen in SW Ohio in the last 15 years didn't play club...one went to college for baseball and the other I believe ran track....the other point I will make is simply age related...Little Susie or Johnny might be tearing it up for their u15 CUP team....but step out onto a high school field where you are playing against 18 yr. olds and that is a whole other ball of wax.
 
Oh...and best athlete is easy...big, strong, fast and co-ordinated with game IQ...Messi is an outlier...they do exist but are VERY rare. There are 5'8 dudes that have made it in the NBA...but only a handful...We have a ton of kids playing soccer....but our best athletes still are drawn to the money sports...remember Ocho Cinqo trying out for Sporting KC? They said he may have been one of the better US players ever if he had concentrated on it when he was younger...with that speed, size and athleticism that is without doubt...Steve Nash (although Canadian) is another soccer lover but chose basketball to the tune of 2 mvp's
 
Oh...and best athlete is easy...big, strong, fast and co-ordinated with game IQ...Messi is an outlier...they do exist but are VERY rare. There are 5'8 dudes that have made it in the NBA...but only a handful...We have a ton of kids playing soccer....but our best athletes still are drawn to the money sports...remember Ocho Cinqo trying out for Sporting KC? They said he may have been one of the better US players ever if he had concentrated on it when he was younger...with that speed, size and athleticism that is without doubt...Steve Nash (although Canadian) is another soccer lover but chose basketball to the tune of 2 mvp's
This argument will get nowhere with you, as you are pretty stuck on your own mindset with "best athlete."

If Messi is an outlier, you've obviously not been around the game of soccer for long. Almost none of the "best ever" players would be sniffed as "best athlete" by your definition. Let alone the best current.

As I mentioned previously, you put any of our current USMNT players up against any other national team, I would be we are more or just as athletic as any of the others. Size. Speed. Coordination. All will be similar, if not better for the USMNT. "Athleticism" is not where we lack. And, you think adding around 350 players to the soccer player pool would really take us to the top -- that 350 is how many NBA players there are that could be eligible for USMNT -- ??? :unsure:
 
So...you are actually stating that players of Messi’s size are the norm? 😳...so the top Euro leagues are full of guys that are 5’6 ..140 pounds wet holding a brick? Do YOU watch anything outside of the lackluster MLS? Messi is a outlier because of what he has achieved considering his lack of size...and he was the best at his peak. You can have all the Academies you want..until there is real road that leads to something besides laughable college soccer and low paying domestic leagues why would our best athletes put in that kind of time and hard work? If our USMNT players are such fantastic athletes why, outside of a handful of players, are they not playing in the big money leagues around the world? I love our team...watch all the matches and root them on relentlessly but the quality is uneven at best...and until the OUTREACH is wider and less expensive we are collectively *eeing into the wind
 
PS....I am in my 50’s and have been around the game for a LONG time...I still have my original Cosmos and Tampa Rowdies jerseys from when I was a kid...and remember when the only time I could watch futbol was the occasional Wide World of Sports and the PBS series “Soccer Made in Germany
 
So...you are actually stating that players of Messi’s size are the norm? 😳...so the top Euro leagues are full of guys that are 5’6 ..140 pounds wet holding a brick? Do YOU watch anything outside of the lackluster MLS? Messi is a outlier because of what he has achieved considering his lack of size...and he was the best at his peak. You can have all the Academies you want..until there is real road that leads to something besides laughable college soccer and low paying domestic leagues why would our best athletes put in that kind of time and hard work? If our USMNT players are such fantastic athletes why, outside of a handful of players, are they not playing in the big money leagues around the world? I love our team...watch all the matches and root them on relentlessly but the quality is uneven at best...and until the OUTREACH is wider and less expensive we are collectively *eeing into the wind
Have you ever looked at the national teams across the world? None of them are filled with guys that fit your concept of "bigger, faster, stronger." But, they are filled with guys who know how to play, and play better than the USMNT. We aren't at an athletic disadvantage, we are at a technical and tactical disadvantage (and mental disadvantage).

I'm not here arguing FOR any USSDA. It's more than that. I've never once argued for the USSDA.

But, you answered it yourself, it doesn't mean anything how "athletic" you are, if you aren't better at soccer, you won't make it. Look at DeAndre Yedlin right now, he's probably one of the most gifted "athletes" in the English Premier League, and he struggles. No one would ever question his athleticism, but it's easy to question his ability on the field...especially within a much better system.
 
Have you ever looked at the national teams across the world? None of them are filled with guys that fit your concept of "bigger, faster, stronger." But, they are filled with guys who know how to play, and play better than the USMNT. We aren't at an athletic disadvantage, we are at a technical and tactical disadvantage (and mental disadvantage).

I'm not here arguing FOR any USSDA. It's more than that. I've never once argued for the USSDA.

But, you answered it yourself, it doesn't mean anything how "athletic" you are, if you aren't better at soccer, you won't make it. Look at DeAndre Yedlin right now, he's probably one of the most gifted "athletes" in the English Premier League, and he struggles. No one would ever question his athleticism, but it's easy to question his ability on the field...especially within a much better system.
This! It's not about athleticism, it's about soccer ability.
 

Rohbino

Well-known member
So...you are actually stating that players of Messi’s size are the norm? 😳...so the top Euro leagues are full of guys that are 5’6 ..140 pounds wet holding a brick?
Yes, guys around Messi's size are normal in the European leagues and the MLS. Sure, perhaps some are a little taller but they're not "big" guys. The big guys that you speak of are the anomalies.

I addressed your nonsensical comments earlier in the thread when you stated this: "Buckeye, MRL, ODP and it was mostly small, marginally athletic kids playing a very "unphysical" game." As I stated at that time and I'll state again, you're probably a parent that thinks the best form of soccer is to have minimal passing in the midfield and have the defenders boot the ball up to the big, "athletic", and fast forward. You like a lot of physical play in games and favor it over a more technical affair. That kind of soccer might win lower-level games and recreational games but it isn't going to win at higher levels. I found it funny that you brought up Steve Nash, a fantastic basketball player that is also a decent soccer player, as an example of an athlete that spurned soccer for a different sport. I assumed that you pointed Nash out because you felt that he matched your "prototype" ideal of an athletic person. While Nash is fairly tall at 6'3", he is hardly a big guy at 170-180. Additionally, Nash is not particularly fast. He was such a good basketball player because he has insane technical skill and worked his off to get where he is. That is akin to many of the world's best soccer players.

When I addressed your comments I also pointed out some of the world's best futbolers that are small guys. I'll list out a few other than Messi. These guys play in Europe and the MLS. BTW, there is absolutely no comparison between the level of soccer played in the MLS vs the European leagues. These guys I'm listing are just random guys that popped into my head. There are many other examples of small guys.

Marco Reus (German that plays for Dortmund and the German NT) - 5'11" but probably around 160 lbs
Xavi (Retired Spaniard that was a longtime fixture for Barcelona and the Spanish NT) - 5'7", 140 to 150
Neymar (Brazilian on the NT and previously played at Barca and is now at PSG) - 5'7", 140s
Luka Modric (Croatian on the NT and currently at Real Madrid. Many think the best central mid in the game) - 5'7", 140s
Philippe Coutinho (Brazilian on the NT, previously at Liverpool and now at Bayern) - 5'8", 150s
Franck Ribery (French on the NT, a long time Bayern player and now at Serie A side Fiorentina) - 5'7", 150ish
Mesut Ozil (German on the NT and a long-time Bundesliga, Real Madrid, and Arsenal player) - he's around 6' but is probably 150 lbs at most
Christian Pulisic (the "Great Statesian Hope" on the NT, previously at Dortmund and now at Chelsea) - Pulisic is 5'7" or 8" and a huge 135 lbs
Dani Alves (one of my all-time faves, capt of Brazilian NT with a long Euro career at Barca, Juventus, and PSG. Now plays professionally in Brazil) - 5'8", 150-160
Josef Martinez (Venezuelan goal scoring machine on the NT and currently at Atlanta FC. Good enough to play in Europe) - 5'7", 150ish
Sebastian Giovinco (Italian on the NT, a long-time Juventus player, played at Toronto and currently in Saudi Arabia) - he's a tall guy at 5'3" :)
Michael Barrios (Colombian at FC Dallas) - another 5'2" guy, about 130 lbs
Maxi Moralez (Argentinian assist machine occasionally on the NT and currently at NYC) - the call him Maxi because he's HUGE at 5'3" and 115-120 lbs
Wayne Rooney (English NT player and a long-time fixture at Man U, currently at DC United and going back to England at the end of the MLS season to be a player-coach at Derby County) - Rooney is 5'9" but he is a bulldog and a bit heavier than these other guys. He's hardly fast, though

I think I've made my point. These guys are all technically proficient guys that don't fit your "ideal" of big and fast.

What probably is going on, Sportsjock, is that you have a son that you deem to be "athletic" because he's probably big for his age and you probably think that he's fast. However, he is not technically proficient. He tried out for one of the FCC Academy teams but he didn't make it because he's not good enough. This more than likely explains your bitterness.

Yes...fully funded...for a bunch of mostly rich caucasian kids lol...I HAVE seen 2 DA's play...2 boys and one girl's teams ...
Also, I'll address this comment.

I happen to know a few of the families of the FCC players. They probably wish that they were "rich." You have no basis for that comment. As to your "Caucasian" comment; it's so racist that I won't even go there.

I won't get into the argument that inner-city kids are underprivileged and are not served and don't get good opportunities to play. It's a drum that I have beaten in the past. Come up with a solution for it, or produce some meaningful dialogue, but in the meantime don't insinuate that the Academy players are all from "rich" families or spoiled.
 
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PS....I am in my 50’s and have been around the game for a LONG time...I still have my original Cosmos and Tampa Rowdies jerseys from when I was a kid...and remember when the only time I could watch futbol was the occasional Wide World of Sports and the PBS series “Soccer Made in Germany
Not sure what this has to do with anything? Unless you believe in being an ageist. Just because you are a certain age doesn't mean you actually know what's going on.
 
Yes, guys around Messi's size are normal in the European leagues and the MLS. Sure, perhaps some are a little taller but they're not "big" guys. The big guys that you speak of are the anomalies.

I addressed your nonsensical comments earlier in the thread when you stated this: "Buckeye, MRL, ODP and it was mostly small, marginally athletic kids playing a very "unphysical" game." As I stated at that time and I'll state again, you're probably a parent that thinks the best form of soccer is to have minimal passing in the midfield and have the defenders boot the ball up to the big, "athletic", and fast forward. You like a lot of physical play in games and favor it over a more technical affair. That kind of soccer might win lower-level games and recreational games but it isn't going to win at higher levels. I found it funny that you brought up Steve Nash, a fantastic basketball player that is also a decent soccer player, as an example of an athlete that spurned soccer for a different sport. I assumed that you pointed Nash out because you felt that he matched your "prototype" ideal of an athletic person. While Nash is fairly tall at 6'3", he is hardly a big guy at 170-180. Additionally, Nash is not particularly fast. He was such a good basketball player because he has insane technical skill and worked his off to get where he is. That is akin to many of the world's best soccer players.

When I addressed your comments I also pointed out some of the world's best futbolers that are small guys. I'll list out a few other than Messi. These guys play in Europe and the MLS. BTW, there is absolutely no comparison between the level of soccer played in the MLS vs the European leagues. These guys I'm listing are just random guys that popped into my head. There are many other examples of small guys.

Marco Reus (German that plays for Dortmund and the German NT) - 5'11" but probably around 160 lbs
Xavi (Retired Spaniard that was a longtime fixture for Barcelona and the Spanish NT) - 5'7", 140 to 150
Neymar (Brazilian on the NT and previously played at Barca and is now at PSG) - 5'7", 140s
Luka Modric (Croatian on the NT and currently at Real Madrid. Many think the best central mid in the game) - 5'7", 140s
Philippe Coutinho (Brazilian on the NT, previously at Liverpool and now at Bayern) - 5'8", 150s
Franck Ribery (French on the NT, a long time Bayern player and now at Serie A side Fiorentina) - 5'7", 150ish
Mesut Ozil (German on the NT and a long-time Bundesliga, Real Madrid, and Arsenal player) - he's around 6' but is probably 150 lbs at most
Christian Pulisic (the "Great Statesian Hope" on the NT, previously at Dortmund and now at Chelsea) - Pulisic is 5'7" or 8" and a huge 135 lbs
Dani Alves (one of my all-time faves, capt of Brazilian NT with a long Euro career at Barca, Juventus, and PSG. Now plays professionally in Brazil) - 5'8", 150-160
Josef Martinez (Venezuelan goal scoring machine on the NT and currently at Atlanta FC. Good enough to play in Europe) - 5'7", 150ish
Sebastian Giovinco (Italian on the NT, a long-time Juventus player, played at Toronto and currently in Saudi Arabia) - he's a tall guy at 5'3" :)
Michael Barrios (Colombian at FC Dallas) - another 5'2" guy, about 130 lbs
Maxi Moralez (Argentinian assist machine occasionally on the NT and currently at NYC) - the call him Maxi because he's HUGE at 5'3" and 115-120 lbs
Wayne Rooney (English NT player and a long-time fixture at Man U, currently at DC United and going back to England at the end of the MLS season to be a player-coach at Derby County) - Rooney is 5'9" but he is a bulldog and a bit heavier than these other guys. He's hardly fast, though

I think I've made my point. These guys are all technically proficient guys that don't fit your "ideal" of big and fast.

What probably is going on, Sportsjock, is that you have a son that you deem to be "athletic" because he's probably big for his age and you probably think that he's fast. However, he is not technically proficient. He tried out for one of the FCC Academy teams but he didn't make it because he's not good enough. This more than likely explains your bitterness.



Also, I'll address this comment.

I happen to know a few of the families of the FCC players. They probably wish that they were "rich." You have no basis for that comment. As to your "Caucasian" comment; it's so racist that I won't even go there.

I won't get into the argument that inner-city kids are underprivileged and are not served and don't get good opportunities to play. It's a drum that I have beaten in the past. Come up with a solution for it, or produce some meaningful dialogue, but in the meantime don't insinuate that the Academy players are all from "rich" families or spoiled.
Don’t forget my favorite player of all time - Andres Iniesta. He’s listed at 5’7”, 140 lbs, which is a stretch.
 

Rohbino

Well-known member
Don’t forget my favorite player of all time - Andres Iniesta. He’s listed at 5’7”, 140 lbs, which is a stretch.
Iniesta was a good one. At 35 he's still playing in the Japanese premier league, J1. The mention of Iniesta further bolsters the point I was trying to make with Sports Jock. He was with Barcelona in their academy from the time he was around 12 years old until just last year.

That 2008-2009 Barcelona team is still one of my all-time favorites. They won LaLiga, the Copa del Rey, and the Champions League and they were absolutely loaded: Xavi, Messi, Iniesta, Pique, Puyol, Thierry Henry, Dani Alves,..... They were truly special.
 
Iniesta was a good one. At 35 he's still playing in the Japanese premier league, J1. The mention of Iniesta further bolsters the point I was trying to make with Sports Jock. He was with Barcelona in their academy from the time he was around 12 years old until just last year.

That 2008-2009 Barcelona team is still one of my all-time favorites. They won LaLiga, the Copa del Rey, and the Champions League and they were absolutely loaded: Xavi, Messi, Iniesta, Pique, Puyol, Thierry Henry, Dani Alves,..... They were truly special.
And, obviously the most athletic in all of Spain. They would have beat any Spanish basketball team.🙃
 

Philly_Cat

Active member
Also, I'll address this comment.

I happen to know a few of the families of the FCC players. They probably wish that they were "rich." You have no basis for that comment. As to your "Caucasian" comment; it's so racist that I won't even go there.

I won't get into the argument that inner-city kids are underprivileged and are not served and don't get good opportunities to play. It's a drum that I have beaten in the past. Come up with a solution for it, or produce some meaningful dialogue, but in the meantime don't insinuate that the Academy players are all from "rich" families or spoiled.
I didn't even understand his comment about it being a bunch of rich families, let alone white. If the team is fully funded that removes the barrier of money, opening it up to anyone with skill to have an opportunity. I too know many of the families playing at the FCC academy, and saying they are all rich is a misstatement.

I will argue that because of the money barriers at the younger ages you do have many underprivileged kids never making it to the high school age and still playing soccer, or if they do, they lack the talent or soccer IQ to compete for a DA spot because they were shut out of training and opportunities prior. But that's a separate discussion from the DA. They aren't, and frankly cant be, the answer to all things wrong in US soccer. You cant knock them for trying to do their part to make it better though.
 
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