'Everybody benefits': Loveland teacher pushes for track and field expansion

[psycho_dad]

The question is, how many teams are not full at the Districts and does it make a difference? How many teams are we away from automatically having a 4th division? Is this something that the OATCCC should know? Is the OHSAA going to make a 4th division even if we hit the "Magic Number"?

What resources are needed at a CCS school to be able to get more than 4 kids out? How is it that a middle of the road D2 school can get 50 kids out and a CCS school has 4? How is it that a D3 school can field teams, but a CCS school can't? Can our coaches association be doing something to help? You would think the kids would be starving for something to do. Not to pick on CCS, but do we need to have youth programs? Are there good youth programs and it's not translating to HS numbers? How do some places do it and others don't? Running, Jumping and Throwing. How is it so hard to get kids interested in that?

Is there a way to look at an Akron North, Max Hayes etc.. and drop them a division and have more D2 schools than D1? Should economics and lack of facilities be considered? How do we help those schools, those coaches and those kids?

 

[CC Track Fan]

How many teams are we away from automatically having a 4th division? Is this something that the OATCCC should know? Is the OHSAA going to make a 4th division even if we hit the "Magic Number"?

Based on last count 69. I always heard it was over 750 teams needed for 4th division and last count was 682.

 

[CC Track Fan]

Based on last count 69 for boys. I always heard it was over 750 teams needed for 4th division and last count was 682. Girls much further away with only 629 teams.

 

[Newton's Third]

Based on last count 69. I always heard it was over 750 teams needed for 4th division and last count was 682.

I am echoing what any coach or track and field fan knows, but that magic number was not used for lacrosse and situations in other sports. While it is a guide, I am not sure it is not ignored if the wheel squeaks loud enough. Are the track and cross-country people being too passive? Too aggressive? Maybe a collective campaign to get OHSAA swamped with communications from coaches, ADs, principals, and superintendents could be considered. There are many states with half the population of Ohio with more divisions in track and cross-country.

 

[mathking]

The question is, how many teams are not full at the Districts and does it make a difference? How many teams are we away from automatically having a 4th division? Is this something that the OATCCC should know? Is the OHSAA going to make a 4th division even if we hit the "Magic Number"?

What resources are needed at a CCS school to be able to get more than 4 kids out? How is it that a middle of the road D2 school can get 50 kids out and a CCS school has 4? How is it that a D3 school can field teams, but a CCS school can't? Can our coaches association be doing something to help? You would think the kids would be starving for something to do. Not to pick on CCS, but do we need to have youth programs? Are there good youth programs and it's not translating to HS numbers? How do some places do it and others don't? Running, Jumping and Throwing. How is it so hard to get kids interested in that?

Is there a way to look at an Akron North, Max Hayes etc.. and drop them a division and have more D2 schools than D1? Should economics and lack of facilities be considered? How do we help those schools, those coaches and those kids?

The resource question largely means activity buses or other transport. When my son was in middle school several of his friends were on the TF team with him. But most of them opted not to in high school. I regularly gave a couple of kids rides home after HS practice because they otherwise faced 90 or more minute trips via COTA buses.

Most of the schools in Columbus have fairly typical track team sizes. Some are smaller and some are larger, but they are not abnormally small. But some of the smaller ones (my son was at one of the smallest) also draw kids from all over the city. That makes for a lot of trouble with transportation. Coupled with the number kids who need to work and/or take care of younger siblings so their parents can work, it makes for a challenging environment. But again, most of the CCS schools have 9+ kids.

For TF, the much bigger problem is the number of small (often new charter) schools that don’t get 9 kids out regularly.

 

[psycho_dad]

The resource question largely means activity buses or other transport. When my son was in middle school several of his friends were on the TF team with him. But most of them opted not to in high school. I regularly gave a couple of kids rides home after HS practice because they otherwise faced 90 or more minute trips via COTA buses.

Most of the schools in Columbus have fairly typical track team sizes. Some are smaller and some are larger, but they are not abnormally small. But some of the smaller ones (my son was at one of the smallest) also draw kids from all over the city. That makes for a lot of trouble with transportation. Coupled with the number kids who need to work and/or take care of younger siblings so their parents can work, it makes for a challenging environment. But again, most of the CCS schools have 9+ kids.

For TF, the much bigger problem is the number of small (often new charter) schools that don’t get 9 kids out regularly.

Yeah, I coached CC in Cleveland and it was the same thing. over an hour to get home and good luck with the kids showing on Saturday.

We have activity buses and that does help.

 

[CC Track Fan]

I am echoing what any coach or track and field fan knows, but that magic number was not used for lacrosse and situations in other sports. While it is a guide, I am not sure it is not ignored if the wheel squeaks loud enough. Are the track and cross-country people being too passive? Too aggressive? Maybe a collective campaign to get OHSAA swamped with communications from coaches, ADs, principals, and superintendents could be considered. There are many states with half the population of Ohio with more divisions in track and cross-country.

I agree it is just a guideline. But I don't think they have ever added a 4th division without the 750 but certainly have added a 2 second division before 250 and a 3rd division before 500. I agree a 4th division should happen for track and small chance it will. But for CC with the drop of teams from 599 to 563 for boys and 506 to 472 for girls in last 5+ years there is no chance CC adding a 4th division. Girls going to 2 divisions is more likely not that I think that will happen either.

 

[psycho_dad]

I agree it is just a guideline. But I don't think they have ever added a 4th division without the 750 but certainly have added a 2 second division before 250 and a 3rd division before 500. I agree a 4th division should happen for track and small chance it will. But for CC with the drop of teams from 599 to 563 for boys and 506 to 472 for girls in last 5+ years there is no chance CC adding a 4th division. Girls going to 2 divisions is more likely not that I think that will happen either.

Why the drop in teams? It seems more and more kids are participating and meets are bigger and bigger.

So, my two cents and it's all anecdotal evidence. The meets are too big and the same teams and schools are having all the success. Parents and kids I've talked to from schools other than my own are sort of tired of not having any success. All they go to are big meets and all they do is finish average or below. I went to an invite at the Akron U course out in Wadsworth a few years back. It was small and it was nice because the kids in the race sort of knew where they were and parents could sort of see how they were doing and could half keep track of teams. I am very good at watching a race like Boardman and stripping away the teams that aren't in contention and having a good idea what is going on. I've been doing it my entire life and have over 50 years experience. My wife is amazed, but she won't go to meets because she can't follow them. It's just kids running to her. To the average fan, it's an individual sport and after the 10th place kids comes through, who cares about the 100 or more behind that. Average fan can't tell you who the top 5 teams are. They typically leave and never even find out which teams won. Who cares.

I think coaches should try and find some smaller meets or even have some dual meets or host a 5 team meet so that the race and the team places matter. Who goes to another sporting event and could care less who wins or loses? 90% of the teams will never be in a position to be in contention in the big meets. Riding a bus all day with your friends is only fun to a point. Does anyone care about the teams other than first or 2nd place?

It's all about team to me. I know that I might be in the minority, but I really think it's a great thing to finish high in the team standings in your conference. I think mixing in some small meets for a lot of schools would be better for them and be more interesting to kids and parents.

 

[yj_runfan]

Every time a school levy fails the district usually raises activity fees. Kids are then forced to choose one sport to participate in and track takes a hit.