Dublin Coffman 2019

Harrycrane

Well-known member
Thanks, I hope not I want you guys to win the ballgame and finish tings off next week . I really thought you would be in this position . Trotty is tough , but I think you can win the game if you play clean and make a few plays in the passing game . Good luck and enjoy the rest of your holiday.
 

Pickeringtonsports

Active member
I assume you are a Pick C homer? OK then ,. are you telling me none of your players have ever had any 'ISSUES" and later played ? Seriously get off your high horse here . I know better
Then you know better than me. I can think of one player that got in trouble the summer before his senior year and then got back on the field in game 5. Maybe there are more that I don’t know about though. I don’t get in other peoples business so there most certainly are issues that I am not aware of. All of the issues that I do know about, the player rarely got any playing time. Most of them end up sitting in the student section. I hope that if a player doesn’t participate in pre season scrimmage games and/or doesn’t practice, they don’t get in the game on Friday with a few exceptions for excused absences or if the coach holds them out. If you let one player get by with that nonsense, eventually as a coach you will lose your team.
If what the Orrville people said turns out to be true, the coach has a hard decision to make. If it were me, I would pass and stick with the players that have developed in my program. I have never been in favor of transfers coming in and starting from day one. But in this case, it would be hard to keep him off the field. Lastly, I want to be very clear that I don’t know this player, never even heard of him and have no idea if any of this is true. I am speaking 100% hypothetically.
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
Then you know better than me. I can think of one player that got in trouble the summer before his senior year and then got back on the field in game 5. Maybe there are more that I don’t know about though. I don’t get in other peoples business so there most certainly are issues that I am not aware of. All of the issues that I do know about, the player rarely got any playing time. Most of them end up sitting in the student section. I hope that if a player doesn’t participate in pre season scrimmage games and/or doesn’t practice, they don’t get in the game on Friday with a few exceptions for excused absences or if the coach holds them out. If you let one player get by with that nonsense, eventually as a coach you will lose your team.
If what the Orrville people said turns out to be true, the coach has a hard decision to make. If it were me, I would pass and stick with the players that have developed in my program. I have never been in favor of transfers coming in and starting from day one. But in this case, it would be hard to keep him off the field. Lastly, I want to be very clear that I don’t know this player, never even heard of him and have no idea if any of this is true. I am speaking 100% hypothetically.

I'm with you on most of the post , I also only know the kid from film and stats he is really good not sure what will happen here. , good luck tomorrow , PC always represents well win or lose . Mentor is a great team and it will take a great effort to win . I'll be watching on TV . Enjoy the rest of your holiday , dessert on tap in about 45 minutes along with the belt loosened .
 
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Raylan_Givens

Active member
Watched Parks the last few years and will say that if he ends up at DC, y'all will love him. Great talent & even better competitor. I'm sure they'll be some saltiness coming out of Orrville, but no one could say that he didn't give them his all. (Heck, I'm a bit salty too, but that's just because won't be able to watch him again until DC makes it to Canton.)
As for the "law" stuff, remember everything said on here is rumor. Kids a minor so very few folks actually "know" what happened. Had the incident last year happened somewhere other than "holier than thou" Wayne Co I get the feeling it would have played out completely different.

Happy Thanksgiving to all.
 

OrrvilleRR

Active member
'May be open to a player with issues"? 'players were allowed to play only if thy felt like it"? You know the issues and the Coffman's coach attitude or thoughts how? First off the coach hasn't and doesn't just let kids 'Sit out" . A High school football coach cannot make a kid play who says he's hurting. That was an issue with ONE kid , not multiple and again coach certainly wasn't down with it. I assume you are a Pick C homer? OK then ,. are you telling me none of your players have ever had any 'ISSUES" and later played ? Seriously get off your high horse here . I know better .

Yes I realize that a scout can't go there in that vane but I was just pointing out that he thought he was a high character kid and I would think if he was as bad as some Orville people seem to think NOW that he is gone he would be less enthusiastic in that piece. Do you think coaches can make a player play who says he's hurt even if he thinks is being a bit soft? I wrote that the coach went on the radio and made the statement that he wasn't down with player{s} " sitting out when not injured but merely sore " Mind over matter stuff . Past behavior and issues should exclude a kid for life from participating? That's a tricky one , but I will take that Orrvill homer's take on the matter with a big grain of salt. He and others may be 'Salty " that the kid is leaving and are throwing shade now that he is gone . Enjoy your Holiday and good luck Friday , Tigers have a good chance at victory I think .
Good luck in 2020. I wish your team the best.
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
Week 14 Cont.

Mentor vs. Pickerington Central - LP line Mentor - 19 Cal Preps - 19

Yes both odds houses see the game the same way . I don't. I see Mentor as the best team left and certainly can win here and if there is a larger margin in this game the odds are heavy that it would be Mentor winning in that vane.

2017 game is brought up a lot , but it's relevance to me is minimal. 2017 PC team was better than this edition , and this Mentor edition is better than the 2017 club. That is why this line is at the number it is . I think it to be too heavy myself but I see where the line comes from . Mentor has been crushing teams and has beaten the two Catholic powers a total of three times. Some say and there is some evidence to support it that Iggy isn't quite the power it once was. I see the term 'hockey and Lacrosse school, Golf , soccer , you know the less manly activities. In Ohio you can suk at many things and your girls teams can be beyond bad but if your football team is a consistent kicker? You get respect . Iggy and Ed's don't have girls.


PC is an athletic powerhouse in many sports , proudly they aren't that good in Lacrosse Tennis and don't have hockey , but they are great at football and hoops and that carries a certain cache. Sr. QB is back and he was basically unstoppable two years ago . I don't see a big leap in his game from then to now. He does throw a bit better and is more patient? Big kid who is thick , probably thick out of the womb . Early developer? Has he peaked a bit? HMMM. O-Line is not as nasty as has been pointed out numerous times . They are coached the same and as well but don't have that attitude that they want to eviscerate you along the line. The couple who do may not be physically capable? Defensive front should be the main challenge for Mentor who is good on the O-line but not dominant , not the pancakes you saw at times with the bigger D-1 kids they had the last couple years.

PC defense is fast but not dominant against this class of offense. They really didn't face an offense that plays at this pace with the skill kids and the schemes that Mentor has so obviously this is the biggest challenge. Naperville Central was a 500 team but had the QB and the athletes but couldn't stop anyone { 20 point win } . Winter Park was a good test as well as they stayed with the Tigers for a while losing by 13 . Columbus East was the closest of the out of staters losing 20-14 to PC.

At the moment Pasteur has PC rated slightly above Euclid . WRONG , PC would grind down Euclid and may be not win 45-0 but they aren't two points better than Euclid either.. I think the league Mentor plays in wasn't as strong this year lending itself to huge margins. Solid loop and pretty good talent but not some meat grinder either. Mentor has had the best public school program to never win a title and with their coach exiting stage left after the last game this season , The Cards want to send him out with a bang and a Ring . Guy built a great program and whether he wins a title or not won't change the fact that he is a great coach .

Mentor wants to get PC on it's heels with an up tempo attack with a very solid QB with D-1 talent who can also run the ball , Floreia is a hiccupitty quick tough athlete who just makes plays . Going to BC where he will play and prosper. Trobel is an undersized likewise quick fast twitch guy who can burst out of the pack and make things happen.

Very well coached , efficient and may be the best all around defense they have had. This doesn't mean that PC won't move the ball at all because Mentor is not exactly known as a defensive wrecking crew. PC will go with Mosely as much as he keeps grinding out yardage , he is a very good back who is tough and runs hard but also has some wheels . Crenshaw will lean , twist and churn as he does and the X Factor to me is Styles Jr. who is a game breaker if he gets the opportunity's . In fact I would probably play him over top of Floriea and that match-up would be worth the price of admission . Pound pound , take a shot for PC, sustained up tempo attack with trying to dent the defense and drain them mentally as much as physically for Mentor?


PC wants a street fight and wants to lower the arms with body blows up front, Mentor wants a boxing match and a more scientific approach with some sweetness and finesse mixed in . Great match-up of styles which we know makes fights.

PC will represent well, physically more gifted perhaps but there is just something about Mentor this year . A kind of destiny , a higher purpose? A culmination of a man's life work being rewarded with the highest prize in his sport ? An Ohio State high school championship is a damn good accomplishment in most sports , great competition , numbers and talent. But in football it's a bit more special because this is a football state , and the attention to it and the coaching levels and players dedication to it makes it so competitive and tough to win five games in a row vs the kind of folks you will see.

Mentor High School and coach Triv won't win that elusive state title tonight with a victory, but they take a very large step in the direction of it and the smell of it will be wafting around the field and in their busses home after the win tonight .


Mentor 31 PC 21
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
Week 14 cont.

Massillon vs Avon - LP line Mass - 6 CP - 15

Big difference and I side with the CP line here. Massillon at a different level in this one , and unless they lay the ball the ball on the ground a handful of times they should win comfortably. Game played at a different speed and talent level will overwhelm Avon at some point .

Massillon 31 Avon 16

TCC vs. LaSalle - LP Line TCC - 1 CP Line LaSalle - 9


Again the CP line is tighter here and I agree with it , LaSalle is marginally better and has played a bit tougher schedule overall and that will serve the well when the crap hits the fan tonight .


LaSalle 27 TCC 20


Good luck to all teams and safe travels and good health .
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
And there were two . In each division that is. Soaked up some of the commentary of the winners and the losers. Watched the excellent competitive heavyweight tilt between Mentor and Pick C. on TV . Thought here was 'something " about Mentor this year with their team mostly healthy , their momentum and the way they were absolutely blitzkrieging teams if you will.

Watching them in a game in real time play for play it was apparent they are worthy of a state title . I thought they would win the ballgame by about 7-10 scoring 31 points . They got to 21 but gave up 28 . A few plays here and a few plays there? Like many games between fairly even teams it often comes down to a few plays. A bad call , an unfortunate happening or a momentary blip in judgment . These are teenage kids after all.

We all agree that the19 point spread that BOTH Louie P and Cal preps offered was ridiculous. The real number based on all the evidence was probably about 7- 8 and a half if offered by a real Bookmaker. A lot is always made about Mentor scheduling the nearby Catholic Powers Iggy and Ed's . Props to them for playing them and beating them a decent percentage of the time .

The problem may be WHEN they play them though. Weeks one and two gives you an immediate sense of who you are and where you are in reference to other great programs who can match your prowess but from weeks 3 - 10 the competition seems to wane , ebb and flow unsteadily. This year they basically had little to no competition within their league. That isn't the case every year but this year anyway the challengers were not as strong. Cruise control .

The notion that PC's league ledger was weaker in comparison or the misguided notion that circa 2019 that NEO public school football is a good heaping superior to Central Ohio Public schools is specious. PC had more competitive games and lesser margins of victory and it wasn't as we found out because they were inferior to Mentor who was running roughshod through their league .

PC had a 20-14 First round win vs Reynoldsburg . They lost to a program{ Groveport } that hadn't MADE the play-offs since 2007 and hadn't beaten a team with a wining record in about a decade and was 0-10 in 2017 which was snarkily pointed out by the " want to win the game before the game starts crew. I saw posters whine that Mentor has to play the Cleveland Catholics and should have bene able to slaughter the R-2 team and that some conspiracy was probably at work . Good grief . I saw someone opine that the R-4 region winner would " MURDER" the R-2 winner . WRONG . Elder if not for Springfield fumbling deep in their territory and not getting that onside kick just may be watching Springfield play PC this weekend . They played with them very well on pretty even terms just as Coffman with their better defense than Elder would have also .

Of course I realize that PC is a tougher opponent than Springfield might have been because of their ridiculous defensive front talent. But this notion that people care that much about Mentor not getting a title so they conspired to do things to lessen the chance is absurd. Since when was it ordained that for ever and ever that the same regions always have to play each other into infinity in a state semi final? May be the players took your cues and became intimidated and afraid of Pick C . Yeah as 19 point Favs. I didn't see that , the players played hard and well at times against a very good talented football team and did I say had a ridiculous defensive front?

I guess the High school 'Deep state " was also enlisted to call that holding penalty on a scoring play . Sheet Happens . TD'S get called back on motion penalty's that have nothing to do with the play and on holding penalty's that have zero affect on a play on the other side of the field and often are phantom calls . Suks . There is no doubt that officiating is getting worse because of the lack of people who actually want to do it anymore and a part of the reason why is the crap that they get on a consistent basis. I have seen multiple TD'S called back by horse crap calls , ridiculous Pass Interference penalty's that greatly alter games . Memo to refs, this isn't basketball , if the defender makes contact with the receiver as the ball arrives it isn't a penalty , it isn't an over the back hoops infraction , CONTACT is allowed in football . I agreed with the refs picking up that flag on the PC defender . I wish they had in the Coffman -Springfield game the week before which greatly helped them with their only TD drive.

Was the ball caught by the PC Linebacker on the tipped ball? If I had to guess after looking at it a few times on replay? Probably not . I am for replay , may be not in every round but at least the Semi Final and the final . Pretty easy to implement. I was a bit conflicted in who I was rooting for in this one quite frankly . I am a Central Ohio fan of course and I have seen the region take big strides in how competitive it has become and the improvements that have taken place despite the various 'School splits" that happen here on a much greater basis than other areas .

I was rooting for PC on that level and to show others that CO football is very good and has improved but wanted the coach of Mentor to win a title. Not to validate that he is a great coach but to experience that ultimate victory at the school and community that he is from and has worked
so hard for. Very disappointing to see the backlash against the coach from 'some " posters and fans of the program . Yes the program would be so much better off with someone else other than the well ahh ummmm 'The guy who freaking built it ? Are coaches capable of just snapping their fingers and building a kicking defense ? Has he had the type of body's and athletes on a consistent basis that maybe a Pick C or Wayne has had to name just two Publics? This notion that he has lost too many times to other publics as if they should never commit that mortal sin. We play the two nearby Catholics after all , and sometimes beat them , why should we accept losing to other mere Publics?

Would he be a better coach if Davidson missed that two point conversion in 2006 ? What was the other transgression ? Losing to Whitmer with a really good QB and talented skill kids and a really solid program? The horror . May be the skill sets and demo's your program has had present lends itself to more of an offensive team that has a system that is tough to stop and may be not blessed with what say a PC has on that side of the ball? Bashing the coach and opining that may be 'next year" now that this guy is gone will be the year that they get over the hump because your feelings are hurt because you and the great fans haven't experienced a state title from your local program is a bad look .

You act as if the man has only been a bane on the quest to become the D- 1 state football champs of Ohio. So I guess he and his staff and the program in general has had nothing to do with developing the players themselves and the head guy has been a liability ? Emotion clouds the judgment as we all know or may be we don't because what I have seen and read is pretty disappointing.
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
15 weeks is a long season. When you count 7 on 7 , off season team workouts, camp dates , personal workouts and then training camp and scrimmages it becomes more a case of persevering and finishing a long journey and having enough gas in the tank to do so. Handicapping football is an exercise that like any other task involves some basic fundamentals.

One of them is taking close looks at how much gas is in the tank , how much physical and mental energy a team has going into s certain match-up . A good example of this was a few weeks ago when Indiana hosted Michigan and was getting 9 and a half points. Some if not many thought " Hmm that looks ripe , Michigan will be may be looking ahead to Ohio State and play just to get the win? Indiana they thought to themselves are 4-1 last five and played Penn State to the wire losing late by a TD on the road getting 15 , so getting 9.5 at home against a team Penn State's equal should be a good spot for them to play well again and take it to the wire ?

Not so fast . A fundamental of handicapping that I learned a long time ago was really delving into the possible situational problems and issues a team may have in a match-up that might increase the odds of cashing the ticket. One fundamental inside the fundamentals is playing on a team that played full out emptied the bucket for the full 60 and lost a close one to a superior foe. That team often expended every bit of energy fighting , scratching and clawing against a stronger team just missing the win so what would you think their mental and physical state may be their very next week?

I had a few guys I commiserate with bring this game up and thought there may be value on the Hoosiers getting those points seeing as Michigan had Ohio State up next. Well I said Indiana was immediately taken off my board as a possible play because of the fact that they were hot, really geared up and hyped to play Penn State , played well and lost a tough one and were in it for the full 60 . I didn't think they had much left emotionally and or physically to fight another opponent that was better than they were even at home and getting 9and a half .


Michigan was too hot and even with the obvious look ahead situation present had a lot of energy and gas left and knew they needed to keep the momentum and win to make the Ohio State game actually mean something . Now I wouldn't always play the team that is playing the club I took off the board as unbettable like I did with Indiana , but in this case I did take Michigan and cashed that ticket as they won easily . I kept a couple people off of that game but not Colin Cowherd who I texted after he used Indiana on his show as one of his three college plays . He's been really cold lately and had a bad college year , I did say that I that he probably will lose that one . He's had good years and does some homework but in that case he forgot one of the 'Fundamentals " and it cost him .


This week looking a the games this type of thought process is involved to an extant as well. Not all people age the same way and not al football teams go through the football season with equal health energy and gas supply . Some took harder roads, some were involved in a holy war type game or even two, and some have bene more fortunate with health and a less rocky road or path to Canton . No lookaheads of course in the play-offs, or the same situational dynamics as there are in the regular season but some team may be fresher and healthier and have more mental energy as well .


71-41 vs. the Pasteur number after week 4 and 83-56 overall with the first three weeks using the Cal Preps line. Not bad , I always think around 60 percent is where I should be doing this at the HS level { NFL is going well at just under but rounded off to 58 percent , and CFB at 56.8 percent rounded off to 57 is also solid} . I have been at about 63 percent going against the LP Line , and 60 overall . Some weaker numbers along side some strong ones .


Elder - 2 PC - CP 34-27 Elder - Should be very interesting actually. Elder has some athletes on offense and a good scheme , not as athletic on offense as PC but they do have one thing that could negate a major strength of the Tigers. A really good D-Line going against a really big and talented Elder line will be worth the price of admission . Leaning Tigers but still looking.

Massillon - 5 LaSalle -- CP 27-21 Massillon - I really like Massillons chances of getting that title on the field after many AP and UPI titles ? Don't mistake those titles for the notion that during that time of no play-offs that if contested on the field at that time that the Tigers wouldn't have multiple titles. THEY WOULD HAVE.

Trotty W - 5 Mansfield - CP 26-19 Trotty - How much does Mansfield have ? Great story but does the clock strike midnight for a more Cinderella team?

Will look at and predict all seven , don't know much about some of the smaller schools but will take a stab.
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
Week 15

Off a 5-0 week vs. the number , I really like a couple of these games vs a couple weak numbers . Some very interesting match-ups to be sure . True Heavyweight battles like PC-Elder , Massillon- LaSalle , A couple 'Old Guards" vs newer bloods Trotty Mad vs. Mansfield , and Marion Local vs Lucas .


Ironton and Kirtland is very interesting in it's potential to be a slobberknocker squared. Teams appear to be poised to attempt to Bludgeon each other with the winner may be the first one to get up after a simultaneous knockdown ala Rocky vs Apollo Creed part two ?

Anna appears along side their MAC brother ML to be large favorites . SHOCKER !!. Anna - NMS has the largest disparity between the Pasteur number and Cal Preps line. { LP - 6 , CP - 19} Clyde and Licking Valley is interesting in it being an undefeated team vs a 4 loss team who is moving DOWN a division and it's strength of schedule probably being the reason they are here.


Plan on summarizing the Coffman season , the Seniors who are departing and the prospects for next year after this weekend when the 2019 season is officially done. There isn't a lot of responses on this thread generally and that's fine because I write it in part for long time original Rocks fans who live out the area and still check in on their old hometown and school and though they rarely respond , I know you are out there and like to follow what's going on . No strain for me being a fan and a community member and loving the game of football at all levels . But for now it's championship week and as I mentioned there are some very interesting games in the next few days.
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
Week 15 Cont.

Massillon -5 VS. LaSalle - Cal Preps - Mass 27-21

Massillon Washington sounds like Ohio pigskin royalty, , you think whiskey bottles brand new cars , Oh that's Skynard , Southern Rock royalty. Oops . sorry. It's more Wheaties boxes , brand new inside facility's . Paul Brown , Chris Spielman , and oh yes Wheaties boxes and paper titles. Of course if play-offs existed a couple generations before they did ? Old Dudes who will be in the stadium tomorrow would be reminiscing about the big block they threw to win that title on the last drive or the heroic comeback to steal that title from Warren Harding or another poor school who was in the long list of teams to succumb to the great power that was us, The Massillon Tigers.

Tradition is something that is earned by long stretches of excellence , by ground breaking coaches and schemes . Or by in the words of the immortal cat with nine lives Charlie Sheen , 'WINNING ". The old dudes and there are a lot of them still loyal to the cause will have to settle for just knowing they were something special instead of a piece of hardware exclaiming it or proving it beyond all doubt. I didn't grow up in Ohio but damn I remember hearing about the Massillon's the Moeller's and the legends of Texas like Odessa Permian , and Plano . Dynasty's inspire awe and mystique, what is it they know that the rest of us don't in terms of being able to win year after year and being known in far away places?

Not sure of the knowledge of their history these boys on the 2019 team possess, but they will be playing for whether they know it or not the pride of a lot of those diehards, former players, coaches and history. They will be trying to validate the existence of the power of past Massillon teams who either couldn't win a title on the field or the ones who probably could have but such a thing didn't exist .

Isn't 'THEIR " time to do this ? It certainly isn't LaSalle's is it? They have been there , done this , Massillon is doing it for generations of their public , may be the most loyal following in the state ? No not may be . Will they feel the burden of being the validators , or will they reach just the right emotional pitch ? A feverish energy of confidence and duty that will propel them to a victory that will never be forgotten in it'[s significance. and importance to this football blue blood ?


The Tigers have the requisite stud QB and audaciously talented receivers that all great programs seem to have when you watch those documentary's of great High school teams , the requisite indoor facility that the community insists on having no matter other budgetary concerns because THIS MATTERS TO US. It's part of who we are and what we think of ourselves . It's our identity. LaSalle is the new money Catholic on the block who has elevated itself to champion status. They also have really talented guys , work real hard at it , have recent but strong tradition . Confidence. They are ranked 5th by Pasteur and Massillon is 3rd so this is a heavyweight bout. Lasalle is tested , they have played the 2nd toughest schedule in all of D-2. Massillon tested itself also by playing the 12th toughest.


Out of state Covington Catholic beat up LS pretty good , well are they really out of state? Some dirty water separates them from us , and a Kentucky side view of the Cincy skyline and a few cool store fronts with the simple words Whiskey and Cigarettes plastered on the front . Former neighbor of mine used to be a sales guy with Northern Kentucky as part of his territory , he would sometimes stroll over to where we were sitting at someone's house outside in good weather and simply say Cigarettes ? I didn't smoke but invariably a person or two would pony up a 20 spot for him to bring back cheaper cigarettes . I always wondered if he got them at one of those Whiskey Cigs stores? Never asked .

Another loss to Winton Woods and close wins vs ST X and Elder more than prepared them for this battle . Massillon had to battle Hoban the D-2 super power with a long winning streak in the play-offs and that is enough to give anyone a boost of confidence isn't it? LaSalle handled Toledo Central Catholic pretty well but they seem just a tad down from what they have been to get here . Massillon had a bit of an easier time perhaps beating a banged up Avon team . Will Massillon have a bit more left here? Will the bigger more fanatical crowd lift them up and help elevate them ? Is it just their time like it was the American's time vs Russia circa 1980 ? Of course an absurd analogy because these clubs are in the same realm , but history will say it's Massillon's time , long overdue. Win one for the old dudes who had to settle for a paper title , or just didn't get it done on the field . I was fortunate to grow up in a sports community with expectations and some history and tradition and some titles I felt that for sure, wanted to maintain , build , be part of it .It wasn't this strong though in his vastness and length and fanaticism .


Massillon will win because they have good enough players and coaches but also because it's just their time to win this sucker and not LaSalle's . Talent tradition a greater purpose and opportunity , along with a loud supportive crowd will propel Massillon to their first on field title in it's storied history and yes the hairs on my arms are at attention as I type this.


Massillon 28 LaSalle 20
 
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Harrycrane

Well-known member
Week 15 Cont.

Cincinnati Elder - 2 vs. Pickerington Central - CP Elder 34-27


The Cal preps score prediction is certainly plausible . Elder can flat score the football to borrow the hoops slang . Probably about 25 years ago I remember the basketball jargon adding 'He or they can really score the ball " and 'He has a lot of 'Upside " potential . Well what else can you score with if not the BALL? And isn't 'Upside and Potential essentially the same thing and redundant " Reminds me of the time my 7th grade history teacher said we were all going to have to get up in front in the class and give and 'oral " talk on the subject matter we were working on . Isn't that redundant " Is there any other way to give a 'Talk " other than Orally?

Anyway Elder is a scoring team, their tempo , their size and talent up front on defense makes it possible for good skill kids to be really good given more time and space as a result of kickers up front . OSU guy James goes about 280 and is about 6-4 ? Louisville commit Kadra is a pretty massive kid himself about the same size as James . Throw in a couple Seniors who are in that 240 -250 range and you have a very powerful unit that really makes a difference , especially in this match-up .

QB Luebbe is a true dual threat as he has thrown for 2000+ and rushed for 1100 . TE Royer is another OSU commit and he goes about 6-5 215-220 . PC is pretty big and talented big up front on the D-Line . This match-up as I have said is the price of admission justification. If you love big tough talented kids going at in the trenches for 48 this is the game for you . No offense to the other match-ups up front but this one is the most intriguing and probably the key to who wins the ballgame.

PC brings it hard in the front seven with DE Hamilton leading the way , a 6-3 255 pound athlete who wreaks havoc and is a true difference maker. Mammoth DT Alibi is 315 and hard to move . Young Soph Doggette going against Seniors may be a math-up to watch . He goes about 6-2 250 , a rather large young puppy. Another youngin is Gillision who mans the outside at DE and is 6-2 230 . These kids against the Elder line will tell us a story here.

PC Linebacker Sr. Marasco who had the big interception last week is a heart and soul player who plays a bit bigger than his listed 5-10 205 { He actually is probably 5-9 tops and when soaked is 196. Jr. Dukes is 5-10 about 200 and change. Talented Secondary with Wr Styles probably playing two ways will be necessary . Elder Soph. Ramsey the coachers son is a key receiver with some speed who missed last weeks game and will be needed to make a few plays .

One common foe Gahanna went in Elder's favor but the 41-6 margin was may be inflated . yardage was plentiful for Gahanna , scoring was scarce, but Elder put a lot of points and yards on the Lions as well. PC scored 49 themselves on the Lions but gave up 28 . most when the game was over. Elder only gave up 6 .


PC offense with Professional HS QB Crenshaw will be a real challenge for Elder to stop. Physical with 200 pound speed guy Mosely , 215 pound Crenshaw running the ball as well with Styles and Smith among other catching passes and trying to match up with a physical PC O-Line while not as big and decorated as the Elder group may have a bigger match-up advantage then the Elder line vs PC defensive front ? A guess of course and we won't know until the game starts , but to me this is a huge key.

PC will attempt to run the clock and sustain longer drives , score TD'S but can kick FG's as well as Kicker Bookman is very solid, get a lead and unleash their defensive front . Mentor was a bit tougher and more physical on defense than I thought they might and PC was also surprised. Can Elder surprise and be better on that side of the ball than most suspect?

Should be a real battle of top units , games within games and adjustments . I like PC by a little here and only getting 2 points means that they pretty much have to win . I would rather be getting the Cal Preps 7 here but i am using Louie's line.

Again like last week when I opined that Styles Jr. may be the X factor and he made that huge big TD play in the pass game , I envision that kind of scenario again , may be on defense this time as well? Hamilton will relish going against this level of O-lineman and he will have to come up big . Very interesting match-up . Have gone back and forth but ? Crenshaw Styles and Hamilton are the X factors here. Elder is more battle tested overall playing the 4th hardest schedule in D-1 whereas PC's was only the 36th or about the median . Still like what I saw vs a great Mentor club and the ultimate team player and winner Crenshaw.


PC 31 Elder 28
 
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Harrycrane

Well-known member
Week 15 Cont.

A 'Good" game last night that really had the potential top be a '" GREAT" game but fizzled into a display of jet sweeps that were never adjusted to or when they were the kids simply couldn't tackle anyone . I was imploring the wide guys to at least make the kid cut back instead of giving the outside when standing flatfooted waiting and then swiping at the shoes that just skirted by them .

Over and over and over again , it never really ceased and you need to give the O-Line of LaSalle credit they continually gave the eel like Houdini Lancer QB just enough room { They are really good at holding I mean REALLY good at it by not extending the arms much hence not being called much at all subtle and nuanced is key and they are masters} . That being said al admiration aside they kicked their butts up front fair and square , just beat them . Their guys were just better than the Tigers on the line of scrimmage .


The other thing was the Tigers ground game was so predictable and mundane that it was fairly easily defended despite really good backs. Keyes had little to on room all night long . The zone read exclusively being your run game only works well when the QB is a very good runner , I had seen this movie with the Coffman offense until this year when they ONLY used the same play zone read scheme when they ran the ball.. This year they ran outside , more jet sweeps , and while it helped to have a stud RB emerge in Threats it would have prospered better the previous few seasons if instituted . UNLESS YOUR QB ACTUALLY SCARES THE DEFENSE AS A RUN THREAT THE ZONE READ ONLY RUN GAME WHEN GOING AGAINST GOOD TOUIGH WELL COACHED DEFESNES WON'T WORK THAT WELL. Massillon I suppose found that out but why limit yourself?


QB has a pretty big arm , had some ridiculous throws , dropped some dimes , had a great look off the safety drop it in the seam long TD pass and a perfect drop in the bucket win a big stuffed Giraffe at the county fair throw at the pylon as well. So Run game lacking and the turnovers were KEY to LaSalle getting a margin . Turnovers are a problem , BUT not getting any yourself is also a problem . I think the game is in the balance in the last 4-5 minutes without the fumbles , and may be this heavyweight tilt becomes more of an instant classic , but make no mistake the better team won the ballgame . Tackling is getting worse at al levels of football , so why are you making it easier by only running between the tackles with a fake zone read with a lesser running threat at QB ? Make kids tackle in space against good athletes and if they can tackle you change course.

Announcers made a great point about the vast cushion the Lancers Db's were giving the talented Tiger receivers. Unfortunately they didn't stay patient and take what was clearly given to them , opting to make longer throws that were more miss than hit in the final analysis . Many teams have problems corralling a slick running QB , and the Tigers were no exception, i am surprised that more drastic adjustments weren't made to almost force Lasalle to beat you in the deep passing game . LaSalle had a better plan , some really good nifty quick fast savvy players to execute it and a good enough offensive line going against this defense to execute it almost perfectly . Bottom line was LaSalle was a bit more patient disciplined , executed better and had better and superior schemes .

They didn't have to tackle in space much , weren't made to pay for laying off receivers , and despite this STILL got beat DEEP a few times which is a testament to Massillon's ability , but while their offense hit a few long tape measure homeruns , they didn't get on base quite enough , left too many guys on base , and had some key errors in the field making it easier for their opponent to score . We all talk about getting the ball to your athletes in space and make the opponent make tackles one on one in space , one team made the other team do that over and over again and the other one didn't . The other difference was one team had a QB that could slice and dice the defense with his feet and a natural ability to make guys miss as if he was Floyd Mayweather using g the shoulder roll on the ropes and only catching glancing blows .

Lastly one play stuck out to me that while real unimportant in the grand scheme summed up a big difference in the game. Massillon finally realizing that this zone read only scheme wasn't really working especially when behind most of the way , tried a swing pass in the flat to Keyes to change things up and make the defense tackle a talented back ion space . Well that's great , except for the fact that they got it out to him with ZERO blockers out there as three LaSalle defenders closed in making the easy stop behind the line of scrimmage . When you are out of answers sometimes you flail . Massillon is the quintessential 'Wait til next year" program where hope is sometimes stronger than reality . I thought this was the year and I suppose it could have been , but the schemes and adjustments along with execution and making a couple more mistakes wouldn't allow it .


Anna - 6 New Middletown Springfield - CP Anna 40-21

Largest difference between all the LP vs. CP lines . 10.00 AM. start , not exactly Friday night lights . Early morning games have that scrimmage feel to them initially no matter how important? Some states play Thanksgiving day games . I have played on Thanksgiving , it's early , it' cold this time of year usually , may be some snow { We were throwing snowballs at each other going out to practice the day before the game one year and I can still hear the burly young assistant to the assistant Defensive Coordinator just out of college bellowing " Hey sheetheads what are you 'STUUUUUUUPPPPID " Cool guy who went on to be a really good wrestling head coach at another school . }

Logistics and schedule makes some play at this early hour as the kids paly may be the most important game of their lives to this point or in many cases the last game THEY EVER put the pads on for. Seems like a class difference. First off Anna is a member of the prestigious MAC, we all know that means that some battles have bene participated in . Anna played the 5th toughest schedule in D-6 whereas NMS played the 48th most arduous slate. In a two month stretch NMS was a mid 20's point favorite on average as they crushed teams with ease.

This isn't to say that Anna didn't crush their fair share of blowout wins , they have ,but it seems to be more of a case of being the real deal and just really good . NMS is a good club obviously also but their schedule and competition was weaker so the large margins were less impressive.

Beating Minster by 26 Archbold by 35 and Coldwater by 40 shows that strength and class difference. Looking at a one point win vs. Trimble is telling to me . Anna probably beat that club by 3-4 scores ? A three point loss to Marion Local is the only blemish and that is less than a small paper cut . Real spread is probably 14-15 points which might make you think for a bit. 6 point Louie Line is a no brainer and if he took action using this number he would eventually have to raise it multiple points creating a 'Middle " type situation that would have him scrambling to Cousin Sal trying to lay off the largesse .


Kick is less than an hour out , kids will be burping their breakfast early , wiping away the last crust of eye crud , and getting that last few yawns out of the way as they play for a state championship .


Anna 38 NMS 20
 
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TigerA

Member
Good luck to the Pickerington Central Tigers , bring the trophy back to CO !!!
Done. Just got home from Canton. What a game. Congrats to Tigers on their 2nd state title in DI in 3 years. 21-14 over Elder. That Luebe kid at QB for Elder is a slippery little SOB. Very tough to get a handle on him running the ball even when everyone in the stadium knew he was going to be keeping it. Good call on Styles in the end making the big play for the winning score Harry! Play of the game though was Crenshaw fending off 3 or 4 defenders on 4th and long play to complete a pass near the end of the 3rd quarter to keep the drive alive that ended up tying up the game at 14 early in the 4th. Absolute beast to try and bring down.
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
Congrats to PC , excellent very competitive battle befitting of a D-1 title game . Styles is just a smooth fast playmaker, if you can get him the ball a handful of times he will make a play or two and he certainly did last night . No substitute for speed, once he caught it went up field and BOOM switched to the next gear it was over . Crenshaw was the other factor that is just a problem for other teams. He is calm , cool , athletic and just makes big plays when needed, that 4th down play was absurd and that play along with Styles turning on the jets ultimately were the difference .

Must be said how huge it was for PC to keep Elder out of the end zone at the end of the half , then the missed FG was just the gravy. Had to feel good about that being tied at that point because Elder was better in the first half . I know Coffman fans myself included had that sick feeling at the half of the Springfield game when the Rocks totally controlled the first half but was up only 3-0 when the score should have been at least 10-0 . Comes b ack to bite you . I was thinking after seeing the first half that overtime might be in the making . Elder had the ball one last tie but the Tigers were up to the task and wrapped the sucker up nicely.

Slippery Qb's seems to be a trend in terms of offensive schemes . Like the Wing T was big , the Veer , Wishbone at the college level , it seems in the last few years or so many successful teams utilize that running QB more , going away from the straight zone read , but incorporating simple QB keepers on sweeps and quasi draws utilizing the kids elusiveness and at times he defense doesn't account as much for the QB .

Obviously to make this modus operandi work really well you need a solid O-line of course but also a few playmakers outside and a good RB to keep the defense pre-occupied. Seen the slight and more obvious changes with Coffman up close and watching the play-offs the majority teams that are prospering and going far have seemed to have that running threat at QB . Not always real fast in every case but athletic tough kids with good feet and an innate ability to get that extra 3-4 yards when needed . Prater , the kid up at Anthony Wayne , LaSalle's QB running I thought was the difference vs Massillon making gains himself and freezing people on jet sweeps with faster ball carriers .

Crenshaw brings a slippery aspect himself but at about 215 pounds it's not enough to catch him cleanly and put a shoulder and hat on him , he is impervious to most hits at this level , you need a host . His ability to keep eyes downfield when harried and in trouble is impressive and improved . and difference making as it turned out. Elder was an impressive team , certainly looked better at times , but the Tigers are champions because they have a really good combination of size in the right places , raw speed , and the can't be overlooked worth ethic in the off-season where the kids get stronger which shows up in the second half , and of course they had the veteran leader who is just a winner who does what's necessary . Any boss in any profession will tell you that finding talented smart workers is key, BUT they also will say they need guys who will do 'What's necessary " to get the job done and ensure a great chance for success.

In many cases the term he's just a 'WINNER " is a way of downplaying some obvious limitations such as too short , average feet , average arm etc. But in a case like Crenshaw I use that term in the He's a winning 'PERSON ", a true leader who others feed off and are better for having him around as their QB , not just a special talent with great moves feet strength or rocket arm .


Two titles in three years of starting ? That's legendary. It can be thought of as an era really . And it's ended exactly like truly great era's end . On top.
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
Week 15 Cont.

Marion Local - 15 Lucas - CP - ML 28-8

Nice article on ML and the community . Being Catholic and a sliver German myself growing up in a overwhelmingly Catholic town I respect the faith aspect . My community was a lot bigger D-1 size but the faith aspect which isn't as universal now where I grew up I love seeing that in the small town dynamic. The bottom line with these true ridiculous dynasty's like this is their absurd work ethic . ML simply outworks folks PERIOD!! You don't do what they do without an incredible attention to work , detail , faith and fanatical community support .

Others in the MAC emulate them , try to be like them , are like them in many respects. I am surprised that ML beat Anna after seeing them on recording and their blowout wins on paper . Some times tings are just MORE important to some and that advantage is huge . Lucas is a fine story , a good football team no doubt but they aren't at this level . Margins of victory overall is too hard to ignore . ML treats this as simply week 15 of their season, old hat , just another morning in the scope of the season. 9th straight final ? Cut the crap.

Game kicks in 15 minutes so need to get the obvious prediction in . 3-1 start to the finals for me which gets us safely above 60 percent overall and even better than that vs the Louie Line which came out in week 4.


I'll watch for a bit as I eat my Oatmeal with some rye toast and two poached eggs washed down with some OJ and tomato juice . may be that rare third cup of coffee rooting for Lucas . Futile I am positive but may be the ball bounces a bit funny , the wind blows in an askew fashion only when ML has the rock, or there is a mysterious illness that sweeps through the ML locker room at the half and they have to forfeit . OR


Marion Local 37 Lucas 13
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
Week 15 cont.

Marion Local is not as dominant at least early on as I thought as they lead 14-0 , BUT they are a very interesting team to watch. Balanced , nuanced , lots of sets, very well coached defense that disguises what they do well , bring selective but timely pressure. Love their balance , did I say that ? I mean a lot of these small town farm communities guys like to take pride in their run only scheme that requires baling hay carrying large buckets of chicken feed in addition to intense work throwing around and pushing metal plates . Real rural tough guys who worship at the church of 'smash-mouth ". ML is a tiny school that somehow thinks they can run a balanced attack that shows many different looks , double tights , I formations and then motion guys with three wides and go play action. LOVE IT . 150 boys and don't think they have to just dive at people's legs and run the same 3 plays hoping to bailed out a few times during a SEASON with a big pass prayer , err play. Running a this century offense yet maintaining old school traditional values? Who knew ?

They aren't playing real football of course according to some small thinking townies who dot the Ohio landscape who thin they do it the 'RIGHT " way , screw progress. Also don't see a bunch of 4.4 flyboys out there for ML , so it is possible to be diverse without being truly diverse and exceptionally athletic? Love to see it , I think the way they do things is kind of the 'Right " way despite not thinking the forward pass is a sign of weakness. Yes they have run the ball more than usual in the first half but I love their sets and scheme. ML I suspect is trying to chew clock against the better clock 'Chewer " Lucas who runs that double wing variance that is wearing on a defense . Beat then at their game ? NOt always a bad strategy but I suspect we see ML throw some balls downfield in the second half


Licking Valley - 11 Clyde - CP LV 31--24


What jumps out to me is the fact that vs. the line LV is 0-4 in the play-offs , two narrow non covers , but Clyde is a cruising easily 4-0 against the numbers . Clyde coming down from D-5 has been a real benefit to this traditionally strong program . Not always easy losing 4 ballgames including three in a row as underdogs . Two narrowly and one by 13 points. Big win vs Wyoming is their signature accomplishment of course and what we last saw , BUT recency bias isn't a factor for me , but rather a real body of work that has them very confident here. LV s one of those teams that is on a dreaded list of teams with most play-off wins without a title . As a Central Ohio fan I am rooting for them to being to bag the title.

Love the 11 points and think Clyde finishes with a 5-0 record vs the number even if they lose here but I think they are just playing at a higher level at the moment and that's what will count


Clyde 27 LV 23
 
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Harrycrane

Well-known member
Week 15 Cont.

Nice finish to the season vs the number as now at 5-1 with one game to go.

Already jotted down a few thoughts about this game and as I finish up my college stuff I have little time to re-iterate or expand on what I am thinking about this one.


Kirtland - 10 Ironton - CP Kirtland 24-17

Think the CP margin is more accurate so grabbing 10 seems to the best play here. Carrico will be the best player on the field and Ironton is BIG and not just for D-5 really , good size at other levels. Some of it is YOUNG size which isn't as strong but really impressive team and Carrico is the real deal . Both teams haven't played the toughest of schedules , Kirtland the 47th and Ironton the 35th in D-5. Strength on strength . Who gets up first al a the Rocky 2 fight as I said earlier? Kirtland is always here , Ironton is a little ways away from their glory days?


Kirtland 20 Ironton 17
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
As does Marysville from what I read in their season previews and from the horses mouth the last few seasons . Good luck in your new division
 

Harrycrane

Well-known member
Actually Kramer M-Ville is pretty good , Rising Junior Powers is a stud . I do think they lose some good players but have a very good Junior to be class. Berlin can win , but not exactly a Xmas present may be.
 
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