Big ten Hoops

Stirred not Shaken

Well-known member
IU used to be a school that could get the blue-chippers. They are still a blue blood. They just need the right coach.
IU was Bobby K. just like UCLA was a blue blood under Wooden. IMO their are 3 Blue Blood bball programs : Kansas, Kentucky, and North Carolina. It is all about coaching, before Mike K. how many championships had Duke won.
 

Red14

Active member
IU was Bobby K. just like UCLA was a blue blood under Wooden. IMO their are 3 Blue Blood bball programs : Kansas, Kentucky, and North Carolina. It is all about coaching, before Mike K. how many championships had Duke won.
But think about it, you've had one coach at Duke for 40+ years, Kansas has had two coaches, Williams and Self, and NC Smith and Williams. Let's see what happens to Duke when Coach K leaves. I don't know how much longer Cal stays at UK, the pressure there is immense.
 

Red14

Active member
IU was Bobby K. just like UCLA was a blue blood under Wooden. IMO their are 3 Blue Blood bball programs : Kansas, Kentucky, and North Carolina. It is all about coaching, before Mike K. how many championships had Duke won.
I"m as big of an IU fan as there is, I don't think you'll ever see a day when IU is on the national stage like in the 70's and 80's. College basketball is so much different now, so many more good players, so many more ways to lose. The game back then was very controllable by the coaching game plans, no shot clock, no 3 point line. Knight was a master at managing games and getting kids to play a certain way. Coaches today have little influence on the games then they did back then.
 

Stirred not Shaken

Well-known member
I"m as big of an IU fan as there is, I don't think you'll ever see a day when IU is on the national stage like in the 70's and 80's. College basketball is so much different now, so many more good players, so many more ways to lose. The game back then was very controllable by the coaching game plans, no shot clock, no 3 point line. Knight was a master at managing games and getting kids to play a certain way. Coaches today have little influence on the games then they did back then.
Couldn't disagree more. So many good players ? Today college has the 1 and done back than players stayed 3 to 4 years, to win a national championship a team had to have a very talented team. Teams were more controlled ? Why is it than back in the 70's and 80's teams averaged high 70's to low 80's pts. per game including IU. College bball today is almost unwatchable for me, to physical and the coaches are control freaks instead of letting the players decide the games like they use to. IU 75 - 76 team averaged 82 pts. per game, how many times has IU even scored 80 pts. this season.
 
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Big 10 is as balanced as it has been in years this year.....should get 10 teams in NCAA. Still Sparty's league to lose but maybe 16-4 will win the league this year. Not sure anyone else can be better than 15-5 as road games are wars no matter who you are playing. Illinois and Iowa seem to have it going well right now but that could change quickly. Maryland may be 2nd most talented team in league to Sparty as well. All wins important now for Big 10 tourney seeding and NCAA seeding too. Top 4 in league get double bye to quarterfinals in league tourney. Big 10 has a lot of good teams but I do not see a team that can win the NCAA tourney so that bad streak may live on. MSU missed Langford big time as another outside scoring threat. This year the national scene is as wide open as I can remember though so a team that gets hot at right time could surprise in March.
 

Chop Stix

Well-known member
Wrestling this year instead of hockey. Hopefully no mixing of the two. Have fun.
I didn't see the wrestling, but Rutgers brought out a huge crowd for the basketball game. I've been going to Michigan games in NYC for 7 years and this was the first one I've attended where their fan base was clearly outnumbered (at least 70/30).

Rutgers had some impressive athletes but Michigan had the better ballplayers. Didn't realize until I got home and checked the box score that Rutgers had 36 more field goal attempts on the night.
 

Red14

Active member
A fascinating and sad story about Zavier Simpson and his one game suspension a couple of weeks ago. Apparently, he wrecked the car owned by Michign AD's wife at 3AM. He denied he was in the crash initially, and even gave the police a different name. Now the more disturbing news on this is Michigan appeared to try to sweep this under the rug, and for almost a week and a half, most were in the dark as to why out of the blue, Michigan's 3 year starting point guard would suddenly miss a game.
This goes back to the good old days when the media would stay quiet on matters on college campuses and we'd only find out later when major infractions were going on.
This could go many ways. On the minor side, Simpson innocently borrowed the car from the son of Michigan's AD, who's a student manager on the team. But why lie as to who you are, and that you were involved in the accident? At the time of the incident, an officer on the scene did not smell alcohol on Simpson, so no breathalyzer was done.
So on the bad side, this is the university, allowing an athlete, a high profile one, access to a car. We don't know if this was one time, or he's had the car for the 4 years he's been there, along with other improprieties.
Minimally, Michigan looks real bad on this.
 

Bevo

Well-known member
Ouch on Mich. Smells.

Bucks sitting at 15-7 with nine regular season games to play plus at least one in the tourney. Reg. season - H: Rutgers, Purdue, Maryland, Michigan, and Ill. A: Wisc., Iowa, Nebraska, MSU.

Do they get to 20 wins prior to Big Ten tourney? I say, doubtful. OSU would have to upset Maryland, Purdue. Rutgers or Ill. to get toward 20. Not going to happen. Maybe they can beat Nebraska and Wisc. on the road.

I have been a fan since Luke, and Hondo. I have never seen the league remotely like this. Brutal! Bucks really needed to beat Wisc. and or Minn. at home.

Hope Carton is ok; any expectation when or if he will be back? Is he with the team at games?
 
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Arrogate

Well-known member
But think about it, you've had one coach at Duke for 40+ years, Kansas has had two coaches, Williams and Self, and NC Smith and Williams. Let's see what happens to Duke when Coach K leaves. I don't know how much longer Cal stays at UK, the pressure there is immense.
He just signed a "lifetime" contract last year. Cal will be at UK for a while.

As for Duke the worst thing they could do is hire a K disciple. None of them have really panned out. If Capel ends up having success, which i doubt, he seems to be the guy K wants. Personally if I were Duke I would make a run at Wright when K is done. Runs a clean and successful program and has had success at a private school.

If I were Duke I would look at Buzz, Wright, Beard, and depending how Mussellman does he would be a good fit
 
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eastisbest

Well-known member
Bob Knight returns and Indiana not showing much Knightishness. Barring a strong comeback, they're going to be lopsided by Purdue.
 

Arrogate

Well-known member
Miller is trash. The recruits next year aren’t very good. He will likely be shown the door after next year.
 

Johnstown Benny

Well-known member
A fascinating and sad story about Zavier Simpson and his one game suspension a couple of weeks ago. Apparently, he wrecked the car owned by Michign AD's wife at 3AM. He denied he was in the crash initially, and even gave the police a different name. Now the more disturbing news on this is Michigan appeared to try to sweep this under the rug, and for almost a week and a half, most were in the dark as to why out of the blue, Michigan's 3 year starting point guard would suddenly miss a game.
This goes back to the good old days when the media would stay quiet on matters on college campuses and we'd only find out later when major infractions were going on.
This could go many ways. On the minor side, Simpson innocently borrowed the car from the son of Michigan's AD, who's a student manager on the team. But why lie as to who you are, and that you were involved in the accident? At the time of the incident, an officer on the scene did not smell alcohol on Simpson, so no breathalyzer was done.
So on the bad side, this is the university, allowing an athlete, a high profile one, access to a car. We don't know if this was one time, or he's had the car for the 4 years he's been there, along with other improprieties.
Minimally, Michigan looks real bad on this.
No mention made whether he was alone at the time of the accident in the wee hours of the morning or was he with someone
who exited the scene. A very strange scenario on the reasoning to give a false name to the police ??


JB
 

Red14

Active member
No mention made whether he was alone at the time of the accident in the wee hours of the morning or was he with someone
who exited the scene. A very strange scenario on the reasoning to give a false name to the police ??


JB
And yet we've heard nothing else from Michigan, the athletic department or the police. And we wonder why people are still skeptical of criminal activity by athletes at big time schools?
 

Arrogate

Well-known member
Yes I think he stays because of money and Fred Glass' ineptness/loyalty

His contract states:

IU would owe Miller 100-percent of his remaining salary before March 31, 2022 and 50-percent of his remaining salary any date after that.

IU should never miss the tourney 3 years in a row unless there are severe sanctions like when Crean took over. Archie isnt the guy. Listened to a podcast last week and thought it was very interesting when Mark Cuban said he doesnt donate to the basketball team. My guess is bc of Fred Glass and Cuban loved Crean.
 

Red14

Active member
Yes I think he stays because of money and Fred Glass' ineptness/loyalty

His contract states:

IU would owe Miller 100-percent of his remaining salary before March 31, 2022 and 50-percent of his remaining salary any date after that.

IU should never miss the tourney 3 years in a row unless there are severe sanctions like when Crean took over. Archie isnt the guy. Listened to a podcast last week and thought it was very interesting when Mark Cuban said he doesnt donate to the basketball team. My guess is bc of Fred Glass and Cuban loved Crean.
But don't you feel that IU could come up with that money quickly, I mean IU has to be really careful that they don't slip into a UCLA like funk. IU needs to get a progressive, high energy coach that can bring in big time recruits. We are getting good, but not great players. Now the other knock on Archie is development. I know Archie is known for defense and development. He's not developed HIS players like I hoped he would. Al Durham, Justin Smith, D'Ron Davis, and even to a certain level Rob Phinesse are the same players they were 2-3 years ago. A little stronger, but that's physical development all go through. Our team defense is better than it was, but offensively we've regressed.
 

wolves82

Well-known member
Archie Miller was thought to be a progressive, high energy coach. Lots of programs, including the Buckeyes, wanted Archie, and IU "won" that battle. Who do you propose IU should go after?
 

Orin Swift

Active member
I mean IU has to be really careful that they don't slip into a UCLA like funk.
Indiana hasn't made it past the Sweet 16 since 2001-2002 and has reached the Sweet 16 three other times since then. In that same time frame UCLA has 3 Sweet 16 appearances (as recently as 3 years ago) in addition to 2 Final Fours and a national championship game appearance. IU is well below UCLA lol
 
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Red14

Active member
Indiana hasn't made it past the Sweet 16 since 2001-2002 and has reached the Sweet 16 three other times since then. In that same time frame UCLA has 3 Sweet 16 appearances (as recently as 3 years ago) in addition to 2 Final Fours and a national championship game appearance. IU is well below UCLA lol
Good point.
 

Red14

Active member
Archie Miller was thought to be a progressive, high energy coach. Lots of programs, including the Buckeyes, wanted Archie, and IU "won" that battle. Who do you propose IU should go after?
IU's over the top fan base didn't like Tom Crean because we didn't win enough, or didn't play enough defense. We'll we now play better defense, but can't score and are winning less. I like the Buckeyes coach Holtman, can we just trade with them?
 

Red14

Active member
Does not appear we're going to hear anymore from Michigan basketball and Simpson's accident in the AD's car??? Funny how that is, eh?
 

wolves82

Well-known member
IU's over the top fan base didn't like Tom Crean because we didn't win enough, or didn't play enough defense. We'll we now play better defense, but can't score and are winning less. I like the Buckeyes coach Holtman, can we just trade with them?
I would have made that trade when the hires were made. Not now. I really like what Holtman is doing.
 

Red14

Active member
I would have made that trade when the hires were made. Not now. I really like what Holtman is doing.
And Ohio State got Holtman in what like June or something, really late. To me, Miller just does not seem to be able to develop players. And you know me, I'm not "fire the coach" guy, but I'm not feeling the direction of the program is going right. IU is a middle of the pack big ten team. You can't in in college basketball scoring between 50-60 points a game. I like Holtman, now he's hit a rough patch here the last couple of months, not sure what's going on, but he's done a lot more in his two years at Ohio State than Archie has done in the same time at IU.
 

Arrogate

Well-known member
If Beilein really quits/gets fired this year I could see IU and Texas making a run at him. Saw earlier that the Cavs were talking about letting Beilein walk during the all star break
 

wolves82

Well-known member
If Beilein really quits/gets fired this year I could see IU and Texas making a run at him. Saw earlier that the Cavs were talking about letting Beilein walk during the all star break
I read that also. When he took the Cavs job it did not make sense to me - he is clearly a great college coach, but the NBA is a different game, the players are in charge. He does not seem to be adapting. Some college will snap him up in a heartbeat.
 

Red14

Active member
Beilein will be out of a job for about 10 minutes. That dude can coach. I'd like to see Indiana move on from Archie Miller and look at Beilein.
 

Arrogate

Well-known member
Beilein will be out of a job for about 10 minutes. That dude can coach. I'd like to see Indiana move on from Archie Miller and look at Beilein.
I’d pay the buyout on Archie because you won’t have to pay any previous buyout to hire Beilein.
 
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