zebrastripes
Well-known member
Another rules change cycle, another shot clock proposal shot down. Hooray!
The average possession in a HS game lasts less than 30 seconds - the length of the NCAA shot clock. A 30-second clock would be pointless, a 45-second clock would be laughable.I wish we could have a shot clock of 45 seconds, but I think in today’s basketball it would be a disaster. Most basketball is not very good. Many boys scores look like many girls scores. Ugly. If you put a shot clock in , the average and bad teams have No chance to even make it close against above average teams. Very few teams are skilled enough to get a decent shot in 30 seconds. If you think it’s bad now, a shot would be even worse. Just my opinion.
The average possession in a HS game lasts less than 30 seconds - the length of the NCAA shot clock. A 30-second clock would be pointless, a 45-second clock would be laughable.
I stoppped going to HS games awhile ago but still watch some on TV and such. Just seems like coaches micro manage every possession and dont allow the game to flow and go up and down the court nearly as much as they used to. Sure, there are more turnovers that way but it usually ended with many more possessions and points.I wish we could have a shot clock of 45 seconds, but I think in today’s basketball it would be a disaster. Most basketball is not very good. Many boys scores look like many girls scores. Ugly. If you put a shot clock in , the average and bad teams have No chance to even make it close against above average teams. Very few teams are skilled enough to get a decent shot in 30 seconds. If you think it’s bad now, a shot would be even worse. Just my opinion.
It’s 22 seconds because there’s usually 40 TOs in most HS games today. A lot of bad basketball. Off season basketball will improve the game. Don’t know when most of kids today will put in the extra time to do this. Shot clock will Not make the game better, just a little fasterFor what it's worth, the average length of a possession currently sits at 22 seconds.
You’re correct about the over coaching, but many just don’t have the HorsesI stoppped going to HS games awhile ago but still watch some on TV and such. Just seems like coaches micro manage every possession and dont allow the game to flow and go up and down the court nearly as much as they used to. Sure, there are more turnovers that way but it usually ended with many more possessions and points.
I sorta wish coaches will loosen the reigns a bit, dont treat every possession like 5 seconds left in game 7 of the NBA finals and let the kids play ball.
but that is just me.
It’s 22 seconds because there’s usually 40 TOs in most HS games today. A lot of bad basketball. Off season basketball will improve the game. Don’t know when most of kids today will put in the extra time to do this. Shot clock will Not make the game better, just a little faster
I stoppped going to HS games awhile ago but still watch some on TV and such. Just seems like coaches micro manage every possession and dont allow the game to flow and go up and down the court nearly as much as they used to. Sure, there are more turnovers that way but it usually ended with many more possessions and points.
I sorta wish coaches will loosen the reigns a bit, dont treat every possession like 5 seconds left in game 7 of the NBA finals and let the kids play ball.
but that is just me.
It’s 22 seconds because there’s usually 40 TOs in most HS games today. A lot of bad basketball. Off season basketball will improve the game. Don’t know when most of kids today will put in the extra time to do this. Shot clock will Not make the game better, just a little faster
I don't believe any coach believes what you say they believe, zero.The misnomer is the shot clock improves scoring. That’s not the intent. The intent of a shot clock is to improve flow. Has nothing to do with points scored, shots attempted, or shots made. Those that continue to make this argument don’t truly understand the need for change.
coaches don’t want it changed because it limits their control. Ultimately, until the coaches realize they are simply a vessel for kids to enjoy and improve on the game, and not the main show, it will never change. The players are most important, and the players would love it.
why do they never poll the players?
I don't believe any coach believes what you say they believe, zero.
Your initial insinuation was that coaches just want to control their players and are more worried about themselves than the growth of their kids (read your 2nd paragraph). There are very few, if any, coaches in the game (high school and below and minus basketball prep schools) who's number one focus is not on the growth of the players on their teams. And the ones that have other priorities ahead of the kids don't last long coaching.I do, they’ve told me. They want to run their teams like they see fit, not have to change their tactics with the implementation of a shot clock.
If all of the coaches wanted it, it would be happening. The coaches all say they want it publicly, but Snodgrass has repeatedly said “our state wants to play by the NFHS rules”. So who is lying?
Either way, the kids aren’t at the center of the decision. There would be overwhelming support if the kids were polled. Why wouldn’t they ask them?
Because kids aren't administrators and don't understand that there are many factors in play beyond their personal preference. There is a reason students don't run the OHSAA.Either way, the kids aren’t at the center of the decision. There would be overwhelming support if the kids were polled. Why wouldn’t they ask them?
OHSAA bylaws, which Snodgrass is not responsible for implementing, require games to be played by NFHS rules and only make state adoptions where allowable by rule. If the member schools really want a shot clock as much as you say they do, they can amend the bylaws. I wonder why that hasn't happened if there is so much support...If all of the coaches wanted it, it would be happening. The coaches all say they want it publicly, but Snodgrass has repeatedly said “our state wants to play by the NFHS rules”. So who is lying?
If a high school team can't get a shot off with a shot clock of 35-45 seconds then they should not be playing basketball.It just amazes me that we have people who believe a shot clock will magically make bad basketball better.
???. Somebody finally gets it. For the millionth time, until most of these kids get off their phones/azzes , the game will only get worse. It has little to do with sets/shot clock.....It just amazes me that we have people who believe a shot clock will magically make bad basketball better.
A lot of them shouldn’t be playing. But God bless most of them. They’re trying and want to play for their school.If a high school team can't get a shot off with a shot clock of 35-45 seconds then they should not be playing basketball.
Ii See your point. The TOs create layups quickly at the other end. Maybe a 5 second possession. Thus your average is 22 seconds. The rest of the possessions are much longer because most don’t have the skills to get a good shot the rest of the time.Not sure where 40 TO’s comes from or the relevance if there were 40, but the 22 seconds is when a shot is attempted.
I disagree with the game being hard to watch today. Nothing wrong with running sets and watching a good fundamental team scoring off good passing on a pass is still beautiful to watch. Watching teams press the whole game, go 1 on 5 in the half court and turn the ball over 20 times a game. Now that’s hard to watch at times.These aren’t my opinions. If you ask or research opinions on this subject, 9 out of 10 are for a shot clock. It’s overwhelming, from the players, to the coaches, to those that know the game, from past high school players - so what gives? There is overwhelming support to give it a try.
And I do believe it would alter coaching habits, in a good way. It would require more offensive skill development for more players. I would require more kids to generate offense. It obviously wouldn’t happen overnight, but would be much better for the sport on the long run.
Kids work and practice and train more today than ever before, but it doesn’t show up in the games because they don’t get to use any of it because they’re running sets every single minute of the game. That’s what has made the game hard to watch. A shot clock almost guarantees some free flowing action. That’s a good thing.
It provides a good mix of efficient sets and gives the flexibility for offensive creation. Best of both worlds.
OHSAA bylaws, which Snodgrass is not responsible for implementing, require games to be played by NFHS rules and only make state adoptions where allowable by rule. If the member schools really want a shot clock as much as you say they do, they can amend the bylaws. I wonder why that hasn't happened if there is so much support...
I disagree with the game being hard to watch today. Nothing wrong with running sets and watching a good fundamental team scoring off good passing on a pass is still beautiful to watch. Watching teams press the whole game, go 1 on 5 in the half court and turn the ball over 20 times a game. Now that’s hard to watch at times.
So high school basketball isn’t “all about the kids” then...just what I thought.If a high school team can't get a shot off with a shot clock of 35-45 seconds then they should not be playing basketball.
So high school basketball isn’t “all about the kids” then...just what I thought.
Glad we can put that myth to rest.