2020-2021 OHIO STATE BASKETBALL

All due respect to Liddell, I think he's going to be a very good four year college player but he has no chance in the NBA. As a pro prospect he's undersized as a four man, and he's not nearly athletic enough to make up for it on the defensive end.

This reared it's ugly head the other day as he was often the guy getting abused by Oral Roberts using their two good players in a common NBA action, a high flat ball screen with the floor spaced out. You can think of this as being "James Harden action". When Holtmann switched Jallow onto Obanor, Oral Roberts mixed in a different kid as the screener to make Liddell continue guarding that action against Abmas, who I imagine will get drafted in the second round. There's no realistic "get more athletic" for E.J. at this point that's going to make up for his length and speed deficiencies defending the two man ball screen game and defending the ball in space.
 
I’m torn regarding Holtmann. On one hand, my first instinct is he is a good coach that squeezes a lot out of limited rosters. On the other hand, he’s the architect of these subpar rosters. I definitely would not fire him now, but he really needs to step up the recruiting of HS kids and transfers to get a better quality of roster. Right now he recruits as if he’s still at Butler.
 
Trying to a realist things could be better...and they could also be a lot worse like Indiana. He probably safely has two more years to get to a higher level in terms of either or both winning the Big Ten, whether regular season or tournament, and getting past the first weekend.

If they don't get to that "next level" it will be because he fails to adjust his recruiting fully to this level. Xs and Os, player development, culture and everything else have been pretty solid so far...it's just that some of the inputs coming in need to be better on day 1. I like Liddell and Washington, but you need to have somebody better than both of those guys to compete at that level.
 
I guess I'm the dumb one here. If Washington Jr. plays in control of himself and dishes instead of putting it all on his shoulders, were are a better team. But what do I know with all these experts on here.
 
Stirred not Shaken said:
Finished 12 - 8 in a conference that has one team left in the tourney
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Do you mind checking my math - is 12-8 finishing 0.500 like you predicted?

I am so glad you are happy with mediocracy.
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That's a weird, inaccurate assumption. Me calling you out for your dumb (and inaccurate) prediction means I'm happy with mediocracy? Why do you constantly try to one up your stupidity?
 
Orin Swift said:
Good god, I can't imagine knowing nothing about college basketball and the NBA and come spouting off looking like y2h has. Nearly everything he has said was wrong.
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Have to love all of the casual basketball fans who are nowhere to be found when the team wins and only chime in when the team loses. This mentality of thinking "they should never lose" that many carry over from football is why no one in their right mind will ever leave a solid Power Five job situation to come to Ohio State, and their hiring history of always plucking guys from "basketball schools" and mid-majors bears that out. This is historically a good job with a ton of resources, but why would anyone established want to play second fiddle to football no matter how well they do while also being scrutinized like football whenever they lose and especially have a bad loss?

The only high-end coach they could have ever poached that's a crazy enough fer to take that on is Huggins, as with all of his connections this is the only job he would have ever left West Virginia for. If this Holtmann era doesn't pan out there will be a lot of casual fans that will lose their minds when a few years from now they have to "settle" for another younger or trendy coach from a non-major (and probably midwestern) basketball school.
 
Orin Swift said:
Do you mind checking my math - is 12-8 finishing 0.500 like you predicted?



That's a weird, inaccurate assumption. Me calling you out for your dumb (and inaccurate) prediction means I'm happy with mediocracy? Why do you constantly try to one up your stupidity?
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Where did I predict OSU to go 500 this season ? Go help Brian with flipping the burgers would you.
 
nwwarrior09 said:
Have to love all of the casual basketball fans who are nowhere to be found when the team wins and only chime in when the team loses. This mentality of thinking "they should never lose" that many carry over from football is why no one in their right mind will ever leave a solid Power Five job situation to come to Ohio State, and their hiring history of always plucking guys from "basketball schools" and mid-majors bears that out. This is historically a good job with a ton of resources, but why would anyone established want to play second fiddle to football no matter how well they do while also being scrutinized like football whenever they lose and especially have a bad loss?

The only high-end coach they could have ever poached that's a crazy enough fer to take that on is Huggins, as with all of his connections this is the only job he would have ever left West Virginia for. If this Holtmann era doesn't pan out there will be a lot of casual fans that will lose their minds when a few years from now they have to "settle" for another younger or trendy coach from a non-major (and probably midwestern) basketball school.
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How do you know who is a casual bball fan and who is not.
 
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LELL said:
I guess I'm the dumb one here. If Washington Jr. plays in control of himself and dishes instead of putting it all on his shoulders, were are a better team.
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I agree 100%. The challenge is getting Duane to do that. He is a tremendous college scorer who is too confident for his own good. He remains a work in progress, and Holtmann talks about him all the time, how he keeps hammering the message home. But you can't sit the kid, he is too good.
 
nwwarrior09 said:
Trying to a realist things could be better...and they could also be a lot worse like Indiana. He probably safely has two more years to get to a higher level in terms of either or both winning the Big Ten, whether regular season or tournament, and getting past the first weekend.

If they don't get to that "next level" it will be because he fails to adjust his recruiting fully to this level. Xs and Os, player development, culture and everything else have been pretty solid so far...it's just that some of the inputs coming in need to be better on day 1. I like Liddell and Washington, but you need to have somebody better than both of those guys to compete at that level.
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This is the perfect summary. In terms of D-1 college players, I would list EJ and Duane as "very good" and players 3-10 on our roster as "good". It is the best roster depth we have had in a long while. But we are lacking one "great" player (and a big man). EJ got close this year, and deserved his all-Big Ten spot.

Holtmann can coach them and develop them, but we need to see another big catch on the recruiting trail. I would say getting the 2-time Mr Basketball from Illinois (EJ) was a big catch, but you need one every couple of years.
 
cjb56 said:
I’m torn regarding Holtmann. On one hand, my first instinct is he is a good coach that squeezes a lot out of limited rosters. On the other hand, he’s the architect of these subpar rosters. I definitely would not fire him now, but he really needs to step up the recruiting of HS kids and transfers to get a better quality of roster. Right now he recruits as if he’s still at Butler.
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I'm glad we have Holtmann.
I think he's a good recruiter. You can argue all day about the team makeup regarding size, etc. But I liked this year's team.
I think Holtmann is a good X & O man. I liked the way he used more players throughout the year.
I will never be a fan who likes coming across half court and just standing around half the play clock, unless the end of the game with the outcome certain.
I don't understand how Ahrens scoring just disappeared late in the season.
I don't understand missing all those free throws in the game against ORU.
We certainly missed Kyle Young in that game.
I definitely don't blame any of those on Holtmann.

And I'm not into criticizing the Big Ten. I think every team, except North Texas, that beat a Big Ten team is going to the Sweet 16.
 
nwwarrior09 said:
Have to love all of the casual basketball fans who are nowhere to be found when the team wins and only chime in when the team loses. This mentality of thinking "they should never lose" that many carry over from football is why no one in their right mind will ever leave a solid Power Five job situation to come to Ohio State, and their hiring history of always plucking guys from "basketball schools" and mid-majors bears that out. This is historically a good job with a ton of resources, but why would anyone established want to play second fiddle to football no matter how well they do while also being scrutinized like football whenever they lose and especially have a bad loss?

The only high-end coach they could have ever poached that's a crazy enough fer to take that on is Huggins, as with all of his connections this is the only job he would have ever left West Virginia for. If this Holtmann era doesn't pan out there will be a lot of casual fans that will lose their minds when a few years from now they have to "settle" for another younger or trendy coach from a non-major (and probably midwestern) basketball school.
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They should never lose to a 15 seed...
 
On the transfer portal front, one available big body to possibly keep an eye on is North Carolina's Sterling Manley, a 6'11 250 pound product of Pickerington Central that missed nearly two years like Towns with injuries. Showed some promise early on at UNC before injuries buried him on the depth chart.

Two years of eligibility and probably worthy of another major conference scholarship if he seems to be healthy and getting back in shape. Saw some limited action late in the year for UNC, so that seems to be the case.
 
Just saw on Twitter that Penn State PG Jamari Wheeler will be coming to Ohio State as a graduate transfer next year due to the extra year of eligibility.

Pretty good pickup. He was a three year starter that has a 2-to-1 assist to turnover ratio, shoots 36-37% from three, and is a very good defender with a pretty high steal rate. He was a Big Ten All-Defensive team selection the last two years.
 
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Most important part of that is the Big Ten All Defensive team the last 2 years. OSU was awful on perimeter defending this year.
 
nwwarrior09 said:
Just saw on Twitter that Penn State PG Jamari Wheeler will be coming to Ohio State as a graduate transfer next year due to the extra year of eligibility.

Pretty good pickup. He was a three year starter that has a 2-to-1 assist to turnover ratio, shoots 36-37% from three, and is a very good defender with a pretty high steal rate. He was a Big Ten All-Defensive team selection the last two years.
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This is awesome news.
 
I can't believe no one is talking about Key. He needs more touches down low. Going to be a very good player IMHO.
 
LELL said:
I can't believe no one is talking about Key. He needs more touches down low. Going to be a very good player IMHO.
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I think a lot of people are underwhelmed by his height and the high 3/low 4 star rating next to his name as a recruit. Ignoring the rating and his size, there's a reason that several other Power 5 programs including schools like Illinois, Wisconsin, USC and Florida also wanted him.

He was very productive at times this year as a freshman. Plays extremely hard and is very physical, and I imagine he'll have a good career.

Height is still an issue defensively, and Ohio State still needs a longer 6'10+ kid to guard the large centers most of the better teams in the Big Ten have.
 
You need a back to basket traditional big man for the B1G regular season which is called like a WWE match. Come tourney time what you really need are PGs who can control the tempo of the game to your liking, athletic wings that can guard multiple positions, and most importantly multiple guys that can drain open 3s.
 
Musa Jallow is going to be transferring out as a graduate transfer with two years of eligibility remaining.

Depending on what Kyle Young decides he wants to do, with the funky scholarship counting rules for next year with the extra year of eligibility Ohio State still has 1-2 more spots they can fill.
 
nwwarrior09 said:
Musa Jallow is going to be transferring out as a graduate transfer with two years of eligibility remaining.

Depending on what Kyle Young decides he wants to do, with the funky scholarship counting rules for next year with the extra year of eligibility Ohio State still has 1-2 more spots they can fill.
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Sorry to see Jallow leave,his injury hurt his defense but I think his offense was ready to improve a lot.
 
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